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Recommended HD Antenna?

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Anonymous
September 26, 2005 8:23:32 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

I have DISH with the HD package and an 811 receiver. This is what
antennaweb.org tells me...in case the formatting gets messed up, I'm
basically 38-40 miles from everything and need a VIOLET antenna, which
is "large directional". Our area is very flat and we have no trees
higher than the house within a 1/4 mile or so (it's new construction).
I'd like to avoid a huge antenna on the roof for asthetic reasons, but
if that's what I need, oh well. I tried poking around a few sites but
didn't understand most of what they say. ANy recommendations out there
from the experts?

FREQ NET CITY COMP MILES ASSG

lt green - uhf KPXM-DT 41.1 PAX ST. CLOUD MN 12° 35.7 40
violet - uhf WFTC-DT 29.1 UPN MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 39.4 21
violet - uhf WCCO-DT 4.1 CBS MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 38.8 32
violet - uhf KSTP-DT 5.1 ABC ST. PAUL MN 69° 38.8 50
violet - uhf KARE-DT 11.1 NBC MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 38.8 35
violet - uhf KMSP-DT 9.1 FOX MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 39.4 26

Thanks!

More about : recommended antenna

Anonymous
September 26, 2005 11:41:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

alcarm1964@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> I have DISH with the HD package and an 811 receiver. This is what
> antennaweb.org tells me...in case the formatting gets messed up, I'm
> basically 38-40 miles from everything and need a VIOLET antenna, which
> is "large directional". Our area is very flat and we have no trees
> higher than the house within a 1/4 mile or so (it's new construction).
> I'd like to avoid a huge antenna on the roof for asthetic reasons, but
> if that's what I need, oh well. I tried poking around a few sites but
> didn't understand most of what they say. ANy recommendations out there
> from the experts?
>
> FREQ NET CITY COMP MILES ASSG
>
> lt green - uhf KPXM-DT 41.1 PAX ST. CLOUD MN 12° 35.7 40
> violet - uhf WFTC-DT 29.1 UPN MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 39.4 21
> violet - uhf WCCO-DT 4.1 CBS MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 38.8 32
> violet - uhf KSTP-DT 5.1 ABC ST. PAUL MN 69° 38.8 50
> violet - uhf KARE-DT 11.1 NBC MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 38.8 35
> violet - uhf KMSP-DT 9.1 FOX MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 39.4 26
>
> Thanks!


What the above data tells me is that your local Digital/HD OTA

towers/stations are: UHF, 39 miles away, at a 69 deg angle off N..

Forget about the PAX St Cloud channel....

What you need is a Good UHF antenna (Chans 14 thru 59) and

it should be a ChannelMaster or Winegard unit....

A $25 Channel Master UHF #3021 4 bay bow tie using RG-6 cable

will do just fine... If you want double the Signal Strength...

a $50 Channel Master UHF #4228 8 bay bow tie is better...

A UHF Yagi type antenna is 2nd best... but should work too.

Placing the antenna in an attic, or possibly a closet on

tower side of the house can work too IF no metal siding.
Anonymous
September 27, 2005 12:40:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

(alcarm1964@hotmail.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
> I have DISH with the HD package and an 811 receiver. This is what
> antennaweb.org tells me...in case the formatting gets messed up, I'm
> basically 38-40 miles from everything and need a VIOLET antenna, which
> is "large directional". Our area is very flat and we have no trees
> higher than the house within a 1/4 mile or so (it's new construction).

Based on the local channels you listed (and I snipped), I'd say a Channel
Master 4221 (4-bay) or 4228 (8-bay) would do you just fine. The 4221 is
relatively small, but should do the job if pointed correctly. You might
even be able to pick up the PAX station without a rotor.

--
Jeff Rife | Coach: What's the story, Norm?
|
| Norm: Thirsty guy walks into a bar. You
| finish it.
Related resources
Anonymous
September 27, 2005 1:46:39 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeff Rife wrote:
> (alcarm1964@hotmail.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
>
>>I have DISH with the HD package and an 811 receiver. This is what
>>antennaweb.org tells me...in case the formatting gets messed up, I'm
>>basically 38-40 miles from everything and need a VIOLET antenna, which
>>is "large directional". Our area is very flat and we have no trees
>>higher than the house within a 1/4 mile or so (it's new construction).
>
>
> Based on the local channels you listed (and I snipped), I'd say a Channel
> Master 4221 (4-bay) or 4228 (8-bay) would do you just fine. The 4221 is
> relatively small, but should do the job if pointed correctly. You might
> even be able to pick up the PAX station without a rotor.

