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Help! would e6300@1.8Ghz bottleneck my 4870?

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August 13, 2008 6:16:51 AM

Guys,


Hi! I just bought my 4870 and for some reason I am still getting kinda low FPS from my games such as Vegas 2 and Age of Conan. All I can come up with is that I am being bottlenecked by my CPU. I am open to learning how to OC my CPU but I think it is impossible with my mobo (intel dq965gf). I also have 3G DDR2. Please help would be great for I am not good with really technical computer stuff.

P.S if a CPU upgrade would do the trick would i be better off with e8400 or q6600

Thanks!
August 13, 2008 6:30:06 AM

Macer1,



I already got the latest drivers for my 4870 even before I posted. That was my initial solution of the low fps.



Thanks!!
Related resources
August 13, 2008 6:35:39 AM

your cpu is good enough dont waste your money
August 13, 2008 6:36:36 AM

Guys,


I would just like to post my system details from dxdiag.

------------------
System Information
------------------
Time of this report: 8/13/2008, 14:31:10
Machine name: MUNZ
Operating System: Windows XP Professional (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2 (2600.xpsp.060411-1541)
Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: INTEL_
System Model: DQ965GF_
BIOS: Default System BIOS
Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU 6300 @ 1.86GHz (2 CPUs)
Memory: 3062MB RAM
Page File: 868MB used, 4078MB available
Windows Dir: C:\WINDOWS
DirectX Version: DirectX 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904)
DX Setup Parameters: Not found
DxDiag Version: 5.03.2600.2180 32bit Unicode

------------
DxDiag Notes
------------
DirectX Files Tab: No problems found.
Display Tab 1: No problems found.
Sound Tab 1: No problems found.
Sound Tab 2: No problems found.
Music Tab: No problems found.
Input Tab: No problems found.
Network Tab: No problems found.

--------------------
DirectX Debug Levels
--------------------
Direct3D: 0/4 (n/a)
DirectDraw: 0/4 (retail)
DirectInput: 0/5 (n/a)
DirectMusic: 0/5 (n/a)
DirectPlay: 0/9 (retail)
DirectSound: 0/5 (retail)
DirectShow: 0/6 (retail)

---------------
Display Devices
---------------
Card name: ATI Radeon HD 4800 Series
Manufacturer: ATI Technologies Inc.
Chip type: ATI Radeon Graphics Processor (0x9440)
DAC type: Internal DAC(400MHz)
Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_9440&SUBSYS_05021002&REV_00
Display Memory: 512.0 MB
Current Mode: 1280 x 1024 (32 bit) (60Hz)
Monitor: Plug and Play Monitor
Monitor Max Res: 1600,1200
Driver Name: ati2dvag.dll
Driver Version: 6.14.0010.6833 (English)
DDI Version: 9 (or higher)
Driver Attributes: Final Retail
Driver Date/Size: 7/4/2008 11:23:45, 309248 bytes
WHQL Logo'd: Yes
WHQL Date Stamp: n/a
VDD: n/a
Mini VDD: ati2mtag.sys
Mini VDD Date: 7/4/2008 14:33:33, 3230720 bytes
Device Identifier: {D7B71EE2-D700-11CF-0369-0825A1C2CB35}
Vendor ID: 0x1002
Device ID: 0x9440
SubSys ID: 0x05021002
Revision ID: 0x0000
Revision ID: 0x0000
Video Accel: ModeMPEG2_C ModeMPEG2_D
Deinterlace Caps: {6E8329FF-B642-418B-BCF0-BCB6591E255F}: Format(In/Out)=(YUY2,YUY2) Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,1) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_PixelAdaptive
{335AA36E-7884-43A4-9C91-7F87FAF3E37E}: Format(In/Out)=(YUY2,YUY2) Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,0) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_BOBVerticalStretch
{6E8329FF-B642-418B-BCF0-BCB6591E255F}: Format(In/Out)=(UYVY,UYVY) Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,1) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_PixelAdaptive
{335AA36E-7884-43A4-9C91-7F87FAF3E37E}: Format(In/Out)=(UYVY,UYVY) Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,0) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_BOBVerticalStretch
{3C5323C1-6FB7-44F5-9081-056BF2EE449D}: Format(In/Out)=(NV12,0x3231564e) Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,2) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_PixelAdaptive
{552C0DAD-CCBC-420B-83C8-74943CF9F1A6}: Format(In/Out)=(NV12,0x3231564e) Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,2) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_PixelAdaptive
{6E8329FF-B642-418B-BCF0-BCB6591E255F}: Format(In/Out)=(NV12,0x3231564e) Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,1) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_PixelAdaptive
{335AA36E-7884-43A4-9C91-7F87FAF3E37E}: Format(In/Out)=(NV12,0x3231564e) Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,0) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_BOBVerticalStretch
Registry: OK
DDraw Status: Enabled
D3D Status: Enabled
AGP Status: Enabled
DDraw Test Result: Not run
D3D7 Test Result: Not run
D3D8 Test Result: Not run
D3D9 Test Result: Not run



