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Should I wait until the Core i7?

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October 6, 2008 3:02:53 AM

Hi I was planning on buying my new system build, but now with the soon arrival of core i7 should I just wait for it? The cpu I was going to buy was

Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Processor BX80569Q9550 - 2.83GHz, 12MB Cache, 1333MHz FSB, Yorkfield, Quad-Core, Retail, Socket 775, Processor with Fan

all feed back is appreciated!


More about : wait core

October 6, 2008 3:06:33 AM

For gaming, the difference between a Q9xxx/Q6600/E8xxx and i7 is minimal at best. If gaming is what the system will be mainly for, then its really a coin flip. Personally if its going to be a $1000+ system, id wait, but prices of the i7 chips are $300+, and I dont expect X58 boards to be below $250 if X38/X48 was any indication, and of course then you gotta add on the "its a new thing so we need to add some extra $$ to the sale price" deal.
October 6, 2008 3:10:40 AM

Matt87 said:
Hi I was planning on buying my new system build, but now with the soon arrival of core i7 should I just wait for it? The cpu I was going to buy was

Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Processor BX80569Q9550 - 2.83GHz, 12MB Cache, 1333MHz FSB, Yorkfield, Quad-Core, Retail, Socket 775, Processor with Fan

all feed back is appreciated!


It depends on what you have right now. If your current machine can meet your requirements, then i would say you should wait. If not, build what you want.
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October 6, 2008 3:12:07 AM

spathotan said:
For gaming, the difference between a Q9xxx/Q6600/E8xxx and i7 is minimal at best. If gaming is what the system will be mainly for, then its really a coin flip. Personally if its going to be a $1000+ system, id wait, but prices of the i7 chips are $300+, and I dont expect X58 boards to be below $250 if X38/X48 was any indication, and of course then you gotta add on the "its a new thing so we need to add some extra $$ to the sale price" deal.


The system I was planning on building was around $2.400 and using x48 board.

I'm just trying to build a system that is future proof for the long run. Think I should wait?
October 6, 2008 3:14:35 AM

agreed. @spathotan

if it is gaming. then go ahead get something right now. a quad will take you pretty long before you start feeling any kind of bottleneck.

although quad is not optimum for gaming, but yet, ill advice you to get it. it will make your pc run smoother due to the fact of four cores taking care of many stuff running on your pc.

thats what i think.

which quad to choose, im not sure. ill go with the cheaper one. thats what ill do. Q6600 has good value. although it is almost 1 year old now.

edit.

if you going to use that much of money, then wait.
a b à CPUs
October 6, 2008 3:14:53 AM

IF your budget is that much I would wait, at worst after new stuff is out the price of current stuff will drop
October 6, 2008 3:16:58 AM

If you are really looking to future-proof it, then I would wait.

"Future-proof" is a relative term so it ultimately depends on how long before you upgrade. Since Core i7 is an entirely different socket/architecture, it is probable best to get that, so you will at least be able to upgrade your CPU/RAM for a few years.
October 6, 2008 3:22:26 AM

helios2052 said:
If you are really looking to future-proof it, then I would wait.

"Future-proof" is a relative term so it ultimately depends on how long before you upgrade. Since Core i7 is an entirely different socket/architecture, it is probable best to get that, so you will at least be able to upgrade your CPU/RAM for a few years.


I suppose the 775 socket is getting obselite ... Which is why i asked if i should wait. I plan on using ddr3 ram so hopefully this new cpu well run programs better + games ==
October 6, 2008 3:36:54 AM

well the initial benchmarks showed that the i7 is a few fps slower than LGA775 processors in gaming.

things can change when it actually comes out.
October 6, 2008 3:44:42 AM

Well I hope when its released it well perform very very well. How much do you guys expect the price range for mobo + cpu all together ?
October 6, 2008 3:47:59 AM

Well I believe the CPUs are rumored (maybe fact??) to be around ~$300, plus I would imagine an X58 chipset is going to run any where from $250-$350. DDR3 ram should stay the same if not drop in price a little by then.
October 6, 2008 4:02:27 AM

Matt87 said:
Well I hope when its released it well perform very very well. How much do you guys expect the price range for mobo + cpu all together ?


