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New System XP vs Vista

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July 24, 2008 12:55:10 PM

A friend of mine and I are getting ready to build him a new gaming rig based around an E8400 CPU and ATI 4870 GPU. Except for DirectX 10, I can't say Vista has any features that I would personally want, but I have avoided Vista discussions for a while since I've been perfectly happy with XP, but thought I'd get a more informed opinion since Vista now has its Service Pack 1. Basically we were wondering if
1.) Is DirectX 10 enough of an improvement to upgrade now

2.) Does Vista have any other primarily gaming related upgrades compared to XP

3.) If we go with Vista, what are the advantages of Ultimate 32 bit vs Ultimate 64 bit


Thanks for all your imput.

More about : system vista

July 24, 2008 1:13:41 PM

Ive been using vista (retail) since before it was released and the only problems i had was with my old x600xt drivers.
Personally i would recommend it but not if you have less than 2gb ram.
Vista64 is good if you have 4gb+ ram.
Gaming performance with the service pack is virtually identical to xp. And whats the use of all the power of the 4870 when you only use dx9? :/ 
July 24, 2008 1:15:04 PM

Vista 64
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July 24, 2008 1:16:05 PM

I heard they're going to replace Vista with Vienna by the end of next year. I'm going to stick with XP until Vista's future is a little more clear.
July 24, 2008 1:20:51 PM

1. If you already have a copy of XP, it's pretty much a coin flip. If you're in a position where you must buy a new OS at this point I think you'd be crazy to buy XP.

2. None are coming to mind. My Vista Premium 64 bit laptop arrives tomorrow... so maybe I'll find SOMETHING.

3. If you're going to have 4 GB or more, you'll absolutely want a 64 bit variety of Vista. Not really sure I'd recommend the Ultimate version, but hey... whatever. Ultimate pretty much combines the functions of Vista Business and Vista Home Premium into one package. If you're not joining a domain or if you don't require automatic file backups, Home Premium would serve you fine.


Well, they've already said that Vista will support DX11 so I'm not sure there's any benefit to waiting for Windows 7.
July 24, 2008 1:21:17 PM

I have Vista HP 64bit.

I hated it at first before SP1. Was the crappiest OS, but still not as bad as Windows 98.

The 4870 will have DX 10.1 support, so upgrading to Vista you will see the bonus of DX 10.

Since SP1 Vista has given me no problems with games, and runs them flawlessly. It is a faster OS now, and feature packed.

I suggest 64bit, since you can use more ram than a 32bit OS. I use 4Gb, and Vista starts to really shine. Lots of speed, and multitasking, and then some.


Cheers,

-PM
a b 4 Gaming
July 24, 2008 1:38:58 PM

I upgraded to Vista 32 about 6 months ago from XP Pro.
I really like Vista, I have had no problems what so ever and like all the features. I have the 64 bit version as well, but waiting for my next major upgrade and going from 2 to 4 gig of memory before I bother installing it.
July 24, 2008 1:54:53 PM

I have recently gone vista, and i must say its nicer than xp. Its hardly revolutionary or groundbreaking, and it does require a good PC, but better than xp.

As for waiting for Viena...well i dont really think thats much of an option. Who knows for sure when it will arrive, and when it does come out it will be full of bugs just like every other microsoft OS. Always better to wait at least a year before getting MS's newest OS so that by the time you do take the plunge it might actually work.
a b 4 Gaming
July 24, 2008 2:12:21 PM

I agree with Rodney. If you already have XP, there's nothing compelling enough in Vista to make it worth spending more money.
That said, the next new Windows OS I buy will not be XP. I think they've finally gotten a lot of compatibility issues worked out of Vista, certainly enough that it's worth a shot. I KNEW the initial versions would not work for me, but I no longer have any basis for that belief, so I will move forward.
July 24, 2008 2:26:00 PM

Quote:
Vista all the way dude. Get the 64 bit version.

My what a difference one SP must make.
July 24, 2008 2:34:09 PM

Vista is a bloated pig.
I love how people say that Vista is not as bad as Windows ME or 98, like that"s a ringing endorsement.
Go and use Windows XP Pro it's way better on a fast system than Vista.
It will be at least another year before DX 10 makes a great difference in gaming.
Hell even the game Crysis is being recoded to make it run better. They should give everyone who bought the first version of Crysis a free copy of the new game.
So you really have no good reason to run out and buy Vista.
a b 4 Gaming
July 24, 2008 2:40:37 PM

Unlicensed said:
3.) If we go with Vista, what are the advantages of Ultimate 32 bit vs Ultimate 64 bit
Home Premium 64 is probably what you want. Look this article over to see the difference between versions: http://techreport.com/articles.x/15009/10
The advantage XP had in gaming performance has been neutralized with Vista being pretty much on par now.