If you guys see anything wrong please post it here :D 
August 13, 2008 6:51:16 AM

th_username said:
your cpu is good enough dont waste your money



any idea how I can improve my fps? I am really lost why my 4870 is giving me ave of 15-25 fps in age of conan.



PS my bro got e6750 2GB DDR2 and an 8800gt OC and is still getting a lot better FPS than me in Age of Conan and Vegas2.




August 13, 2008 6:58:58 AM

Why don't you download gpu-z and get and idea of how much work your unit is doing, that way you'll know for sure if the cpu data isn't driving the gpu.
August 13, 2008 7:00:18 AM

Yes it is bottle necking. CPU plays a big role in AoC. I know from experience. Its not optimized for quad so a faster dual core will be better.

If your mobo wont overclock check into the BSEL pin mod.
August 13, 2008 7:02:37 AM

Vertigon said:
Why don't you download gpu-z and get and idea of how much work your unit is doing, that way you'll know for sure if the cpu data isn't driving the gpu.


Vertigon,


Thanks for the great suggestion...will be trying it out...be back with the results.



Thanks!
August 13, 2008 7:30:03 AM

roadrunner197069 said:
Yes it is bottle necking. CPU plays a big role in AoC. I know from experience. Its not optimized for quad so a faster dual core will be better.

If your mobo wont overclock check into the BSEL pin mod.



Faithful,


Sorry but I dont know what the BSEL pin mod is. Help?


Is it a downloadable program?

Thanks!
August 13, 2008 7:32:42 AM

check in bios and make sure something like your pci-e lanes isnt down to x1
August 13, 2008 7:33:23 AM

carlosmunoz08 said:
Vertigon,


Thanks for the great suggestion...will be trying it out...be back with the results.



Thanks!










Guys, here are the charts from Gpu-z, am I right in saying my Gpu is really under utilized? (taken while running vegas 2 )



Thanks!
August 13, 2008 7:49:08 AM


Are you sure there are no other video driver conflicts?

Also why can't you OC that chip? Have you tried it in bios?
August 13, 2008 8:03:20 AM

BSEL mod is an overclocking method. You connect pins on your CPU using conductive ink to increase the FSB. It's just like increasing the FSB using the BIOS. It is tricky and I don't recommend it, but it may be for you. The reason people do it is because their BIOS won't let them increase the FSB.

I definitely think your 1.86 E6300 is bottle necking your 4870. If you will upgrade, go for at least 2.4GHz, preferably 2.6Ghz or higher. Between the Q6600 and the E8400, I would pick the Q6600 because 2 more cores is a pretty decent upgrade. While the E8400 increases clock speed a lot, it doesn't add more cores. The Q6600 is kind of a balance between more cores and more clock speed.
August 13, 2008 8:09:30 AM

froggyluv said:
Are you sure there are no other video driver conflicts?

