Why do LCD HDTV monitors have a resolution of 1366 x 768?

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

The Sharp Aquos that I bought does 1920x1080... Its an LCD...

"Paul A. Jacobi" <p.jacobi@nononospam.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:r7ydnUgsSo6t_LneRVn-jA@comcast.com...
> I've noticed a number of widescreen LCD HDTV monitors have a resolution of
> 1366 x 768. Why is such an imperfect multiple of 16:9 used? It seems to
> me
> that a resolution of 1600 x 900 would be the best fit for HDTV. Does any
> LCD monitors exist with a resolution of 1600 x 900? Is the odd resolution
> that is currently sold today an indication that the LCD technology is not
> quite mature for HDTV?
>
>
> Paul A. Jacobi
> p dot jacobi at comcast dot net
>
>
>
>
>

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

The 768 is the key number in the 1366x768 screens. If you start with a
1024x768 4:3 XGA screen, you get 1366 pixels when cutting for a 16:9
screen. 50" plasmas are mostly 1366x768 as well (with the exception of
the 1280x768 Pioneers).

Since all HD TVs have to be able to scale 480i, 720p, 1080i to the
resolution of the set, scaling to 1366x768 is no big deal. I expect we
will see HD TVs evolve to 1280x720 for smaller TVs, and 1920x1080 for
bigger sets, but it will be a while before the 1366x768 sizes go away.
But for TV watching on a TV of 50" or less from a sitting distance of 10
feet or so, 1366x768 works just fine.

As for 1600x900, why mess around with that and just go right to
1920x1080 for a TV or 1920x1200 (15:9) for a computer monitor?

Alan F



Paul A. Jacobi wrote:

> I've noticed a number of widescreen LCD HDTV monitors have a resolution of
> 1366 x 768. Why is such an imperfect multiple of 16:9 used? It seems to me
> that a resolution of 1600 x 900 would be the best fit for HDTV. Does any
> LCD monitors exist with a resolution of 1600 x 900? Is the odd resolution
> that is currently sold today an indication that the LCD technology is not
> quite mature for HDTV?
>
>
> Paul A. Jacobi
> p dot jacobi at comcast dot net

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 12:52:23 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi <p.jacobi@nononospam.comcast.net> wrote:

| I've noticed a number of widescreen LCD HDTV monitors have a resolution of
| 1366 x 768. Why is such an imperfect multiple of 16:9 used? It seems to me
| that a resolution of 1600 x 900 would be the best fit for HDTV. Does any
| LCD monitors exist with a resolution of 1600 x 900? Is the odd resolution
| that is currently sold today an indication that the LCD technology is not
| quite mature for HDTV?

It's probably due to the legacy of LCD designs previously made for use
as computer monitors. Since they already had the design files done and
the manufacturing tooled up for making computer monitors, it represnted
the least costly way to get started in LCD TVs. I'm sure changes will
be coming about.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Phil Howard KA9WGN | http://linuxhomepage.com/ http://ham.org/ |
| (first name) at ipal.net | http://phil.ipal.org/ http://ka9wgn.ham.org/ |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

<phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
news g24j24302u@news1.newsguy.com...
> It's probably due to the legacy of LCD designs previously made for use
> as computer monitors.

That's just as I expected. 1366x768 is left-over from computer monitor. I
think I will wait until LCD panels are built specifically for HDTV. Sharp
Aquos seem to be in the lead at producing 1920x1080 panels. Now when will I
be able to buy such a panel for under $2K?


Paul A. Jacobi
p dot jacobi at comcast dot net

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Paul A. Jacobi" <p.jacobi@nononospam.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:KvSdnTX4RM6KILneRVn-tA@comcast.com...
>
> Sharp Aquos seem to be in the lead at producing 1920x1080 panels. Now
> when will >I be able to buy such a panel for under $2K?


Here are some under $2k available right now:
Sceptre 37",
http://www.mergedigital.com/technology/me-tech-gadget-w...

