Deneb does 4.3GHz on air

[kassler]

Another thread edited and locked due to the fanboy voting game.

 

[yomamafor1]

I find it extremely difficult to believe. Given the process technology AMD uses, its simply no match to Intel's more advanced HK/MG process.

But of course, if there's actually proof for it (CPU-Z shot, machine shot), then it should be believed.

 

[dagger]

I find it extremely difficult to believe. Given the process technology AMD uses, its simply no match to Intel's more advanced HK/MG process.

But of course, if there's actually proof for it (CPU-Z shot, machine shot), then it should be believed.

Lol, same here. Without high k material, AMD chips face a serious physical wall on oc that high. It's not just "computer stuff," there are laws of physics that need to be followed.

 

[the last resort]

AMD's Deneb's do use HK/MG. Time for someone to do their homework. THat's why AMD's Denebs are doing well.

 

[teh_boxzor]

yep AMD and IBM have been using it for some time. IBM i guess developed their own version of high k and gave it to AMD.

i'll try to dig up the article i found it at.

edit: here the link http://blogs.computerworld.com/node/4462

someone teach me how to link?

 

[yomamafor1]

Actually no. Deneb is still built on 45nm SOI technology from IBM. They will make the migrate probably next year.

Time for someone to do their homework.

Right back at ya

 

[MarkG]

Sounds dubious, but good news for everyone other than Intel if it does turn out to be true...

 

[roofus]

if it is true, great. i couldn't help notice that site pretty much circles the wagons around AMD products so i would take that article with a grain of salt.

 

[yomamafor1]

yep AMD and IBM have been using it for some time. IBM i guess developed their own version of high k and gave it to AMD.

i'll try to dig up the article i found it at.

edit: here the link http://blogs.computerworld.com/node/4462

someone teach me how to link?

I'm sorry, but your article mentions nothing about AMD moving to HKMG with Deneb.

Here is a report this year:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20080304121622_AMD_Demos_45nm_Native_Quad_Core_Processors.html

Key innovations within AMD’s 45nm process are scheduled to include Immersion Lithography, Fourth-generation Strained Silicon, Ultra-low-k Dielectrics, and High-k/metal Gates. However, the initial 45 nm CPU generation will not use high-k dielectric metal gate technology. AMD believes that it can be “competitive” without high-k at this time, but high-k is an option to be introduced at a later stage of 45 nm production.

 

[dagger]

if it is true, great. i couldn't help notice that site pretty much circles the wagons around AMD products so i would take that article with a grain of salt.

Well, they're not doing AMD any favors by trying to build up hype to an untenable level. It'll be the same thing that happened to Phenom. Overinflated expectations leads to crushing disappointment. ATI's 4000s graphics card is the opposite. No one expected much, but received high performers.

 

[roofus]

i 200% agree dagger. that's pretty much my point. dropping links and posting from obscure, subjective sites could lead to a major let down. AMD kept it pretty quiet on their 4000 series cards and had pure gold. the "leaks" and hype for the Deneb are reminiscent of the Phenom.

 

[jj463rd]

Go here to find out.High-K is later on.
http://www.amd.com/us-en/0,,3715_15503,00.html?redir=45nm01
See the Press Presentation .pdf and the Q&A on 45nm.

 

[descendency]

When did clock speeds matter in comparision to other very different chips?

 

[Just_An_Engineer]

i 200% agree dagger. that's pretty much my point. dropping links and posting from obscure, subjective sites could lead to a major let down. AMD kept it pretty quiet on their 4000 series cards and had pure gold. the "leaks" and hype for the Deneb are reminiscent of the Phenom.

The same could be said of the sites reporting that Nehalem will OC over 4 Ghz on air. I'm skeptical that this article is true just as I am skeptical of the articles about Nehalem. Until the production processors are released and we see test results from non-ES chips it's all just conjecture.

Regarding AMD's use of the HK/MG process, I suspect that this will be implemented with the AM3 Denebs slotted to come out in Q1-09 and the AM2+ Denebs that will be released this year will be the last SOI parts.

 

[randomizer]

the "leaks" and hype for the Deneb are reminiscent of the Phenom.

But Deneb doesn't have a high performance bar to jump over, unlike Nehalem. People are also more skeptical of AMDs claims this time round (remember the Barcy 40% over Clovertown?), so I don't think there will be as much hype. More hope, for sure, but the hype has too much salt this time.

 

[epsilon84]

And the hype machine goes into overdrive!

I like the months before something new gets released, its exciting with so many rumours, leaks and claims of grandeur... of course with those highs often come the inevitable lows when release time comes and you realise all the hype was blown way out of proportion.

I'll be honest, without a CPU-Z screeny I am quite sceptical of these claims, especially the part about power consumption being better than Intel 45nm HKMG, but it would be amazing if true.

However, I'm sure most of us here remember the hype surrounding Phenom before release... and we all know how that went.

