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IS IT WORTH WAITING FOR NEHALEM

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July 31, 2008 4:37:47 PM

I am planning to build a gaming rig from scratch my config would be

Q 9450
Evga 780i sli
2 Evga 9800 gtx+
dell 24 inch
logitech g15 keyboard and g5 mouse
corsair 1000 W psu
cooler master cosmos s
wd 500 gb hdd

so people help me is this config good or should i wait for nehalem core

More about : worth waiting nehalem

July 31, 2008 4:46:45 PM

You might be overdoing it with the PSU wattage. Probably can go down to 750W with no trouble.

Otherwise I like the build, though you don't mention what type/amount of RAM you are getting.

As far as Nahalem, unless you are an enthusiast and will purchase the nahalem Mobo/CPU's at their release prices, I'd say build your current proposal now and upgrade to Nahalem in a couple years when prices come down.
July 31, 2008 4:53:32 PM

the ram would be corsair 2gb*2 800 mhz dhx
Related resources
July 31, 2008 4:58:10 PM

Nehalem is actually supposed to be released at reasonable prices.
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?p=1032771697

You can count on a big drop in price of current processors if you decide to not go Nehalem anyways. The computer industry is going to go nuts with the new release. I would definitely wait on it.
July 31, 2008 4:58:53 PM

hyperjoe said:
You might be overdoing it with the PSU wattage. Probably can go down to 750W with no trouble.

Otherwise I like the build, though you don't mention what type/amount of RAM you are getting.

As far as Nahalem, unless you are an enthusiast and will purchase the nahalem Mobo/CPU's at their release prices, I'd say build your current proposal now and upgrade to Nahalem in a couple years when prices come down.


I disagree... it is always a good option to go high on the PSU if you can afford it, it can't not hurt you in any way other than paying a little more and leaves the door open for future upgrades that may require even more power.

You have a great setup, I would go with it. I wouldn't wait for Nehalem because it will take a while before all the kinks on the motherboards are worked out and DDR3 comes down in price a bit. That setup will definetely last you until then and more, and you could upgrade to the 32nm version of Nehalem.
July 31, 2008 5:01:06 PM

Q6600 launched at $850. each in quanities of 1000.
Estimate what you think the Nehalem will launch at.
6 months ago the E8400 was $300. Now $160. ish
I would say a realistic wait time would be maybe a year from now.
You also have to concider Motherboard...1366 socket. DDR3
X58 chip sets...
nvidia chip sets for SLI? Will they be avaiable?
July 31, 2008 5:04:40 PM

knotknut said:
Q6600 launched at $850. each in quanities of 1000.
Estimate what you think the Nehalem will launch at.
6 months ago the E8400 was $300. Now $160. ish
I would say a realistic wait time would be maybe a year from now.
You also have to concider Motherboard...1366 socket. DDR3
X58 chip sets...
nvidia chip sets for SLI? Will they be avaiable?


Who cares, the Nvidia chipsets are crap.

Anyways, just because you are waiting for the release of Nehalem doesn't mean you actually have to buy Nehalem. There will be a price drop in everything with the release of a new chipset. That alone is worth waiting for.
July 31, 2008 5:09:40 PM

njalterio said:
Who cares, the Nvidia chipsets are crap.




The 780i is THE BEST Nvidia chipset. 680i gave a lot of trouble, 790i's are giving a lot of issues and are not worth it.

He can't go wrong with an XFX or EVGA 780i mobo... very overclocking friendly as well.
July 31, 2008 5:12:33 PM

It depends on a few variables. They are:
1. How old is your current system.
2. How much money are you willing to spend on a new system once nehalem comes out.
3. Are you willing to wait a few months to build a new system once nehalem is out.

My personal vote would be build a system now. You posted a very good system. The nehalem Mobos will use DDR3 ram, so it is going to be a bit more pricy to build a new computer down the road especially when you take into account the price of new technology.
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July 31, 2008 5:13:17 PM

nvidia chip sets aren't crap. right now they have the fastest chips available for your enthusiast........... the 790. Gamers will get more from this than anybody else. The only problem I have with their chip sets are the extreme heat they throw off........ minga.

