Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

260 and 4870 are the same price. Help!

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
Share
July 21, 2008 2:57:07 PM

Now that both the 4870 and the 260 are $270, what is better to choose?

I will be buying 1 card now and another one to run sli/crossfire in the future.
I will be running flight simulators, cod4, crysis, and video editing software.


Thanks


And please! Stop arguing, just give me the facts and your opinion about the subject, not about each other's opinions

More about : 260 4870 price

July 21, 2008 3:03:11 PM

4870 has been shown to run slightly better than GTX 260 and will improve over time with a driver update and some hotfixes each month. Get that.
July 21, 2008 3:06:11 PM

About how long do you believe it will take for the updates to come out?
Related resources
July 21, 2008 3:08:10 PM

There's one every month. Don't know when exactly. The next update is Catalyst 8.7 and it should come very soon if it hasn't already. And it will be the first driver to officially support the 4xxx series I've heard.
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 3:17:08 PM

Agree, the 4870. The G260 will be eol or end of life soon, as the newer 55nm version comes out. Also, where the 4870 leads in games, it can really dominate, whereas the G260 may only edge the 4870.
July 21, 2008 3:17:57 PM

i think at this point the 4870 is better than the 260. it gives the 280 run for its money. if i was you. ill get the 4870.
July 21, 2008 3:21:22 PM

Right, the 4870 is faster so if they're the same price... this probably doesn't need explaining :) 
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 3:29:58 PM

just wondering how much better is 2 gtx 260 vs 1 9800gx2?
July 21, 2008 3:32:53 PM

invisik said:
just wondering how much better is 2 gtx 260 vs 1 9800gx2?

OT?

I don't know google it.
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 3:35:52 PM

couldnt find any good reviews with the gtx 260 in sli. =[
July 21, 2008 3:45:47 PM

Looks to me like the 260sli is substantially better than 4870 cf.
July 21, 2008 3:46:54 PM

wow even 4870 CF cant beat Nvidia's mid-range GTX260 SLI LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
July 21, 2008 3:47:50 PM

Not really, 260 sli vs 4870 cf is very close, win some, lose some.

Sli scales better across the board that is fact, Crossfire boards are way better than Nvidia boards.
July 21, 2008 3:49:09 PM

There is no guarantee that ATI will put out some driver that really gives it some kind of advantage.
I personally don't bank on stuff I have no guarantee of. For all we know the drivers could get worse or just continue to suck.

Looking at the here and here, the 4870 and GTX 260 perform very much the same. Maybe the 4870 is 2 or 3 fps faster in some games, yet the 260 wins in other games.

On top of that (and not sure why this doesn't get mentioned), the GTX 260 is definitely the better overclocker. I know one person with a 30% overclock. I know 2 people who can't even reach a 10% OC with the 4870. When you add OC'ing in as a factor, which you damn well should since everybody and their mother does it (and companies like eVGA are even throwing in their own OC software), then the 260 is the better buy IMO, you really can't make a bad decision here.

The 260 also has the better cooler, and the better drivers right now. You here that the 4870 *will* have better drivers coming. Even if that is true, we need to consider that Nv will be putting out better drivers as well. And you never know when that Cuda will come in handy.

Also, with the software you mentioned you are running, you might want the 400mb more memory the 260 offers. Granted it isn't DDR5, but the 260's DDR3 is still plenty fast and its memory bandwidth is not all that far behind that of the 4870's.
If 512mb of memory is enough for you in all situations, then clearly DDR5 is the better choice. But let's remember that we already have games released that recommend 512mb.

Cut to 5 months from now and games/software will only be more vid ram hungry. There comes a point where if your rig is wanting a tad more vid ram, it doesn't matter how fast ddr5 is when you don't have enough of it. More ram can cure many things that faster ram can't.

I'm not telling you what to get, but rather helping you look at the entire big picture here. What is best for you might not be the best choice for somebody else, especially if you are considering SLI'ing one of these cards in the future.
The 260 definitely isn't a clear loser here. Nor is the 4870. If you run at lower resolutions, are fine with 512mb ram, and don't overclock, then perhaps the 4870 is your better choice. If you do run at higher rez's, think you'll want or need more than 512mb ram, and do want to overclock, then I say the 260 is the way to go.

Think about these things and you really can't make a wrong choice.
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 3:54:07 PM

thanks dos1986 much appreciated.
=]
July 21, 2008 3:59:31 PM

robx46 said:
There is no guarantee that ATI will put out some driver that really gives it some kind of advantage.
I personally don't bank on stuff I have no guarantee of. For all we know the drivers could get worse or just continue to suck.

Looking at the here and here, the 4870 and GTX 260 perform very much the same. Maybe the 4870 is 2 or 3 fps faster in some games, yet the 260 wins in other games.

