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spathotan   08-26-2008 at 06:32:02 AM

In the middle of building a light/mid gaming system and im not all that savy on the whole "bottlenecking" issue. Basically im in the process of cutting corners off the cost and I need to know how low I can go on the processor before performance is put in a cast.

Right now im pondering this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 819103255. I know the Intel offers kick its ass yadda yadda, but im looking for the lowest point I can go before I hit the bottleneck remember. Intel dosent have any offerings around that same price except the Pentium E2200's with their ungodly 800mhz FSB, and is still $14 more........ :??: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6819116070

Ive heard 2.3ghz tossed around but I dont know if that holds any weight.

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IndigoMoss   08-26-2008 at 06:42:27 AM
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Are you at all interested in overclocking? the E2200 series can be OC'd to 1066 FSB with a cheap cooler like the Arctic Cooling Freezer 7 Pro extremely easily on any P35/P45 board. Which would provide extremely nice performance for the price, you could even boost it higher if you want (I have my brother's E2180 @3.2Ghz)


Message edited by IndigoMoss on 08-26-2008 at 06:42:43 AM
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englandr753   08-26-2008 at 06:48:41 AM
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You should go dual core on the cpu. This is a must if you are planning on making this rig last for any length of time for todays games and a few new releases in the future. A single core cpu will be a bottleneck for any decent gaming card by todays standards.

Go for the best dual core & motherboard combo. What is the specs for the rest of the system this is going in?

If you dont want to go Intel, this is a great overclocking cpu and a decent combo price:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applica [...] etailspecs

Otherwise, get an Intel E2160 or E2180 and overclock. Its the best price point for the money besides what I suggested for AMD.


Message edited by englandr753 on 08-26-2008 at 06:59:37 AM
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englandr753   08-26-2008 at 07:10:46 AM
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We need to know what parts you have and how much you have to spend to give a better assessment. Make a list and post so we can give a better answer...

Reply to englandr753
spathotan   08-26-2008 at 11:44:47 PM
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Sorry, was preety damn tired when I made this, cant believe I left out the basics. So far im looking at....

 

Foxconn P45 if proc is an Intel http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6813186148
Biostar 790GX if proc is an AMD http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6813138128

 

4850 video card, 4GB of RAM, 450W Corsair PSU.....thats about it.

 

$800 is the max, with the Foxconn board and E7200 im at $792. System has to be ATX also, no mATX

 

This http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6819103289 has caught my eye. Hmm.....


Message edited by spathotan on 08-27-2008 at 02:08:34 AM
------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
spathotan   08-27-2008 at 02:29:22 AM
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Also I just thought of this, but with the 790GX Hybrid Crossfire is there......hmm....

------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
SpinachEater   08-27-2008 at 03:27:37 AM
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Are you buying a new case? Optical drives? HDDs? ....or are you just needing the backbone MOBO, GPU, CPU, RAM, PSU?

Reply to SpinachEater
spathotan   08-27-2008 at 03:28:53 AM
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I already have all that stuff picked out. Im just stuck on the mobo and processor.

------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
SpinachEater   08-27-2008 at 03:57:51 AM
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how much do you have left for both?

Reply to SpinachEater
spathotan   08-27-2008 at 04:02:01 AM
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Roughly $200-$230. A little lower really....lol.


Message edited by spathotan on 08-27-2008 at 04:02:17 AM
------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
SpinachEater   08-27-2008 at 04:35:07 AM
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Hmm....your E7200 + Foxcon board sounds like the best option at the moment.

You could go with AMD triple core 8450 for $104 at newegg. I am not too familiar with AMD CPUs though to be able to recommend them. Wouldn't hurt to look at it though.

Reply to SpinachEater
spathotan   08-27-2008 at 04:37:33 AM
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The E7200 and the Foxconn are without a doubt the best combo, but im being a pennypincher with this one, but nothing else really seems worth it, the E7200 crush AMD offerings for a fraction of the price, plus I can OC the hell out of it.

Message quoted 1 times
Message edited by spathotan on 08-27-2008 at 04:38:57 AM
------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
SpinachEater   08-27-2008 at 04:43:25 AM
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Well, I see that people are getting the AMD triple core up to 3.0GHz. If you play games that like more than 2 cores that could get you a few more FPS than the E7200. But...I guess if the E7200 can get up to 3.5GHz...it would probably surpass a 3.0GHz AMD CPU.

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/amdphenomx3_042308023719/16892.png
Interesting to see how an X3 stacks up against the E7200 in UT3


Message edited by SpinachEater on 08-27-2008 at 04:47:06 AM
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dagger   08-27-2008 at 04:45:42 AM
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spathotan wrote :

The E7200 and the Foxconn are without a doubt the best combo, but im being a pennypincher with this one, but nothing else really seems worth it, the E7200 crush AMD offerings for a fraction of the price, plus I can OC the hell out of it.