As for the question at hand............. performance is estimated to be at least45% over what Intel is selling now. At what price, who knows ?
July 31, 2008 5:18:49 PM

Nvidia chipsets are way overpriced and have been known to suck at overclocking. I suggest getting an Intel P45 chipset if the OP absolutely cannot wait on Nehalem. With the money saved he could get a GTX 280, which would probably beat the 9800s.
July 31, 2008 5:19:35 PM

Rubenov said:
The 780i is THE BEST Nvidia chipset. 680i gave a lot of trouble, 790i's are giving a lot of issues and are not worth it.

He can't go wrong with an XFX or EVGA 780i mobo... very overclocking friendly as well.


swifty_morgan said:
nvidia chip sets aren't crap. right now they have the fastest chips available for your enthusiast........... the 790. Gamers will get more from this than anybody else. The only problem I have with their chip sets are the extreme heat they throw off........ minga.


Aaaahhhh... those gave me a good laugh.
July 31, 2008 5:19:52 PM

I am willing to spend about $2500
July 31, 2008 5:21:03 PM

I Nehalem build is definitely going to cost you more at release.
The Chips and Chipsets will likely be a little pricey at first release until demand settles. The big thing is going to be DDR3 memory. That will take the biggest chunk out of your budget.

I suspect in 6months after Nehalem ships that DDR3 will have only a very small premium, but to start it will definitely be there.

One thing to consider waiting for his Aug 10th.
The Prices on the 45nm Quads Drop them.
The Q9550 will be available for the Q9450 price.
July 31, 2008 5:22:03 PM

bonecrush said:
I am willing to spend about $2500


After reading this, i think i need a hug.
July 31, 2008 5:25:24 PM

swifty_morgan said:
nvidia chip sets aren't crap. right now they have the fastest chips available for your enthusiast........... the 790. Gamers will get more from this than anybody else. The only problem I have with their chip sets are the extreme heat they throw off........ minga.

As for the question at hand............. performance is estimated to be at least45% over what Intel is selling now. At what price, who knows ?


If by "chip" you mean processor, you should know that motherboards do not have integrated processors, unless you count the integrated graphics processor. However, I do not believe Nvidia chipsets have IGP's as those motherboards are for enthusiasts.
Any motherboard can run an Nvidia graphics card, just not two of them in SLI. I do not think SLI is worth having an unstable board.

We do have a pretty good idea of the price. The thread I posted mentions $285 for the 2.6 GHz Nehalem quad. If this is the tray price, it will be closer to $300.
July 31, 2008 5:26:47 PM

These are you options:

2.66 Ghz Nehalem ~ $300
X58 ~ $300
6 GB of 1333 DDR3 ~ $600
4870 X2 ~ $450
Samsung Spinpoint F1 1TB drive ~ $150
Enermax Galaxy S DXX 1KW ~ $300
New Dell 24 in ~ $400

Or

Q9770 ~ $500
DFI Lanparty or Gigabyte X48 ~ $200
4GB of 1066 DDR2 ~ $100
2x 4870 X2 ~ $900
Samsung Spinpoint F1 1TB ~ $150
Enermax Galaxy S DXX 1KW ~ $300
New Dell 24" ~ $400

^ Both around $2500 and both after the Nehalem launch, you tell me which will perform the best, it is pretty obvious that it is not Nehalem...

I recommend the Samsung F1 1TB drive, its fast, cheap, and reliable. The Enermax Galaxy S is slightly more stable, has better connections, and is the same price as the Corsair 1000w.
July 31, 2008 5:26:49 PM

radnor said:
After reading this, i think i need a hug.


*Hugs radnor*

LOL
July 31, 2008 5:31:50 PM

The_Blood_Raven said:
Then go for the Nehalem build, this is how I think it should go:

2.66 Ghz Nehalem ~ $300
X58 ~ $300
6 GB of 1333 DDR3 ~ $600
4870 X2 ~ $450
Samsung Spinpoint F1 1TB drive ~ $150
Enermax Galaxy S DXX 1KW ~ $300
New Dell 24 in ~ $400

^ Exactly $2500 without shipping, but add in rebates and it should be close. I strongly recommend the Enermax 1KW over the Corsair, it is slightly better has more connections and is the same price.


Slightly off topic, but have you seen an updated copy of the PSU tier list around at all?
July 31, 2008 5:32:00 PM

nVidia chipsets run hotter, but can handle the heat. My 680i has goten my E8300 to 4 on air. Look at the 3DMark records, as much as I hate benchmarks, all the best scores are done with nVidia chipsets.
a b à CPUs
July 31, 2008 5:36:11 PM

Personally, even though Nehalem is better optimized and will run faster, I don't think we'll have the jump in speed everyone is expecting. If you build a strong system now, you will be plenty fine for the next year or two. Thats why I just spent $4500 on a new PC; I plan on skipping over Nehalem entirely.