People claim that Vista is bloated because it uses more RAM. That ignores the design of Vista that actually gives back more of that RAM (when required by the programs & processes) than XP can.

a b 4 Gaming
July 24, 2008 3:12:05 PM

+1 to WR2
Yeah superfetch is designed to use pretty much all your ram to speed up your pc, which IMO is why you buy ram in the first place. However it does give it back when necessary.

Just Fyi, vista ultimate has a basic disc imaging utility which can come in handy. Also it let you use Microsoft virtual pc, which can be a great way to reuse that copy of xp if you've got it, or linux. IMO it's worth the 50 bucks.
July 24, 2008 3:25:07 PM

What vista does with the RAM is cache's it. Instead of a program determining how much RAM it needs or gets, Vista controls the RAM. So, in vista, when you go to task manager then performance, you want to see almost all your ram chaced.

I have used Vista 64 since release and never had a issue that I can blame on Microsoft. Nvidia is another story....
July 24, 2008 3:30:34 PM

bobbknight said:
Vista is a bloated pig.
I love how people say that Vista is not as bad as Windows ME or 98, like that"s a ringing endorsement.
Go and use Windows XP Pro it's way better on a fast system than Vista.
It will be at least another year before DX 10 makes a great difference in gaming.
Hell even the game Crysis is being recoded to make it run better. They should give everyone who bought the first version of Crysis a free copy of the new game.
So you really have no good reason to run out and buy Vista.


For the majority of users there's no reason to build a new machine and stick with XP as opposed to Vista, especially Vista 64bit. I admit that I see SUBJECTIVE improvements in performance of Vista64 over Vista32, but all of the 64bit systems I've used have at least, at least 4GB of RAM (which is not that much and is nothing special considering historic Microsoft OS RAM usage increases...it is 2008).

For a while I tried the dual-booting scenaaario, XP32 and Vista64...but I soon realized that there was no benefit in keeping a hardware-based XP32 installation around, in fact, it even flaked out at times (way more so than Vista64, on the hardware listed in my sig). ...but just in case, I keep XP32 alive and well fed in a VMWare virtual machine...but there's really no need to do so, its just part of an MS OS museum...kinda fun.

XP is faster on lesser hardware, yes. ...but Win2K would be even faster still...should we fall back to Win2K? My opinion is this, Vista64 is stronger, as quick or quicker, and offers a more contemporary experience than XP64. XP32 limits my RAM usage and, therefore, my concurrently running virtual machines, why would I stick with it? XP, especially for general home use, is fading into the past...let it go...or virtualize it if you want. Besides, all truth be told, Vista can be turned down to XP levels if nostalgia is really your thing.

I do undersand that still Vista offers a challenge in the Enterprise environment...just like XP did for a while. ...but I'm able to use it quite well on my office Dell M1730 with dual XP32 virtual machine's running concurrently (for my privileged and non-privileged domain accounts). For me this scenario works better on a Vista64 host than XP anything.
July 24, 2008 3:48:39 PM

I have run Vista 32 for a year and the only trouble I have ever had with Vista is with the Media Center. It can be difficult to get other devices on a network to recognize a Vista Machine as a media center and much is written troubleshooting those issues. Vista guards your machine tighter than a Medieval chastity belt. That said, all else seems to run fine and I just ordered a new desktop with Vista Home Premium 64.
July 24, 2008 4:11:09 PM

+1 to the Vista is a bloated pig comment.

I am using XP with a vista theme - looks very similar on the surface and I don't have huge amounts of bloatware inhabiting my system.

Maybe I will upgrade to Vista on my next re-install, but for now XP is fine.
July 24, 2008 4:28:20 PM

i like my vista 64 =)
July 24, 2008 4:30:47 PM

I recently upgraded an old laptop from XP Pro to Home Premium 32 bit, b.c. I needed a media center in a new location and wanted My Movies capabilities.