Also why can't you OC that chip? Have you tried it in bios?



no BIOS options for the intel dq965gf searched a lot of forums. QQ
August 13, 2008 8:10:37 AM

pcgamer12 said:
BSEL mod is an overclocking method. You connect pins using conductive ink to increase the FSB. It's just like increasing the FSB using the BIOS. It is tricky and I don't recommend it, but it may be for you. The reason people do it is because their BIOS won't let them increase the FSB.



Yea i Think this would be too much for me...might just destroy the PC
August 13, 2008 8:23:34 AM

pcgamer12 said:
BSEL mod is an overclocking method. You connect pins on your CPU using conductive ink to increase the FSB. It's just like increasing the FSB using the BIOS. It is tricky and I don't recommend it, but it may be for you. The reason people do it is because their BIOS won't let them increase the FSB.

I definitely think your 1.86 E6300 is bottle necking your 4870. If you will upgrade, go for at least 2.4GHz, preferably 2.6Ghz or higher. Between the Q6600 and the E8400, I would pick the Q6600 because 2 more cores is a pretty decent upgrade. While the E8400 increases clock speed a lot, it doesn't add more cores. The Q6600 is kind of a balance between more cores and more clock speed.


Then i better start saving up for Q6600, when running AoC windowed mode I can see the "CPU usage" from task manager to average at 70-80% does this add to the proof of being bottlenecked by my cpu?
a b à CPUs
August 13, 2008 8:26:35 AM

1.83Ghz c2d bottle neck a 9600GT when it comes to cpu intensive games or a game running at low resolution.........u will be fine playing gpu intensive games though

this is how u check if ur cpu is the bottleneck.
-note the fps u r getting at ur current resolution.
-then lower the resolution to the next level.(if ur at 1248x1024, go to 1024x865 or sumthing).......
if u note that ur fps dint improive by a significant margine (by more than 5fps), it will mean that ur cpu is bottlenecking ur card

NOTE: lower detail level too while chking fps
a b à CPUs
August 13, 2008 8:29:32 AM

carlosmunoz08 said:
Then i better start saving up for Q6600, when running AoC windowed mode I can see the "CPU usage" from task manager to average at 70-80% does this add to the proof of being bottlenecked by my cpu?


i dont see y u should get a new CPU altogether.....jus OC ur CPU to 2.6GHz and u will be fine.
August 13, 2008 8:31:42 AM

sarwar_r87 said:
1.83Ghz c2d bottle neck a 9600GT when it comes to cpu intensive games or a game running at lot resolution.........u will be fine playing gpu intensive games though

this is how u check if ur cpu is the bottleneck.
-note the fps u r getting at ur current resolution.
-then lower the resolution to the next level.(if ur at 1248x1024, go to 1024x865 or sumthing).......
if u note that ur fps dint improive by a significant margine (by more than 5fps), it will mean that ur cpu is bottlenecking ur card


Dude this is a great test, I mean i run 1280x1024 and get round 15-25 fps. All else constant, running @ 1024x768 would not give much of a boost. Same with Vegas 2 changing resolutions between the 2 does not give noticeable FPS boost. QQ (wishing I can resolve this w/o having to spend anymore)
August 13, 2008 8:33:56 AM

sarwar_r87 said:
i dont see y u should get a new CPU altogether.....jus OC ur CPU to 2.6GHz and u will be fine.


mobo intel dq965gf would not allow OC QQ ... If i can only find a way to OC i would be willing to buy cooling instead of a CPU
a b à CPUs
August 13, 2008 8:38:07 AM

carlosmunoz08 said:
Dude this is a great test, I mean i run 1280x1024 and get round 15-25 fps. All else constant, running @ 1024x768 would not give much of a boost. Same with Vegas 2 changing resolutions between the 2 does not give noticeable FPS boost. QQ (wishing I can resolve this w/o having to spend anymore)


sorry to see ur cpu holding ur back.......if u have a aftermarket cooler for ur cpu, then just OC it.i took ma e6300 (when i had one) to 3.2GHz on stock cooler. 3GHz will resolve all cpu botlleneck issues