Oc course, I could be way off the mark, but thats the choice you have to make.
July 31, 2008 5:37:03 PM

njalterio, you quoted me before I changed my mind, lol. Anyway the Enermax Galaxy S DXX is slightly better bang for the buck and the stability is slightly higher in some cases, it also looks cooler!
July 31, 2008 5:38:45 PM

themyrmidon said:
nVidia chipsets run hotter, but can handle the heat. My 680i has goten my E8300 to 4 on air. Look at the 3DMark records, as much as I hate benchmarks, all the best scores are done with nVidia chipsets.


False, the best score in 3dmark06 was 32,601 and the manufacturer of that board was Asustek.
July 31, 2008 5:39:53 PM

The_Blood_Raven said:
njalterio, you quoted me before I changed my mind, lol. Anyway the Enermax Galaxy S DXX is slightly better bang for the buck and the stability is slightly higher in some cases, it also looks cooler!


No no I wasn't critcizing you! I just was wondering if the PSU tier list has been updated.
July 31, 2008 5:41:42 PM

gamerk316 I agree to a certain extent. From what I have seen so far Nehalem will only be slightly faster than the current high end and is not worth the price. However, I do not think you should skip over it entirely, after the dust has cleared a little bit and a decent DDR3 set up is under $300, we will see real performance increases for the price. Then even after that the new Nehalem architecture will be pushed much further and it should start to really shine.
July 31, 2008 5:46:18 PM

njalterio said:
No no I wasn't critcizing you! I just was wondering if the PSU tier list has been updated.


Oh no problem, I haven't seen the list in awhile so I do not know. I do know the construction, ratings, performance, and the hardware used in many power supplies and that is how I form my opinions. You can't really go by the list too much, because the PSUs are updated and there can be discrepancies in the power ratings of even the best PSUs if they are bad from the factory. Look at the Cooler Master 1000w, it sucked and so it has a bad rating in the list, but the new revision is pretty decent.
July 31, 2008 5:47:39 PM

Quote:
not sure on the question but IS IT WORTH FCUKING SHOUTING!!!!


Erm... ok....
July 31, 2008 5:51:00 PM

I only ask because I haven't seen my PSU on the list at all. It seems to be really stable although with my system I doubt I stress it to that point. Reviews were very good (not newegg, real reviews), but nothing on the tier list....
July 31, 2008 5:52:30 PM

Is the q9450 overclocks badly than q6600
July 31, 2008 6:02:27 PM

The_Blood_Raven said:
Aaaahhhh... those gave me a good laugh.


Raven, do you own a 780i? Go to newegg and read all the reviews on the XFX 780i board... after over 100 reviews it enjoys a perfect score (5 eggs).

I use it and has been superb at overcloking. Definitely the best choice out of all the Nvidia chipsets for anyone that wants to go SLI.
July 31, 2008 6:10:02 PM

Quote:
seriously now, you didn't just mention newegg reviews as proof of something did you?


?

Anything wrong with people commenting on an item they own?

Seriously, the 680i was bad, and unfortunately Nvidia got a bad rep from that (and the 750i to some extent) and they haven't been able to recover from it. EVGA + XFX 780is are good boards. If you don't own a 780i then Shhhhh please.
July 31, 2008 6:10:04 PM

Rubenov said:
The 780i is THE BEST Nvidia chipset. 680i gave a lot of trouble, 790i's are giving a lot of issues and are not worth it.

He can't go wrong with an XFX or EVGA 780i mobo... very overclocking friendly as well.

I started reading this thread and I got to this point and had to comment.

The 780i is nothing more than a 680i with an extra pci-e controller for 3 16x slots. It has all the same problems that the 680i has and is more than 18 months old yet is still premium priced. Nvidia chipsets are absolute garbage with the only exception being the 790i but a bargain 790i board is $350 with the most expensive being ~$450, utterly ridiculous. Nvidia sells sub-par chipsets for higher than premium prices because they have sole rights to SLI and people will buy them.