The PAX station won't be HD, but 4 (or 6) SD sub-channels with
religious or info commercial content. I find the local Pax station
something I rather delete from the list of channels. Takes too long to
step through all the sub channels.

The OP is lucky in that all his digital HD stations are on the same
azimuth bearing so he can pick between a highly directional UHF Yagi
antenna or a slightly broader beam flat screen bowtie. At close to 40
miles, he is likely to need an amplifier if there is any terrain or high
trees in the way.

Alan F
Anonymous
September 27, 2005 2:13:18 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

My experience is even with unobstructed flat terrain UHF digital
transmitters at 40 miles distance requires you to get the receiving
antenna up in the air. At a bare minimum I'd say 10 feet above the
highest point on a single story house. 20 feet is even better. I think
probably a preamp also is needed for great digital reception in all
weather conditions.


--
Lorenzo, Posted this message at http://www.SatelliteGuys.US
Anonymous
September 27, 2005 3:02:04 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

afiggatt (afiggatt@adelphia.net) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
> The PAX station won't be HD, but 4 (or 6) SD sub-channels with
> religious or info commercial content. I find the local Pax station
> something I rather delete from the list of channels. Takes too long to
> step through all the sub channels.

My local PAX shows some baseball games (local contract), and the DirecTV
feed of that channel is fugly, so I keep it in the list. Also, one of the
subchannels actually shows some decent movies from time to time.

--
Jeff Rife |
| http://www.nabs.net/Cartoons/Dilbert/StupidCoWorkers.gi...
Anonymous
September 27, 2005 11:46:41 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Thanks for all the info...being the corner house in a new development,
I'm kinda "on-display" in the neighborhood, and while there's no
association or anything, I don't want to have some giant antenna on the
roof if I don't have to. I looked at the Channel Master 4221 and 4228
and they're not as big (or ugly) as I thought. I have a corner of the
house (coincidentally, also the closest corner to where the TV is) that
faces east and is actually the only corner that isn't terribly visible
from the road. So, I think I'm going to go with one of those (probably
the 4221 1st, then if it doesn't work, go with the bigger one). I live
about 40 miles west of Minneapolis/St Paul, and if anyone here is also
from that area, you know it's flat as a pancake. Anyway, hopefully
this weekend I'll give it a shot. Thanks again for al the help folks!
Anonymous
September 27, 2005 5:45:26 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

alcarm1964@hotmail.com wrote:
> Thanks for all the info...being the corner house in a new development,
> I'm kinda "on-display" in the neighborhood, and while there's no
> association or anything, I don't want to have some giant antenna on the
> roof if I don't have to. I looked at the Channel Master 4221 and 4228
> and they're not as big (or ugly) as I thought. I have a corner of the
> house (coincidentally, also the closest corner to where the TV is) that
> faces east and is actually the only corner that isn't terribly visible
> from the road. So, I think I'm going to go with one of those (probably
> the 4221 1st, then if it doesn't work, go with the bigger one). I live
> about 40 miles west of Minneapolis/St Paul, and if anyone here is also
> from that area, you know it's flat as a pancake. Anyway, hopefully
> this weekend I'll give it a shot. Thanks again for al the help folks!

A useful website on TV antennas is at
http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ISSUES/erecting_antenna.html. Number of
related useful pages under Antenna issues.

Good luck.

Alan F
Anonymous
September 27, 2005 6:17:38 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 19:41:53 -0500, Dennis Mayer <Polaris1@execpc.com>
wrote:

