Pc Wouldnt Load With 4gb ram

[jpdaballa]

So here is my story,

I had before 2X 512 mb sticks with another 1 gb stick and the last slot empty,

i then decided to buy 3 more 1gb sticks,

i was running on windows xp media center edition at the time, and the comp wouldn't load with 4 gb but it would load up np with 3.

then to try to take the easy way out i upgraded to vista, and my comp would load up but it still would not show up as 4 gb, instead it shows up as 3582mb of ram.

now that i am sick of vista after about 2 months i want to go back to windows xp but i am wondering, is there anyway i can get all 4 gb of ram on windows xp?

oh and also my computer is a m7170n hp.

 

[Ed1161]

You're gonna need a 64-bit OS, Vista or XP so see all 4 gigs of ram I believe.

 

[jpdaballa]

I don't think that's true m8, I've gone through other topics in this forum, and people have gotten it to work with xp.

 

[dallasjoh]

When you had 4 sticks of ram did you go into the bios and set the timings and voltage to manufactures spec's. Sometimes with 4 sticks of ram you have two raise the voltage and maybe the NB voltage a little.

 

[jpdaballa]

Dallas I have no idea how to get into the bios and change anything around, I just put in the sticks of ram and that's it

 

[jpdaballa]

I understand what the bios is now, how do I change the settings of my ram, and how do i know what to set them at. Where can i find out.

 

[mford66215]

Nobody's EVER gotten it to show all 4G of ram on XP 32bit, that's the issue with a 32bit OS. Sure, it can see all the way up to 4G, but once you add a video card with any memory then xp will show you the 4G-video_ram=total_memory.

Of course, if you do run XP with 4G (just like me) then you won't care that it doesn't see that last little bit o ram. It's unlikely with 4G that you'll be pushing the machine so hard that it needs the swapfile, and just getting away from that will give a speed boost you'll be happy with.

(BTW - one major difference between the macs and pc's of old was this memory issue you're seeing. Macs place the device memory at bit 0 and then build up to the system ram....pc's put system ram at bit 0, and put the device memory in at the top of the range. Top happens to be 4GB on the 32 bit OS, big deal.)

Search this site's forums for overclocking threads...you don't need to overclock, but using the bios to set memory timings and voltages in the bios are all explained well there...

 

[jpdaballa]

as long as it loads up with 4 sticks inside, I don't mind it showing 3582 just trying to get it to work

 

[dallasjoh]

jpdaballa;

I missed the HP part. Hp has limited access to the BIOS. Have you tried HP's tech support? Are the 3 sticks of memory the same speed and voltage as the 1 stick you already had?

 

[mtyermom]

Nobody's EVER gotten it to show all 4G of ram on XP 32bit, that's the issue with a 32bit OS. Sure, it can see all the way up to 4G, but once you add a video card with any memory then xp will show you the 4G-video_ram=total_memory.

This is completely incorrect. It has nothing to do with video card memory, at all. It has to do with the amount of memory address space available with a 32-bit OS.

Basically, a 32-bit OS has enough memory address space for exactly 4GB, but the Windows operating system reserves some of this available space for itself (how much depends on exactly how it is configured). Most home use Windows installations generally reserve approximately half a gig. So, it is completely normal to have 4GB of RAM installed on a computer with a 32-bit version of Windows installed and only see approximately 3.5GB of RAM available. (note: You will see the full 4GB in BIOS, but Windows will only see ~3.5GB)

Again, this is completely normal and expected on a 32-bit OS. In order to see/have available the full 4GB of RAM you must use a 64-bit OS.

A 64-bit environment has a theoretical memory address space on the order of 16 exabytes or 17.2 billion gigabytes, but 64-bit versions of Windows impose more realistic limits, depending on the version.

64-bit versions of Windows:
Vista Home Basic = 8GB
Vista Home Premium = 16GB
Vista Business - Vista Enterprise - Vista Ultimate - XP-64 = 128GB

64-bit wiki
Memory Limits for Windows Releases

Generally, people who use a 32-bit version of Windows with 4GB of RAM installed just accept that the OS will reserve its memory address space and live with having just the ~3.5GB available. In all but very specific circumstances, the 3.5GB available RAM performs just as well as having the 4GB available. In other words, you won't notice the ~1/2 gig of RAM that is unavailable.


Hope this clears things up.

@jpdaballa: You system is operating as expected, and your 3582MB of available RAM is normal for your configuration.

