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cazint   10-29-2008 at 06:10:40 AM

Hey all,

Hoping some of you PC gurus can help me out here a bit. I built my first computer more than eight years ago, but ever since, i've just purchased prebuilt ones. Now, i know exactly what i want to buy, but it is difficult to find a good deal on a Core 2 Duo system because everyone is pushing these darn Quads.

So i've decided, eight years later, to try building again. I'm not a PC gamer, so i do NOT need the best of everything. I run typical desktop applications with a good bit of graphics software (Illustrator and Photoshop). Here are my main requirements:

E8400 (or E8500) Intel Core 2 Duo processor
MB: a board that works well with this processor...perhaps allowing me to overclock if i so choose in the future
XFX 512 MB Video card --- i'm looking at $50 at newegg

I do not need the best, coolest, or newest case. I do not need the most powerful psu. Here's what i've got thus far, but i'm not too happy with the MB.

MB: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applica [...] u=I69-2168
From what i've read, this MB cannot be overclocked. It's a basic MB that does the job...which, in general, is OKAY for me. Since i'm not a gamer, there's really no need for extra PCI-E slots (not need to worry about SLI). But i've read plenty of bad things about this one...and the fact that it can't work with overclocking.

Are there any SIMILARLY PRICED mother boards that you all recommend? Boards that are good name, good quality, and can tolerate overclocking this cpu? I looked a bit on newegg and saw a bundle with the E8500 cpu. It comes with a GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3R LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard. Here's the link: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6813128359

Would any of you recommend that one? Or perhaps a similar item?

Thanks for your help.

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dirtmountain   10-29-2008 at 06:37:09 AM
- 1 +

The E8500 with the P45 Gigabyte UDP3 is a very good choice for you.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6813128359

I'd seriously consider getting one of the new HD4670 graphic cards at $65 after rebate. It's not a hard core gaming card, but it is very graphic and video friendly.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6814127383

Reply to dirtmountain
chechnyan   10-29-2008 at 06:37:41 AM
- 0 +

when choosing motherboard you will search for its chipset first
and how it can give you the overclocking space for the cpu & ram a
nd then the design and layout and how much pci slot and RAM bank and SATA ports USB etc
i will say go with GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3R
for the cpu the E8500 will be good for you
for the graphic card (i know you are not into games but i still encourage you to pay a little and get the HD 4670
check this this combo deal her in newegg you can get one with a 2x2 ocz 800Mhz ram
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] =10&page=1

Reply to chechnyan
cazint   10-29-2008 at 04:39:23 PM
- 0 +

Thanks for the replies. Sounds like the Gigabyte board (at least from two replies thus far) is the winner.

With regards to video, I'm currently set to get this video card:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6814150247

Why is this card, the one you are suggesting, better:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6814127383

The xfx card had a TON more reviews, which usually means a TON more purchases. Only a handful of ppl, in comparison, reviewed (and perhaps purchased) the ati crossfire.

Just curious why you think it is better.

Thansk.

Message quoted 1 times
Reply to cazint
ajhen314   10-29-2008 at 04:59:57 PM
- 0 +

I would say that you should get a quad if you are using graphical programs as they will take advantage of the multiple cores and allow you to multitask better. As for the ati card the only reason the 4670 has less reviews is because it has been out for a shorter period of time but it will run circles around the 8600gt. Really it is no contest and for the money it cannot be beat by any of Nvidias offerings.

Reply to ajhen314
aevm   10-29-2008 at 05:23:17 PM
- 0 +

cazint wrote :

Thanks for the replies. Sounds like the Gigabyte board (at least from two replies thus far) is the winner.

With regards to video, I'm currently set to get this video card:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6814150247

Why is this card, the one you are suggesting, better:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6814127383

The xfx card had a TON more reviews, which usually means a TON more purchases. Only a handful of ppl, in comparison, reviewed (and perhaps purchased) the ati crossfire.

Just curious why you think it is better.

Thansk.



Yeah, that Gigabyte is a good board.

He thinks the HD 4670 is better than the 8600GT because it's about twice as fast in games. You may not care about that, but still why get a weaker card if the price is similar. Also, the HD 4760 is based on newer 55nm technology and that means better performance per Watt. It's also a better match for the Crossfire motherboard you're buying.


Reply to aevm
cazint   10-29-2008 at 06:15:00 PM
- 0 +

Oh, and when/if you give you opinion on the MBs, please know that i would, ideally, like to overclock the cpu in the future.

Thanx.

Reply to cazint
aevm   10-29-2008 at 07:25:34 PM
- 0 +

P45 is very good for overclocking. In fact, it's the best available unless you count the much more expensive X48. The X48 doesn't make sense for you because you're not a gamer and don't need Crossfire. So yeah, pick something based on P45.