OP: To answer your question I would say no it's not worth the wait as currently you can build a very capable gaming system for a very reasonable price. Nehalem will be an increase over what is currently available but as others have wrote you will have to wait about a year for full availability and for the prices to have come down a little. Build a system now and upgrade in a couple years when the 32nm refresh is released.
a b à CPUs
July 31, 2008 6:13:44 PM

bonecrush said:
Is the q9450 overclocks badly than q6600


All the extreme edition do; my 9650 was only able to hit 3.45 (up from 3.0 stock). Still, the extra cache size makes the chip more desirable if price is not an option.

And yes, once people make the switch to DDR3, Nehalem will show its power, but I suspect the majority will upgrade CPU/Motherboard, and carry their old RAM over. If 3.45 Quad and 4GB DDR3 (1333) isn't enough to run everything on gods green earth for the next two years, then something is really off.
July 31, 2008 6:18:14 PM

I am pondering the same question but I will use my PC more for video editing/encoding with occasional gaming. Would Nehalem do encoding much better than what available now?
July 31, 2008 6:22:02 PM

ausch30 you beat me to it! damn you!!!! Yes I own a 780i, did you not read the 680i in my config? I've built a system with a "7"80i before for a friend, like my P.O.S. 680i it could not overclock a dualcore to any reasonable height without a huge change in voltage. He wanted 2 250 GB Raptors in Raid 0, and we quickly found that there was absolutely NO difference in performance between that and his old >IDE< 320 GB drive. I wont even go through all the problems I went through trying to enable 4Gb of RAM!!! We eventually sent it back and got a cheap P35 and it doubled the overclocking performance and with it those 2 Raptors absolutely screamed.
July 31, 2008 6:28:48 PM

The_Blood_Raven said:
ausch30 you beat me to it! damn you!!!! Yes I own a 780i, did you not read the 680i in my config? I've built a system with a "7"80i before for a friend, like my P.O.S. 680i it could not overclock a dualcore to any reasonable height without a huge change in voltage. He wanted 2 250 GB Raptors in Raid 0, and we quickly found that there was absolutely NO difference in performance between that and his old >IDE< 320 GB drive. I wont even go through all the problems I went through trying to enable 4Gb of RAM!!! We eventually sent it back and got a cheap P35 and it doubled the overclocking performance and with it those 2 Raptors absolutely screamed.


One thing I didn't mention that you touched on is the RAID performance between the two. Nvidia's RAID performance is abysmal where as Intel's Matrix Storage gives outstanding RAID performance with very little CPU overhead.


Oh and as for Nvidia's chipsets
http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1045810/00011931...
"On July 2, 2008, NVIDIA Corporation stated that it would take a $150 million to $200 million charge against cost of revenue to cover anticipated customer warranty, repair, return, replacement and other consequential costs and expenses arising from a weak die/packaging material set in certain versions of our previous generation MCP and GPU products used in notebook systems."

It's not just the 680i that are crap.
July 31, 2008 6:32:38 PM

The_Blood_Raven said:
ausch30 you beat me to it! damn you!!!! Yes I own a 780i, did you not read the 680i in my config? I've built a system with a "7"80i before for a friend, like my P.O.S. 680i it could not overclock a dualcore to any reasonable height without a huge change in voltage. He wanted 2 250 GB Raptors in Raid 0, and we quickly found that there was absolutely NO difference in performance between that and his old >IDE< 320 GB drive. I wont even go through all the problems I went through trying to enable 4Gb of RAM!!! We eventually sent it back and got a cheap P35 and it doubled the overclocking performance and with it those 2 Raptors absolutely screamed.


Well then, it sucks that you had a bad experience. I overclocked an E8500 to 3.8Ghz (9x400) while reducing the voltage, and use 8gb 800Mhz DDR2 RAM (4x2) on my 780i board. Haven't even tried going to 4Ghz+, but going judging by how well it has responded and how little voltage I have had to use I'm pretty sure I can. I guess it is fair if you had a bad experience, mine has been exactly the opposite (and I've tried several mbs)

Check signature...
July 31, 2008 6:33:58 PM

bonecrush said:
I am planning to build a gaming rig from scratch my config would be

Q 9450
Evga 780i sli
2 Evga 9800 gtx+
dell 24 inch
logitech g15 keyboard and g5 mouse
corsair 1000 W psu
cooler master cosmos s
wd 500 gb hdd

so people help me is this config good or should i wait for nehalem core



I'd say do it now as from what I've heard, the first Nehalem mobos will be more than $400 (780i is around $300 - depending on features).
a b à CPUs
July 31, 2008 6:36:47 PM

He's assuming. Seems to be a lot of that for Nehalem.