The biggest issues I hit are that Home Premium does not allow Remote Desktop (but there is a hack to solve this out on the internet), and the MB sound chip (STAC9750) did not have fully-compatible drivers for Vista so I lost my S/PDIF out (and DTS/DD 5.1 out! Doh!). But I can hack the RD if necessary, and I was able to get a turtlebeach USB sound card supporting S/PDIF optical out and DTS/DD 5.1 for very cheap.

With newer hardware and in particular the 4870 GPU, you shouldn't have the same sound card issues, and with Ultimate (if you want to pay that much), you get RD.

The fresh install of Vista is far faster than the aged install of XP that it replaced. But I couldn't tell you whether a fresh install of XP would be notably faster than Vista or not.

You will need to upgrade from XP at some point, due to lack of support from MSFT. I daresay Vista should be supported far longer, which will reduce the likelihood of a necessitated upgrade.

There are features in Vista (e.g. Sidebar, Sideshow) that are just beginning to gain traction with developers. I expect you will soon see sidebar gadgets for things like Media Center secondary display controller, IM, and who knows what else. But there might be something out there you'll find interesting, and you wouldn't be able to get it with XP.
July 24, 2008 5:12:27 PM

I wouldnt change from my Vista Ultimate 64bit for anything. Lets face it, technology moves forward, not back. Why invest in an old OS, even if it was a good one. If you are getting a new rig together, may as well make it as current as possible. As future hardware comes out, you run an increasing risk of XP drivers no longer being supported the further down the road you go.

Personally, go with a Vista 64bit system with at least 4GB of ram...preferably 8GB. Once you get up to 8GB of ram in Vista, you gain an extra benefit from how the OS handles caching to the HD. DDR2 is so cheap right now, may as well stock up on a high quality brand.
July 24, 2008 5:28:37 PM

What I would suggest is to use a computer that is running Vista on it and see how you like it. Don't expect it to think, look, feel, run like XP because, as you can see by the name, it isn't XP. Treat it like a new OS and you will have very little to no issues. Treat it like XP and be closed minded, and you will have a world of issues on your desk.

Vista will be supported far longer then XP for the sole reason that the Vista kernel will be in the next few OS that Microsoft will be coming out with. Windows 7 or whatever the name is, is base on Vista.

Vista is more secure, with a better firewall and runs you administrative account in a user account mode to reduce the amount of malware, viruses, worm, Trojans or any other harmful program from installing itself onto you machine. Vista 64 is better with higher support for RAM (Ultimate can support up to 127 GB of RAM while Home Premium can support only 16GB). Compatibility mode in Vista actually works. XP compatibility mode never worked for me. Hibernate works with Vista (XP had known issues with coming out of hibernation). With all versions of Vista you have the Windows Media Player (not WMP but the thing that lets you watch TV or the other media stuff... I am drawing a blank on names right now). Because you are a gamer, Direct X 10(.1) is only on Vista which also means when DX11 comes out next year (your 4870 card is already DX11 compatible) you have to have Vista to have that as well (due to having a DX10 compatible system as a requirement for DX11).


The only reason why you wouldn't want to upgrade to Vista is if you have an older system that is only 32bit compatible. If you buy an new system or have at least a Conroe, then there is no reason why you shouldn't move to Vista.
July 24, 2008 5:30:27 PM

Quote:
Id go with XP DX10 is a joke so far and Microsoft announced it will support XP until 2013.


Microsoft will support Windows XP untill 2012.
July 27, 2008 7:09:41 PM

I have Vista in 32bit(htpc) and 64bit(gaming pc).The 32bit was very. problemmatic until sp1 showed up.Now the 64bit Ultimate with 4gigs of ram is flawless,but then this is a new build with available drives at the time I built it.SP1 was the icing on the cake adding more noticable speed.I can honestly say I love Vista
July 27, 2008 8:54:26 PM

i recently built a new amd-based system and i originally installed xp on it. before building, i had planned on buying vista along with it, but i never got around to it. I ran XP up until about 1.5 months ago, when i installed vista. So far, i've had only one BSoD, which was actually caused by an ATi graphics driver, and everything has been running faster. vista is just so much better for every day use. i see a noticeable difference in how much faster firefox starts on vista than on xp. Games work fine, crysis is a little slow, but i'm going to blame this one on my athlon x2. other than that, i have no complaints and i'm officially done with xp. and i'm not missing it.
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