No SLI for Nehalem?

Currently nVidia has no way to put their cards in SLI on a Nehalem, ever. Will this change? http://news.cnet.com/8301-10784_3-9956256-7.html
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  1. It has nothing to do with Intel at all. It will physically work. nVidia coded their drivers so it will not work on the Intel chipset. I think it is stupid on nVidia's part I will not do SLI because I prefer Intel's chipset so if I needed more graphics processing power then I can get in one card to ATI/AMD I go.
  2. nvidias going to be stupid like they always are and completely shut out intel...

    idk but I see that happening...


    what should have happened is Nvidia should have joined with intel... like AMD buying ATI... would make for a nice bit innovation if you ask me... I know it would take some of the competitiveness out of it... but w/e
  3. Who Cares SLI and Cross Fire are are not that impressive
  4. Theres no way Otellini and Jen-Hsun could even be in the same business , let alone the same building together
  5. nVidia has to give in to what intel wants, there's no other way around it. Intel will start selling systems with those beast-CPU Nehalem that will most likely leave AMD behind by a fair margin. No enthusiast (SLI users) in their right mind would pair $800-1000 worth of graphics with a slower CPU that can't feed their GPUs.

    Intel can happily use Crossfire support and still sell high end systems, I'm sure anyone that wants to spend $1000 on graphics cards wouldn't mind using 2 HD 4870 X2s on a Nehalem as long as they perform a lot better than 2 GTX 280s on a Phenom/Deneb.

    If AMD was competitive on the high end then it would be a different story, but it was a very stupid move of nvidia to try and take on intel. Instead of this whole ordeal, they could've sweetened their chipsets over intel offerings. For example, Intel X58 offering SLI support, but 880i would offer power down GPUs and use IGP while not in 3D (Hybrid SLI I think that is? Offer huge power savings)
  6. Ive posted several threads in the cpu forum about the cpu being a bottleneck for the new gpus. They didnt believe it. Are you saying the same thing? Or ONLY that people want the fastest cpu?Wont it possibly push people towards AMD? And Deneb will be out a little later, so then or by then it wont matter maybe which cpu is used
  7. i dont think this will be a problem. most games dont need much cpu power, any modern processor now can handle all the games fine.
  8. From a gamers POV, it looks like Intel is missing the mark. From the enthusiast in me, I wish they all could get it right. Intel holds all the cards. Will they deny AMD as well? NO. Why? Because they need them around for their monopolistic reasons. I agree with you to an extent, but frankly, I dont want to see nVidia harmed like VIA,AMD cant remember all the others. Fanboys will say, its because of better tech, thats why Intel won out. Im not so certain. Ask a nVidia fanboy that question. All we have is slides of Larrabee, and currently, nVidia is superior in gpus. And I like ATI too. Just telling it true. Thats why Im taking this as a sorta win win. For AMD somewhat
  9. I feel like they will be a bottleneck for the SLI/Crossfire configs unless we start seeing quad-threaded games soon, and I'm not saying that the phenom/deneb are bad by any stretch, but if I have to put myself in the shoes of someone spending $3000 on a gaming machine. If I am to spend $1000-1500 in graphics, I'm sure as hell spending $400-500 on fast enough CPU that can keep all those power hungry GPUs happy, not on entry level quads that can barely keep up with the Q6600 stock as it is, because I wouldn't want my machine to turn up to be a dud.

    EDIT: People are putting a lot of hope on deneb, but as far as I know they are only disabling L3 cache and a die shrink, so it won't be enough to even catch Q9XXX, let alone what are shaping to be some insanely fast monolithic quads (finally...?)... which reminds me to start saving up for my Nehalem system.
  10. I understand. If AMDs cpu solution works out, Im hoping that will change, at least in the minds of heavy spending gamers. I see all of us being forced with this issue. Ill be interested to see how this pans out, and whos trying to work it out, and who isnt. This could be a bad thing for nVidia, and if its a situation where Intel doesnt eventry, well Intel will still be here, andwe will be stuck with that.
  11. Yeah definitely. If AMD can pull a Core 2 out of nowhere (which is basically what intel is doing again with nehalem...), then they will remain at least competitive and recapture the enthusiast market, because as long as the CPUs are not the bottleneck, everyone will want the faster GPU system.
  12. JAYDEEJOHN said:
    From a gamers POV, it looks like Intel is missing the mark.