The GA-EP45-UD3R sounds very appropriate here. 3 PCI slots and 8 SATA ports is excellent and pretty rare these days. You could also look at the P5Q Pro (lose one PCI slot but gain a second PCI-E slot). The second PCI-E slot can be useful if you want to add a cheap 8400GS or something to handle monitors #3 and #4.

Reply to aevm
cazint   10-29-2008 at 07:47:12 PM
- 0 +

ya'll have been so helpful, i may as well even ask a couple more ?s.

tigerdirect has 2 GB of ram (1gb x2) for $20 after mail in rebate...and this is corsair. However, it is PC6400 DDR2 800MHz. The Gigabyte MB supports more than 800 MHz for RAM. am i missing out soooo much by taking this great deal?

Also, ? for you on the case. Currently, i've picked an Ultra case from tigerdirect for $40:
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applica [...] u=ULT33179

I'm set to get a power supply from Newegg:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6817153052

With rebates, that's $75 for case and psu (500W). Is there any similarly priced ones that you all recommend?

Thanks again.

Reply to cazint
aevm   10-29-2008 at 07:58:17 PM
- 0 +

You should get 4 GB of RAM, especially if you use Vista. If you buy 1 GB sticks you fill all the DIMM slots on the MB and can't add more if you want 8 GB later. I'd look for something like 2x2GB. Still, considering how cheap DDR2 is, it doesn't matter either way.

There's a $108 combination case+PSU (Antec Sonata + 500W Antec Earthwatts) if you want.
http://www.buy.com/prod/antec-sona [...] 59259.html

I got one like that at work. It's bad for gaming (just one fan), it has a door (which I find annoying but some of my coworkers like), and it's very quiet.

Pick a video card first, then pick a case that has enough room for it. It should be easier for you than for gamers because you won't need a huge high-end gaming card.


Reply to aevm
cazint   10-29-2008 at 08:16:25 PM
- 0 +

Thanks for the response.
Okay, i'm set to order now; i have two carts ready to click "proceed to checkout". Just want to confirm that i have everything i need.

  • Case & PSU.
  • MB.
  • 2 - 120mm fans (one at front and at back)...the front fan is meant to be for intake...but it's just the same fan. Will that work just by turning it around? or do i actually need to by a special "intake" fan?
  • CPU (retail box...i assume this comes with heatsink and fan.?.)
  • Thermal gel (arctic silver 5)...is this even necessary though? Is the default 3 strips of gel on the cpu by intel enough?
  • Graphics Card.
  • RAM
  • Harddrive
  • DVD writer and DVD rom


Am i missing anything? When you parts like this, does each part come with everything i should need? Meaning, i don't need extra screws or this or that?

Thanks for all the help.

Reply to cazint
aevm   10-29-2008 at 09:35:14 PM
- 0 +

Screws should come with the case.
At least they did come with my case - I got a whole bag and I don't even know what some of them are for :)

SATA cables should come with the motherboard.

Yes, CPU retail box means heatsink and fan too.

The Arctic Silver 5 is not really necessary, but it would lower temperatures.

Not sure why you'd buy a DVD ROM. I'd buy a second writer for a few bucks more, or just one writer.

No such thing as special intake fan. Just make sure your fans point in the same direction - one must push and one must pull.

Reply to aevm
cazint   10-29-2008 at 10:27:27 PM
- 0 +

the DVD rom is stupid. but it's for copying dvd's if i made some and then wanted to copy them. unless i'm missing something, why spend, even if it's just 10 bucks more, that extra to get a 2nd dvd burner when i really only need a basic dvd rom?

but maybe there's something i'm not thinking of.

thanks.

Reply to cazint
aevm   10-29-2008 at 10:35:37 PM
- 0 +

I usually copy DVDs to the hard disk first, that way I don't risk buffer underrun errors if the reader is slower than the writer or it discovers a scratch and fails. But anyway, yeah, it makes sense now.

Good luck with the build! Let us know how it works.


Reply to aevm
cazint   10-30-2008 at 12:34:28 AM
- 0 +

btw, here's the memory i purchased:
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applica [...] CatId=2368

Just want to make sure this will be okay with the gigabyte board.

Also, that is a great deal right? 20 bucks for 2gigs of Corsair memory.

If so, i'll grab another pair for 20 bucks and have the 4gb...although i believe windows 32bit only shows like 3.2ish.

Thanks.

Reply to cazint
aevm   10-30-2008 at 02:59:26 AM
- 0 +

Good RAM. Good price. Ask a friend to order two more GB for you.

Quote :

Restrictions Apply. Notice: Limit one (1) rebate per person, address, company, or household.

Reply to aevm
cazint   10-30-2008 at 03:47:48 AM
- 0 +

thanks.

when i get all these parts next week, should i dig up this thread and just add to it if i have any questions on the build, or woudl it be best to just make a new thread. and when I say questions, i literally mean the steps of how to build a computer.

Is there a how-to guide somewhere? perhaps something that you all recommend.

Thanks.

