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Trying to install first SATA hard drive

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August 19, 2009 8:42:22 PM

OS: windows XP SP3

I just got a new 500 GB Samsung SATA hard drive, which I plan on using for storage. My current hard drive is a 250 GB seagate IDE drive that has the OS on it. This is my first SATA drive. I also have another 250 gb hard drive hooked up to a Pata controller card (sil 0680). I have the controller card because at one time, I had 3 ide hard drives, but one of them broke down recently, which is why I got the sata drive.

At first, I had problems with BIOS because it wouldn't even recognize it, but I managed to overcome that by modifying some settings under the Peripheral category.

However, after making those changes, I'd get the BSOD after seeing the Windows logo screen. It'd tell me something like: remove any newly installed hard drive, or something like that.

I decided to try booting up in Windows 7, and surprisingly, it worked like a charm. From there, I created a logical partition.

I restarted my computer, selected Windows XP from the boot screen, and I got the BSOD again. So, I unplugged the SATA drive, rebooted again, and still got the BSOD. Then I went back into BIOS > Peripherals > and selected Native "something" > and disabled SATA > restarted computer > and here I am now.

Since I was able to boot into Windows 7, I figured it had to be a driver issue. I looked in Device manager in windows xp, and there's nothing there that says sata, only Intel 82801EB ultra ata controllers. I even went to Intel's download page and typed in 82801eb and got no results. I also updated my chipset drivers, but it didn't make a difference.

Motherboard webpage:
http://us.msi.com/index.php?func=downloaddetail&type=dr...

Chipset page:
http://downloadcenter.intel.com/filter_results.aspx?str...*&lang=eng&strOSs=44&submit=Go

I also tried installing the RAID Software - Intel® Matrix Storage Manager - Primarily for Intel® ICH5R, but when I installed it, it said that it wasn't compatible with my hardware. I think it says that because it can't detect the SATA controller. And the reason it can't detect it is because in Bios, it's disabled. And the reason it's disabled is because if I enable it, I'll get the BSOD and then I won't be able to boot into Windows.

I already switched my hard drive from Sata II to Sata I, but I still go the BSOD.

You can find the manual for the mother board here (note: even though it's a Polish website, the manual is in English)
http://pl.msi.com/index.php?func=downloadfile&dno=3707&...

If you download > open it > and scroll down to the bottom of page 3-23, you'll see what I see in my Bios.

The next page gives some description of what they are, but I can't make much out of it.

Bottom line, I think I need to install the SATA drivers for my motherboard. Can I do this by doing a "repair installation" of Windows XP, in which case, I'd have the floppy drive with the sata drivers and then I'd hit the F6 key during installation.






Field Value
Computer
Computer Type ACPI Multiprocessor PC
Operating System Microsoft Windows XP Professional
OS Service Pack Service Pack 3
Internet Explorer 6.0.2900.5512
DirectX 4.09.00.0904 (DirectX 9.0c)
Computer Name COMPUTER1 (computer1)
User Name Tosh Hida
Logon Domain COMPUTER1
Date / Time 2009-08-18 / 19:34

Motherboard
CPU Type Intel Pentium 4, 2600 MHz (13 x 200)
Motherboard Name MSI 865PE Neo2-S (MS-6728) (5 PCI, 1 AGP, 4 DDR DIMM, Audio)
Motherboard Chipset Intel Springdale i865PE
System Memory 2560 MB (PC3200 DDR SDRAM)
DIMM1: Samsung M3 68L2923FLN-CCC 1 GB PC3200 DDR SDRAM (3.0-3-3-8 @ 200 MHz) (2.5-3-3-7 @ 166 MHz)
DIMM2: Samsung M3 68L2923FLN-CCC 1 GB PC3200 DDR SDRAM (3.0-3-3-8 @ 200 MHz) (2.5-3-3-7 @ 166 MHz)
DIMM3: Kingston K 256 MB PC3200 DDR SDRAM (2.5-3-3-8 @ 200 MHz) (2.0-3-3-7 @ 166 MHz)
DIMM4: Kingston K 256 MB PC3200 DDR SDRAM (2.5-3-3-8 @ 200 MHz) (2.0-3-3-7 @ 166 MHz)
BIOS Type AMI (09/29/04)
Communication Port Communications Port (COM1)
Communication Port Communications Port (COM2)
Communication Port ECP Printer Port (LPT1)

Display
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 (256 MB)
Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 (256 MB)
3D Accelerator nVIDIA GeForce FX 5200
Monitor Plug and Play Monitor [NoDB] (170116843009)
Monitor ViewSonic Q19wb-2 [19" LCD] (QGU064802765)

Multimedia
Audio Adapter C-Media CMI9739(A) @ Intel 82801EB ICH5 - AC'97 Audio Controller [A-2/A-3]
Audio Adapter Creative Audigy 2 Platinum (SB0240) Sound Card