NOTE: then get a cheap MSI or gigabit MB that allowsu to do moddest OC.....all u need to do is increase FSB to 333.
August 13, 2008 8:41:19 AM

sarwar_r87 said:
sorry to see ur cpu holding ur back.......if u have a aftermarket cooler for ur cpu, then just OC it.i took ma e6300 (when i had one) to 3.2GHz on stock cooler. 3GHz will resolve all cpu botlleneck issues



Dude if i can find a way to OC (doubt it thou) and just oc it up to round 2.6Ghz would the stock cooler be fine until i can buy additional cooling sys.?


oh i just read on another thread about this OC program "set FSB" thoughts on this please :D 
August 13, 2008 8:43:48 AM

sarwar_r87 said:
1.83Ghz c2d bottle neck a 9600GT when it comes to cpu intensive games or a game running at low resolution.........u will be fine playing gpu intensive games though

this is how u check if ur cpu is the bottleneck.
-note the fps u r getting at ur current resolution.
-then lower the resolution to the next level.(if ur at 1248x1024, go to 1024x865 or sumthing).......
if u note that ur fps dint improive by a significant margine (by more than 5fps), it will mean that ur cpu is bottlenecking ur card

NOTE: lower detail level too while chking fps


Eh...no. That's exactly the opposite of what is right.

If you are gaming at low resolutions, you are mostly using your CPU. If you increase your resolution, the game starts being more GPU rather than CPU intensive. So, increase the resolution and see if anything changes.

Your CPU should not be bottlenecking your card. If there is a bottleneck, it's something rather small and not noticeable much.
a b à CPUs
August 13, 2008 8:50:40 AM

i dont think u would need a after market cooler for OC in it to 2.6GHz......2.6GHz is like the stock speed to most common c2d running on stock cooler.

donno much bout that program.
get a cheap MSI or gigabit MB that allowsu to do moddest OC if that software fails

http://www.overclock.net/downloads/255892-setfsb-2-0-a....
a b à CPUs
August 13, 2008 8:51:59 AM

1849705,24,129437 said:
Eh...no. That's exactly the opposite of what is right.

If you are gaming at low resolutions, you are mostly using your CPU. If you increase your resolution, the game starts being more GPU rather than CPU intensive. So, increase the resolution and see if anything changes.
/quotemsg]

ok.....den wat is he supposed to do if he is alreading running at highest possible resolution......

btw....if his cpu is already on bootleneck(which he thinks is) how will he be allowed to use "more CPU" if he lower the resolution. if u increase the resolution then there is a chance that he might hit GPU bottle neck
August 13, 2008 8:55:03 AM

1280x1024 is definitely not the highest resolution he can run his games at...
a b à CPUs
August 13, 2008 8:57:10 AM

nightscope said:
1280x1024 is definitely not the highest resolution he can run his games at...


definately....but it could be the hightest allowed by his monitor

Quote:
btw....if his cpu is already on bootleneck(which he thinks is) how will he be allowed to use "more CPU" if he lower the resolution. if u increase the resolution then there is a chance that he might hit GPU bottle neck
August 13, 2008 9:01:33 AM

nightscope said:
Eh...no. That's exactly the opposite of what is right.

If you are gaming at low resolutions, you are mostly using your CPU. If you increase your resolution, the game starts being more GPU rather than CPU intensive. So, increase the resolution and see if anything changes.

Your CPU should not be bottlenecking your card. If there is a bottleneck, it's something rather small and not noticeable much.



ok here are some screen shots....im really lost now.