There are better performing p45 motherboards from more well known brands that also cost less than that Foxconn board.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6813128345
The Foxconn board has rating for 1600mhz fsb and 1066mhz ddr2 as "(o.c.)," or overclocked speed. This is very poor for p45 chipset. The cheaper Gigabyte board has native 1600mhz fsb rating, and native 1200mhz ddr2 rating. Who needs to know how much they think you'll likely be able to overclock the thing? Manufacturer should be able to guarantee the speeds they advertise.

------------------------------ Q6600@3.6ghz, GA-EX38-DS4 motherboard, 8gb 800mhz ddr2 4-3-3-12, 8800GTS(g92)@780mhz, 1TB + 1.5TB hdds, 850watt psu
 Reply to dagger
spathotan   08-27-2008 at 04:47:41 AM
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Those triple cores are just too expensive, $104 for for 2.1ghz one, the 2.4ghz 8750 is $175. Im "sure" the 2.1ghz one will bottleneck the 4850.

 

**EDIT** Hmm, the results for those triple cores arent that bad....wow. I had no clue. The 8750 is right there with the E8400, and you get an extra core for only a few bucks more with the AMD. Even the lowly 8450 isnt bad. I need to dig up some more charts to see what impact the low clock has on GPU performance, also with the 790GX board I should be able to OC it a little more than with the others.

 

Also thanks for the heads up on the Foxconn dagger.


Message edited by spathotan on 08-27-2008 at 04:51:53 AM
------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
SpinachEater   08-27-2008 at 04:53:35 AM
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It is actually at the stock 2.1GHz clock surpassing the 2.5GHz E7200...that has some promise if one could indeed get it up to 3.0GHz....that is on a quad core loving game engine though.

Let me be fair and throw up a game that doesn't care about tri or quad cores...the X3 gets hosed

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/amdphenomx3_042308023719/16893.png

Reply to SpinachEater
spathotan   08-27-2008 at 04:54:43 AM
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Rofl, E4700.

------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
SpinachEater   08-27-2008 at 05:03:44 AM
- 0 +

wow the E4700 is $140, that is amazing seeing the E7200 is $120.

Reply to SpinachEater
spathotan   08-27-2008 at 05:04:15 AM
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Intel pricing is pathetic. Just look at the E8400 price, then compare it to its lesser.

------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
SpinachEater   08-27-2008 at 05:13:36 AM
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It is a 65nm vs 45nm so production yields / costs are higher for the smaller dies but still...you would think pricing would even out for the 65nm chips.

Message quoted 1 times
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dagger   08-27-2008 at 05:33:12 AM
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SpinachEater wrote :

It is a 65nm vs 45nm so production yields / costs are higher for the smaller dies but still...you would think pricing would even out for the 65nm chips.



They price it at what people are typically willing to pay. :na:

Message quoted 1 times
------------------------------ Q6600@3.6ghz, GA-EX38-DS4 motherboard, 8gb 800mhz ddr2 4-3-3-12, 8800GTS(g92)@780mhz, 1TB + 1.5TB hdds, 850watt psu
 Reply to dagger
eklipz330   08-27-2008 at 05:56:51 AM
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nice avatar england.... =P

Reply to eklipz330
SpinachEater   08-27-2008 at 06:17:01 AM
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dagger wrote :

They price it at what people are typically willing to pay. :na:



Absolutely. I am amazed at the Q6600 pricing right now. $190 vs $260 for the closest 45nm quad (Q9300)...this one is a no brainer.

Message quoted 1 times
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dagger   08-27-2008 at 02:55:53 PM
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SpinachEater wrote :

Absolutely. I am amazed at the Q6600 pricing right now. $190 vs $260 for the closest 45nm quad (Q9300)...this one is a no brainer.



Average people don't oc, which means at stock, q9300 average 7% faster. Also, they look at names more than benchmarks.

------------------------------ Q6600@3.6ghz, GA-EX38-DS4 motherboard, 8gb 800mhz ddr2 4-3-3-12, 8800GTS(g92)@780mhz, 1TB + 1.5TB hdds, 850watt psu
 Reply to dagger
Shadow703793   08-27-2008 at 09:07:13 PM
- 0 +

^Very true. Look at X2 vs. P4/PD. Even though X2 was better people fell for the "faster is better" and now look.

------------------------------ http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2617/3815217176_0a5be7955d_o.gif
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3553/3818083596_1a772f7162_o.gif
 Reply to Shadow703793
spathotan   08-28-2008 at 11:02:14 PM
- 0 +

Yea......I think non-oc'ing results are what im leaning towards right now. Im not gonna blow money on an aftermarket cooler and all.