Storage
IDE Controller Intel(R) 82801EB Ultra ATA Storage Controllers
Storage Controller NERO IMAGEDRIVE SCSI Controller
Storage Controller Silicon Image SiI 0680 Ultra-133 Medley ATA Raid Controller
Storage Controller StarPort Storage Controller
Storage Controller StarPort Storage Controller (Lite)
Floppy Drive Floppy disk drive
Disk Drive ST325082 3A SCSI Disk Device (250 GB, 7200 RPM, Ultra-ATA/100)
Disk Drive ST3250824A (250 GB, 7200 RPM, Ultra-ATA/100)
Optical Drive _NEC DVD_RW ND-3540A (DVD+R9:8x, DVD-R9:4x, DVD+RW:16x/8x, DVD-RW:16x/6x, DVD-ROM:16x, CD:48x/32x/48x DVD+RW/DVD-RW)
SMART Hard Disks Status OK

Partitions
C: (NTFS) 28003 MB (7016 MB free)
D: (NTFS) 4643 MB (2076 MB free)
E: (NTFS) 6291 MB (1106 MB free)
F: (NTFS) 180.0 GB (1.1 GB free)
H: (NTFS) 232.9 GB (0.8 GB free)
J: (NTFS) 15170 MB (2841 MB free)
Total Size 465.8 GB (14.7 GB free)

Input
Keyboard Logitech HID-Compliant Keyboard
Keyboard Logitech HID-Compliant Keyboard
Keyboard PS/2 Keyboard
Mouse HID-compliant Bluetooth Mouse
Mouse Logitech HID-compliant Cordless Mouse

Network
Primary IP Address 192.168.2.103
Primary MAC Address 00-07-E9-0F-2B-7B
Network Adapter Intel(R) PRO/1000 MT Desktop Adapter (192.168.2.103)

Peripherals
Printer AdolixPDFConverter
Printer Brother HL-1440 series
Printer Bullzip PDF Printer
Printer Canon MP360 Series Printer
Printer DocuCom PDF Driver
Printer Microsoft Office Live Meeting Document Writer
Printer Microsoft XPS Document Writer
Printer PaperPort Black & White Image
Printer PaperPort Color Image
Printer PaperPort PDF
Printer Quicken PDF Printer
Printer SnagIt 7
Printer Visage eXPert PDF
FireWire Controller Creative Audigy IEEE1394 Firewire Controller (PHY: TI TSB41AB1/2)
USB1 Controller Intel 82801EB ICH5 - USB Controller [A-2/A-3]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801EB ICH5 - USB Controller [A-2/A-3]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801EB ICH5 - USB Controller [A-2/A-3]
USB1 Controller Intel 82801EB ICH5 - USB Controller [A-2/A-3]
USB2 Controller Intel 82801EB ICH5 - Enhanced USB2 Controller [A-2/A-3]
USB Device Generic USB Hub
USB Device Generic USB Hub
USB Device Logitech USB Camera (Communicate Deluxe)
USB Device QuickCam Communicate Deluxe Mic
USB Device QuickCam Communicate Deluxe
USB Device USB Composite Device
USB Device USB Human Interface Device
USB Device USB Human Interface Device
USB Device USB Human Interface Device
USB Device USB Human Interface Device
USB Device USB Printing Support

DMI
DMI BIOS Vendor American Megatrends Inc.
DMI BIOS Version V2.5
DMI System Manufacturer MICRO-STAR INC.
DMI System Product MS-6728
DMI System Version 100
DMI System Serial Number 00000000
DMI Motherboard Manufacturer MICRO-STAR INC.
DMI Motherboard Product MS-6728
DMI Motherboard Version 100
DMI Motherboard Serial Number 00000000
DMI Chassis Manufacturer Uknown Chassis Manufacture
DMI Chassis Version Version 1.00
DMI Chassis Serial Number 123456890
DMI Chassis Asset Tag 0123ABC
DMI Chassis Type Desktop Case
DMI Total / Free Memory Sockets 4 / 0

Problems & Suggestions
Problem Disk free space is only 1% on drive F:.
Problem Disk free space is only 0% on drive H:.

More about : install sata hard drive

August 19, 2009 9:02:22 PM

Here's the bad news. To get it to work as a SATA drive, you will have to get the driver install file (it's a .exe file) run it to copy the actual driver file to a floppy and reinstall XP hitting F6 at the beginning of the install when it asks if you have other drivers. You can also go back into the BIOS and set the SATA drive to IDE mode. Then it will work, but it won't be as fast and will lose some of the other advantages of a SATA drive.

If I were you I'd just stay with the windows 7.
August 19, 2009 9:09:59 PM

How can I go back to Bios and set the SATA to IDE mode?

And I already have the drivers on a floppy.

This SATA drive is basically going to be used for storage, so speed doesn't matter much.
Related resources
August 20, 2009 8:34:23 AM

Well, all due to the fact that I chose a wrong boot image file, I was unable to bootup using the slipstreamed windows xp sp3 dvd. As a result, I tried using the original windows xp cd, which didn't have SP1. Even though, I stopped process right when it asked me which partition I want to install it on, it still ruined the partition tables. As a result, the drive became inaccessible.