>
>
>alcarm1964@hotmail.com wrote:
>>
>> I have DISH with the HD package and an 811 receiver. This is what
>> antennaweb.org tells me...in case the formatting gets messed up, I'm
>> basically 38-40 miles from everything and need a VIOLET antenna, which
>> is "large directional". Our area is very flat and we have no trees
>> higher than the house within a 1/4 mile or so (it's new construction).
>> I'd like to avoid a huge antenna on the roof for asthetic reasons, but
>> if that's what I need, oh well. I tried poking around a few sites but
>> didn't understand most of what they say. ANy recommendations out there
>> from the experts?
>>
>> FREQ NET CITY COMP MILES ASSG
>>
>> lt green - uhf KPXM-DT 41.1 PAX ST. CLOUD MN 12° 35.7 40
>> violet - uhf WFTC-DT 29.1 UPN MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 39.4 21
>> violet - uhf WCCO-DT 4.1 CBS MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 38.8 32
>> violet - uhf KSTP-DT 5.1 ABC ST. PAUL MN 69° 38.8 50
>> violet - uhf KARE-DT 11.1 NBC MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 38.8 35
>> violet - uhf KMSP-DT 9.1 FOX MINNEAPOLIS MN 69° 39.4 26
>>
>> Thanks!
>
>
> What the above data tells me is that your local Digital/HD OTA
>
> towers/stations are: UHF, 39 miles away, at a 69 deg angle off N..
>
> Forget about the PAX St Cloud channel....
>
> What you need is a Good UHF antenna (Chans 14 thru 59) and
>
> it should be a ChannelMaster or Winegard unit....
>
> A $25 Channel Master UHF #3021 4 bay bow tie using RG-6 cable
>
> will do just fine... If you want double the Signal Strength...
>
> a $50 Channel Master UHF #4228 8 bay bow tie is better...
>
> A UHF Yagi type antenna is 2nd best... but should work too.
>
> Placing the antenna in an attic, or possibly a closet on
>
> tower side of the house can work too IF no metal siding.

I had much the same situation this past weekend with my RatShack
$90.00 receiver. I tried a Zeinith Silver Sensor, but was to pointy,
that being had to keep adjusting it. I found a Channel
Master 4221 (4-bay) locally for more in the $40.00 range and was able
to hide it on the backside of a fence on cup hooks. No pointing was
needed and all the channels are crystal clear with strong singles.

In my opinion go with Channel Master. They lie flat and no roof top
mounting was required.

John
Anonymous
September 27, 2005 7:58:22 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

I have a 3-LNB DirecTV dish with two RG6 cables -- one goes to a Sony
SAT-HD200 receiver, and the other to a SD (B50?) receiver in another
room. I also have one of those dish-mounted antennas, Terk TV42 I
believe. I know these are not the best choice for DTV, or even analog,
but I installed it 5-6 years ago in order to save myself running
additional cables, I'm on the first floor of a three-story apartment
building, and the dish is on the roof. The antenna uses the same RG6
cables that carry the satellite signal (and power), and has diplexers at
the ends to split the two signals.

Until last week I was receiving most of the local (Los Angeles) digital
channels with about 70-80% signal strength, which was good enough. Most
of the analog channels were noisy/ghosty, but I get locals from DirecTV
too, so I'm only concerned about the digital ones, especially those with
HD programming. However, one day (after a rain) I lost all OTA reception
-- digital and analog. Some digital channels show about 5% strength, but
most are at 0. Satellite reception is not affected on any receiver,
meaning the cables are good. OTA reception is dead on both TVs, which
eliminates the diplexers as a possible cause (both must have failed at
the same time). It looks like the antenna is dead, but then I wonder how
is the satellite signal passed through. The LNB's are connected to the
head of the antenna first, and from there go to the receivers. Can
someone explain what could be wrong with the antenna and still allow the
satellite signal to pass?

The next question is, if the antenna is dead, is there a better option
for replacing it? I'm trying to avoid running additional cable(s) for
the antenna, and if possible, mount it on (or near) the dish mast.
Antennaweb.org shows that most of the DTV channels in my area are at 6-7
degrees and 37-38 miles away. The type for most channels is "red - uhf"
except for KCBS-DT, which is "green - uhf".

Any recommendations and comments are appreciated!

Thanks,

--
chicho
Anonymous
September 28, 2005 12:52:05 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Chicho Misho wrote:
>
> I have a 3-LNB DirecTV dish with two RG6 cables -- one goes to a Sony
> SAT-HD200 receiver, and the other to a SD (B50?) receiver in another
> room. I also have one of those dish-mounted antennas, Terk TV42 I
> believe. I know these are not the best choice for DTV, or even analog,
> but I installed it 5-6 years ago in order to save myself running
> additional cables, I'm on the first floor of a three-story apartment
> building, and the dish is on the roof. The antenna uses the same RG6
> cables that carry the satellite signal (and power), and has diplexers at
> the ends to split the two signals.
>
> Until last week I was receiving most of the local (Los Angeles) digital
> channels with about 70-80% signal strength, which was good enough. Most
> of the analog channels were noisy/ghosty, but I get locals from DirecTV
> too, so I'm only concerned about the digital ones, especially those with
> HD programming. However, one day (after a rain) I lost all OTA reception
> -- digital and analog. Some digital channels show about 5% strength, but
> most are at 0. Satellite reception is not affected on any receiver,
> meaning the cables are good. OTA reception is dead on both TVs, which
> eliminates the diplexers as a possible cause (both must have failed at
> the same time). It looks like the antenna is dead, but then I wonder how
> is the satellite signal passed through. The LNB's are connected to the
> head of the antenna first, and from there go to the receivers. Can
> someone explain what could be wrong with the antenna and still allow the
> satellite signal to pass?
>
> The next question is, if the antenna is dead, is there a better option
> for replacing it? I'm trying to avoid running additional cable(s) for
> the antenna, and if possible, mount it on (or near) the dish mast.
> Antennaweb.org shows that most of the DTV channels in my area are at 6-7
> degrees and 37-38 miles away. The type for most channels is "red - uhf"
> except for KCBS-DT, which is "green - uhf".
>
> Any recommendations and comments are appreciated!
>
> Thanks,
>
> --
> chicho


