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AoE 2x controller damage in I5, who benefits most?

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Anonymous
July 31, 2005 10:36:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Were I to roll a new controller, which sets benefit most from the aoe
2x damage going in I5? I've only played 1 controller thus far
(ice/emp) and he decidedly isn't going to get much lovin' from this.
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 11:07:09 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

On 31 Jul 2005 18:36:07 -0400, Michael Campbell
<michael.campbell@gmail.com> scribed into the ether:

>
>Were I to roll a new controller, which sets benefit most from the aoe
>2x damage going in I5? I've only played 1 controller thus far
>(ice/emp) and he decidedly isn't going to get much lovin' from this.

The same controllers who do the most damage now...illusion.
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 7:52:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Matt Frisch <matuse73@yahoo.spam.me.not.com> wrote:
> The same controllers who do the most damage now...illusion.

You're just imagining that. <fx elaborate hand gestures> You're... Just...
Imagining... That.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 22 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
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-= Justice Server =-
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Anonymous
August 1, 2005 9:17:10 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Michael Campbell <michael.campbell@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Were I to roll a new controller, which sets benefit most from the aoe
> 2x damage going in I5? I've only played 1 controller thus far
> (ice/emp) and he decidedly isn't going to get much lovin' from this.

None of them. The only controller with AoE direct damage is Mind,
from the cone fear attack, and the recharge on that is too long to use
it more than once every couple fights.

You might get somewhere by slotting the AoE immobilize powers for
damage, but they're DoT attacks, and not very strong.

If you have a single-target offensive power slotted for damage, it
helps a little, particularly if you're creating a new controller with
Trick Arrow. Mind (with Levitate) and Illusion get a fair amount of
mileage out of a single-target hold + oil slick + attack.

--
Zed Pobre <zed@resonant.org> a.k.a. Zed Pobre <zed@debian.org>
PGP key and fingerprint available on finger; encrypted mail welcomed.
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 9:17:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Zed Pobre <zed@resonant.org> looked up from reading the entrails of the
porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:

>Michael Campbell <michael.campbell@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Were I to roll a new controller, which sets benefit most from the aoe
>> 2x damage going in I5? I've only played 1 controller thus far
>> (ice/emp) and he decidedly isn't going to get much lovin' from this.
>
>None of them. The only controller with AoE direct damage is Mind,
>from the cone fear attack, and the recharge on that is too long to use
>it more than once every couple fights.
>
>You might get somewhere by slotting the AoE immobilize powers for
>damage, but they're DoT attacks, and not very strong.

Surely though, 2x not very strong is better than the not very strong
they had before - assuming they get the 2x on dot attacks.

Xocyll
--
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 12:53:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

I tested out a mind/trick arrow controller and was constantly out-damaging
the blaster at levels 1-10. He could area of course and I couln't but that
was the only area he beat me on without going into defiance for a boost.
Almost every attack I had did a hold/sleep effect and the arrows were good
for back up

"Shenanigunner" <shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote in message
news:Xns96A55A58D17BCnitropressatnitrosyn@216.168.3.44...
> Matt Frisch <matuse73@yahoo.spam.me.not.com> wrote:
>> The same controllers who do the most damage now...illusion.
>
> You're just imagining that. <fx elaborate hand gestures> You're... Just...
> Imagining... That.
>
> --
> -= Victory Server =-
> -= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
> -= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
> -= Mr Cellophane: Level 22 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
> -= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
> -= Justice Server =-
> -= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
> -= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
> -= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 2:17:05 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Xocyll <Xocyll@kingston.net> wrote:
> Zed Pobre <zed@resonant.org> looked up from reading the entrails of the
> porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:
>>
>>You might get somewhere by slotting the AoE immobilize powers for
>>damage, but they're DoT attacks, and not very strong.
>
> Surely though, 2x not very strong is better than the not very strong
> they had before - assuming they get the 2x on dot attacks.