On top of that (and not sure why this doesn't get mentioned), the GTX 260 is definitely the better overclocker. I know one person with a 30% overclock. I know 2 people who can't even reach a 10% OC with the 4870. When you add OC'ing in as a factor, which you damn well should since everybody and their mother does it (and companies like eVGA are even throwing in their own OC software), then the 260 is the better buy IMO, you really can't make a bad decision here.

The 260 also has the better cooler, and the better drivers right now. You here that the 4870 *will* have better drivers coming. Even if that is true, we need to consider that Nv will be putting out better drivers as well. And you never know when that Cuda will come in handy.

Also, with the software you mentioned you are running, you might want the 400mb more memory the 260 offers. Granted it isn't DDR5, but the 260's DDR3 is still plenty fast and its memory bandwidth is not all that far behind that of the 4870's.
If 512mb of memory is enough for you in all situations, then clearly DDR5 is the better choice. But let's remember that we already have games released that recommend 512mb.

Cut to 5 months from now and games/software will only be more vid ram hungry. There comes a point where if your rig is wanting a tad more vid ram, it doesn't matter how fast ddr5 is when you don't have enough of it. More ram can cure many things that faster ram can't.

I'm not telling you what to get, but rather helping you look at the entire big picture here. What is best for you might not be the best choice for somebody else, especially if you are considering SLI'ing one of these cards in the future.
The 260 definitely isn't a clear loser here. Nor is the 4870. If you run at lower resolutions, are fine with 512mb ram, and don't overclock, then perhaps the 4870 is your better choice. If you do run at higher rez's, think you'll want or need more than 512mb ram, and do want to overclock, then I say the 260 is the way to go.

Think about these things and you really can't make a wrong choice.


Thank you for the thoughtful reply. I think about it for a while and see. I want the new computer to be able to last several years before updating the hardware.

Here is another question that might affect my choice. Is the 780i mobo or the x48 mobo "better"?
I was looking at the GIGABYTE GA-X48-DS4 costing $225 or the xfx 780i costing $220

Thanks again
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 3:59:45 PM

Please check the AA used in that bench, and who are these people?
July 21, 2008 4:04:07 PM

Its a legit German site, they are the german version of Maxishine.

July 21, 2008 4:11:02 PM

JAYDEEJOHN said:
Please check the AA used in that bench, and who are these people?

+1

I was ready to give up on this thread, good to see all is not lost.

@astronomy10: The X48 is far better than the 780i. It's seriously not even a competition. Until we see the one nondescript "performance rating" chart from a German website showing that the NVIDIA product is clearly superior :D 
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:16:00 PM

Several weeks ago when the GTX260/280 was alone out there in the market and Nvidia was price gouging their faithful to the tune of 400/650 dollars plus. Then when the ATI cards hit the shelf at less then half the price and very close performance. People were buying these ATI cards like it was boxing day!
Now that Nvidia has finally brought their cards down to the price they should have launched at we have a real choice to make.
Myself being a long time Nvidia fan have decided to jump camps and go the ATI way. My brother has one and the image is quite nicer looking than the Nvidias.
Just my thought on the subject.
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:19:44 PM

Lets look closer to home , here we see CF and the x2 killing the G280 in sli http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTUzMSw0... OK, and here another more respected and known nsite, we see that this game is obviously cpu limited until you get to 25x16, where unless the G280 in sli sees 100% scaling, it wont best the 4870 in CF . Also, the x2 does better than CF. http://www.techreport.com/articles.x/14990/9 So, unless you really do your homework and know your sources, anybody can show anything they want, after all this is the internet
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:23:00 PM

Plus Ill add this quote from [H], arguably NOT a favorite for ATI "AMD’s 4800 series and NVIDIA’s GT 200 series maintain a very competitive antialiasing image quality. However AA framerate performance is a bit different story. In real world gaming scenarios, with enthusiast-level 4870 X2 and GTX 280 cards, both in single GPU and SLI/CrossFireX configurations, AMD’s high-end antialiasing techniques are more likely to be useable than NVIDIA’s. We can finally say that all of these super-quality AA settings that have been little more than marketing fluff in the past have finally become attainable with the right hardware." So, in conclusion, what was shown is an exception, not the rule, where the 4870 in CF or the x2 win out

July 21, 2008 4:24:46 PM

With AA and AF John



Is it that hard to admit, Ati did good and Nvidida did good?

a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:27:30 PM

astronomy10 said:
Thank you for the thoughtful reply. I think about it for a while and see. I want the new computer to be able to last several years before updating the hardware.