And a Westy 37",

http://www.westinghousedigital.com/products/monitors/pr...

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:24:28 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi <p.jacobi@nononospam.comcast.net> wrote:

| <phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
| news g24j24302u@news1.newsguy.com...
|> It's probably due to the legacy of LCD designs previously made for use
|> as computer monitors.
|
| That's just as I expected. 1366x768 is left-over from computer monitor. I
| think I will wait until LCD panels are built specifically for HDTV. Sharp
| Aquos seem to be in the lead at producing 1920x1080 panels. Now when will I
| be able to buy such a panel for under $2K?

Actually, I'd like to see the 1920x1080 panels used for computer monitor
purposes, too (yes, at 16:9). Maybe if this is done, that will how bring
down the price by making it the standard size to tool up manufacturing.
That, and products can have dual-use.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Phil Howard KA9WGN | http://linuxhomepage.com/ http://ham.org/ |
| (first name) at ipal.net | http://phil.ipal.org/ http://ka9wgn.ham.org/ |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

<phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
news g3tm45ok8@news3.newsguy.com...
> On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:24:28 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi
> <p.jacobi@nononospam.comcast.net> wrote:
>
> | <phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
> | news g24j24302u@news1.newsguy.com...
> |> It's probably due to the legacy of LCD designs previously made for use
> |> as computer monitors.
> |
> | That's just as I expected. 1366x768 is left-over from computer monitor.
> I
> | think I will wait until LCD panels are built specifically for HDTV.
> Sharp
> | Aquos seem to be in the lead at producing 1920x1080 panels. Now when
> will I
> | be able to buy such a panel for under $2K?
>
> Actually, I'd like to see the 1920x1080 panels used for computer monitor
> purposes, too (yes, at 16:9). Maybe if this is done, that will how bring
> down the price by making it the standard size to tool up manufacturing.
> That, and products can have dual-use.
>
> --
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> | Phil Howard KA9WGN | http://linuxhomepage.com/
> http://ham.org/ |
> | (first name) at ipal.net | http://phil.ipal.org/
> http://ka9wgn.ham.org/ |
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------


Is this the type of dual-use monitor you're looking for?

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=2...

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

<phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
news g3tm45ok8@news3.newsguy.com...
> On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:24:28 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi
> Actually, I'd like to see the 1920x1080 panels used for computer
> monitor
> purposes, too (yes, at 16:9). Maybe if this is done, that will how
> bring
> down the price by making it the standard size to tool up
> manufacturing.
> That, and products can have dual-use.

This 24" 1920x1200 looks pretty good:
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/ProductDetail.aspx?T...

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Markeau" <please_reply@news.group> wrote in message
news:qdadnQAGldrMj7veRVn-sQ@giganews.com...
>
> <phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
> news g3tm45ok8@news3.newsguy.com...
>> On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:24:28 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi
>> Actually, I'd like to see the 1920x1080 panels used for computer monitor
>> purposes, too (yes, at 16:9). Maybe if this is done, that will how bring
>> down the price by making it the standard size to tool up manufacturing.
>> That, and products can have dual-use.
>
> This 24" 1920x1200 looks pretty good:
> http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/ProductDetail.aspx?T...

It's getting rave reviews and available with a new PC for ~$450. :-O

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Mon, 12 Sep 2005 18:42:05 -0500 Markeau <please_reply@news.group> wrote:
|
| <phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
| news g3tm45ok8@news3.newsguy.com...
|> On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:24:28 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi
|> Actually, I'd like to see the 1920x1080 panels used for computer
|> monitor
|> purposes, too (yes, at 16:9). Maybe if this is done, that will how
|> bring
|> down the price by making it the standard size to tool up
|> manufacturing.
|> That, and products can have dual-use.
|
| This 24" 1920x1200 looks pretty good:
| http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/ProductDetail.aspx?T...