    But at this stage of the develoment, are they really bothered?

    Coming from a point of virtually nowhere, i.e. IGP, Intel don't really have anything to lose as long as they get their development right. If the first offering is anywhere near competitive both in terms of performance and price, they'll jump into being a top player overnight.
  13. Add this to poll!!

    Amd gives Nvidia a call and tells them we are leaving Intel too :D

    We are going to invest heavily in our own chipsets which will support crossfire and sli, Intel chipsets will not have any dual graphics card support, leaving the whole gaming market to ous, with our 10% slower cpu...
  14. As far that pole goes, I was torn between voting that Intel would tell Nvidia where to go or voting that AMD would sit back and smile. On second thought, unless a miracle happens, I can't see AMD smiling about much of anything, so I voted that Intel would tell off Nvidia.

    As to the SLI vs Crossfire thing, Nvidia really blew it when they went to war with Intel. All they accomplished was that a fair number of people who need two cards for their large monitors end up buying two ATI cards. Through the years, I switched off between Nvidia and ATI cards regularly, but now I'm set to buying nothing but pairs of ATI cards. Nvidia took my choice away, so they can go jump in a lake full of piranha for all I care.
  15. Or is this Nvida's chance to take over the red corner, Intel would be in a hole then...
  16. I doubt it, I think Intel has more market than Nvidia. remember there are more none gamers out there than gamers:)
  17. damn consoles... Jk, but I am hateful of all the pathetic console gamers that think they know it all.. and I ask, what is a console made up of? They awnser: HALO!!! (this does not apply to all "console gamers"). But back to the topic.. I would really rather buy dual nvidia cards on the intel chipset. And as others said: the only way to get ppl buy their chipset is to make it better than intel's.
  18. Hey I posted the same topic before, like 2 months ago on this.
    http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/250535-33-love-intel
    Crashman said:
    Now look what you did, by linking to a misinformation article. The chipset doesn't control SLI capability, that's up to the graphics driver.

    The only way to make a chipset incompatible is to prevent the cards from communicating with each other, but that prevents Crossfire too.

    All Crossfire chipsets are SLI capable, nVidia simply disables SLI in the graphics driver for any chipset that doesn't carry it's SLI branding.

    What Intel is probably doing is denying nVidia a license for its new communications bus, to prevent nVidia from making their own chipsets for the new CPU's. That can change in an instant.
  19. Nehalem will require a new chipset because it will have an onboard memory controller. Since nvidia has just released the their chipset i doubt their willing to make the investment in releasing another so soon. However I don't think that means that intel systems will NEVER have SLI. It just might be a year or two after Nehalem launch.
  20. Let's not forget Intel's GPUs, the new dude in the GPU market.
    How will they perform...
  21. Looks like NVIDIA is in trouble this time. Right now I'm looking for an SLI motherboard and its so hard to find one these days. Either that NVIDIA needs to give in to Intel or NVIDIA might start thinking about making their own motherboards soon.
  22. The August issue of Maximum PC there is an article on this topic,and Nvidia says they have a license to to produce Nvidia chipsets for Nehalem.
  23. I'm not exactly in a rush to go out and buy a max pc mag; is there an http source for that information?
  24. kudos to kellytm3...

    starting a month old thread woohoo... gotta love it
  25. Seems Nvidia is going at same fool way as 3dfx done before.
  26. http://www.maximumpc.com/article/intel_and_nvidias_secret_war_revealed?page=0%2C0

    I found the article he mentioned - however what he misinterpreted was Nvidia having a license to make SLI chipsets for Nehalem. The jury is still out on that one because Intel and Nvidia are still negotiating whether the license can/should include that architecture or not.
  27. Will an nforce 800i come to fruition? Only time will tell if it happens.
  28. Well, I think its likely that Nvidia will simply give Nehalem a miss until Intel gives them the full license.