I'm not sure why you have the OTA TV reception problem..

Dump the Terk..

Data shows UHF channels, 38 miles away, & I hope you are on the
TV Tower side of your complex....

Buy a Channel Master $25 UHF #3021 4 bay bow tie antenna, use RG-6
cable
and this set up should work at a 40 mile range over flat ground..
Anonymous
September 28, 2005 2:52:43 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Dennis Mayer wrote:
>
> Chicho Misho wrote:
>
>>I have a 3-LNB DirecTV dish with two RG6 cables -- one goes to a Sony
>>SAT-HD200 receiver, and the other to a SD (B50?) receiver in another
>>room. I also have one of those dish-mounted antennas, Terk TV42 I
>>believe. I know these are not the best choice for DTV, or even analog,
>>but I installed it 5-6 years ago in order to save myself running
>>additional cables, I'm on the first floor of a three-story apartment
>>building, and the dish is on the roof. The antenna uses the same RG6
>>cables that carry the satellite signal (and power), and has diplexers at
>>the ends to split the two signals.
>>
>>Until last week I was receiving most of the local (Los Angeles) digital
>>channels with about 70-80% signal strength, which was good enough. Most
>>of the analog channels were noisy/ghosty, but I get locals from DirecTV
>>too, so I'm only concerned about the digital ones, especially those with
>>HD programming. However, one day (after a rain) I lost all OTA reception
>>-- digital and analog. Some digital channels show about 5% strength, but
>>most are at 0. Satellite reception is not affected on any receiver,
>>meaning the cables are good. OTA reception is dead on both TVs, which
>>eliminates the diplexers as a possible cause (both must have failed at
>>the same time). It looks like the antenna is dead, but then I wonder how
>>is the satellite signal passed through. The LNB's are connected to the
>>head of the antenna first, and from there go to the receivers. Can
>>someone explain what could be wrong with the antenna and still allow the
>>satellite signal to pass?
>>
>>The next question is, if the antenna is dead, is there a better option
>>for replacing it? I'm trying to avoid running additional cable(s) for
>>the antenna, and if possible, mount it on (or near) the dish mast.
>>Antennaweb.org shows that most of the DTV channels in my area are at 6-7
>>degrees and 37-38 miles away. The type for most channels is "red - uhf"
>>except for KCBS-DT, which is "green - uhf".
>>
>>Any recommendations and comments are appreciated!
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>--
>>chicho
>
>
>
> I'm not sure why you have the OTA TV reception problem..
>
> Dump the Terk..
>
> Data shows UHF channels, 38 miles away, & I hope you are on the
> TV Tower side of your complex....
>
> Buy a Channel Master $25 UHF #3021 4 bay bow tie antenna, use RG-6
> cable
> and this set up should work at a 40 mile range over flat ground..

Well, I'm convinced the Channel Master will do much better job than the
Terk, but from what I've found, it can't use the satellite cable and
needs its own RG-6... Or am I missing something?

Thanks,

--
chicho
Anonymous
September 28, 2005 3:47:22 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Chicho Misho wrote:
> However, one day (after a rain) I lost all OTA reception
> -- digital and analog. Some digital channels show about 5% strength, but
> most are at 0. Satellite reception is not affected on any receiver,
> meaning the cables are good. OTA reception is dead on both TVs, which
> eliminates the diplexers as a possible cause (both must have failed at
> the same time). It looks like the antenna is dead, but then I wonder how
> is the satellite signal passed through.