Youre looking at $500-$700 for the i7+X58 board, vs $500-$650 now for that Q9550 and a good X48. Like I said before, its really a coin toss, but if youre gonna be building a $2000+ system I would wait for i7.
October 6, 2008 4:04:33 AM

spathotan said:
Youre looking at $500-$700 for the i7+X58 board, vs $500-$650 now for that Q9550 and a good X48. Like I said before, its really a coin toss, but if youre gonna be building a $2000+ system I would wait for i7.


All right thanks
October 6, 2008 4:40:11 AM

I decided to wait and take the plunge on the latest and greatest. I have never bought cutting edge new, so I guess I will try it now.

I am figuring on $700 for mobo and CPU. Ram shouldnt be to bad because evidentally you need the low volt stuff which is cheaper. I'm sure it will get worked out but maybe not at release.
October 6, 2008 4:57:46 AM

I agree with most of the other posters, definitely wait. Don't just blindly run out and buy it when it's released. Wait a little longer for the fallout. Check the benches to see if it is real and read the threads to see if anyone is screaming about problems. Also determine if the other (read cheaper) mobos will be available in an acceptable time frame.

Then make your decision to go with the i7 or the existing, now cheaper, Yorkfield.

October 6, 2008 5:00:51 AM

You could always build a Q6600 on a cheap board that uses DDR3, then when Core i7 comes out, switch everything to the new motherboard/processor. That way, it'll be easier to wait and you won't "waste" money buying i7 right away.
October 6, 2008 5:03:57 AM

Zorg said:
I agree with most of the other posters, definitely wait. Don't just blindly run out and buy it when it's released. Wait a little longer for the fallout. Check the benches to see if it is real and read the threads to see if anyone is screaming about problems. Also determine if the other (read cheaper) mobos will be available in an acceptable time frame.

Then make your decision to go with the i7 or the existing, now cheaper, Yorkfield.


I'm going to wait until the i7 is released. See how it goes, but im also very interested in the x58 motherboards as well.. Hopefully on release their isn't many bugs = =
a b à CPUs
October 6, 2008 5:13:22 AM

Dekasav said:
You could always build a Q6600 on a cheap board that uses DDR3, then when Core i7 comes out, switch everything to the new motherboard/processor. That way, it'll be easier to wait and you won't "waste" money buying i7 right away.



As cheap as DDR2 is why waste your money on ddr3? As others have stated, wait if your current system is doing fine. If not, I would spend half the money you are talking about spending on a good Q6600 setup and stay running another 2-3 years and wait after the new stuff comes out and they get more cpus to select from. I would expect as with a lot of new releases they will release better and better cpus as time goes by and work some bugs out and keep the extra money you wouldve spend originally to do upgrades and stay somewhat current.

If your current rig is working fine just simply wait. I was just thinking earlier today about when I went out and bought my "top end" ATI X850XT video card for 250 bucks and that everything that was on the shelf that I was drooling over is now being discarded by most enthusiasts and they wouldnt even consider buying it.

Technology changes rapidly and you can take the plunge and spend a wad on a great system but as always it will be a midrange system at best in 2 years or so. So think hard on spending that kind of coin when you can get something maybe 10% slower for half the price or so and take the money you wouldve spend originally and use it to make upgrades as you go along to stay somewhat current on performance.
October 6, 2008 5:19:12 AM

englandr753 said:
As cheap as DDR2 is why waste your money on ddr3? As others have stated, wait if your current system is doing fine. If not, I would spend half the money you are talking about spending on a good Q6600 setup and stay running another 2-3 years and wait after the new stuff comes out and they get more cpus to select from. I would expect as with a lot of new releases they will release better and better cpus as time goes by and work some bugs out.

If your current rig is working fine just simply wait. I was just thinking earlier today about when I went out and bought my "top end" ATI X850XT video card for 250 bucks and that everything that was on the shelf that I was drooling over is now being discarded by most enthusiasts and they wouldnt even consider buying it.

Technology changes rapidly and you can take the plunge and spend a wad on a great system but as always it will be a midrange system at best in 2 years or so. So think hard on spending that kind of coin when you can get something maybe 10% slower for half the price or so.