In the end, I installed a fresh copy of Windows XP onto the Sata drive and right now I'm trying to recover everything that I lost on the ide drive.
a b G Storage
August 20, 2009 1:50:05 PM

Sorry to see you had so much trouble.
All you had to do was go into the BIOS, under your choices and settings for the SATA controller, and change the mode from "AHCI" or RAID, or whatever you had it set to, to "native IDE" or "emulated IDE" or some just say simply "IDE mode".

The basic problem here is XP does not contain the drivers for SATA drives.
Vista and 7 do contain SATA drivers.
Setting to the IDE mode means you lose some of the advantages of the SATA drive, like hot swapping, and NCQ, if your particular drive supports it, but these really don't have much affect at all on the drives overall performance. Anyhow, if XP was already installed, you MUST use the IDE setting.
You cannot (well you can.....but it requires some registry modifications and a long, long list of mods you must accomplish) change the setting to AHCI after XP is installed. XP must be installed fresh, the drivers supplied during installation by hitting F6 when you set the BIOS to AHCI or use a RAID mode.
Looks like you have got it working though, hope everthing goes smoothly.
a c 362 G Storage
August 20, 2009 4:23:35 PM

Let me make sure I have some details right before starting.

1. You have an MSI 865PE Neo2-LS motherboard, right? I ask because there are two other versions with names ending in Neo2-S and Neo2-FIS2R. The -S one was the original basic board which had SATA ports, the -LS one has LAN (10/100) added, and the -FIS2R has Gigabit LAN, IEEE 1394 and SATA ports, with RAID built into the hard drive controller chip. The mobo manual in the link you gave says it is for an 865G Neo2 board, also called an MS-6728 mobo version 1.2, but it includes details on the 10/100 LAN port so I assume it's for the 865PE Neo2-LS board. IF you do NOT have the version with RAID control, that would explain why you could not install the RAID drivers.)

2. You had three IDE hard drives at one time, two apparently connected to IDE mobo ports, and a third added via an extra IDE controller plugged into the PCI bus. The original boot drive still is a 250 GB Seagate as the Primary IDE channel Master but there are no other hard drives on IDE ports now since one failed. The second IDE drive is on the added controller. Now you have been trying to add a 500 GB Seagate SATA drive.

3. I'm not clear why you had to add a PCI card in order to add a third IDE drive. The mobo has two IDE ports or channels, and each can support two devices - a Master and a Slave. So 2 IDE channels support 4 devices max. Do you already have two other IDE devices (like CD-ROM drives) on the IDE ports? This has an impact on how the SATA ports are set up.

4. After much struggling, you now have the original 250 GB Seagate C: drive in the Primary Master position inaccessible because the Partition Table on it has been corrupted. Since then you have managed to get the new SATA drive hooked up and installed on it an original version of Win XP which does NOT have any Service Pack installed. You had to do this because the slipstreamed XP Install Disk with SP3 was faulty and could not install. Your board supports the original SATA standard with 150 speed, not the new faster SATA II standard. For newer drives to be compatible, Seagate used a jumper system (NOT the same as the Master / Slave jumpers for IDE drives) to force the drive to slow down to the older SATA specs. Often Seagate drives arrived with this jumper in place, and you removed it if you were sure your system was SATA II. In your case you would need to leave the jumper on, and I suspect you have done that - your drive is working, right?

Now, to the setup of BIOS options.

5. Your manual says you can use PATA (IDE) ports and the two SATA ports with the limit that the two SATA ports will REPLACE one of the IDE ports, leaving you only one IDE port (2 devices) to use. This is the "Combined Mode" on manual pages 3-23 and -24. It also says you can choose whether the IDE channel you can use is the first one, or the second one with the SATA ports occupying the first channel position. So this is where the total number of PATA devices in your system is important. My guess is that you have a 250 GB hard drive as Master on IDE channel 1 and a CD-ROM drive on that same port and cable as its Slave. Then you have a third IDE device connected to the added IDE controller in a PCI bus slot. Right now, with no third IDE hard drive, there should be no device or even cable plugged into the IDE channel 2 port on the mobo.

6. Manual page 3-23 suggests the best setting for hard drive port mode is Legacy Mode, and that's right. I expect that is the default and your system is set this way already. If this label means what I think, the BIOS is making your SATA ports pretend to be older-style PATA ports that Windows knows all about and can use right away, even in the Install procedure. This setting completely eliminates the need for additional drivers. I suspect that's how it is set now because you succeeded in getting your SATA drive to work. If you were to change that to Native mode, you'd need to install SATA port drivers.

7. Page 3-24: you want to set ATA Configuration to PATA + SATA; SATA and PATA both to Keep Enabled; Combined Mode Option to PATA 1st channel. I am not sure whether your setting for PATA Channel Selection should be Primary (since that's the only IDE channel you are using) or Both (to allow the SATA ports to be used as the Secondary PATA channel). For SATA Port Definition, since you have only one SATA device attached, I expect you don't have to make a choice but just be sure it is set to the particular mobo SATA port number you have hooked up.

