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q6700 @ 3.6 ?

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June 2, 2008 6:02:14 PM

i am considering this list and looking for help.

Thermaltake Armor Series VA8000BWS $139.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Intel Core 2 Quad Q6700 Kentsfield 2.66GHz 254.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

GIGABYTE GA-X48-DS4 LGA 234.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

PC Power & Cooling S610EPS 610W 109.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

ZOTAC ZT-98XES2P-FCP GeForce 9800 GTX 309.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

SUPER TALENT 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 4-4-3-8 49.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3250410AS 250GB 64.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Arctic Silver 5 5.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

XIGMATEK HDT-S1283 120mm Rifle CPU Cooler 36.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


$1207.91

Ideally i would like to see the pc running @ 3.6 ghz for gaming and mulitasking. I expect with the hardware chosen this is a realistic goal, hopefully someone can confirm this for me.

More about : q6700

June 2, 2008 6:48:07 PM

ok i can make that change (to the 900). drops the price a bit also. i choose the armor cause i thought it is bit larger, the newegg reviews state the zotac card is enormous. i am also up in the air about the mobo, not sure if its worth the price to go up to dd3 or if i could get away with a bit cheaper model that supports ddr2 like..

GIGABYTE GA-EP35C-DS3R $144.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

or

GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS4 LGA 775 Intel P35 $174.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

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June 2, 2008 6:55:41 PM

DDR3 is still too expensive. If you are not interested in Crossfire go with:

Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3L, very popular here.
June 2, 2008 7:02:00 PM

those 2 changes really drop the price alot. what am i sacrificing with the ds3l over the GA-X48-DS4 in the original post?
June 2, 2008 7:16:48 PM

The big thing is you are giving up PCIe 2.0. The X48 board supports video cards with twice the bandwith of the P35 board. Last I heard, few cards made use of more bandwidth than 1.0, but I am sure this is changing quickly. And I doubt that it can handle all of the power of the 9800 GTX - not to mention any future upgrades you might anticipate.

Also, the X48 supports two video cards and the additional express channels required for it. It would allow a simple video upgrade in future of adding another 9800 GTX. (I think the board supports SLI but not sure). While in the past, many avoided SLI because of its problems, I see the THG video card buyers guide has twin cards in the last several top spots.

I suggest going to the Gigabyte site - they have a nice tool for comparing motherboards.
On the plus side - most are saying to stick with DDR2 still as the price performance ratio of DDR3 is not there yet.
June 2, 2008 7:24:55 PM

rockyjohn:
are you saying dropping from the x48 to the p35 i would see an actual in-game difference in performance, assuming everything else is the same? if so i would rather pay for the nicer model and get more room for upgrades later along with it.
June 2, 2008 7:55:29 PM

Quote:
Also, the X48 supports two video cards and the additional express channels required for it. It would allow a simple video upgrade in future of adding another 9800 GTX.


Intel chipsets don't work with SLI...only Crossfire. P35 also supports dual cards, but only Crossfire as a dual GPU solution. You can use 2 nVidia cards, but not in SLI mode, similarly how those students set up that 4x9800gx2 machine to run CUDA-based software for image rendering.

Quote:
rockyjohn:
are you saying dropping from the x48 to the p35 i would see an actual in-game difference in performance, assuming everything else is the same? if so i would rather pay for the nicer model and get more room for upgrades later along with it.


No. You wouldn't be able to tell much difference between P35 and X38 boards.
June 2, 2008 8:03:52 PM

and you expect 3.6 ghz is likely with either? also, the 9800 gtx is specified @ pci-e 2.0, would i be limiting the card with the board that lacks the 2.0 support?
June 2, 2008 8:06:21 PM

well the ds3l just sold out on newegg i guess that makes my choice a bit easier assuming i dont wait to order. right now i am running a 5-6 y/o 2.4 p4 so i am itching to upgrade though.
June 2, 2008 8:26:28 PM

Look at the x38 boards. I have a Gigabyte GA-ES38-DS4. It supports 45nm quads and PCIe 2.0. Just a little future specs.
June 2, 2008 8:32:08 PM

its sold out also, only the ddr3 model is available retail.
June 2, 2008 8:36:58 PM

Ok, try aBit IP35 Pro and GA-EP35-DS3R.