Ya I get what you mean but my machine is like 4 years old... So even with this new upgrade it well be so much better to me.
Hopefully ill be able to max crysis 1680 x 1050 fully out with this new build b:p 
October 6, 2008 6:05:08 AM

you'd be able to get a decent build with $1000... and yeah, you can play Crysis @ 1680x1050

Q6600 (Well, you can actually use a E2160 here :p )
4GB DDR2
Some Motherboard (maybe xfire would be nice)
4870X2 <-- this is what gives you "Max Settings"

the rig above will get you through a year or two...

and you still have $1400... by then you'd be able to get another decent rig.

stay away from the cutting edge (err... the bleeding edge)



October 6, 2008 6:13:30 AM

Q6600 $180
4GB DDR2 $100
Some Xfire Motherboard P35 seems cheap and good enough(maybe xfire would be nice) $200
4870x2 $250
PowerSupply $200






October 6, 2008 6:16:01 AM

4870x2 is around $500... my bad..

October 6, 2008 6:21:12 AM

icedeocampo said:
you'd be able to get a decent build with $1000... and yeah, you can play Crysis @ 1680x1050

Q6600 (Well, you can actually use a E2160 here :p )
4GB DDR2
Some Motherboard (maybe xfire would be nice)
4870X2 <-- this is what gives you "Max Settings"

the rig above will get you through a year or two...

and you still have $1400... by then you'd be able to get another decent rig.

stay away from the cutting edge (err... the bleeding edge)


Ya I was planning to get 4870 x2 to begin with :)  . Yet now it seems im holding out... Since im really interested on seeing how much better this new cpu and mobo well be. Also how much longer do you guys think intels socket 775 well be good for?
October 6, 2008 6:36:54 AM

Just noticed a reseller over here in the UK is advertising i7's and bundles for shipping at the end of this month.
This morning I notice that Intel have issued a warning that using RAM of more than 1.65V (on an i7) will cause damage to the CPU; all the bundles I have seen advertisted offer 1.7-2V ram sticks...

I think I'll wait...
October 6, 2008 10:03:31 AM

I wonder how many people will be bytching about blown up processors.
October 6, 2008 10:41:02 AM

Matt87 said:
I suppose the 775 socket is getting obselite ... Which is why i asked if i should wait. I plan on using ddr3 ram so hopefully this new cpu well run programs better + games ==


I'd wait. The main reason is that Nehalem should bump some very nice Core 2 CPU's and EOL socket T motherboards down in price. With Intel's dominance, though, I'm not sure how much prices for EOL Q6600's etc. will actually drop.


a b à CPUs
October 6, 2008 12:26:17 PM

True to that...
a b à CPUs
October 6, 2008 12:52:21 PM

A Q9550 is plenty. Should last for a while before you need to think of replacing it.
October 6, 2008 8:00:51 PM

Zorg said:
I agree with most of the other posters, definitely wait. Don't just blindly run out and buy it when it's released. Wait a little longer for the fallout.


You mean Fallout 3 on 10/28? ^_^
October 6, 2008 9:12:24 PM

snarfies1 said:
You mean Fallout 3 on 10/28? ^_^


FTW

October 8, 2008 5:23:16 PM

snarfies1 said:
You mean Fallout 3 on 10/28? ^_^
:lol: 
October 23, 2008 9:03:55 AM

Matt87 said:
Ya I was planning to get 4870 x2 to begin with :)  . Yet now it seems im holding out... Since im really interested on seeing how much better this new cpu and mobo well be. Also how much longer do you guys think intels socket 775 well be good for?


I don't think the I7 will have a pretty price/performance ratio when in launches, and even if the i7 becomes available, a lot of ppl would still stay with the 775.


Socket 775...hmm
i guess a year or 2, a quad core will last you a year. By that time you'd get better things to buy.

a b à CPUs
October 23, 2008 12:11:30 PM

icedeocampo said:
I don't think the I7 will have a pretty price/performance ratio when in launches, and even if the i7 becomes available, a lot of ppl would still stay with the 775.


Socket 775...hmm
i guess a year or 2, a quad core will last you a year. By that time you'd get better things to buy.



Based on every bench ive seen so far, for gaming at least, a Q9650 will be as fast, in some cases faster, than i7.

Your best move price wise is to make a LGA775 system, stock it with whatever you can, and ride that for the next 3-4 years. I see zero reason to update to i7 for gaming.