8. If you go now to the Standard CMOS Features on Manual page 3-6 and look in your BIOS screens, I expect you can see the old 250 GB Seagate as Primary IDE Master and your CD-ROM drive as Primary IDE Slave. From there I'm not exactly sure how your PCI IDE controller card affects things. It may show up here as the Third and Fourth IDE channels (with one IDE drive on it somewhere as Master) and let the two SATA ports show up as the Master and Slave on the Secondary channel, with the new 500 GB Seagate as the Secondary Master. Or it could show differently. What do you see?

9. Manual page 3-8 under Advanced BIOS Features you go to Boot Device Select. In your current situation you may have a floppy drive and a CD-ROM drive as your first two choices, maybe not. But the hard drive choice right now, I suspect, is the new 500 GB Seagate SATA drive attached to whatever port shows in item 8 above. That would be how you could boot from it with its recently-installed old version of Win XP. If so, that's fine, leave it that way. When you boot, I expect this new drive comes up under the name C: with a size of about 128 GB total. The PCI-connected older drive also should be showing in My Computer; the CD-ROM drive also should show. But I expect you cannot see the original C: drive, the 250 GB Seagate attached as Primary Master, because of its Partition Table problem.

So, that's how you can connect and access your devices now. That still leaves us with several issues:

A. You have a lot of data on the original C: drive no longer accessible and want it all back. Do not try to use it until we get some tools to help out.

B. The original plan was to keep the older 250 GB Seagate in the Primary Master position as the boot drive called C: with Win XP SP3 installed; a second 250 GB Seagate unit already on an added IDE controller card in the PCI bus; and then add a new 500 GB Seagate SATA drive for data storage only - not bootable. I expect you want all three to be used as single volumes of full drive size, as opposed to splitting each into smaller Partitions treated as individual drives. So, is that still your final goal? It is do-able in a few ways, or other options are also possible.

C. Right now with original version Win XP you cannot create any disk Partition larger than 128 GB, although you can create several of this size or smaller on one large disk. This is because it lacks "48-bit LBA Support" which was added to XP in SP1. Your current boot device, the new 500 GB drive, has Win XP installed on its Primary Partition limited by this size restriction and you cannot change that size directly. Even if you update it to SP3, you can't directly change the size of the Boot Partition. But there are ways around that.

If your system is operating stably with this structure, I suggest the first priority is recovery of the original C: drive that now has Partition Table problems. If that can be restored fully, you can go back to using it as your boot drive with Win XP SP3 installed and all you data and application files restored. Then you can proceed to add the new drive to your system properly.

To do this you'll need some Partition Recovery software, installed on your current boot drive (the 500 GB SATA one). I'm going to break off this post here and look for help for that. Meanwhile, maybe answer some of my questions about your exact system structure and components, and where you want to get to. Then we can focus on that without distractions of the form, "if this is your situation then ... BUT if not, then ..."
August 20, 2009 6:42:37 PM

Geez Paperdoc, you didn't have to go through the trouble of writing an entire book. LOL But I do appreciate your help. Thanks

Update: Currently, my computer is up and running because I installed Windows XP SP3 on the SATA drive. But I'm still hoping I can repair what Windows did to my IDE drive which I used to use as my master drive until yesterday night.

1) No, my motherboard is a 865PE Neo2-S, not Neo2-LS.

2) Yes:
Primary Master IDE: 250GB Seagate
Slave connected through PCI controller card: 250GB Seagate
SATA motherboard port: 500GB Samsung

But, since Windows XP messed with my partition tables, I am now using the SATA as a Master drive (I reinstalled windows xp on the sata temporarily) and the other two as slaves. They are still connected through the same ports as above.

3) Well, yes I have or actually had two cd rom drives hooked up to the other ide ports, so I wanted to hook up a third hard drive and I needed a controller card for that. But, since one of them broke down, I now have two IDE hard drives, 1 SATA drive, 1 dvd drive (since I never use the 2nd cd rom drive I just unplugged it)

4) Yes, the original 250GB seagate is inaccessible. I'll try not to make things more confusing, but to get my computer working again I temporarily used an old WD 120GB (the 250gb was used to replace the 120gb) hard drive that had Windows XP on it to slipstream a copy of Windows XP SP3. But this time, I managed to find the correct "boot image file", and successfully created a bootable dvd which I used to install on the SATA drive. Note: the SATA is a Samsung drive, and using the tool ESTOOL, I changed it from SATA II to SATA 1.

5) The IDE cable isn't long enough to reach the DVD drive at the top of my case and the hard drive near the middle of my case, if you know what I mean.

Primary Master IDE Port 1: 250GB Seagate
Slave connected through PCI controller card: 250GB Seagate
SATA motherboard port 1: 500GB Samsung
IDE Port 2: DVD drive

6) Well, I think I was able to get it working because I used the drivers on the floppy when I was installing Windows XP. I kept on flipping through Native and Legacy with so many different configurations, and none of them worked. It only started working after installing windows xp. Note: right now it's set on Legacy.