I doubt if the antenna is "dead". An antenna is a piece of metal,
nothing more. If the reception was lost after it rained, you likely have
water inside the antenna (if the design has hollow tubes) or, more
likely, in one of the connections from the antenna to where the antenna
feed connects to the sat feed. If you can get to your satellite dish &
Terk antenna, unscrew and check out each of the coaxial cable
connections starting right at the antenna. It does not much moisture
getting into coaxial connector to severely attenuate the signal.

Alan F
Anonymous
September 28, 2005 3:47:23 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

afiggatt wrote:
> Chicho Misho wrote:
>
>> However, one day (after a rain) I lost all OTA reception -- digital
>> and analog. Some digital channels show about 5% strength, but most are
>> at 0. Satellite reception is not affected on any receiver, meaning the
>> cables are good. OTA reception is dead on both TVs, which eliminates
>> the diplexers as a possible cause (both must have failed at the same
>> time). It looks like the antenna is dead, but then I wonder how is the
>> satellite signal passed through.
>
>
> I doubt if the antenna is "dead". An antenna is a piece of metal,
> nothing more. If the reception was lost after it rained, you likely have
> water inside the antenna (if the design has hollow tubes) or, more
> likely, in one of the connections from the antenna to where the antenna
> feed connects to the sat feed. If you can get to your satellite dish &
> Terk antenna, unscrew and check out each of the coaxial cable
> connections starting right at the antenna. It does not much moisture
> getting into coaxial connector to severely attenuate the signal.
>
> Alan F

Thank you for the input, Alan. A picture of the antenna can be seen here:

http://terk.com/products.html#

(under Product Photos, TV42)

The "head" of the antenna has 4 F-connectors -- two IN, and two OUT. Two
short RG6 cables go from the LNB switch to the IN connectors and two
long ones from the OUT connectors down to the diplexers/receivers. I
would think that if any of the four connectors had water in it, it would
affect satellite reception, no?

I will certainly get on the roof (it's flat) and redo all four
connections, but I doubt it will help. I think inside the "head" there
is an amplifier powered by the voltage sent out by the satellite
receivers. The rain may have shortened that amplifier, rendering the
antenna "dead". I would expect however in that case satellite signal not
to be passed through, but I may be wrong.

Thanks again,

--
chicho
Anonymous
September 28, 2005 3:18:41 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Chicho Misho wrote:
>
> Dennis Mayer wrote:
> >
> > Chicho Misho wrote:
> >
> >>I have a 3-LNB DirecTV dish with two RG6 cables -- one goes to a Sony
> >>SAT-HD200 receiver, and the other to a SD (B50?) receiver in another
> >>room. I also have one of those dish-mounted antennas, Terk TV42 I
> >>believe. I know these are not the best choice for DTV, or even analog,
> >>but I installed it 5-6 years ago in order to save myself running
> >>additional cables, I'm on the first floor of a three-story apartment
> >>building, and the dish is on the roof. The antenna uses the same RG6
> >>cables that carry the satellite signal (and power), and has diplexers at
> >>the ends to split the two signals.
> >>
> >>Until last week I was receiving most of the local (Los Angeles) digital
> >>channels with about 70-80% signal strength, which was good enough. Most
> >>of the analog channels were noisy/ghosty, but I get locals from DirecTV
> >>too, so I'm only concerned about the digital ones, especially those with
> >>HD programming. However, one day (after a rain) I lost all OTA reception
> >>-- digital and analog. Some digital channels show about 5% strength, but
> >>most are at 0. Satellite reception is not affected on any receiver,
> >>meaning the cables are good. OTA reception is dead on both TVs, which
> >>eliminates the diplexers as a possible cause (both must have failed at
> >>the same time). It looks like the antenna is dead, but then I wonder how
> >>is the satellite signal passed through. The LNB's are connected to the
> >>head of the antenna first, and from there go to the receivers. Can
> >>someone explain what could be wrong with the antenna and still allow the
> >>satellite signal to pass?
> >>
> >>The next question is, if the antenna is dead, is there a better option
> >>for replacing it? I'm trying to avoid running additional cable(s) for
> >>the antenna, and if possible, mount it on (or near) the dish mast.
> >>Antennaweb.org shows that most of the DTV channels in my area are at 6-7
> >>degrees and 37-38 miles away. The type for most channels is "red - uhf"
> >>except for KCBS-DT, which is "green - uhf".
> >>
> >>Any recommendations and comments are appreciated!
> >>
> >>Thanks,
> >>
> >>--
> >>chicho
> >
> >
> >
> > I'm not sure why you have the OTA TV reception problem..
> >
> > Dump the Terk..
> >
> > Data shows UHF channels, 38 miles away, & I hope you are on the
> > TV Tower side of your complex....
> >
> > Buy a Channel Master $25 UHF #3021 4 bay bow tie antenna, use RG-6
> > cable
> > and this set up should work at a 40 mile range over flat ground..
>
> Well, I'm convinced the Channel Master will do much better job than the
> Terk, but from what I've found, it can't use the satellite cable and
> needs its own RG-6... Or am I missing something?

