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600w single rail power supply with 26a on +12v for a video card

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November 18, 2008 4:36:33 AM

600w single rail power supply with 26a on +12v

Im thinking of this power supply if it can run a 9800gt with no problem and i have a simple system set up:

no plans to overclock
1dvd writer
5200+ athlon x2
1 side panel fan
stock cooler for cpu
1 sata harddisk
2gb ram
no more :D 

still using a 500w generic power supply and im scared of this ticking bomb!!!! so i must act fast and buy a psu :cry: 
and im really on an ultra super high tight budget so please helppppp!!!!!

More about : 600w single rail power supply 26a 12v video card

November 18, 2008 5:51:56 AM

The evga 9800 GT uses 26 amps. That would be taxing your PS.

So you might want something with a little more amps.

I'm running a PC Power & Cooling 610 with 49 amps with the evga 9800GT.
No problems, nice and quiet. the only draw back with this power supply is that it's 1" longer than my old Antec.
It's 75 bones at the Egg right now after rebate. (note 6 weeks and still waiting).
PS : you may want to get 3 or 4 more suggestions. (It not the latest greatest, but I like it + 5 year warranty
a b ) Power supply
a b U Graphics card
November 18, 2008 6:24:21 AM

paul_out3 said:
600w single rail power supply with 26a on +12v


DO NOT BUY THIS PSU! :non: 
It is a junker and will fail first chance it gets.
Look into a QUALITY 450w+ Corsair, PCP&C (the one listed above is good), Enermax, Seasonic or Antec Earthwatts PSU. ANY of these PSU's at 450w will have more +12v amperage than the 600w you are considering.

The PSU is something you do not want to go cheap with.
They are rated to output more power than they really can and when they fail there is a good chance of it taking more of your system with it.
Related resources
November 18, 2008 6:43:30 AM

well said^
November 18, 2008 7:03:33 AM

outlw, has a good list there. the bad thing about the PC P&C is the rebate thing,haven't got mine yet (fingers crossed). But the others he list all have quality reviews.

I was looking hard at the Seasonics when I bought my 610. Antics have a really good rep. Had a Ultra-Quiet 350, never a problem over 3 years.

What swayed me towards PC P & C was the 5 year warranty for future builds. So you might take into account what your future needs might be.
November 18, 2008 7:06:52 AM

That PSU of 600watts is a fake... even my 450watt PSU by Shuttle in my XPC has 17A+17A
November 18, 2008 7:08:31 AM

Might consider Silverstone 400watt Strider also...
November 18, 2008 7:24:47 AM

Paul_out3, your PSU is more than enough!
UncleFester said that 9800GT uses 26A :o  This will mean that Graphic card drains 312 W , which is pretty funny! Most probably it drains 26A on VDDC, VDDC is working on 1-2 Volts - and this will mean that GPU drains about 26A * 2Volsts = 52Watts which is most probable.
500W PSU is more than enough for your system even you OC! You can easy measure the tottal power consumption of your system by pluging your mains cable to this and it will show you that you're usin about 150-250 Watts tottal !
November 18, 2008 7:43:37 AM

I went to evga site to get the recomeded amp numbers for the 9800 GT
specs they quoted at least a 550 watt power supply,26 amps

yonef, is way more studied then I am on PSs.

He would have alot better advise (and no I'm not being sarcastic)
Let him know what your generic PS specs are.
This is an area you don't want to skimp on.
November 18, 2008 8:08:58 AM

The EVGA reccommendation is TOTAL 12V use by PC, not the video card alone. 9800GT uses MAX of 10A. They are giving big safety margin, may have shares in PSU companies.

Mike.
November 18, 2008 8:47:34 AM

im very curious about yonef's advise cause im really running now on my generic power supply everything is stable and the only problem is heat my psu is hot!hot!hot!. Considering that i can run my pc with this ultra cheapo psu that came with my case maybe i can buy a pretty cheap gigabyte superb psu or hec power supply, they only sell about less than 30 dollars some hec are about 26 dollars at new egg

but im also thinking of what outlw6669 suggested for a safer system

i think ill go on the safer side =)

November 18, 2008 11:20:17 AM

Sounds like your present PSU is being pushed to its limit, this will shorten it's life. Cheap PSU are also inefficient, which wastes power and money. How noisy is present PSU?

Mike.
a b U Graphics card
November 18, 2008 11:59:57 AM

I can't see where the OP has given enough information to give a decent opinion. We should be asking specifically WHAT the brand and model of PSU he is looking at. There are bad and good PSU's all across the board, and we all know just because the PSU has decent specs, does not make it a good PSU!
a b ) Power supply
a b U Graphics card
November 18, 2008 12:02:11 PM

paul_out3 said:
600w single rail power supply with 26a on +12v



With out knowing any of the details, the above statement is enough to tell me for sure that it is a POS PSU he is considering but I would agree. More information is never a bad thing to have.
November 18, 2008 12:15:07 PM