I'm not absolutely sure this is true from a time-to-kill perspective.
If it normally takes you four minutes to kill a batch of white minions
with AoE DoT, and you get to knock that down to two, you're still a
minute and a half slower than if you just whacked them down one at a
time with higher damage single target attacks.

That's just a random example, though; I haven't run the numbers.

--
Zed Pobre <zed@resonant.org> a.k.a. Zed Pobre <zed@debian.org>
PGP key and fingerprint available on finger; encrypted mail welcomed.
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 8:24:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Zed Pobre <zed@resonant.org> looked up from reading the entrails of the
porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:

>Xocyll <Xocyll@kingston.net> wrote:
>> Zed Pobre <zed@resonant.org> looked up from reading the entrails of the
>> porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:
>>>
>>>You might get somewhere by slotting the AoE immobilize powers for
>>>damage, but they're DoT attacks, and not very strong.
>>
>> Surely though, 2x not very strong is better than the not very strong
>> they had before - assuming they get the 2x on dot attacks.
>
>I'm not absolutely sure this is true from a time-to-kill perspective.
>If it normally takes you four minutes to kill a batch of white minions
>with AoE DoT, and you get to knock that down to two, you're still a
>minute and a half slower than if you just whacked them down one at a
>time with higher damage single target attacks.

But surely even then a _controller_ would be nailing the group with an
AOE immob and then ALSO hit them with single target attacks to actually
kill them quickly

Doing 2x damage on the AOE DoT would make things die faster, and lord
knows controllers need things to die quicker.

Xocyll
--
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr
August 2, 2005 9:00:45 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Michael Campbell wrote:
> Were I to roll a new controller, which sets benefit most from the aoe
> 2x damage going in I5? I've only played 1 controller thus far
> (ice/emp) and he decidedly isn't going to get much lovin' from this.
>

This really depends on what you want your controller to do. If you feel
like focusing on single target power Illusion, Mind, and Gravity are
strong here. Combined with Arrow, Radiation, and Sonic they will all
work well here. For real AoE control and damage you're looking at Ice
and Earth primaries with Illusion, Mind, and Fire all distant seconds,
Arrow and Radiation will be the preferred secondaries for this.

Tatics will vary only slighty now. Single target is simple, open with
the hold and have everything else slotted for damage, kill the most
dangerous thing first and move down the food chain. AoE control/damage
will be concentrated around two tatics, one control/damage and the other
control. First the AoE immobilize (one accuracy, one duration, others by
preference) plus your secondary powers to survive the aggro, in theory a
correctly slotted /Rad could solo 10 orange/red mobs starting at level 8
or so. Second AoE control comes from a perma capable "soft" control like
Ice Slick, Earthquake, or Phantom Army, depending on your ideals you'll
use 10 to 18 recharge SOs to do this (Accelerate Metabolisim, Hasten,
control power).

After 41 you start getting real damage powers in the epic pools, at this
point blasters will get very envious of you. Well actually they'll just
still be very envious, before you had good control and then got pets to
do damage, now you'll have decent control and do extreme damage to what
you controlled. Fireball is proving to be a big hit in the 45+
controller damage game.

The Issue 5 changes did different things to different controllers.
Illusion/Rad is nearly unaffected if they skipped Flash before, however
a Grav/FF who focused on team assistance took massive 50% to 75% hits
all over the place. Some Mind controllers are reporting only slightly
changed game play after 45, others are hard hit at 25 if they didn't
take Hasten.

Overall I'd say look for fewer /Empathy and /FF controllers, more Mind
and Illusion, and alot of /Sonic and /Rad. Plus even fewer controllers
won't have Hasten, when three to five of your powers are 15 second
duration and 90-240 second recharge guess what you do? PermaHasten.