    Maybe Nvidia is holding back their SLI license specifically so that Intel can't put a squeeze on them down the road when they begin to develop their own graphics technology - it would seem sensible that if Intel got this license they would have access to a great deal of information that would make reverse engineering SLI technology quite a bit easier...
  29. nvidia will most likely be the winner as intel will take into account what nvidia managed to do just last year (made the number 1 slot in forbes magazine)
  30. i just like the picture of the eye ball also that is another topic and if you think nvidia is that unnecessary you are an idiot
  31. emp said:
    nVidia has to give in to what intel wants, there's no other way around it. Intel will start selling systems with those beast-CPU Nehalem that will most likely leave AMD behind by a fair margin. No enthusiast (SLI users) in their right mind would pair $800-1000 worth of graphics with a slower CPU that can't feed their GPUs.

    Intel can happily use Crossfire support and still sell high end systems, I'm sure anyone that wants to spend $1000 on graphics cards wouldn't mind using 2 HD 4870 X2s on a Nehalem as long as they perform a lot better than 2 GTX 280s on a Phenom/Deneb.

    If AMD was competitive on the high end then it would be a different story, but it was a very stupid move of nvidia to try and take on intel. Instead of this whole ordeal, they could've sweetened their chipsets over intel offerings. For example, Intel X58 offering SLI support, but 880i would offer power down GPUs and use IGP while not in 3D (Hybrid SLI I think that is? Offer huge power savings)



    ha ha, lets say nvidia let intel use sli how on earth are they supposed to sweeten there chipsets when you can now buy an intel chipset with sli and crossfire who in there right mind would buy nivdia just to save some watts
  32. secolliyn said:
    Who Cares SLI and Cross Fire are are not that impressive

    wrong.

    I really think that AMD is going to make a comeback pretty soon. This happens every other year. The AMD 64 kills the P4's, the C2D kills the X2, in 2009 I'm tellin you AMD will come out with something that surprises us all, just like the HD 48xx series of GFX cards.

    I've just decided to sit back and watch what happens. I don't care who it's from as long as it works... well. Comprendo?
    It was hard for me to grab an E8400 instead of the AMD 6400 that I wanted.... do you think i'm regretting it? haha, no. It was hard for me to get the HD 4870 instead of the GTX 260 that has recently dropped in price, do you think I'm regretting that I'm going to the opposite that I am a fanboy of? No. I'm able to max every game @ 1680x1050, I couldn't care less that I've lost my fanboyginity.

    My apologies if this sounds like babbling.... I can't seem to type/read atm.
  33. This just makes me LOL. It was bad enough that, generally considered, Intel's chipsets, like their CPUs, are the superior ones. The fact alone that you can't have SLi on the best chipsets, but you CAN have CrossFire, is already a slap in nVidia's face. And given how well CrossFire now performs, and how rediculously more cost-effective AMD's video cards over nVidia's at this point... It's gonna sting again for nVidia.

    I imagine that if anyone gives in, it will be nVidia. As cocky as they may have gotten by their prior ability to slap around ATi/AMD, they should know well enough that Intel's less of a Titan and more of an outright God; opposing them in the way that they are is sheer folley. They simply don't have any real bartering power against Intel, ESPECIALLY with nVidia losing its clutches on the high-end crown to the specter of the 4870X2, which should be out when we see Nehalem chips like the Bloomfield cores.

    Really, in light of a potential combination of a 3.2GHz Bloomfield with a pair of 4870X2s... nVidia doesn't really have much of anything to counter as a threat. A pair of GTX 280s with a Phenom? That's laughable by comparison, and weaker all-around. Plus, of course, the Phenoms could use the 4870X2s anyway...