Here is another question that might affect my choice. Is the 780i mobo or the x48 mobo "better"?
I was looking at the GIGABYTE GA-X48-DS4 costing $225 or the xfx 780i costing $220

Thanks again


780i - Can do SLI, not CF
X48 - Can do CF, not SLI

Which one is "better" is determined by which brand, NVIDIA (SLI) or ATI (CF) you buy.
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:27:32 PM



Those bench mark results are misleading. You have to take the entire article into consideration.

The 3DMark scores show the 4870's in CF besting the 260's in SLI. Also in FEAR, CoD4, and Rainbow 6 the 4870's CF beat the 260's SLI.

The results also seem to depends on the game and resolution. The results for Call of Juarez is a good example.

Early drivers have to be the culprit in some of the poorer 4870 CF results because there is no way that a single 4870 should be able to beat 4870's in CF in any benchmark. That defeats the whole purpose of having CrossFire! The result shown for Stalker is proof of that.

Regardless of CF or not, a single 4870 consistently performs better that a single GTX260. The 4870 is defintely the better way to go.
July 21, 2008 4:27:50 PM

Every game has there preferred card John, those links you posted showed HD4870 CF beating GTX 280 SLI in AOC, switch the page and 280 SLI is pawning 4870 CF in Crysis.

July 21, 2008 4:30:55 PM

chunkymonster said:
Those bench mark results are misleading. You have to take the entire article into consideration and not just post selected results. Are you sure we read the same article?

The 3DMark scores show the 4870's in CF besting the 260's in SLI. Also in FEAR, CoD4, and Rainbow 6 the 4870's CF beat the 260's SLI.

The results also seem to depends on the game and resolution. The results for Call of Juarez is a good example.


.


Look at the original link I posted, which takes the average of like 15 games.

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fww...

4870 CF is winning at lower res, 260 sli higher and so on, very little between them.Saying one is much better than the other is crazy and being biased imo.


a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:35:08 PM

Everyone, and I mean everyone, is tired of Crysis, so dont go there. Look at all the rest, not 1 game that no one plays, and for the most part has given up on. Read what you want, determine what you will, makes no difference, as we are all gifted with brains to discern the difference on these cards. Believe what you will, just dont foist it upon people who dont know. Because the vast majority of us know better, and which card or cards are better, thus the other responses in this thread.
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:39:06 PM

Youve shown 1 site, Ive given 2, and theres more than that, if you want. You say I handpick hames, yet you handpick 1 site, and of all the sites, guess who wins? The 4870 in CF or the x2
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:41:48 PM

Youre still hanging on, thats good, for nVidia. Ill settle for what Ive posted here in 3 months, the question is, will you?
July 21, 2008 4:42:10 PM

4870 is like 7% faster across the board, gtx 260 can be overclocked higher thus canceling that out entirely.

Its not that hard to see that they are really quite equal.

July 21, 2008 4:43:39 PM

JAYDEEJOHN said:
Youve shown 1 site, Ive given 2, and theres more than that, if you want. You say I handpick hames, yet you handpick 1 site, and of all the sites, guess who wins? The 4870 in CF or the x2


You gave one with no sli/crossfire review and the other had 280 sli not 260.

July 21, 2008 4:44:10 PM

JAYDEEJOHN said:
Youre still hanging on, thats good, for nVidia. Ill settle for what Ive posted here in 3 months, the question is, will you?


Settle on what?
July 21, 2008 4:48:27 PM

4870.

Unless of course you WANT to support a company that has been reaming us for well over 2 years. Personally, I would wait a week or two for the price cuts to the 4870 to come in and undercut the 260GTX again. By that time the new drivers will be out and you won't have people quoting obscure german sites in an attempt to prove the 260 is better.....
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:50:28 PM

dos1986 said:
4870 is like 7% faster across the board, gtx 260 can be overclocked higher thus canceling that out entirely.

Its not that hard to see that they are really quite equal.


Actually, the 4870 can be overclocked higher. It has quite conservative clock speeds, especially for the memory, while the nvidia cards are on the edge of heat and power already (hence the vacuum cleaner fan).
July 21, 2008 4:50:30 PM

Is it true that 4800 serie doesnt support monitor bigger than 30 inches?
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 4:51:14 PM

Saying that what youve posted, the benchmarks from this site, and that sli G260 is better than CF 4870 or the x2. Youve picked 1 site, and its flawed. Heres another quote from guru3D "Once the R700 arrived I spent a complete day with it just to test and see how many problems we'd run into. Fact is, I had close to none. A lot of games that where not shown in this preview due to an enforced limitation, ran all really well. I mean, two weeks ago we published a Crossfire review and stumbled into some issues with for example Frontlines: Fuel of War, with the X2 it worked flawlessly. So yeah, the overall experience was just splendid, with one exception, Crysis. But after checking with some colleagues .. I noticed that pretty much everyone is having the same difficulties with that title, Crossfire is a very hard thing to achieve on Crysis. And that has to be my word of advice to you guys .. for Crossfire to be able to kick in, AMD must update it's driver, and you'll need to install them on a very regular basis. I've had a lot of critique in the past on Crossfire, valid criticism as only the popular games editors mostly used had good Crossfire support. With the new 48x0 X2 cards we think the tide definitely has turned. But this will only work if AMD will keep it's attention and dedication to it's drivers, for current, past and future games. We'll be monitoring that very closely and keep you guys updated on it.

