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Sony KDFE50A10 LCD TV - some comments and questions

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September 19, 2005 1:40:52 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv,rec.video (More info?)

I just exchanged a Mitsubishi WD-52725 DLP for a Sony KDFE50A10 LCD
set (for $500 more). After using the Mitsubishi for over a week and
the Sony for 1 day, here are some comments/questions about the Sony
for anyone who may know:

- Using the same test DVDs, same cables, and same DVD player (a
Toshiba SD-5980 with HDMI cable), the Sony blows the Mitsubishi's
picture away in every category, in my opinion. Sony's brightness,
viewing angle, and colors are so much better. My main reason for
returning the Mitsubishi besides a soft, grainy picture was a problem
with greens and yellows (the yellows looked green). Apparently I'm not
the only one on the Internet who noticed a green issue with this
Mitsubishi unit.

- I'm annoyed that in 720p and 1080i, the Sony and Mitsubishi don't
offer a Normal/Narrow mode. This means I have to switch to component
inputs (480i or 480p) in order to watch a 4:3 DVD without the picture
being distorted. Does anyone know why manufacturers remove
Normal/Narrow options in these higher resolution modes? Is it a
technology limitation or just a "feature" choice on their part?

- When I use 480p on a Toshiba SD-5980 DVD player over either
component or HDMI, vertical panning causes a "grille" effect. If I
switch the player into 480i then there is no problem with vertical
panning. I saw this on both the Mitsubishi and Sony, so I assume it's
the DVD player. It means I have the leave the player in 480i mode with
HDMI set to 1080i. For 16x9 I use the HDMI input and for 4:3 I use the
480i input. Is there any other way to fix this?

- Using Avia's Geometry tests, I found the Sony has a tilt of 1/8" to
1/4". The Mitsubishi had a tilt worse than 1/2", so the Sony's tilt is
small enough it doesn't bother me. The last Sony I tried was a 36" CRT
WEGA in 2000 for the same price. That Sony had very poor geometry and
the "funhouse effect" on horizontally scrolling text that the
KDFE50A10 thankfully does not have.

- Does anyone know of a link to a site or thread with a Service Menu
tweak guide and what settings people recommend for the Sony KDFE50A10?

- The Mitsubishi was not able to receive any digital channels, but the
Sony connected to the same analog cable received 8 of them. I don't
know if that's because I couldn't figure out how to access them on the
Mitsubishi or maybe the Sony's receiver is better.

- After 8 hours of use the Sony suddenly turned itself off and then
came back on. I hope that's not a precursor that this unit is going to
die.

- I bought a 5 year warranty from Fry's Electronics which they claim
includes as many bulb replacements as I need during those 5 years.
However, that is not specifically mentioned. Does anyone have
experience with Fry's service plans with such issues?

I'm not sure what I'm going to do with the Sony set due to the stuck
pixels I mentioned in a previous post. Hopefully people will have some
advice on that.

I'll probably be returning the Toshiba SD-5980 DVD player because it
randomly pauses and stops playback on most DVDs. Last year I tried 3
previous Toshibas (SD-3960, I think) which did the exact same thing. I
thought after a year I'd have better luck with a Toshiba. It's too bad
because I like the picture, the SD card slot, and it was the cheapest
upconverting player with HDMI.

Disclaimer: The above are my opinions.
Anonymous
September 20, 2005 5:24:37 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv,rec.video (More info?)

On 19/9/05 7:40 AM, "John" <John@nospam.com> wrote:

> - I'm annoyed that in 720p and 1080i, the Sony and Mitsubishi don't
> offer a Normal/Narrow mode. This means I have to switch to component
> inputs (480i or 480p) in order to watch a 4:3 DVD without the picture
> being distorted. Does anyone know why manufacturers remove
> Normal/Narrow options in these higher resolution modes? Is it a
> technology limitation or just a "feature" choice on their part?

The specifications for 720p and 1080i say they are 16:9, period. If you're
using an upconverting DVD player it really should have an option to add
sidebars to the 4:3 signal. If you aren't, then you're pretty much stuck
with what you're doing right now.

>
> - When I use 480p on a Toshiba SD-5980 DVD player over either
> component or HDMI, vertical panning causes a "grille" effect. If I
> switch the player into 480i then there is no problem with vertical
> panning. I saw this on both the Mitsubishi and Sony, so I assume it's
> the DVD player. It means I have the leave the player in 480i mode with
> HDMI set to 1080i. For 16x9 I use the HDMI input and for 4:3 I use the
> 480i input. Is there any other way to fix this?