7) If my memory serves, I think that this is how my Bios (integrated peripherals) looks like (Note: I'm not at home so I can't just take a look):

On Chip IDE Configuration
On Chip ATA Operate Mode: Legacy Mode
ATA Configuration: SATA Only
SATA Keep Enabled: Yes
PATA Keep Enabled: Yes
PATA Channel Selection: (I think it's: Both)
the rest I can't remember

8) The "original" 250 GB Seagate would show up as Primary master. The Dvd drive would show up as: Seconardy master. The one on the controller card would not show up in this area. But now that I have the SATA as the main drive...well, I'll have to get back to you on that after I get home.

9) Since I managed to get SP3, all the drives are working with full capacity, except for the previous main drive which was screwed up. I can see the icon for the messed up drive, but when I click on it, it says the drive is not properly formatted.

9A) I've got a few tools, such as Getdataback NTFS and Data Recovery Wizard Professional 4.3.6. I had Paragon Hard Disk Manager Special Suite on my previous drive (the messed up one), but I'm having trouble finding another download because they don't offer this specific one on their site.

9B) Yes, that is accurate, except for the Partition table part. This is how I was planning to partition everything:

250 GB IDE Seagate (main drive)
C: Windows - 30 GB - for Windows XP and drivers only
D: Utiltity - 6 GB - for small utility programs
E: Applications - 10 GB - for bigger applications (MS Office)
F: Games - 180 GB - for games, obviously
J: Windows 7 - 14 GB - a temporary partition to test out Windows 7

250 GB IDE Slave drive
H: Other - 232 GB - mainly for storage and My Documents

500 GB SATA
G: Miscellaneous - 472 GB - also for storage

___________________
The partitions above were how I was planning to have things, but since things didn't go according to plan, this is my current setup:

500GB SATA Main Drive
C: 42 GB - Windows XP
G: 400 GB - storage
J: 42 GB - I was planning to install Windows 7 on this just in case

250 GB Slave (connected through controller card)
H: 232 GB - more storage

250 GB Slave (previous the main drive)
"this drive has not been formatted properly."


9C) I downloaded Easeus partition Manager free edition to created the partitions.

Thanks again for your help.
August 20, 2009 6:55:54 PM

Would either one of these be any good:


Partition Manager 10 Professional
http://www.paragon-software.com/home/pm-professional/

Hard Disk Manager 2009 Professional
http://www.paragon-software.com/home/hdm-professional/

EASEUS Data Recovery Wizard Professional 4.3.6
http://www.giveawayoftheday.com/data-recovery-wizard-pr...

This one looks interesting:

Partition Recovery for Windows 3.5
http://www.ptdd.com/partition-recovery-for-windows.htm

Note: do you know what the worst part is, I have that software on my messed up hard drive. It was a special promo where it was available for free for one day, so I can't redownload and activate it. But I might be able to recover the files in my messed up hard drive.
a c 362 G Storage
August 20, 2009 8:15:05 PM

Ahah! You've had some real success - you got a current XP SP3 installed on the new 500 GB to run from.

Let me get a little "picky" because there's lots of confusion about Master, Slave and Boot. The terms "Master" and "Slave" do not relate to the whole machine and do not designate which is the main drive you boot from. There used to be a relationship which is the root of the confusion. Any IDE port and cable can handle up to two devices. For that reason, it is necessary to identify those two uniquely, and the method was to use jumpers on the device itself to label it either a "Master" or a "Slave" FOR THAT IDE PORT ONLY. This is only a way to identify two devices on one port - it is NOT the way we specify the boot drive. Sometimes the "Master" is sub-divided into two options, Master with no Slave, or Master with Slave Present. More recently came the system in which ALL devices on the port are set to "CS" for Cable Select, and the device on the END of the cable will be the Master. Every IDE port in use MUST have a designated Master device. IF there is a second device, it MUST be designated the Slave. If you have both a HDD and an optical drive on one port, it is highly recommended that the HDD be the Master and it be connected to the END of the cable; the optical drive should be the Slave on the middle connector. In lots of cases an optical drive is on a port as Master all by itself, or with another optical drive as the Slave.

So, every IDE port has a Master if used at all, and may have a Slave. A system could easily have two Masters and one or two Slaves. At one time by default the Primary IDE channel Master device was the boot device for the system. More recently BIOS's began offering the option that the boot device might be any of the connected units - a floppy (always was an option), a CD_ROM or other optical drive, the Secondary Channel Master, whatever ... - thus clearly removing the link (that never was ) between "Master" and "Boot Drive". However, lots of people still equate "Boot Drive" with "Master". A system normally will have one Boot Drive, specified in the BIOS Setup Boot Priority Sequence, and may have several other non-bootable drives. In some cases it may even have more than one bootable drive.