I'm implying 2 things:
Don't use RG-59 cable....

Your Terk/Dish RG-6 cable could be bad....

and if the Terk ran thru a combined cable, then the Channel Master
could do the same thing... Cable TV etc.... is a whole
bunch
of different frequencies (different Program Groups) running thru
the same cable... Highest Frequencies Groups normally show
cable problems first.....



>
> Thanks,
>
> --
> chicho
September 28, 2005 4:44:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

It appears that the Terk you are using is an amplified antenna and contains
a preamp. Perhaps the power supply which provides power to the preamp is
unplugged or has failed? Perhaps the preamp itself has failed due to
moisture or lightning? These events would explain why the diplexers and coax
lines continue to work properly for the other satellite feeds while the Terk
no longer is functioning.

Smarty




"Dennis Mayer" <Polaris1@execpc.com> wrote in message
news:433AC261.F53EC5C2@execpc.com...
>
>
> Chicho Misho wrote:
>>
>> Dennis Mayer wrote:
>> >
>> > Chicho Misho wrote:
>> >
>> >>I have a 3-LNB DirecTV dish with two RG6 cables -- one goes to a Sony
>> >>SAT-HD200 receiver, and the other to a SD (B50?) receiver in another
>> >>room. I also have one of those dish-mounted antennas, Terk TV42 I
>> >>believe. I know these are not the best choice for DTV, or even analog,
>> >>but I installed it 5-6 years ago in order to save myself running
>> >>additional cables, I'm on the first floor of a three-story apartment
>> >>building, and the dish is on the roof. The antenna uses the same RG6
>> >>cables that carry the satellite signal (and power), and has diplexers
>> >>at
>> >>the ends to split the two signals.
>> >>
>> >>Until last week I was receiving most of the local (Los Angeles) digital
>> >>channels with about 70-80% signal strength, which was good enough. Most
>> >>of the analog channels were noisy/ghosty, but I get locals from DirecTV
>> >>too, so I'm only concerned about the digital ones, especially those
>> >>with
>> >>HD programming. However, one day (after a rain) I lost all OTA
>> >>reception
>> >>-- digital and analog. Some digital channels show about 5% strength,
>> >>but
>> >>most are at 0. Satellite reception is not affected on any receiver,
>> >>meaning the cables are good. OTA reception is dead on both TVs, which
>> >>eliminates the diplexers as a possible cause (both must have failed at
>> >>the same time). It looks like the antenna is dead, but then I wonder
>> >>how
>> >>is the satellite signal passed through. The LNB's are connected to the
>> >>head of the antenna first, and from there go to the receivers. Can
>> >>someone explain what could be wrong with the antenna and still allow
>> >>the
>> >>satellite signal to pass?
>> >>
>> >>The next question is, if the antenna is dead, is there a better option
>> >>for replacing it? I'm trying to avoid running additional cable(s) for
>> >>the antenna, and if possible, mount it on (or near) the dish mast.
>> >>Antennaweb.org shows that most of the DTV channels in my area are at
>> >>6-7
>> >>degrees and 37-38 miles away. The type for most channels is "red - uhf"
>> >>except for KCBS-DT, which is "green - uhf".
>> >>
>> >>Any recommendations and comments are appreciated!
>> >>
>> >>Thanks,
>> >>
>> >>--
>> >>chicho
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I'm not sure why you have the OTA TV reception problem..
>> >
>> > Dump the Terk..
>> >
>> > Data shows UHF channels, 38 miles away, & I hope you are on the
>> > TV Tower side of your complex....
>> >
>> > Buy a Channel Master $25 UHF #3021 4 bay bow tie antenna, use RG-6
>> > cable
>> > and this set up should work at a 40 mile range over flat ground..
>>
>> Well, I'm convinced the Channel Master will do much better job than the
>> Terk, but from what I've found, it can't use the satellite cable and
>> needs its own RG-6... Or am I missing something?
>
> I'm implying 2 things:
> Don't use RG-59 cable....
>
> Your Terk/Dish RG-6 cable could be bad....
>
> and if the Terk ran thru a combined cable, then the Channel Master
> could do the same thing... Cable TV etc.... is a whole
> bunch
> of different frequencies (different Program Groups) running thru
> the same cable... Highest Frequencies Groups normally show
> cable problems first.....
>
>
>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> --
>> chicho
Anonymous
September 28, 2005 5:01:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Chicho Misho (chicho.misho@gmail.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
> Well, I'm convinced the Channel Master will do much better job than the
> Terk, but from what I've found, it can't use the satellite cable and
> needs its own RG-6... Or am I missing something?