Besides, i'm hesitant to upgrade sockets for a CPU that offers me no performance gain, when theres a chance the new socket will become the next socket 487 (no upgradeability). As i've stated before, i decent quad can last at least until Sandy Bridge comes out in 2011.
October 23, 2008 3:23:50 PM

yipsl said:
I'd wait. The main reason is that Nehalem should bump some very nice Core 2 CPU's and EOL socket T motherboards down in price. With Intel's dominance, though, I'm not sure how much prices for EOL Q6600's etc. will actually drop.


I agree. In a month Nehalem will come out and prices of C2D and C2Q, DDR2 and LGA775 motherboards will probably come down a little more and more even after Xmas time!

For what i realize for sometime through benchmark comparisons between C2D vs C2Q and now Nehalem/i7 vs C2Q, i think there is still the problem that 90% of the programs aren't ready to take advantage of multi-core cpus. That takes time since i believe the software development to take advantage of multi-core or multi-cpu is quite different then a single core. Maybe one more year... maybe.

Another aspect is that the performance of most games, especially FPS, is based on the performance of the GPU. So for gamers is more important to upgrade the GPU rather than the CPU especially if your CPU has only about 1 or 2 years old and it's already a C2D or X2.

Where Nehalem seems to have real performance improvement is on the programs that require a lot of CPU work, like image/movie rendering, math calculations, benchmark SW (like SuperPI, 3DMark), and so on. These are typically the current programs that are prepared to deal with multi-core or multi-cpu, and so we already notice improvements when using C2Q.

One should consider also investing in a good and fast hard disk (like a WD Raptor 10K-rpm) which seems also to have impact on overall performance including program loading (like game levels or data), windows boot and memory swapping to disk (which even with 3GB RAM windows will need always to write to disk...).

In conclusion:
- buy Nehalem if you want a state-of-the-art Intel cpu.
- buy Nehalem if you do image/movie rendering or lot of math work and you can buy an expensive system state-of-the-art.
- buy C2Q if you do image/movie rendering or lot of math work but you don't want a very expensive system.
- buy C2D if you are only a gamer and check if you need to upgrade other important components like the GPU, memory or hard disk.

My 2 cents...
a b à CPUs
October 23, 2008 4:56:49 PM

Nah, get a Quad regardless at this point. Theres no reason to have to buy a Duo now, then a Quad, then whatever intel has out. I see no reason anymore to build a new PC with a Duo now that i7 is almost out.
October 23, 2008 5:39:45 PM

gamerk316 said:
Nah, get a Quad regardless at this point. Theres no reason to have to buy a Duo now, then a Quad, then whatever intel has out. I see no reason anymore to build a new PC with a Duo now that i7 is almost out.


Two major reasons:
- Performance: a 45nm duo like E8500 3.1GHz has more performance than a 65nm C2Q 2.40GHz, specially if you are a gamer where a high number of cores is pointless.
- When the games start taking true advantage of multi-core, maybe a year from now, we'll have another generation of i7 and the current quad-cores will be outdated with low performance. Intel is already planning 32nm with 8-core to sell in 2010 so current quads are only worth it if you use them now in CPU heavy programs like CAD, image processing, movie rendering, ...

BUT the way i see it maybe when the current Q9650 wil cost as much as the E8400 now after i7 start selling maybe that's a good buy. But that only will happen probably in February 2009 so it's also a matter of choosing the moment to buy or wait.
I say C2D E8400 or E8500 are good choices after Nehalem comes out in a month.
a b à CPUs
October 23, 2008 7:10:34 PM

A Q9550 or above is fine. Besides, your starting to see the first apps the dynamically adjust to the number of cores (Lost Planet, which Intel used to demo the i7 and inflate its stats, for instance).
a b à CPUs
October 23, 2008 7:10:34 PM

A Q9550 or above is fine. Besides, your starting to see the first apps the dynamically adjust to the number of cores (Lost Planet, which Intel used to demo the i7 and inflate its stats, for instance).
a b à CPUs
October 23, 2008 7:26:17 PM

powerbaselx said:
Two major reasons:
- Performance: a 45nm duo like E8500 3.1GHz has more performance than a 65nm C2Q 2.40GHz, specially if you are a gamer where a high number of cores is pointless.
- When the games start taking true advantage of multi-core, maybe a year from now, we'll have another generation of i7 and the current quad-cores will be outdated with low performance. Intel is already planning 32nm with 8-core to sell in 2010 so current quads are only worth it if you use them now in CPU heavy programs like CAD, image processing, movie rendering, ...