So I'm going to refer to your drives as:
Primary Master - the old 250 GB with Partition Table trouble
Secondary Master - your DVD drive - I presume it is jumpered to "Master" of its channel.
PCI Master - that's not a common term, I know - the 250 GB unit on the extra IDE controller card in your PCI bus. Since it is still an IDE port, I assume this drive is jumpered also to be the Master for its port.
You don't have ANY "Slave" drives here in terms of jumper settings.
SATA_1 - the new 500 GB unit on SATA Port #1. Note that there is no Master or Slave in SATA ports, because each port only handles one device.

Boot Drive - the SATA_1 device right now.

When you get back to the machine, re-check some of those BIOS settings. If I understand your BIOS manual, you cannot use BOTH IDE ports PLUS the SATA ports if they are set to Legacy Mode. And you need that mode. So let's try doing it the way the manual says. For starters, as a test, disconnect the DVD drive's data cable and make sure the BIOS has the PATA and SATA modes set to Legacy. Set the ATA Mode to PATA + SATA, both types to Keep Enabled - Yes, PATA Channel Selection to Primary, Combined Mode Option to PATA 1st Channel. Go to the Standard CMOS Features screen (manual page 3-6) and see where your new 500 GB unit is shown, where (if?) your 250 GB "PCI Master" disk is shown, and where is the old 250 GB troubled drive - probably on Primary Master. Then go to the Advanced BIOS Features screen (Manual page 3-8) and ensure the 1st (and only) boot device is the 500 GB unit you have XP SP3 on. (In this setup you should not be able to see or boot from the DVD drive that is disconnected.) Save and boot from that. According to the manual, this should have no conflicts of any kind, so it will be very interesting to know whether the troubled Primary Master unit is still unusable. If not - if it is there and NOT having trouble - then the thing we need to fix is not the drive, but the way the BIOS handles all the devices. However, I'm not betting on that much good luck!

By the way, I am intrigued by how the added IDE controller card works in the PCI bus. If it does not show up in BIOS anywhere but works just fine once Windows is loaded, then I have to suspect it requires a Windows driver (which is being loaded by Windows already) for access and hence cannot be used as a boot device. But if it does show in BIOS - say, as Master on the Third or Fourth IDE channel - that's a different story. This will have an impact on how to handle the DVD drive, because we do want it in use and connected to be able to use as a boot device.

Thinking ahead about that DVD drive, the manual clearly says that, to use your SATA ports, you should NOT be using one of the two mobo IDE ports, so the DVD will have to become a Slave on the Primary Port (channel) OR connect to the PCI card (and there's that question about whether it shows in BIOS as a potential boot device). I fully understand your problem about cable lengths - had that exact problem, and it's made worse because the MIDDLE connector of the ribbon cable should be connected to the DVD drive as the channel's Slave device at the top of the case, then the END has to drop down to the HDD mounted lower down. You MAY be able to deal with this with an extra-ling PATA cable. Typical cables are 12" or a bit more, but 18" cables are commonly available. You are not supposed to exceed 18", but you can buy ones 24" to 30" long. In my own case I did the 18" thing and that still was not quite right, so I actually opened up the middle connector, carefully removed all 80 wires from the little grabbers, and re-located the connector farther along the cable to match up with the actual locations of my drives and mobo port. I do NOT recommend that to most people, but it is possible. Maybe buying a longer pre-made cable with attention to spacing between middle and end connector is better. Another possibility to consider is mounting the hard drive up high next to the DVD drive in a slot that is designed for (but not occupied by) a different drive type. A 3½" floppy drive slot fits, or maybe you can find brackets to adapt the HDD to fit a wider 5¼" slot.

Now, irrespective of that DVD issue, back to recovering the troubled 250 GB older unit. My reading (I have NEVER done this, so read up yourself, please!) says that Getdataback NTFS which you have should do the job if it's a simple matter of a corrupted Primary Partition Table. It may be really important for you to know what Partitions were on that disk originally, and their sizes. Look through this forum for posts on Partition Recovery and Data Recovery. Keep an eye open for posts by Somejoe7777 - he knows a GREAT deal about hard drives and this recovery process. See if you can find a safe and reliable way to fix that Primary Master unit in this computer configuration. And then see if you can figure a way to connect the DVD without using the second IDE port. Let us know what details you found in your BIOS Setup screens, and what progress you make.
August 20, 2009 11:24:24 PM

Okay, I unplugged the DVD drive and made the modifications to the Bios. This is what it's currently set at:

On Chip IDE Configuration
On Chip ATA Operate Mode: Legacy Mode
ATA Configuration: Pata + SATA
SATA Keep Enabled: Yes
PATA Keep Enabled: Yes
PATA Channel Selection: PATA 1st Selection
PATA 0 Master / Pata 1 Slave

In the CMOS it shows the Samsung 500 GB as Seconday Master and the "Messed up" 250 GB Seagate as Primary Slave (I set it on slave previously because I was afraid it'd interfere with the boot process). The HD connected to the controller card doesn't show up here. It does appear in the list of selections when I go to set the Boot order, but not in CMOS.