You can use a diplexer at each end and use the existing satellite cable.

You put a diplexer outside and plug wires from the antenna and the dish into
the diplexer. The output of the diplexer plug into the wire you currently
use from the dish, so you'll need a new short wire that goes from the dish
to the diplexer.

Inside the house, just reverse the procedure...the current satellite wire
plugs into the diplexer, and the two outputs go to your satellite receiver
and your TV tuner.

Whatever you do, don't spend more than $10/each for the diplexers.

--
Jeff Rife | "I'm reading a great John Grisham novel...it's
| about a young Southern lawyer who fights an
| evil corporate giant."
| -- Dick Solomon, "3rd Rock from the Sun"
Anonymous
September 28, 2005 5:01:12 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeff Rife wrote:
> Chicho Misho (chicho.misho@gmail.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
>
>>Well, I'm convinced the Channel Master will do much better job than the
>>Terk, but from what I've found, it can't use the satellite cable and
>>needs its own RG-6... Or am I missing something?
>
>
> You can use a diplexer at each end and use the existing satellite cable.
>
> You put a diplexer outside and plug wires from the antenna and the dish into
> the diplexer. The output of the diplexer plug into the wire you currently
> use from the dish, so you'll need a new short wire that goes from the dish
> to the diplexer.
>
> Inside the house, just reverse the procedure...the current satellite wire
> plugs into the diplexer, and the two outputs go to your satellite receiver
> and your TV tuner.
>
> Whatever you do, don't spend more than $10/each for the diplexers.
>

Thanks, Jeff, that makes perfect sense. I wasn't aware that diplexers
can also combine two signals, not only separate them... or rather that
the same device can do both.

So currently I have two diplexers, one in each room, that separate
satellite from OTA signals. If I go with only satellite feed for the
room with the SD receiver/TV, I understand I can use that second
diplexer on the roof to combine SAT and OTA for the HD receiver. Is that
correct?

Thanks again,

--
chicho
Anonymous
September 28, 2005 8:32:28 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Chicho Misho (chicho.misho@gmail.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
> So currently I have two diplexers, one in each room, that separate
> satellite from OTA signals. If I go with only satellite feed for the
> room with the SD receiver/TV, I understand I can use that second
> diplexer on the roof to combine SAT and OTA for the HD receiver. Is that
> correct?

After reading your first post, it appears you have a satellite dish with
a built-in 5x4 multiswitch. The wire from the current clip-on antenna
should feed into that switch. Simply replace that wire with one from the
new OTA antenna, and you don't need to change anything else...you are good
to go.

--
Jeff Rife | Coach: How's life, Norm?
|
| Norm: Not for the squeamish, Coach.
Anonymous
September 28, 2005 8:49:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeff Rife wrote:
> Chicho Misho (chicho.misho@gmail.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
>
>>So currently I have two diplexers, one in each room, that separate
>>satellite from OTA signals. If I go with only satellite feed for the
>>room with the SD receiver/TV, I understand I can use that second
>>diplexer on the roof to combine SAT and OTA for the HD receiver. Is that
>>correct?
>
>
> After reading your first post, it appears you have a satellite dish with
> a built-in 5x4 multiswitch. The wire from the current clip-on antenna
> should feed into that switch. Simply replace that wire with one from the
> new OTA antenna, and you don't need to change anything else...you are good
> to go.
>

Well, not sure if it is a 5x4 multiswitch (3x4 seems more logical to me
- 3 LNB's x 4 receivers), but yes, there is a built-in switch on the
dish with connectors for 4 receivers. Are you saying that I can connect
the Channel Master as if it were a third receiver? That sounds great!

Thanks,

--
chicho
Anonymous
September 29, 2005 3:37:41 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Chicho Misho (chicho.misho@gmail.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
> Well, not sure if it is a 5x4 multiswitch (3x4 seems more logical to me
> - 3 LNB's x 4 receivers), but yes, there is a built-in switch on the
> dish with connectors for 4 receivers.