So with that being said, I'm ending this preview for now ... My experiences with the card have been really good, the performance is flabbergasting. If priced right, this is the new king in the high-end arena of graphics cards. I'm impressed, really impressed. And that's a hard thing for a company to achieve." So, Im a fanboy? Or are they? Or techreport? Or even [H] of all places? Give it a rest

July 21, 2008 4:51:19 PM

I see alot of Greenish in here .. from every review that I saw , 2x 4870 cf beats even 2 gtx 280 sli in almost every game but for crysis. and those were reviews from trusted sites , known system specs , driver versions .. etc. this also applies for single cards .. a single 4870 is way better than the gtx260 in every aspect (performance , power consumption , heat , noise)
also sayin the gtx260 will be superior to the 4870 for the extra memory the gtx260 has is misleading . show me a single case where the 4870 performance hit at high resolutions , even those fishy benches don't say so ..
still there's one point though , a pair of those cards in SLI or CF is too powerful for any application now .. to an extinct that nobody could notice the difference .. and in the only title where u can care about the difference(crysis) , 2 gtx260 in sli will beat the 2x4870 in cf due to poor CF support
July 21, 2008 4:54:03 PM

I believe the only real limiting factor on the HD 4xxx series when it comes to OCing is the fact that CCC limits how far you can OC them and no other overclocking tools support the HD 4xxx series yet. This will probably change with newer Catalyst drivers and card revisions.
July 21, 2008 4:55:37 PM

Find me a site that does a comparison between gtx 260 sli vs 4870 cf and takes the average score at the highest res possibile with AA and AF from 10 games +?

I have showed yee.




July 21, 2008 4:58:31 PM

JAYDEEJOHN said:
Everyone, and I mean everyone, is tired of Crysis, so dont go there. Look at all the rest, not 1 game that no one plays, and for the most part has given up on. Read what you want, determine what you will, makes no difference, as we are all gifted with brains to discern the difference on these cards. Believe what you will, just dont foist it upon people who dont know. Because the vast majority of us know better, and which card or cards are better, thus the other responses in this thread.


+1 For 4870 > GTX 260 and Crysis is a terrible game.
July 21, 2008 5:02:54 PM

dos1986 said:
Find me a site that does a comparison between gtx 260 sli vs 4870 cf and takes the average score at the highest res possibile with AA and AF from 10 games +?

I have showed yee.


No one cares about resolution of 2560 x 1600. Do you realize how crazy of a monitor you need to support that?
Most gamers care about the 1280 X 1024 to 1600 X 1200 resolution.

Check out the chart about the percentage of users who use certain resolutions. Over half of the total internet population uses 1024 x 768 or less.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Display_resolution
a c 143 U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 5:05:10 PM

How nice, a flame war. OK, I'll add my 2 cents. The OP mentioned Flight Simulators. If that means FSX, it's essential that he get a quad CPU and overclock it as far as possible. X48 is better than 780i for that AFAIK. If the system has to have two video cards, and it has an X48 motherboard, then the cards have to be ATI.

As for which is better, HD 4870 CF or GTX 260 SLI, with 70 fps for one and 80 fps for the other, does it really matter who gets 70 fps and who gets 80 fps? A typical LCD monitor with a 60 HZ refresh rate will show only 60 frames per second in either case. And even if you have a really good monitor that can do better, your eyes won't really feel the difference.
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 5:06:36 PM

One no ones heard of, everyone questions, and Ive shown 3 we know. Heres another http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3341&p=21 Now, going by what was said by Guru3D, we all know these other games will only get better. So far, it looks like its even with old drivers, and hurried support. Like I said, in 3 months, this will not be the case. And after reading Gurus preview, itll be sooner than that. Watch for the real reviews of the x2 when it arrives, as Im sure theyll have all these questions answered by then, and then we can readdress this, fair enough? Im confident
July 21, 2008 5:07:27 PM

njalterio said:
No one cares about resolution of 2560 x 1600. Do you realize how crazy of a monitor you need to support that?


Thats how you seperate the pretenders, no place to hide
July 21, 2008 5:09:17 PM

dos1986 said:
Thats how you seperate the pretenders, no place to hide


Pretenders? Place to hide? What on Earth are you talking about?
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2008 5:09:34 PM

^+1 for Quad if FSX.
!