August 13, 2008 9:15:01 AM

sarwar_r87 said:
definately....but it could be the hightest allowed by his monitor

Quote:
btw....if his cpu is already on bootleneck(which he thinks is) how will he be allowed to use "more CPU" if he lower the resolution. if u increase the resolution then there is a chance that he might hit GPU bottle neck



Yep THis is the highest because of the monitor :D 
August 13, 2008 9:20:57 AM

sarwar_r87 said:
i dont think u would need a after market cooler for OC in it to 2.6GHz......2.6GHz is like the stock speed to most common c2d running on stock cooler.

donno much bout that program.
get a cheap MSI or gigabit MB that allowsu to do moddest OC if that software fails

http://www.overclock.net/downloads/255892-setfsb-2-0-a....



Sarwar I dont really know how to OC, i really have no experience with this stuff...do u think Asus P5KPL-VM G31 1333/Vpcie/S/GL would be easy to OC (a 1st timer would be able to OC this MOBO) would it be worth spending 1/3 of the price of a new CPU
August 13, 2008 9:50:57 AM


Hmm... not sure how well that G31 chipset will oc. I think you would be better off with a P35 chipset like

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N...

if your in the under the $100 range.

If you go the CPU route I'd say go E8400 since you wont be able to oc on your old board you'll still be running at 3.0Ghz

edit- that games looks kinda fun :0
a b à CPUs
August 13, 2008 9:54:28 AM

i must say m no expert on OC .....
but from ma limited experience:

wats ur ram speed? if its less than 800Mhz, it might be dificult to OC.
theres no auto button for OC. u need to go to bios and change the FSB to 333 or 400 depending on requirement. i say put 333 first and chk for stability. then go to 400 is required.u might need to up ur vcore to atain stability.
u might also need to up ur DDR2 ram voltage from 1.8 to 1.9 or even 2.0 if u wan to change ur FSB to 400 and u dont have 800Mhz bus.

for more info regarding the MB u selected:
http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?p=5476962
a b à CPUs
August 13, 2008 9:56:29 AM

froggyluv said:
Hmm... not sure how well that G31 chipset will oc. I think you would be better off with a P35 chipset like

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N...

if your in the under the $100 range.

If you go the CPU route I'd say go E8400 since you wont be able to oc on your old board you'll still be running at 3.0Ghz

edit- that games looks kinda fun :0


m not sure but i don think a 45nm cpu is supported by ur chipset
August 13, 2008 10:05:05 AM

Yes it is - just check the couple of reviewers on NewEgg + they seem to like it's Oc'ability :) 

edit- oh sorry, you meant that the e8400 isn't supported by the mobo he's already got. Not sure either.
August 13, 2008 10:27:23 AM

sarwar_r87 said:
i must say m no expert on OC .....
but from ma limited experience:

wats ur ram speed? if its less than 800Mhz, it might be dificult to OC.
theres no auto button for OC. u need to go to bios and change the FSB to 333 or 400 depending on requirement. i say put 333 first and chk for stability. then go to 400 is required.u might need to up ur vcore to atain stability.
u might also need to up ur DDR2 ram voltage from 1.8 to 1.9 or even 2.0 if u wan to change ur FSB to 400 and u dont have 800Mhz bus.

for more info regarding the MB u selected:
http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?p=5476962


Dude i removed my dd2 533 so i now got 2g of ddr2 800 (400Mhz) I thought i found the way to overclock my pc thru "set fsb" for it allows OCing for my mobo but for some reason it hangs after i set my fsb to 333
August 13, 2008 10:32:26 AM

In the screen shots you've posted the cpu is at about 65% and the Gpu at about 40%, This means your system will give you a significant power jump if you can wind both to 100%. Question is why can't you get them to 100%. I'd suggest you check the pci bus setting in bios and manually set it at 100Mhz, in case there is some undervolt issue, then run something like prime and lets get your cpu load to 100% so we know that's working fine. Have you got anything that will give you a long render? There's still more power to be had with your system before you worry about buying anything.
August 13, 2008 10:38:55 AM

froggyluv said:
Hmm... not sure how well that G31 chipset will oc. I think you would be better off with a P35 chipset like

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N...

if your in the under the $100 range.