You really should look at features. For example some MBs have Firewire, eSATA, RAID, lots of SATA ports, etc. That DS3L is great, but it doesn't have any of these, it's a no-frills thing for budget builds. Not exactly the right choice for somebody with a 9800GTX card IMO.
June 2, 2008 8:37:16 PM

nate0327 said:
and you expect 3.6 ghz is likely with either? also, the 9800 gtx is specified @ pci-e 2.0, would i be limiting the card with the board that lacks the 2.0 support?


If the graphics card specifies PCI2 3.0, it probably will be best to get a mobo that supports that standard. Otherwise you give up some of the graphics card's capabilities, thus not getting all of what you paid for

As to getting 3.6ghz from a Q6700, because it has a higher multiplier than a Q6600, you should reach that speed easier. That said, when overclocking, no overclocks are guaranteed. Some chips will go higher and some will quit at a lower speed. But you should be able to hit 3.6ghz, nonetheless.
June 2, 2008 8:42:54 PM

sailer:
i dont undertand that its not a sure thing. you aree exactly right the multiplier and the g0 assurance that comes with the q700 is the reason for selecting it.

i dont think i will ever use firewire, have it now dont think its been used once. usb is important though. i already have decent 5.1 speakers and a SB x-fi i plan on using so the audio doesnt matter much.
June 2, 2008 9:25:24 PM

sailer said:
If the graphics card specifies PCI2 3.0, it probably will be best to get a mobo that supports that standard. Otherwise you give up some of the graphics card's capabilities, thus not getting all of what you paid for

Current cards (Including 9800GX2) don't come close to using PCIe 1.1 bandwidth. We will probably need PCIe 2.0 with the next gen dual GPU cards.
June 2, 2008 9:35:44 PM

the vid card is just so expensive i'd rather bite the bullet now with it and hopefully be happy for a few years, considering the board doesnt support sli to double up a cheaper one later.

shadow:
r u disagreeing with the quoted post and suggesting a cheaper p35 mobo like the EP35-DS4 would provide the same performance from the 9800 gtx?
June 2, 2008 9:42:02 PM

Quote:
shadow:
r u disagreeing with the quoted post and suggesting a cheaper p35 mobo like the EP35-DS4 would provide the same performance from the 9800 gtx?



Yes. If you are not going to crossfire 2 ATI cards, the P35 will give you the exact same performance. The P35 is also a very able overclocker so you will not be losing your (potential) 3.6Ghz overclock.

As Sailer said, it is not a sure thing that you will be able to reach 3.6Ghz with a chip that is only rated at 2.66Ghz. Each component has it's limits and there is always a chance that even a Qx6850 (rated at 3.0Ghz) would not reach to 3.6Ghz.
June 2, 2008 9:52:42 PM

ya i am willing to accept that. trying to get there or higher is part of the fun. if it wont happen then so be it, i just want my odds to be as favorable as possible i guess.
June 2, 2008 10:07:15 PM

nate0327 said:
sailer:
i dont undertand that its not a sure thing. you are exactly right the multiplier and the g0 assurance that comes with the Q6700 is the reason for selecting it.


When overclocking, we take CPUs beyond their rated running specs. While Intel will guarantee that a CPU will run at its rated speed, no one can or will guarantee a CPU to run at a higher speed. Each CPU is an individual, with its own strengths and weaknesses. I recently read of someone who had his Q6700 up to 4ghz and stable under Prmie95, but his is the exception. The truth is, many of the QX chips won't run that high and remain stable. At the same time, other CPUs will barely exceed 3.2ghz. Overclocking any CPU is a complete gamble. We can raise the odds, by doing such things as getting a CPU with a higher multiplier or even getting a QX chip with an unlocked multiplier, but we can't guarantee the final results.