Two of the three LNBs have two outputs each, plus one output on the other
LNB (five total). The single output is joined to one of the outputs of
one of the other LNBs using a special combiner, and you end up with 4 total
satellite outputs that get fed into the switch. There should also be a
fifth input that is fed by the clip-on Terk OTA antenna, and the switch
has a built-in diplexer that combines the antenna signal to all four
satellite outputs.

> Are you saying that I can connect
> the Channel Master as if it were a third receiver?

No, you connect the new antenna to the same place the clip-on antenna
is connected to. You are just replacing an existing OTA antenna, so you
don't need any cable changes. You'll get OTA signal where you get it
now, just better.

--
Jeff Rife |
| http://www.nabs.net/Cartoons/Peanuts/TenPin.gif
Anonymous
September 29, 2005 2:05:31 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

I took the diplexers off at both ends (satellite dish on the roof) and
inside (before it went into the receiver) and ran the OTA antenna
directly to the receiver with a separate coax. Worked great. I
mentioned in another thread that my antenna manufacturer mentioned that
diplexers rob the antenna up to 30% of its pulling power, per diplexer.
Anonymous
September 29, 2005 2:13:15 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeff Rife wrote:
> Chicho Misho (chicho.misho@gmail.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
>
>>Well, not sure if it is a 5x4 multiswitch (3x4 seems more logical to me
>>- 3 LNB's x 4 receivers), but yes, there is a built-in switch on the
>>dish with connectors for 4 receivers.
>
>
> Two of the three LNBs have two outputs each, plus one output on the other
> LNB (five total). The single output is joined to one of the outputs of
> one of the other LNBs using a special combiner, and you end up with 4 total
> satellite outputs that get fed into the switch.

Got it.

There should also be a
> fifth input that is fed by the clip-on Terk OTA antenna, and the switch
> has a built-in diplexer that combines the antenna signal to all four
> satellite outputs.

No fifth input, only 4 SAT outputs. It's actually the Terk antenna that
combines the signals. It has two IN and two OUT connectors. So two short
cables connect two of the switch outputs to the IN connectors of the
antenna. The long cables that go down to the receivers (diplexers) are
connected to the OUT connectors of the antenna.

>
>
>> Are you saying that I can connect
>>the Channel Master as if it were a third receiver?
>
>
> No, you connect the new antenna to the same place the clip-on antenna
> is connected to. You are just replacing an existing OTA antenna, so you
> don't need any cable changes. You'll get OTA signal where you get it
> now, just better.
>

Not exactly like that (see above), but I figured it out with your help.
I'll connect switch output #1 straight to the SD SAT receiver (no need
for OTA in that room). Switch output #2 with a short cable to the SAT
connector of a diplexer. The Channel Master to the ANT connector of the
same diplexer. And the third (combined) connector of the diplexer goes
down to the HD receiver (with another diplexer before the receiver to
split SAT and OTA).

Thank you for your help.

--
chicho
Anonymous
September 29, 2005 2:26:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

proc wrote:
> I took the diplexers off at both ends (satellite dish on the roof) and
> inside (before it went into the receiver) and ran the OTA antenna
> directly to the receiver with a separate coax. Worked great. I
> mentioned in another thread that my antenna manufacturer mentioned that
> diplexers rob the antenna up to 30% of its pulling power, per diplexer.
>

I agree that it's better to have a dedicated cable for the antenna, but
in my case it's not very easy to run another RG-6 from the roof to the
first floor. The two that I installed 6-7 years ago when I got satellite
are about 75' long and run down on the outside wall... Had to make them
look tight and pretty, wouldn't go through the same drill again.

--
chicho
Anonymous
September 29, 2005 7:26:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Chicho Misho (chicho.misho@gmail.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
> Not exactly like that (see above), but I figured it out with your help.
> I'll connect switch output #1 straight to the SD SAT receiver (no need
> for OTA in that room). Switch output #2 with a short cable to the SAT
> connector of a diplexer. The Channel Master to the ANT connector of the
> same diplexer. And the third (combined) connector of the diplexer goes
> down to the HD receiver (with another diplexer before the receiver to
> split SAT and OTA).

Bimbo! (see "Short Circuit" for the reference).

If you need to, at a later date you can split the antenna output outside
and wire more diplexers for more rooms of OTA.

--
Jeff Rife |
| http://www.nabs.net/Cartoons/TractorBeam.jpg
!