 

[dallasjoh]

mtyermom

I believe he is having trouble getting it to boot up with the 4 sticks of ram.

 

[jpdaballa]

correct dallas, im trying to go back to windows xp and the only reason i upgraded to vista was so it could boot up

windows xp was faster and more efficient for what i used it for, and it wouldnt boot up with the 4 gb, so i want to get this fixed so when i do the system restore i can get it to start up

 

[dallasjoh]

Install 2 sticks of memory in dimms A1 and B1 and if it boots load your recovery disk. Then after you have loaded your system and all XP updates shut it down and turn off the power and install the other 2 sticks. This should work I had to do it before for a friend of mine.

 

[jpdaballa]

I had all of my updates installed last time i tried to install all 4 sticks of ram. I don't think that was the problem

 

[jpdaballa]

dallas i also dont feel like waiting on the phone with hp's tech support the

here are the specs of my ram

3 of them are pc2-5200
1 of them is pc2-5300
http://www.crucial.com/systemscanner/viewscanbyid.aspx?id=902C0C2E31D926C3

 

[4745454b]

Care to give us any more details other then "it wouldn't load"? Perhaps if we had error messages or symptoms we might be able to help more.

@Mtyer, what do you think windows is reserving "for itself" if its not the cache and other memory found on system devices?

 

[jpdaballa]

it woud just shut off as it was trying to get into the type in my password screen. no error message nothing. just a shut off and i would have to try to turn on my comp again

 

[mtyermom]

dallas i also dont feel like waiting on the phone with hp's tech support the

here are the specs of my ram

3 of them are pc2-5200
1 of them is pc2-5300
http://www.crucial.com/systemscanner/viewscanbyid.aspx?id=902C0C2E31D926C3

Ah, mixing and matching RAM of different types/speeds can commonly cause these types of problems. Even of the same brand, even different batches of the same model/speed can cause problems when mixed together. It's recommended to have all your dimms be exactly the same (ie: come in a kit).

 

[jpdaballa]

so you are telling me to buy another 1 gb stick? i baught 3 of my memorys from crucial and on the website it is popping up as 5200, but now if i want to buy another stick from crucial its 5300... what should i do

 

[4745454b]

Did you ever try just reloading windows XP? Perhaps a harddrive scan might be in order as well.

 

[jpdaballa]

what should i scan my hard drive with?

 

[mtyermom]

@Mtyer, what do you think windows is reserving "for itself" if its not the cache and other memory found on system devices?

Some operating systems reserve portions of process address space for OS use, effectively reducing the total address space available for mapping memory for user programs. For instance, Windows XP DLLs and userland OS components are mapped into each process's address space, leaving only 2 to 3.8 GB (depending on the settings) address space available, even if the computer has 4 GB of RAM. This restriction is not present in 64-bit operating systems.

From the 64-bit wiki.

This has been discussed many, many times on this forum.

 

[4745454b]

Whatever utility comes with windows. Basically I'm wondering if you are running an older harddrive that might have a bad sector on it. Perhaps when xp was installed some file that relates to memory got installed on that sector, but vista was installed elsewhere on the drive. (I know, grasping at straws here...) Both XP and Vista should be fine with 4GB of memory installed in it.

Edit: Taking side discussion to PM to avoid hijack.

 

[mtyermom]

so you are telling me to buy another 1 gb stick? i baught 3 of my memorys from crucial and on the website it is popping up as 5200, but now if i want to buy another stick from crucial its 5300... what should i do

Try using only the 3 identical sticks of ram you bought, see if the system boots and see what speed they are reported as. Using 3 sticks will force you to single channel mode, but we're just troubleshooting at this point. If the machine boots and all are reported as the same speed then I would recommend you buy a 4th stick of the same ram and cross your fingers that they come from the same or at least similar enough batch.

This is assuming that what 4745454b mentions about memory mapping related files in a bad HDD sector is not the case. Which is pretty hard to determine in any case. You could always try using a different HDD to install Windows XP and see if you have any better luck with your current RAM configuration.

 

[4745454b]

Another idea I had based off of Mtyer's idea is to boot with only the 3 sticks and record what the settings are. Then take them out and boot with only the single stick. Manually set the ram using the slowest speed from all sticks. Install all sticks again and see if it works.

For example, if the three sticks together are 4-4-4-15, and the single stick is 5-5-5-15, then manually set the ram to 5-5-5-15 and try with all 4 sticks.