Getting a Q6700 instead of a Q6600 only means that you have a higher multiplier and therefore a higher speed in stock condition. A further benefit is that because of the higher multiplier, every bump higher of the FSB means that you get a proportionally higher bump in overall top speed. For example, if a stock multiplier is 8 and you multiply it by a FSB of 4 you get a total of 32, while if you have a stock multiplier of 9 and you multiply that by 4, you get 36. Each raise of the multiplier gives a greater top speed at a given FSB setting. Thus a Q6600 is slower than a Q6700, and will give an overall lessor speed at any given FSB speed.

But again, the top speed any CPU will allow when overclocking is a gamble that has to be accepted. Its just one of the rules of the game.
June 2, 2008 10:15:53 PM

therefore a q6600 with a mulitplier of 9 needs a fsb of 400 to run @ 3.6 and q6700 @ x10 fsb 366 = 3.6 ghz? i am assuming the 366 is more reliably reached then 400. also, how exactly does the ram speed relate? from what i understand its best to run a 1:1 ratio?
June 3, 2008 1:24:38 AM

nate0327 said:
therefore a q6600 with a mulitplier of 9 needs a fsb of 400 to run @ 3.6 and q6700 @ x10 fsb 366 = 3.6 ghz? i am assuming the 366 is more reliably reached then 400. also, how exactly does the ram speed relate? from what i understand its best to run a 1:1 ratio?


You've got the right idea concerning the FSB. The lower speed bus is easier for the motherboard to handle and produces less heat. Yes, the ram's ideal ratio is 1:1, though that is not always possible.
June 3, 2008 4:03:14 AM

thanks to everyone who has contributed here, i have found your suggestions very helpful.
i am still looking into all my options, apparently the newest vid cards are released mid month, you think it will drive the prices down on the 9800?
maybe
i can wait a few more weeks. someone else has mentioned the p45 chipset.. so many choices. i hope eventually i find a list that i dont need to question.
June 3, 2008 3:28:34 PM

sailer said:
You've got the right idea concerning the FSB. The lower speed bus is easier for the motherboard to handle and produces less heat. Yes, the ram's ideal ratio is 1:1, though that is not always possible.


The higher multiplier of the Q6700 means you only need to run the FSB freq at 360 MHz instead of 400 MHz. But if the processor core will not run at 3.6 GHz, it doen't matter.

With top of the line air cooling, quite a few of us are running Q6600's at 3.6 GHz (GA-EP35-DS3P, Q6600 @3.6 GHz, TRUE/S-Flex) It's likely you can also. But there are no guarantees.
June 3, 2008 4:37:48 PM

Why not get an 8800GTS (G92) instead of the 9800GTX? It's almost the same card but much less expensive.
June 3, 2008 4:40:47 PM

how much does the ram affect this? from what i have read most decent ddr2 800 will work fine, i understand the lower the timings the better? i found the super talent @ 4-4-3-8. would something like

G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 4-4-4-12
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

offer similar performance? (super talent = out of stock as of now)
June 3, 2008 4:42:15 PM

i can make that switch uguv
i liked the zotac card cause its greatly factory overclocked

u have a brand to suggest?
June 3, 2008 4:44:24 PM

With the Q6600 and Q6700 DDR2 800 is generally plenty, as you will not likely be pushing the FSB past 400. With some of the newer quads and their low multipliers, reaching high overclocks require higher FSB frequencies which would then take advantage of DDR2 1066+ ram. For the Q6600 or Q6700 I agree with looking for good CAS latency DDR2 800 RAM.
June 3, 2008 4:44:38 PM

right now i am @ $1,153 w/o ram and shipping but not sure if i will order today or just keep waiting on the new gfx cards or p45 mobo option.
June 3, 2008 4:48:57 PM

If you go with EVGA you could use their "step-up" program to upgrade to a newer card when they come out. If you don't care about that then I've heard positive things about the MSI and XFX cards. MSI recently had a great deal but the rebate ended in May I think.

ECS has a great deal right now but I don't know if I trust the brand. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168... ($160 after rebate)
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