For myself, I'd be looking for one at 18 to 20 inches.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Phil Howard KA9WGN | http://linuxhomepage.com/ http://ham.org/ |
| (first name) at ipal.net | http://phil.ipal.org/ http://ka9wgn.ham.org/ |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Mon, 12 Sep 2005 14:19:15 -0400 David <davey@home.net> wrote:
| <phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
| news g3tm45ok8@news3.newsguy.com...
|> On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:24:28 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi
|> <p.jacobi@nononospam.comcast.net> wrote:
|>
|> | <phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
|> | news g24j24302u@news1.newsguy.com...
|> |> It's probably due to the legacy of LCD designs previously made for use
|> |> as computer monitors.
|> |
|> | That's just as I expected. 1366x768 is left-over from computer monitor.
|> I
|> | think I will wait until LCD panels are built specifically for HDTV.
|> Sharp
|> | Aquos seem to be in the lead at producing 1920x1080 panels. Now when
|> will I
|> | be able to buy such a panel for under $2K?
|>
|> Actually, I'd like to see the 1920x1080 panels used for computer monitor
|> purposes, too (yes, at 16:9). Maybe if this is done, that will how bring
|> down the price by making it the standard size to tool up manufacturing.
|> That, and products can have dual-use.
|>
|> --
|> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|> | Phil Howard KA9WGN | http://linuxhomepage.com/
|> http://ham.org/ |
|> | (first name) at ipal.net | http://phil.ipal.org/
|> http://ka9wgn.ham.org/ |
|> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|
|
| Is this the type of dual-use monitor you're looking for?
|
| http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=2...

Hardly.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Phil Howard KA9WGN | http://linuxhomepage.com/ http://ham.org/ |
| (first name) at ipal.net | http://phil.ipal.org/ http://ka9wgn.ham.org/ |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Mon, 12 Sep 2005 18:42:05 -0500 Markeau <please_reply@news.group> wrote:
|
| <phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
| news g3tm45ok8@news3.newsguy.com...
|> On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:24:28 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi
|> Actually, I'd like to see the 1920x1080 panels used for computer
|> monitor
|> purposes, too (yes, at 16:9). Maybe if this is done, that will how
|> bring
|> down the price by making it the standard size to tool up
|> manufacturing.
|> That, and products can have dual-use.
|
| This 24" 1920x1200 looks pretty good:
| http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/ProductDetail.aspx?T...

There does not seem to be any HDCP support. That kinda ruins it for
general purpose TV (unless I'm willing to skip over copy protected
content, which I'm not).

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Phil Howard KA9WGN | http://linuxhomepage.com/ http://ham.org/ |
| (first name) at ipal.net | http://phil.ipal.org/ http://ka9wgn.ham.org/ |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

phil-news-nospam@ipal.net wrote:
> On Mon, 12 Sep 2005 18:42:05 -0500 Markeau <please_reply@news.group> wrote:
> |
> | <phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
> | news g3tm45ok8@news3.newsguy.com...
> |> On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:24:28 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi
> |> Actually, I'd like to see the 1920x1080 panels used for computer
> |> monitor
> |> purposes, too (yes, at 16:9). Maybe if this is done, that will how
> |> bring
> |> down the price by making it the standard size to tool up
> |> manufacturing.
> |> That, and products can have dual-use.
> |
> | This 24" 1920x1200 looks pretty good:
> | http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/ProductDetail.aspx?T...
>
> There does not seem to be any HDCP support. That kinda ruins it for
> general purpose TV (unless I'm willing to skip over copy protected
> content, which I'm not).


Which copy protected content would that be? The industry hasn't even
settled on a HD standard for DVDs yet. They'll be duking it out with
their collective thumbs up their rumps for the next couple of years. In
the meantime, I think I'd rather just buy a quality set and ignore the
HDCP silliness since it's unlikely to be an issue for years to come.