BUT the way i see it maybe when the current Q9650 wil cost as much as the E8400 now after i7 start selling maybe that's a good buy. But that only will happen probably in February 2009 so it's also a matter of choosing the moment to buy or wait.
I say C2D E8400 or E8500 are good choices after Nehalem comes out in a month.

However, you can get a current 45nm quad like the 9550 which can easily reach 3.5+ GHz, which gives both more than enough single threaded power and the extra cores over a duo if you ever need them. That's the best current option IMHO, though waiting for i7 isn't necessarily a bad idea.
October 23, 2008 9:10:56 PM

If you want to save money, wait for Core I7 to come out. The prices of Q9XXX will drop.
October 24, 2008 2:49:20 AM

cjl said:
However, you can get a current 45nm quad like the 9550 which can easily reach 3.5+ GHz, which gives both more than enough single threaded power and the extra cores over a duo if you ever need them. That's the best current option IMHO, though waiting for i7 isn't necessarily a bad idea.


E8500 easily goes to 4+ GHz, and the price difference between an E8500 and a Q9550 is $130. That's 60% extra for your processor. And that IS a reason. I'm not saying Quad is a bad idea, I just think that unless you have use for it -now- you can wait awhile and get a better one, cheaper, when you can use the extra cores.

Upgrading for now is always cheaper than upgrading for your next upgrade.
a b à CPUs
October 24, 2008 12:27:43 PM

Again, at this point, no one should have to do a CPU update on a LGA775 motherboard. Get the quad now so you don't have to worry about upgrading to a quad, then an X58/i7. Get the Q9550 now and forget about it for the next few years.

Unless the price of the Q9550 drops below $130 before the next time you update, you lose money buying the Duo now and upgrading later. At the same speeds (and even at slightly lower speeds), the Quad is fater than the Duo, and more and more games (Lost Planet for example) are making use of more cores.
October 24, 2008 12:59:03 PM

You all mention E8500 & Q9550...
But what about Q6600? Is it worth to upgrade there too?
also what about the chipsets: P35, P43, P45, X38, X48?
Is P35 still good for a single slot PCIe?

what is a good match CPU/Chipset?
October 24, 2008 2:17:31 PM

gamerk316 said:
Again, at this point, no one should have to do a CPU update on a LGA775 motherboard. Get the quad now so you don't have to worry about upgrading to a quad, then an X58/i7. Get the Q9550 now and forget about it for the next few years.


Few years?? :D 
Dual or quad the speed of change in the PC is faster than that... Beggining 2010 Q9550 will become obsolete against the new Intel 32nm 8- or 16- core... so or you take direct advantage on Quad until then or a Dual core will be suficient and save some bucks!
The consolation AFAIU is that Q9550 will hold well against first Nehalem's.


gamerk316 said:
Unless the price of the Q9550 drops below $130 before the next time you update, you
lose money buying the Duo now and upgrading later.

You always loose money when you buy a CPU or a car... the thing is that you can loose more or less money when you buy the PC depending on your needs and application...


gamerk316 said:
At the same speeds (and even at slightly lower speeds), the Quad is fater than the Duo, and more and more games (Lost Planet for example) are making use of more cores.

That is not correct.
Currently, at the same speeds for most of current programs (especially games) a Dual Core is slightly faster than a Quad.
For some specific programs like CAD, Photoshop, movie makers, format convertion, and others, the Quad is better.

There are very few games that take good advantage of multi-core and the Lost Planet is almost the only example people get to justify a Quad Core nowadays. Even Supreme Commander is only slighly better on quad.
October 24, 2008 2:46:54 PM

Stupido said:
You all mention E8500 & Q9550...
But what about Q6600? Is it worth to upgrade there too?

If you don't want or need the latest quad and want to save some money than the Q6600 G0 will work fine.

Stupido said:
also what about the chipsets: P35, P43, P45, X38, X48?
Is P35 still good for a single slot PCIe?