Reply to cazint
aevm   10-30-2008 at 04:08:10 AM
- 0 +

This one is a good start, I guess.
http://www.pcmech.com/byopc/

You could also buy a book with DVD presentations from this list:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_s [...] &x=19&y=21
This Scott Mueller guy really knows his onions.

Reply to aevm
cazint   11-03-2008 at 05:24:27 PM
- 0 +

My parts should arrive today. Just wanted to inquire about this Arctic Silver 5. You said it is not necessary but woudl lower temps.

All boxes are arriving today EXCEPT the one with arctic silver...and it pains me to wait till tomorrow for the build.

Does anyone know if the temps lower sooo much with Arctic Silver. If it's not a huge amount, i can wait. Maybe in a few months, i'll want to go ahead and learn about overclocking and overclock my processor (it's the e8500). At that time, i could always remove the default "gel" (from the 3 strips) and then add the arctic silver...although i've heard that is a pain and will have to learn about how to remove the default gel.

Any ideas? Does that sound like a good plan? Or perhaps i should just be patient and wait for the A.S. and build my system tomorrow.

Thanks.

Reply to cazint
aevm   11-03-2008 at 05:31:04 PM
- 0 +

I'd wait. Spend today reading the motherboard manual :) If that's too thin, read articles about overclocking.

Reply to aevm
cazint   11-03-2008 at 05:52:52 PM
- 0 +

Isn't overclocking just changing some "stuff" on the cpu.?. I've never done or even read about this. And if i do overclock, i'm not looking to do so excessively...nothing that could even come close to damaging my system. I've read that getting the e8500 to reach 3.6ish is rather easy minimal changes.

Do you have a suggested resource for beginners on this?

Thanks again.

Reply to cazint
cazint   11-03-2008 at 06:19:31 PM
- 0 +

Perhaps nevermind, as i found and have browsed through this:
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/ [...] uals-guide

Damn, that seems like a lot of "stuff" to do in order to overclock. As mentioned, i was only looking to get it to 3.6 GHz for now. The chip's default settings are 3.16 (9.5 multiplier times 333 fsb). So if i increase fsb to 400, that would come to 3.8GHz. And my memory is DDR2-800, which as you know is 400 fsb.

To achieve that, do you think my changes would be kinda minimal...or will i ultimately give myself a headache trying to figure this out?

Thanks.

Reply to cazint
aevm   11-03-2008 at 06:32:57 PM
- 0 +

Oh yes, you will give yourself headaches. There are all sorts of BIOS settings to deal with, and they differ from a motherboard to another. Anyway, I'd suggest you assemble the PC and use it for a month without overclocking. That way if something goes wrong it will be easier to figure out what - fewer variables.

Reply to aevm
cazint   11-04-2008 at 01:57:10 AM
- 0 +

The following ? is not hardware related...it's actually a vista question.

I have an official windows vista ultimate (courtesy of a friends microsoft employeed discount), and i noticed it comes with both the 32 bit and the 64 bit versions. The downfall of the 32 bit is recognizing more than 3 GHz (approx) of ram. But are there downfalls of the 64 bit version?

Are there additional compatibility issues between 64bit vista and other software.....more than that of the 32 bit version.

Just wondering if the 64 bit is a good idea to install, or if i should stick with the 32 bit.

Thanks.

Reply to cazint
aevm   11-04-2008 at 02:33:15 AM
- 0 +

I'd pick the 64-bit version. Vista 64-bit is not just aimed at corporations, the way XP 64-bit was. Games are tested on it, for example. Every driver or application that wants a Vista certification from Microsoft has to pass the same tests on both 32-bit and 64-bit.

Reply to aevm
cazint   11-04-2008 at 07:30:15 AM
- 0 +

okay. i did my build this evening and have spent the last hour and a half trying to figure out why this thing won't turn on.

One obvoius thing i hadn't done was connect the 2x2 12v connector. But everything else looked okay. Basically, what happens is when i hit the power button, all six phase lights briefly cycle on and then off. And i hear a slight beep...almost like it wants to post but can't. Nothing else cycles...no fans, nothing.

I'm using a good psu, supposedly...a 500w Thermaltake purepower. In the very brief guide that comes with the psu, it says for testing purposes, to unplug the 24pin connector from the MB, get a paper clip, unbend it, and put one end into the green wire, and one end into any black. It says to turn on the psu and the psu fan should spin. Mine doesn't!

Damn! Does this mean i have a defective thermaltake psu right out of the box? I mean, how often does this happen?

Reply to cazint
small cheese   11-04-2008 at 02:26:11 PM
- 0 +

:pfff: Just try and take the system apart then put it back again

Reply to small cheese
small cheese   11-04-2008 at 02:30:51 PM
- 0 +

what is the psu in your current computer? check if it will work with your pc you are building if so try and if it works send back the psu. try looking thermaltake tough power 500w :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

Reply to small cheese
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