    Really, the ONLY company that stands to lose out is nVidia. Intel will win, because they've got the hands-down best CPUs, and access to the most powerful video card setups. ATi will win, because they still will have the most powerful card in existence, the 4870X2. Even AMD will win a bit, as they'll have all the video card options open.

    nVidia, however, will lose, producing a card they're now making a loss on and still not selling as hotly as they'd like/need, and can't be SLi'd on the best CPU there is, hence costing them the performance crown in more ways than one...
  34. It simply depends on who Intels sees as a greater threat. If nvidia cuts into intels server segment with their CUDA platform, intel will leave nvidia out in the cold. There is still the odd possibility of nvidia trying to sue their way in - it won't help them until it is way too late but would provide the rest of the industry with something to work on (if they win).
    The important thing is, that SLI itself is utterly unimportant. It's a prestige thing and since nvidia established this "SLI only on nv chipsets" rule themself, intel could hit back by denying them a licence for their new platform. The problem is not the SLI feature, but the possibility for nvidia to establish their CUDA platform that would cut into intels precious server market. And we all know to what lengths intel will go to preserve their golden cow.
  35. Quote:
    why do they need sli when they have crossfire.



    Because if you can reverse engineer both technologies you can ultimately combine any positives of SLI tech to your existing tech.

    Once Intel releases its own GPU i'd say you can forget about AMD gpus on Intel platforms, because they are looking to dominate the market and will likely terminate the license around that point.

    That is neither here nor now, but its one potential eventuality you have to face.
  36. I totally agree with Ovaltineplease

    ^+1
  37. ovaltineplease said:
    Because if you can reverse engineer both technologies you can ultimately combine any positives of SLI tech to your existing tech.

    Once Intel releases its own GPU i'd say you can forget about AMD gpus on Intel platforms, because they are looking to dominate the market and will likely terminate the license around that point.

    That is neither here nor now, but its one potential eventuality you have to face.


    They are going to counter ATI with what? Larrabee? If they are stupid enough not to use either ATI cards on their Nehalem mobos (and not Nvidia either) they will lose the gaming / enthusiast sector of the market... since Larrabee is looking to be a low-end solution. I don't think intel will be able to deliver the capability Nvidia / ATI cards deliver right now, maybe years down the road if they really try to get into that.
  38. nottheking said:
    This just makes me LOL. It was bad enough that, generally considered, Intel's chipsets, like their CPUs, are the superior ones. The fact alone that you can't have SLi on the best chipsets, but you CAN have CrossFire, is already a slap in nVidia's face. And given how well CrossFire now performs, and how rediculously more cost-effective AMD's video cards over nVidia's at this point... It's gonna sting again for nVidia.

    I imagine that if anyone gives in, it will be nVidia. As cocky as they may have gotten by their prior ability to slap around ATi/AMD, they should know well enough that Intel's less of a Titan and more of an outright God; opposing them in the way that they are is sheer folley. They simply don't have any real bartering power against Intel, ESPECIALLY with nVidia losing its clutches on the high-end crown to the specter of the 4870X2, which should be out when we see Nehalem chips like the Bloomfield cores.

    Really, in light of a potential combination of a 3.2GHz Bloomfield with a pair of 4870X2s... nVidia doesn't really have much of anything to counter as a threat. A pair of GTX 280s with a Phenom? That's laughable by comparison, and weaker all-around. Plus, of course, the Phenoms could use the 4870X2s anyway...

    Really, the ONLY company that stands to lose out is nVidia. Intel will win, because they've got the hands-down best CPUs, and access to the most powerful video card setups. ATi will win, because they still will have the most powerful card in existence, the 4870X2. Even AMD will win a bit, as they'll have all the video card options open.

    nVidia, however, will lose, producing a card they're now making a loss on and still not selling as hotly as they'd like/need, and can't be SLi'd on the best CPU there is, hence costing them the performance crown in more ways than one...

    puff puff give...no double toking...your high already
  39. ovaltineplease said:
    Once Intel releases its own GPU i'd say you can forget about AMD gpus on Intel platforms, because they are looking to dominate the market and will likely terminate the license around that point.