Yes. (as an example Asus P5K Pro is a very popular motherboard that uses P35...)
P45 is also very popular as it is associated with latest Intel Chipset ICH10R.
Since the LGA775 and DDR2 will be phase out than you don't need to worry with future upgrades on this motherboard. Anyway, check the price difference between P45 and P35 motherboards. P45 is probably a litlle more recomendable as it's newer.

X38 and X48 are mainly for enthusiasts and "advanced" overclockers. :) 

Stupido said:
what is a good match CPU/Chipset?

Again, it depends on the kind of usage you give to your PC.
The match E8400/P45 or E8400/P35 or E8500/P45 are very popular nowadays.
Q6600/P35 or more recently Q6600/P45 are also popular.
If you have a more money and want or need a more recent Quad, Q9550/P45 is a common choice also.
October 24, 2008 3:15:21 PM

powerbaselx, thanks for the reply! :hello: 
Quote:
Again, it depends on the kind of usage you give to your PC.

gamming it is... :D  (surfing & music are not considered as PC activities... :whistle:  )

since P35 paired with Q6600 is still good (I even overclocked it to 3.4 (FSB @380) with RAM @1140), I guess I'll stick to this rig for a while... @least until first Nehelems are out and benched... :D 

the only concern I have, is my current rig limiting somehow my GTX280... :heink: 
October 24, 2008 3:35:34 PM

Stupido said:
since P35 paired with Q6600 is still good (I even overclocked it to 3.4 (FSB @380) with RAM @1140), I guess I'll stick to this rig for a while... @least until first Nehelems are out and benched...


First Nehalem benchmarks (unless you speak chinese you need google translation) :
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=zh-CN&tl...

Basically for 3D Games and single-thread applications it's as good as any current Quad-Core.
But for applications that take advantage of multi-core (or multi-cpu) the Nahalem brings about 30% to 50% performance increase which is quite remarkable. :) 

Stupido said:
the only concern I have, is my current rig limiting somehow my GTX280... :heink: 

Is that a concern? :D 
I'm still happy with my EN7950GT 512MB !!
a b à CPUs
October 24, 2008 4:52:31 PM

1) The Q6600 doesn't have the horsepower to keep up with the newer processors.

2) A Q9550 or above will be fine until at least 2011 (Sandy Bridge). Tmajority of games are only starting to take advantage of Quads, and even fewer will dynamically use more cores as they are detected, and one is crazy enough to code a game a Quad will be unable to run well for a number of years.

Remember that software generally is one generation behind hardware. Multi-core programming is only starting to become the norm, so it will be some time before more than 4 cores will show significant increases in FPS, and much more until they are actually needed. Most games are GPU bound anyway, farther decreasing the performance of such an extreme CPU.

The trick to cheap systems is to stay one generation back. I converted to a Pentium D when Core2Quads first came out, and that system can still compete with most other setups in non-Crytec games. Now, i7 is comming out, and I got a Q9650 on the cheap, and can run everything on earth without any issues. Why buy a X58 and i7 now, then upgrade the mobo when other mobos released later are far better, buy a die shrink, only to find out Sandy Bridge only ends up using a new socket!

There is no reason to upgrade from a Quad to an i7 for at least 3 years, possibly as long as 4-5, depending on how long it takes software to catch up.
October 24, 2008 5:19:31 PM

gamerk316 said:
1) The Q6600 doesn't have the horsepower to keep up with the newer processors.

2) A Q9550 or above will be fine until at least 2011 (Sandy Bridge).


1) IMO the Q6600 by itself will last at least 1 year. Maybe a little further with some easy OC up to 3.2GHz or 3.4GHz .
Just check this recent Q6600 vs vs Q8200 vs Q9400 vs E8600 benchmark:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/core2quad-...

2) You're talking about a little more than 2 years time. In the meanwhile around 2010 there will come a new generation of 32nm cpus which will bring more real performance gains which will put the Q9550 where the Q6600 is nowadays. So i guess the Q9550 will easily jump over the first Nehalems, the Q6600 requires a little more OC effort but both are nowadays processors which we now by tech history in a 2~3 year time will be both outdated.

I strongly agree with you in terms of software development regarding multi-core. It needs some more time to start making real diference for everyone. And FPS and 3D games as you said are indeed more related to GPUs rather than the CPU.
!