What it sounds like will happen is this: In mid augest, the mid-range Nehalems come out. I figure price will be around $300-$650. Preformance wise, these should match up against the highest non-Extreme-Edition versions of Dual/Quad core CPU they are replacing.

Early next year, the high end version come out, and I expect the prices of the highest version to be well above what the Q9750 was - around $1250 or so. These are the ones that should beat the current generation. Since no one will put out that money for a single CPU (hence, the popularity of the Q6600), I find anything above a Q9450 more than enough for now.

Again though, all of this is guesswork right now.
a b à CPUs
July 31, 2008 6:46:18 PM

@MODS: Please Lock This Thread. This is just point less.
July 31, 2008 6:49:23 PM

+1 for all posts that say nvidia chipsets are crap. Lots of problems not worth it, even if you wanted sli. Since ati has the upperhand for the best price ratio, crossfire looks to be a better option and at least intel chipsets overclock better. The Q9450 isn't that bad of an overclockers, most can reach 3.6ghz easily, just might be mobo limited.
July 31, 2008 6:52:23 PM

Rubenov said:
Well then, it sucks that you had a bad experience. I overclocked an E8500 to 3.8Ghz (9x400) while reducing the voltage, and use 8gb 800Mhz DDR2 RAM (4x2) on my 780i board. Haven't even tried going to 4Ghz+, but going judging by how well it has responded and how little voltage I have had to use I'm pretty sure I can. I guess it is fair if you had a bad experience, mine has been exactly the opposite (and I've tried several mbs)

Check signature...


http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/NVIDIA-790i-SLI,197...

Read the article Tom's just did. It's not that The_Blood_Raven or I had a bad experience it's that you had an unusually good experience. It is possible that you bought the one good chipset they produced but if you look around online there are far more negative remarks than positive ones on Nvidia chipsets.
July 31, 2008 6:59:09 PM

Quote:
unfortunately i have seen that newegg reviewers are not always the most informed and are not to be trusted, indeed some just post complete crap.

I've seen plenty of 5 eggs "Just ordered it it should be here in a few day's" or 1 egg because an OEM drive didn't come with cables or taking an egg off because the clearly IDE drive they bought wasn't sata or because the PSU they bought didn't have modular cables when they knew that when they bought it. Most Newegg reviewers aren't nearly as knowledgeable as they give themselves credit for but you can find some good information in the reviews.
July 31, 2008 7:06:16 PM

TRi channel memory is worth waiting for. Amazing 9 meg performance.

July 31, 2008 7:48:06 PM

E8600 - $190
Gigabyte X48-DQ6 - $285
Corsair 4GB DDR2 1066 - $140
WD Velociraptor - $290
WD 1TB Caviar Black - $200
Powercolor HD 4870 - $255 (after MIR) x 2
Antec TPQ 1000W - $200

Add case ($200 at most), DVD drive ($30), Vista Ultimate 64 ($180)

Total - $2225

That's probably the baddest gaming computer you can buy right now for <$2500

Edit: to answer your question - Does your computer do everything you want it to do right now?
If yes, wait (like me, since I'm happy with my build's capabilities still, barely)
If no, build (it is a very good time to build)
July 31, 2008 8:00:01 PM

Shadow703793 said:
@MODS: Please Lock This Thread. This is just point less.


+1
July 31, 2008 8:18:08 PM

kylSTL makes a good point. if you are cool with your current set up then wait. worst case scenario you don't go nehalem but have better pricing on the stuff you were going to get anyhow. but if you need a new system pretty bad (just getting by or your current system is way bad) then pull the trigger. you shouldn't be disappointed with what you can get right now.
August 1, 2008 4:19:50 PM

Shadow703793 said:
@MODS: Please Lock This Thread. This is just point less.



people helping me to build a new rig


For other just post crap like this one just close the thread
August 1, 2008 5:50:56 PM

So bonecrush, what are your thoughts now about the options? Are you going to wait or build? If build, what setup are you thinking of?
August 1, 2008 6:19:38 PM

i am thinking of to build it.
(it may sound funny)
But i want my investment to stay long atleast (3-4 years)
!