Unfortunately, this didn't affect the messed up drive, it's still the same. And I did set the Samsung to be the "only" boot device.
August 21, 2009 8:59:04 AM

Okay, the good new is that using Partition Table Doctor, I was able to repair my partitions and they are back. Now, the bad news, well, there isn't any, at least not yet. lol

Do I need to Fix the MBR on my "ex-messed up" hard drive?

I still need to reinstall Windows XP with the SATA drivers onto the 250GB Seagate (ex-messed up).

Do I need to change the settings in the Bios if the IDE is going to be the Boot drive?

Put simply, what's my next step?
a c 362 G Storage
August 21, 2009 4:04:45 PM

OK, you're still stuck on the idea that there can only be one Master hard drive in your system that you boot from. WRONG! Master and Slave only have meaning for the IDE channels, and do NOT establish how booting is done. Since you are using the first (Primary) IDE channel, it MUST have a Master. Put the jumper on pins 7 & 8 on the old 250 GB unit (recently troubled, but now OK) to let it fill that need. The new 500 GB Samsung is good - it is on one SATA port, and the BIOS is set to have those 2 ports take over the Secondary IDE channel.

I find it interesting and very useful that the other 250 GB unit (the one connected to the PCI card) does show up as a possibility for boot device. I guess it's not showing on the first BIOS Setup screen just because the BIOS is not managing that interface directly. But this indicates that any other IDE device (like your DVD drive) could be connected to that card and become another potential boot device. So let's do that.

A few possibilities here. The existing 250 GB unit is connected to the PCI card by a ribbon cable from an IDE port on the card, and the END connector of that cable should be going to the hard drive. That drive's jumpers should be set to make it the Master of that channel. Now, does that ribbon cable have a middle connector, too? Can that connector reach the DVD drive? If we have two "yes's" here, it's easy. You ensure the DVD drive's jumpers are set to Slave and plug it into the middle connector.

Next choice: the ribbon cable only has one end connector on it - no middle one. That opens two options: replace this cable with another that has the required middle connector AND it is positioned so that it can actually reach both drives. Do that and check the DVD is set to Slave.

Next choice: the middle connector won't reach, or you can't get a another cable. Well, does the PCI card have a second IDE port on it unused? Yes? - then we're still in good shape. You will need a second 80-conductor IDE ribbon cable for this with or without a middle third connector. Set the DVD this time to MASTER because we're going to connect it as the ONLY device on the second port of the PCI card. Hook up this way, and ensure the DVD drive still has a power connection, too.

Now, reboot into BIOS Setup and check. You should have a (formerly troubled, now OK) 250 GB drive at the Primary Master, and the 500 GB unit as the Secondary Master. The other 250 GB drive and the DVD drive probably do not show on the first screen. Now go to the Boot Sequence setup place. I suggest you set it so that the first boot device choice is the DVD drive - it should be available here. Then make the second choice your 250 GB drive that is the Primary Master - NOT the one on the PCI card. Third choice: none. This way you can boot from the DVD drive if you place in it a bootable disk; if not, it will find nothing useful there and jump right away to your good old 250 GB unit that already has Win XP SP3 on it.

Now, I'm confused why you need to re-install Win XP SP3 on the 250 GB drive that was troubled but is not, now. You were able to repair the Partitions on that drive so they all are accessible. I fully expect that means there is no problem with the MBR. The MBR sector on a hard disk has two components: a small machine-language program that runs run to find and load the real boot software, and a Partition Table that details exactly how many Partitions are on this disk in terms of where each starts and how big they are, and including an indicator for exactly which of these Partitions is the one to boot from. Right now that all seems to be working. Do you have any real information or diagnostic readouts that say there is a problem to be fixed, or are you just being cautious?

As far a SATA drivers go, you don't need them. Your BIOS is set to use Legacy Mode for the SATA ports which makes them behave entirely as if they were simply more PATA ports, and Windows already has everything it needs to handle such devices.

When this is done, you should have this:
1. The original C: drive, a 250 GB unit connected as the IDE Primary Master, is working fine. The system boots from it with no trouble. It has Win XP with SP3 installed.
2. In My Computer you see that C: drive, an additional 250 GB drive with its data and no trouble signs (the one on the PCI card), plus your DVD drive.
3. Also in My computer you should see your new Samsung 500 GB drive, with another installation of Win XP SP3, but it did NOT boot from this drive.
4. If you place a bootable disk in the DVD drive (say, for example, a Windows Install disk) and reboot the machine, it boots from that DVD drive. (If you do this as a test, simply abort the install before it does anything.)
5. In My Computer, if there is a drive that has the wrong letter name, you can change that in Disk Manager before going further.