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

In article <ehGVe.278$zN6.32@fe10.lga>, Ritz <ritz@mordor.net> wrote:
>phil-news-nospam@ipal.net wrote:
>> | This 24" 1920x1200 looks pretty good:
>>
>> There does not seem to be any HDCP support. That kinda ruins it for
>> general purpose TV (unless I'm willing to skip over copy protected
>> content, which I'm not).
>
>Which copy protected content would that be? The industry hasn't even
>settled on a HD standard for DVDs yet. They'll be duking it out with
>their collective thumbs up their rumps for the next couple of years. In
>the meantime, I think I'd rather just buy a quality set and ignore the
>HDCP silliness since it's unlikely to be an issue for years to come.

It's been pretty widely publicised that both Blu-ray and HD-DVD will
require HDMI or DVI/HDCP to display at HDTV quality.

Buying any kind of set now to use as your primary TV that doesn't
support HDMI is foolish. That monitor, however, is designed for PC use.
It's huge and expensive by monitor standards and very small by TV
standards.

Ralf.
--
Ranulf Doswell | Please note this e-mail address
www.ranulf.net | expires one month after posting.

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Ranulf Doswell wrote:
> In article <ehGVe.278$zN6.32@fe10.lga>, Ritz <ritz@mordor.net> wrote:
>
>>phil-news-nospam@ipal.net wrote:
>>
>>>| This 24" 1920x1200 looks pretty good:
>>>
>>>There does not seem to be any HDCP support. That kinda ruins it for
>>>general purpose TV (unless I'm willing to skip over copy protected
>>>content, which I'm not).
>>
>>Which copy protected content would that be? The industry hasn't even
>>settled on a HD standard for DVDs yet. They'll be duking it out with
>>their collective thumbs up their rumps for the next couple of years. In
>>the meantime, I think I'd rather just buy a quality set and ignore the
>>HDCP silliness since it's unlikely to be an issue for years to come.
>
>
> It's been pretty widely publicised that both Blu-ray and HD-DVD will
> require HDMI or DVI/HDCP to display at HDTV quality.

Please let me know when there are any blue-ray or HD-DVD titles
available or any players even for sale. I suspect there won't be ANY
significant amount of content available until the format wars are over.
That will be years.


> Buying any kind of set now to use as your primary TV that doesn't
> support HDMI is foolish. That monitor, however, is designed for PC use.
> It's huge and expensive by monitor standards and very small by TV
> standards.

Are you talking about HDMI or HDCP? There are a LOT of monitors that
support both HDMI and/or DVI now that do NOT support HDCP. Very few
monitors support it, as a matter of fact. And it is a worthless spec
until that moment in time when you cannot watch content that's ONLY
available in HD-whatever format. And even then, you will still be able
to watch the content in 480i. I don't think any studios are going to
put themselves in that position for the forseable future. So you're if
you're worried about your TV not being able to play the highest end HD
content in 4-5 years, then you should spend lots of money now to get the
appropriate display which may or may not even work when the HDMI 1.2 or
1.3 specs are finalised. Or you can get something that actually works
TODAY and will keep working for years and upgrade when you feel like the
HD format war has been won by one or the other combatants.

And that Dell monitor is dirt cheap when you consider its size. Look at
what Apple charges for their 23" cinema display.

Cheers,

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Tue, 13 Sep 2005 16:04:27 -0400 Ritz <ritz@mordor.net> wrote:
| phil-news-nospam@ipal.net wrote:
|> On Mon, 12 Sep 2005 18:42:05 -0500 Markeau <please_reply@news.group> wrote:
|> |
|> | <phil-news-nospam@ipal.net> wrote in message
|> | news g3tm45ok8@news3.newsguy.com...
|> |> On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:24:28 -0400 Paul A. Jacobi
|> |> Actually, I'd like to see the 1920x1080 panels used for computer
|> |> monitor
|> |> purposes, too (yes, at 16:9). Maybe if this is done, that will how
|> |> bring
|> |> down the price by making it the standard size to tool up
|> |> manufacturing.
|> |> That, and products can have dual-use.
|> |
|> | This 24" 1920x1200 looks pretty good:
|> | http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/ProductDetail.aspx?T...
|>
|> There does not seem to be any HDCP support. That kinda ruins it for
|> general purpose TV (unless I'm willing to skip over copy protected
|> content, which I'm not).
|
|
| Which copy protected content would that be? The industry hasn't even
| settled on a HD standard for DVDs yet. They'll be duking it out with
| their collective thumbs up their rumps for the next couple of years. In
| the meantime, I think I'd rather just buy a quality set and ignore the
| HDCP silliness since it's unlikely to be an issue for years to come.