--
"Take me to your leader?"
I think not!
From now on, I AM your leader.
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 10:17:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Xocyll <Xocyll@kingston.net> wrote:
>>
>>I'm not absolutely sure this is true from a time-to-kill perspective.
>>If it normally takes you four minutes to kill a batch of white minions
>>with AoE DoT, and you get to knock that down to two, you're still a
>>minute and a half slower than if you just whacked them down one at a
>>time with higher damage single target attacks.
>
> But surely even then a _controller_ would be nailing the group with an
> AOE immob and then ALSO hit them with single target attacks to actually
> kill them quickly

Right, but the point is that it's a matter of ratio. If it would take
you 30 seconds to clear without the AoE, and 28 seconds with (i.e. it
only saved you one animation cycle), there's not much to work with.
Again, the numbers may be better than this; I haven't run them yet.


> Doing 2x damage on the AOE DoT would make things die faster, and lord
> knows controllers need things to die quicker.

Well, my problem has generally been in staying alive while trying to
kill things, and that involves trying to take down the ones that
*aren't* held first. What this really does is help two- or three-hero
groups, where the controller doesn't have to worry about it, but will
now actually contribute a noticeable amount of damage single-target.
That makes AoE DoT even less worthwhile, however; kill time with a
tank and a blaster is going to be so small that a single DoT may not
even have time to complete, with a damage equivalent to about 25% of a
single attack by the blaster on every target affected.

My gut tells me that this is about right for something like fire
cages, but I can't test it now because I already deleted my fire
controller (to be replaced by Ill/Sonic in I5), and my only remaining
controller is Mind/FF, without an appropriate power.

If you run the numbers, let me know what the results are.

--
Zed Pobre <zed@resonant.org> a.k.a. Zed Pobre <zed@debian.org>
PGP key and fingerprint available on finger; encrypted mail welcomed.
August 3, 2005 6:59:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

buser@heck.huh wrote:
>
> Overall I'd say look for fewer /Empathy and /FF controllers, more Mind
> and Illusion, and alot of /Sonic and /Rad. Plus even fewer controllers
> won't have Hasten, when three to five of your powers are 15 second
> duration and 90-240 second recharge guess what you do? PermaHasten.
>

Amend that, a closer look/test of the Sonic set indicates less damage
and control that I originally though. Also, while it's a nice complement
to FF bubbles the graphics of the sonic bubbles are just hideously
migraine inducing.

As an interesting aside, dose anyone know/guess what percentage of the
live server population is unaware of the massive changes coming for some
sets and ATs? The speculation might be amusing.

--
Evil, malice, death, decay,
Just another working day.
Anonymous
August 4, 2005 5:34:38 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

buser@heck.huh wrote in news:11f2ifu45pq7a76@corp.supernews.com:

> As an interesting aside, dose anyone know/guess what percentage of the
> live server population is unaware of the massive changes coming for some
> sets and ATs? The speculation might be amusing.
>

It depends on where the person gets the information:

1. Has tried it on test.
2. Has read the 'official' forums.
3. Heard it over broadcast in PI.

If the case is 3, then there are a lot of lvl 1 through 30 that have heard
it.
Anonymous
August 4, 2005 5:57:00 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

J Anlee <JanLee@ameritech.net> wrote in
news:Xns96A857404C6E1janleeameritechnet@207.115.63.158:

> buser@heck.huh wrote in news:11f2ifu45pq7a76@corp.supernews.com:
>
>> As an interesting aside, dose anyone know/guess what percentage of
>> the live server population is unaware of the massive changes coming
>> for some sets and ATs? The speculation might be amusing.
>>
>
> It depends on where the person gets the information:
>
> 1. Has tried it on test.
> 2. Has read the 'official' forums.
> 3. Heard it over broadcast in PI.
>
> If the case is 3, then there are a lot of lvl 1 through 30 that have
> heard it.

LOL

Though I've seen people discussing it in broadcast on Champion in the
Hollows, Steel Canyon, Atlas Park, Talos and Independance Port (Couldn't
say about PI - too much broadcast begging in there :)  :)  :) 


--
Marc Bissonnette
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!