Message quoted 1 times
------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
dagger   08-29-2008 at 01:15:07 AM
- 0 +

spathotan wrote :

Yea......I think non-oc'ing results are what im leaning towards right now. Im not gonna blow money on an aftermarket cooler and all.



Saving money is what oc is all about. A good aftermarket cooler only cost $30-40. Spend $30 on a cooler to oc a $180 q6600 from 2.4 to 3.6ghz and outperform a stock "extreme" version quad that cost $1500. You save $1290, and get better performance. :na:

------------------------------ Q6600@3.6ghz, GA-EX38-DS4 motherboard, 8gb 800mhz ddr2 4-3-3-12, 8800GTS(g92)@780mhz, 1TB + 1.5TB hdds, 850watt psu
 Reply to dagger
spathotan   08-29-2008 at 01:22:54 AM
- 0 +

Lol, true. However ive never been able to get this Q6600 I have over 3.0ghz stable. This is with 3 different motherboards (3 different chipsets) and 4 different coolers. 1.3VID, temps get too high too early in the OC.

------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
Shadow703793   08-30-2008 at 12:46:34 AM
- 0 +

^ B3 or G0? High VID too.

------------------------------ http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2617/3815217176_0a5be7955d_o.gif
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3553/3818083596_1a772f7162_o.gif
 Reply to Shadow703793
spathotan   08-30-2008 at 01:44:09 AM
- 0 +

Its a G0. And yea the VID is extremely high, second highest you can get on this I believe hince my crappy OC experience with this piece.

Message quoted 1 times
------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
dagger   08-30-2008 at 01:50:56 AM
- 0 +

spathotan wrote :

Its a G0. And yea the VID is extremely high, second highest you can get on this I believe hince my crappy OC experience with this piece.



I have the exact same 1.3125vid chip, and it's prime95 stressed stable at 1.45vcore @3.6ghz or 1.65vcore @4ghz, with loadline calibration on. It should do fine.

------------------------------ Q6600@3.6ghz, GA-EX38-DS4 motherboard, 8gb 800mhz ddr2 4-3-3-12, 8800GTS(g92)@780mhz, 1TB + 1.5TB hdds, 850watt psu
 Reply to dagger
spathotan   08-30-2008 at 02:33:53 AM
- 0 +

Well I did turn memory speed on Auto and FSB Strap to NB on Auto in the BIOS, and ive been able to get it to 3.2ghz AAAANND lower the voltage down to 1.267 (or w/e it is :D). Its been stressing smallftts in prime for almost an hour now, I went into the BIOS basically right after my last post.

So it had to have been memory or FSB strap that was holding me back, it was set to 333FSB.

Message quoted 1 times
------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
dagger   08-30-2008 at 02:41:25 AM
- 0 +

spathotan wrote :

Well I did turn memory speed on Auto and FSB Strap to NB on Auto in the BIOS, and ive been able to get it to 3.2ghz AAAANND lower the voltage down to 1.267 (or w/e it is :D). Its been stressing smallftts in prime for almost an hour now, I went into the BIOS basically right after my last post.

So it had to have been memory or FSB strap that was holding me back, it was set to 333FSB.



Strange how you can get that low vcore on that high VID chip. Are you sure you used the proper torture test and set it to halt when hitting error? :p

------------------------------ Q6600@3.6ghz, GA-EX38-DS4 motherboard, 8gb 800mhz ddr2 4-3-3-12, 8800GTS(g92)@780mhz, 1TB + 1.5TB hdds, 850watt psu
 Reply to dagger
spathotan   08-30-2008 at 02:48:15 AM
- 0 +

Yea, round of checking is turned on. And yes its smallftts :D Still going strong, temps seem to have peaked at 65/65/61/61

Message quoted 1 times
------------------------------ http://valid.canardpc.com/cache/banner/547515.png
Intel Xeon X3370 @3.6ghz Under Enzotech Extreme-X,EVGA GTX 285 SC, 4GB Mushkin Ascent eVCI @ 1066mhz, Gigabyte P45 UD3P
 Reply to spathotan
dagger   08-30-2008 at 02:55:50 AM
- 0 +

spathotan wrote :

Yea, round of checking is turned on. And yes its smallftts :D Still going strong, temps seem to have peaked at 65/65/61/61



Lol, good job.

------------------------------ Q6600@3.6ghz, GA-EX38-DS4 motherboard, 8gb 800mhz ddr2 4-3-3-12, 8800GTS(g92)@780mhz, 1TB + 1.5TB hdds, 850watt psu
 Reply to dagger
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