 

[NMDante]

Go here to find out.High-K is later on.
http://www.amd.com/us-en/0,,3715_15503,00.html?redir=45nm01
See the Press Presentation .pdf and the Q&A on 45nm.

The link you provided and both the Press Presentation and Q&A simply mention HiKMGs as future 45nm options, not something being used. In fact, in the Press Presentation PDF, it simply states in slide 3 "First to volume production with low-K interconnect material", and in slide 4 "High-k/metal gate / future 45nm".

But back OT -
4.3Ghz is impressive if true. But what if Deneb cannot come close to this supposed mark? I just hope this isn't an attempt to put AMD's upcoming product in a spotlight that it might not be able to handle.

 

[BadTrip]

AMD is still SOI. They wont go HKMG until next year at best. Oh and by the way the Nehalem at 4 GHZ have pics.

 

[zenmaster]

And Intel's CURRENT Quad Core Processors are going 4ghz and Beyond on Air. So to believe their next gen can meet current levels is not surprising.

 

[apache_lives]

http://www.nordichardware.com/news,8195.html

Many readers have been getting back to us regarding the unusually positive reports about AMD lately. I guess we became colored a bit by our love for the Radeon HD 2900 XT cards when no one really cared for them, but then again our favorite games are of the 3DMark series and not of the interactive type, and there the Radeon 2900 XT was a lot of fun. However, we always used Intel's processors together with the card(s), and even though we don't see a change in that anytime soon, the everyday overclockers may get a change of heart with the new AMD models based on the Deneb core.

A while back we reported on a recent interview with AMD General Manager of AMD's Server and Workstation chip business, Pat Patla, where he claimed that Shanghai is much more than a mere die-shrink and that it is 20% faster than Barcelona clock per clock. We've been told by a second source that 20% may be a bit much, but that there is an IPC boost to expect, but closer to 15% than 20. In either case it's just a nice boost. This is applies for Deneb as well we've been told.

The source even indicates that since Nehalem isn't that much of a desktop upgrade, but server mostly, Deneb will become the gaming processor to get. We have no secondary confirmation at this time, but we wanted to forward the information. In fact, source also says that Deneb was able to do 4.3GHz under a Scythe Mine cooler, stable of course. It's very important to use the right motherboard though, you will need the SB750 southbridge to begin with.

Most people should be able to hit 3.6GHz with a decent cooler, source says. The most amazing is that the processor should still run fairly cool and consume less power than Intel equivalents. Comparing Intel's new processors to AMD's new, Intel is gaining on the server market, while AMD will be trying to get back the retail market. We will not have to wait long for it to happen either, mass production is well under way and launch is approaching.

Considering Nehalem clock for clock gains a performance gap as wide as the gap between Core 2 and Phenom, and the fact that a phenom cant even compete with an ancient Core 2 Q6600 (since we ARE talking overclocked figures - 3ghz on stock, 3.6 on an aftermarket easy), and we are talking about Intel here, the memory performance+latency king (Intel 440BX anyone?) - i say good luck AMD.

Nehalem has real performance figures from 10+ sources, your AMD has no REAL figures - post when you have real figures and not BS.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

So NOW its hype. OK, sure it is. So is coolalers findings. You think Andreas would print this if he didnt think it had merit? I know one things for sure. Using HKNG doesnt let you over volt that high, as itll burn up when you try, so having this cpu volted high wont have the same effect as it would on Intels chips. And this isnt hype any more than what weve seen about i7

 

[chaohsiangchen]

(remember the Barcy 40% over Clovertown?)

The alleged 40% performance over is based on 4U server performance. They never say that Agena will out-perform Penryn. Stars core design is for servers, and AMD just didn't bother to design and optimize it for desktop. Ci7 is out to battle AMD on 2U server, while we are just about to see 45nm 24-core vs 16-core battle raging very soon.

 

[dagger]

So NOW its hype. OK, sure it is. So is coolalers findings. You think Andreas would print this if he didnt think it had merit? I know one things for sure. Using HKNG doesnt let you over volt that high, as itll burn up when you try, so having this cpu volted high wont have the same effect as it would on Intels chips. And this isnt hype any more than what weve seen about i7

The 4.3ghz claimed for Deneb on air is already achieved by current Intel offerings, so Nehalem will need to take a big step backward.

The same 4.3ghz on air, however, isn't anywhere near the max oc of current Phenoms, of which Deneb shares the same architecture and is a die shrink of.

So "this isnt hype any more than what weve seen about i7" isn't right. It ranks much higher on the hype scale.

 

[MarkG]

And this isnt hype any more than what weve seen about i7

Except that in one corner we have actual independent benchmarks of actual hardware and in the other corner we have the word of some guy at AMD and an anonymous 'source'...

I'd love to see AMD come out with a CPU that's competitive with Nehalem, but I don't see any reason to see this as more than hype right now.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

If this is true, would it kill some people around here? I think all of this is good news. If its hype about i7, or hype about Deneb, if both are true, its all good.