You take your chances.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Phil Howard KA9WGN | http://linuxhomepage.com/ http://ham.org/ |
| (first name) at ipal.net | http://phil.ipal.org/ http://ka9wgn.ham.org/ |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Tue, 13 Sep 2005 18:11:31 -0400 Ritz <ritz@mordor.net> wrote:

| Please let me know when there are any blue-ray or HD-DVD titles
| available or any players even for sale. I suspect there won't be ANY
| significant amount of content available until the format wars are over.

Since both Blu-Ray and HD-DVD will have HDCP copy protection, the
content industry would have no problem putting out content in BOTH
formats, if the format wars is not concluded by the time it would
be the best point to make their content available in pre-recorded
format for the home.


| Are you talking about HDMI or HDCP? There are a LOT of monitors that
| support both HDMI and/or DVI now that do NOT support HDCP. Very few
| monitors support it, as a matter of fact. And it is a worthless spec

As one who is looking around for a monitor/display, I do see that HDCP
capability is being provided in many monitors now.


| until that moment in time when you cannot watch content that's ONLY
| available in HD-whatever format. And even then, you will still be able
| to watch the content in 480i. I don't think any studios are going to
| put themselves in that position for the forseable future. So you're if

I think they will within a couple years. Afterall, as you say, the
content can still be seen in 480i (but I have also heard 480p will be
allowed).

More info:

http://tv.about.com/od/hdtv/a/hdmidvihdcp.htm


| you're worried about your TV not being able to play the highest end HD
| content in 4-5 years, then you should spend lots of money now to get the
| appropriate display which may or may not even work when the HDMI 1.2 or
| 1.3 specs are finalised. Or you can get something that actually works
| TODAY and will keep working for years and upgrade when you feel like the
| HD format war has been won by one or the other combatants.

Or maybe buy this device if you have VGA inputs:

http://www.spatz-tech.de/spatz/dvi_hdcp.htm

Of course, if this turns out to be too easy to rip high definition quality,
the content industry could revoke its key and content released after that
revocation won't be decryptable.


| And that Dell monitor is dirt cheap when you consider its size. Look at
| what Apple charges for their 23" cinema display.

It could be that Dell is unloading their non-HDCP stock faster with a
lower price.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Phil Howard KA9WGN | http://linuxhomepage.com/ http://ham.org/ |
| (first name) at ipal.net | http://phil.ipal.org/ http://ka9wgn.ham.org/ |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Ritz wrote:
>
> Please let me know when there are any blue-ray or HD-DVD titles
> available or any players even for sale. I suspect there won't be ANY
> significant amount of content available until the format wars are over.
> That will be years.

There won't be any real format war. If the two formats get merged, the
problem goes away. And if the two formats remain separate, then it won't
be long before manufacturers build players that can handle both formats.
So either way we'll have content on the market next year.

> Are you talking about HDMI or HDCP? There are a LOT of monitors that
> support both HDMI and/or DVI now that do NOT support HDCP. Very few
> monitors support it, as a matter of fact.

I'm not aware of any current set that doesn't support HDCP. I'm sure
there are a few cheap ones around that cut that corner, and perhaps some
older models like the stuff you see at Sam's Club and Costco. I think
you might need to spend some time reviewing what's actually on the market.

My Samsung supports it, and it's two generations old new. Heck, even the
cheapest model at Walmart has HDCP.