It sounds like the player isn't correctly removing 2:3 pulldown (or you're
watching DVDs that aren't 2:3 encoded) - either way, it's not sending proper
progressive scan video to your set, instead just sending regular interlaced
frames in 480p, which would cause the grille look.
September 20, 2005 7:39:56 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv,rec.video (More info?)

Cail, thanks for your comments on my questions.

Apparently since the specs for 720p and 1080i didn't discuss 4:3, the
manufacturers didn't bother to include a 4:3 mode even though they
could've/should've (in my opinion).

By the same token, it seems the DVD players I tried (Toshiba SD-5980,
Samsung HD-850, and Panasonic S77) don't have a 4:3 mode in
720p/1080i. I think I tried 720p and 1080i with a 4:3 TV selected
instead of 16:9 on the DVD player with the same results, but I'm not
certain (I tried so many things they blur in my memory).

Regarding the grille effect, all 3 DVD players showed this same
problem with each 4:3 DVD I tried (a few TV series I own) in 480p mode
over both the component and HDMI inputs. It was not the entire picture
but certain horizontal lines that looked weird (i.e. table tops,
people's eyebrows and mouths, etc.)

I had hoped at least 1 of these 3 players could compensate for this
grille effect, or are you saying that DVDs that aren't encoded with
the pulldown (such as TV series?) will always have the grille effect
on any DVD player in any mode other than 480i?

On Tue, 20 Sep 2005 01:24:37 +1000, Cail Young <nospam@anywhere.com>
wrote:
>On 19/9/05 7:40 AM, "John" <John@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>> - I'm annoyed that in 720p and 1080i, the Sony and Mitsubishi don't
>> offer a Normal/Narrow mode. This means I have to switch to component
>> inputs (480i or 480p) in order to watch a 4:3 DVD without the picture
>> being distorted. Does anyone know why manufacturers remove
>> Normal/Narrow options in these higher resolution modes? Is it a
>> technology limitation or just a "feature" choice on their part?
>
>The specifications for 720p and 1080i say they are 16:9, period. If you're
>using an upconverting DVD player it really should have an option to add
>sidebars to the 4:3 signal. If you aren't, then you're pretty much stuck
>with what you're doing right now.
>
>>
>> - When I use 480p on a Toshiba SD-5980 DVD player over either
>> component or HDMI, vertical panning causes a "grille" effect. If I
>> switch the player into 480i then there is no problem with vertical
>> panning. I saw this on both the Mitsubishi and Sony, so I assume it's
>> the DVD player. It means I have the leave the player in 480i mode with
>> HDMI set to 1080i. For 16x9 I use the HDMI input and for 4:3 I use the
>> 480i input. Is there any other way to fix this?
>
>It sounds like the player isn't correctly removing 2:3 pulldown (or you're
>watching DVDs that aren't 2:3 encoded) - either way, it's not sending proper
>progressive scan video to your set, instead just sending regular interlaced
>frames in 480p, which would cause the grille look.
Anonymous
September 21, 2005 11:57:09 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv,rec.video (More info?)

On 20/9/05 1:39 PM, "John" <John@nospam.com> wrote:

> By the same token, it seems the DVD players I tried (Toshiba SD-5980,
> Samsung HD-850, and Panasonic S77) don't have a 4:3 mode in
> 720p/1080i. I think I tried 720p and 1080i with a 4:3 TV selected
> instead of 16:9 on the DVD player with the same results, but I'm not
> certain (I tried so many things they blur in my memory).

That's a pity. If you had money to burn there are devices available that
would fix your problem (scalers) but they're not cheap.

>
> Regarding the grille effect, all 3 DVD players showed this same
> problem with each 4:3 DVD I tried (a few TV series I own) in 480p mode
> over both the component and HDMI inputs. It was not the entire picture
> but certain horizontal lines that looked weird (i.e. table tops,
> people's eyebrows and mouths, etc.)
>
> I had hoped at least 1 of these 3 players could compensate for this
> grille effect, or are you saying that DVDs that aren't encoded with
> the pulldown (such as TV series?) will always have the grille effect
> on any DVD player in any mode other than 480i?

Without seeing exactly what you mean by 'grille effect', it's hard to say,
but if I'm correct that it's the interaction between 480i material and
displaying in progressive scan, then yes, any 480i material will do that
unless properly deinterlaced.
!