If you go the CPU route I'd say go E8400 since you wont be able to oc on your old board you'll still be running at 3.0Ghz

edit- that games looks kinda fun :0




It is a good game! im just not having as much fun because of the FPS LOL!
August 13, 2008 10:42:53 AM

Vertigon said:
In the screen shots you've posted the cpu is at about 65% and the Gpu at about 40%, This means your system will give you a significant power jump if you can wind both to 100%. Question is why can't you get them to 100%. I'd suggest you check the pci bus setting in bios and manually set it at 100Mhz, in case there is some undervolt issue, then run something like prime and lets get your cpu load to 100% so we know that's working fine. Have you got anything that will give you a long render? There's still more power to be had with your system before you worry about buying anything.


vertigon,

I cant seem to find anything like "PCI bus setting" in my bios, the closest is PCI latency timer set at 32. would this be what you are referring to? :D 


Thanks!
August 13, 2008 11:04:58 AM

Nup. Generally the pci bus is set to auto, which should be 100Mhz by default and works fine on most boards, not all. CHeck in you mobo manual. Also how come your not running DX10? Can you confirm your cpu gets to 100%?
August 13, 2008 11:18:29 AM

Vertigon said:
Nup. Generally the pci bus is set to auto, which should be 100Mhz by default and works fine on most boards, not all. CHeck in you mobo manual. Also how come your not running DX10? Can you confirm your cpu gets to 100%?



was that a "yup" or "nope" i think my pci frequency is 33, sorry im really not good at this.



August 13, 2008 11:19:43 AM

Vertigon said:
Nup. Generally the pci bus is set to auto, which should be 100Mhz by default and works fine on most boards, not all. CHeck in you mobo manual. Also how come your not running DX10? Can you confirm your cpu gets to 100%?



oh im using win xp = no dx10
a b à CPUs
August 13, 2008 11:24:01 AM

carlosmunoz08 said:
Dude i removed my dd2 533 so i now got 2g of ddr2 800 (400Mhz) I thought i found the way to overclock my pc thru "set fsb" for it allows OCing for my mobo but for some reason it hangs after i set my fsb to 333


u thought u found a way is not sumthing u should be doin. b very sure b4 u increaese sumthing or u wil end up with a burnt CPU.

if u get options like "FSB = 266" and tried it to up it to 333 but was unstable, den try uping ur RAM volt to 1.9. also try upping ur vcore.....if u find the option. increment it slowly

but u look reali unsure and if so den i say get a new 65nm CPU. 45nm wont go with ur chipset.
August 13, 2008 11:31:35 AM

You said that there is a "SET FSB" setting.
Is there a "CPU Ratio"? It may be set to something like 3:2 right now.
You will want to change it to 1:1 to easily OC your RAM.

The Problem is Increasing your FSB from 266 to 333 may be OverClocking your RAM and Causing a problem.

August 13, 2008 1:46:30 PM

zenmaster said:
You said that there is a "SET FSB" setting.
Is there a "CPU Ratio"? It may be set to something like 3:2 right now.
You will want to change it to 1:1 to easily OC your RAM.

The Problem is Increasing your FSB from 266 to 333 may be OverClocking your RAM and Causing a problem.



The set ration in the OCing program is 1:2 I dont know how to change it though. Ive been reading on OCing and i Know that my fsb should not go over around 400 but I also dont know how to tweak my ram. Tried to tweak it and i ended up reseting the mobo. Im kinda getting scared of trying already.



August 13, 2008 1:58:50 PM

Sarwar,

You are right my mobo does not support e8400 damn so the choices left are e7200 or Q6600. I'm getting depressed... QQ
August 13, 2008 2:46:03 PM

wow...i would never guess an e6300 would bottleneck a 4870...I was gonna ask if you have enough juice powering your 4870...what psu are you running?

just fyi...I recently installed AOC on my comp just to check it out with my friend's account and I'm getting around 30 fps on high settings at 1920x1200...so you should be blowing me out of the water with your 4870...
!