If all of this is OK, then we can get back to your original goal. That was to add the 500 GB SATA drive as a data-only drive in your system. To start, reboot just to be sure everything is fresh. You will use Win XP's own Disk Manager to do three steps to prepare your new drive. Click on Start in the bottom left, and in the menu RIGHT-click on My computer, then choose Manage. A new window opens. In its left list expand Storage if necessary and choose Disk Management. The right-hand portion will show two panes, each scrollable so you can see it all. The upper portion contains all the drives (Partitions) Windows can use right now, and you have four of them I think. The right lower pane contains another list of the physical devices in the machine (whether Windows can use them now or not) and for each there are blocks showing how they are divided up. If a physical disk has two or three Partitions on it and / or some Unallocated Space, these will will show as separate blocks in that device.

For the 500 GB Samsung it should show you that it has one Partition. If your work used all of the disk for this Partition, that's the only block it has; or, if you left some Unallocated Space on it, that will show, too. Right now is your LAST CHANCE to confirm your intentions: do you really want to get rid of everything on the new Samsung and start over with a blank hard drive? What we do next will destroy all the data etc. on this one disk, and you cannot recover any of it! If you are not sure, just back out of Disk Manager and nothing has changed.

Yes, you're sure you want to proceed? OK, then RIGHT-click on the Partition on the Samsung and choose to Delete the Partition. When that's done, check - any other Partitions lying around here, or just Unallocated Space. Delete all Partitions on the Samsung disk unit.

Step 2: RIGHT-click on the Samsung drive and choose to Create Partition. As the first, this will be a Primary Partition. Since you will not boot from it, choose it NOT to be bootable. For size, adjust if necessary to use all available space unless you want to leave some Unallocated for later use to create another Extended Partition. Run this procedure.

Step 3: RIGHT-click again on the new Partition you just created and choose to Format it. Choose the NTFS File System. I recommend the Quick Format option - that will establish all the file-tracking structures needed on the disk in 5 to 15 minutes. IF you want a thorough diagnostic test run on the drive, choose Full Format instead. That does a Quick version first, then goes through the entire disk testing every sector for reliability, and marking off for non-use anything it has trouble with. Normally there is no trouble, but you can do this anyway if you want. The cost is HOURS of processing, so let it run overnight or something if you choose this option.

When these operations are complete, check that it has assigned a good letter name to your new drive. If you don't like it, change it to some letter not already in use. Now back out of Disk Manager and reboot the machine so Windows can update its Registry info. Look in My computer to see all your drives ready to go, including a new big (but empty) disk of about 460 GB total space available.
August 22, 2009 2:36:23 AM

Thank you, thank you, thank you. Thank you so much, you are a godsend. It has finally worked. I got my "ex messed up" hard drive working back the way it was before, plus, now I got my SATA HD working as well.

Note: by the way, where it says: ATA configuration, I had to set that to PATA Mode instead of PATA + Sata Mode, why you ask...well, I don't know, it just didn't work, so I slightly modified the configuration to be only PATA, and it was able to work.

Thanks again for all of your help. If it wasn't for you, I'd still be messing with the bios settings restarting my computer over and over again.

Tosh
a c 362 G Storage
August 22, 2009 2:38:22 PM

Yay! Always happy to hear it worked out. And thanks for letting us know the final result.
August 22, 2009 6:03:46 PM

I apologize,it appears you were actually right about the PATA + SATA settings. Before, when I tried it, it just kept on restarting before the "dual boot" screen appeared. So, I reset it to PATA and then it worked. However, it seemed to take 20-30 seconds longer to boot. I have my HDTV and my monitor set up to my computer. One thing that I notice while booting up is that it takes longer for things to appear on my monitor, about a 3-5 second delay (note: the delay only happens while booting up, not while using windows xp). While I was booting up my HDTV was turned off and my monitor was obviously on.

But today, my HDTV was turned on and while booting up, I noticed what was taking so long. It has something to do with Samsung Boot Manager. Even though the screen only appeared for about 3 seconds, it caused 20-30 seconds delay, but still only appeared for about 3 seconds on my HDTV. Since it was only for about 3 seconds, it never appeared on my monitor. All I saw on my monitor was a blank screen.

So, what I did was uninstall the Samsung Boot Manager (note: it gave met two options, one was to boot into windows xp and the other was to uninstall the boot manager. I tried booting up in windows xp on the samsung but I just got an error message about not being about to boot, repair windows, /ntldr etc.) After I uninstalled the boot manager, I went into Bios and changed the setttings to PATA + SATA, and I was able to boot up with no delays. So, you were right all along. Thanks again.
September 23, 2009 5:30:28 AM

Hey Toshi
Is it possible for you to give me the link and instructions for installing this slip streamed version of XP SP3 version.
Thank you
ckeshava@hotmail.com

tosh9i said:
Well, all due to the fact that I chose a wrong boot image file, I was unable to bootup using the slipstreamed windows xp sp3 dvd. As a result, I tried using the original windows xp cd, which didn't have SP1. Even though, I stopped process right when it asked me which partition I want to install it on, it still ruined the partition tables. As a result, the drive became inaccessible.

In the end, I installed a fresh copy of Windows XP onto the Sata drive and right now I'm trying to recover everything that I lost on the ide drive.

!