    I'm not quite so sure that Intel would be foolish enough to do such a thing. I think that they're smart enough to know that their own designs are a far cry from being able to dominate every segment of the market where multi-card setups matter, and as such, if they terminate that licensing, it could very potentially cripple and wipe them out of that market segment, effectively handing the market controlled by the likes of Falcon Northwest, Voodoo, etc. right over to AMD, on a silver platter. Even though it's not a massive market, there will always be a sector that wants the absolute most gratuitous power regardless of the cost... And that segment tends to have a much higher profit margin than the cheapie OEM segment Intel has traditionally catered to in the graphics world.

    kellytm3 said:
    puff puff give...no double toking...your high already

    What? Are you arguing with the premises I present? For instance, are you arguing against my claim that Intel's CPUs are by far the most powerful available on the market, including in terms of gaming performance? Or are you doubting that a 4870X2 would fail to best a GTX 280, given that a single-GPU 4870 comes rather close in performance to the GTX 280, and typically ties or bests the GTX 260? Or perhaps the note that nVidia could wind up hurting itself by cutting off key market segments that it's relied upon for years? (i.e, "the best")

    As someone who completely abstains from even smoking and alcohol 100%, I must say I dislike your drug reference.
  40. nottheking said:

    As someone who completely abstains from even smoking and alcohol 100%, I must say I dislike your drug reference.



    Yet your profile says, 'addict.' Toke on, my brotha! :kaola:
  41. I totally agree about Intel(Ihave always used their cpu's)but their chipsets are not the superior ones.As for the the upcoming X2,in all fairness is only right to compare it against a pair of 280 GTX cards in SLI configuration.Dual GPU card vs Dual GPU SLI.
  42. Without price being an issue,which will be faster is the point...
  43. Im thinking the 4870x2 will hold its own against the G280 sli setup at half the price. Currently, the 4870 is about 15% slower than the G280, and if the 4870x2 is 15% faster than the 4870 in CF then its looking pretty close, for half the money too
  44. those not interesting in the price of these things obviously arent working [hard] to pay for thier toys

    ATI is for the working man
    Nvidia is for the rich spoiled man
  45. Truth be told,Nvidia alots us a new card for display and show purposes every 6 months for mine and my wife's store front,but,on the other hand AMD/ATI sends us a display/demo card for every new release....there are no rich spoiled people on this end....There are alot of times may paycheck from my fulltime job pays the bills to keep our small buisness going.
  46. Im not compairing...At this moment,going with whats on the market(available to the public,now)and money is not a concern,what graphics card solution/combination will be the absolute fastest...We have already had one of "our best customers"purchase a pair of 280's,and he wants a third when the driver's are worked out.Yes,its true he could have had a pair of 4870's,for the price of 1 280,but,it was"his"money,and"he"wanted the fastest solution at the present.Hell,we could have sold him"4"4870's cheaper than a pair of 280's,and they still would have been cheaper...I'm not ashamed to admit that the ATI cards are the best"deal"around,and if Intel does'nt allow Nvidia a license to build Nehalem chipsets,I will build my next home rig,around multiple ATI cards,there's no way I'm gonna use and AMD cpu so I can have SLI.I like Intel far more than Nvidia...
  47. teeth_03 said:
    those not interesting in the price of these things obviously arent working [hard] to pay for thier toys

    ATI is for the working man
    Nvidia is for the rich spoiled man


    Haha yeah no wonder they're red - they're commies for the working man! But what is the graphics card for the Libertarian? Anyways, pretty ridiculous generalization tehre, plenty of us poor asses have Nvidia.
  48. kellytm3 said:
    I totally agree about Intel(Ihave always used their cpu's)but their chipsets are not the superior ones.As for the the upcoming X2,in all fairness is only right to compare it against a pair of 280 GTX cards in SLI configuration.Dual GPU card vs Dual GPU SLI.

    Not really... Even if we ignore the fact that the GTX 280 and the 4870X2 are about the same price.

    Since you can't find a motherboard (or a power supply!) that will let you even TRY four GTX 280s at once, while there will be loads of options to have a pair of 4870s. I.e, the best nVidia setup POSSIBLE (what people will ACTUALLY BE ABLE TO USE) will be a pair of GTX 280s, or POSSIBLY 3 of them, if they lash together a couple of PSUs. This will compare to multi-card setups involving the 4870X2. As noted, the 4870X2 is suggested to be more powerful than a pair of 4870s in CrossFire, both due to having a more efficient and tighter architecture typing the two GPUs together, (hence making it more efficient than either CrossFire or SLi) as well as the apparent fact that the X2 version will actually clock the cores to 775MHz instead of 750MHz.
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