I'm agreed with mike99 - "Cheap PSU are also inefficient, which wastes power and money. "
@ paul_out3, It is normal that your PSU is hot, since 9800GT consumes good amount of Watts, BUT buying new BRANDED PSU won't solve the problem. If you go for 450-500W good PSU it will run hot because the amperage on the single rail will be about 17A which means that your system will push one of the rails to its limits, which is NOT better than your PSU. The only way you can avoid heat is buying 700-1000W PSU and then it will run on 20-40% of its power capabilities which will be enough to run it cooler than your PSU.
On your place I wouldn't worry about PSU (unless PSU fails).
P.S. you can check your PSU fan, sometimes dust cause fans to spin slower than it should that may cause overheating in your case, BUT definitelly this heat is not caused by your GPU. Even replacing PSU fan will cost you $3-4 You have more than enough power with this PSU and I do not see any reason to buy another one.
a b ) Power supply
a b U Graphics card
November 18, 2008 12:42:01 PM

WTH are you talking about yonef?
No way in hel he needs a 700-1000w PSU for his rig and where are you getting your 'quality' 450w PSU amperage numbers?

PCP&C Silencer 420w: 30A
Corsair 450VX: 33A
Seasonic 430w: 30A
Antec Earthwatts 430w: 30A
Seasonic 300W: 24A

Even a QUALITY 300w PSU will output more +12v amperage than your 'quality' 450W.
A QUALITY PSU will not have any issues handling his system with out overheating and he DOES NOT need a 1Kw PSU!
If you want to do a good and simple comparison, go to your nearest parts shop and do the lift test.
Take a real 450w PSU in one hand and a cheap 700w in the other.
The difference is weight you are feeling is the extra cooling and voltage regulation components that allow the 450w to output more clean power than the cheap 700w.
November 18, 2008 2:20:07 PM

All these PSUs you(outlw6669) talking about is with two rails on +12V which means that they have only 16-17 Ampers on each! Which means that you can NOT power single Graphic card that requires more than 16A!! Which means that if you plug your 9800GT into one of the rails it will push it to more than 80-90% of available power, which will cause nonstable voltage for that rail, which is not good at all. and YES sum of two rails is 30A which is more than sigle rail of 26A, but on sinle rail you can power a device that consumes 26A while on double rail PSUs (that you posted) you can only power a device that uses 17A!
AND it is critical to push ANY of the rails to more than 80% because it will drop the voltage and will cause stability issues.
I'm not trying to say that noname PSUs are better than quality ones, but in this case 600W noname PSU with 26A on +12V rail will do the job. It is pointless spending money for other PSU, it wont make any difference.
paul_out3 if you insist to buy a new PSU, I'll suggest you go for good 700W PSU wich will be future proof for long long time.
a b ) Power supply
a b U Graphics card
November 19, 2008 9:12:14 AM

So, you would prefer a PSU like the Corsair VX450, right?

Sure looks like it lists a single 33a +12v rail to me.
And I guess the PCP&C Silencer 420w does not list a single 30a +12v rail either...
Oh, I forgot to mention, the VX450 really has two rails.
Quote:
The +12 V output is produced by two SBR30A50CT Schottky rectifiers connected in parallel, which can deliver up to 30 A each (measured at 25º C), thus the maximum theoretical current the +12 V line can deliver is of 60 A, which equals to 720 W at 25º C.
....
Antec EarthWatts 500 W, which is basically the same power supply with a different housing, uses a dual-rail design. The difference between the two is only how the OCP (over current protection) circuit is connected. On this power supply this circuit is monitoring all +12 V outputs at the same time, while on the model from Antec this circuit is monitoring two different sets of wires.


Despite what you may think, more +12v rails is not a bad thing in fact it is required by the ATX12V 2.x and EPS12V specifications.
It allows you to segregate components from each other.
With your theoretical 450w POS you have only a single 17a rail to power everything, motherboard, CPU, GPU(s), hard drives, disk drives, CD/DVD drives, etc.
With a dual rail PSU, one rail can power to the motherboard with the main motherboard cable, ATX12V and EPS12V while the other will supply power to all peripheral cables, PEG, SATA, 4-pin Peripheral, 4-pin Berg, etc.

Also keep in mind that a GPU with a single 6 pin PEG will draw a max of 75w or 6.25a (an 8 pin PEG can provide a max of 100w or 8.33a in case you were wondering).
An additional 75w (150w PCIe 2.0), 6.25a (12.5a PCIe 2.0), is provided by the PCIe slot which is provided power through a separate rail. As such, the maximum theoretical power a 9800GT could draw would be 150w or 12.5a (75w from the PEG, 75w from the PCIe slot). Yes, I know that the PCIe 2.0 slot can provide the 9800GT an additional 75w but, as many systems still have PCIe 1.1 slots ATI and nVidia would be shooting themselves in the foot if they required the extra power from it. Even IF all of the power were to come off a single rail, it would not be overloaded as you stated.

So, running a PSU at 80-90% of it's rated will cause the voltage to become non stable huh?
This is surly true with a cheap POS, not so with a quality built unit.

Corsair VX450 tested at 127.1% load
Quote:
"all outputs were within specs and noise level was still very low, 47 mV at +12V1, 58.2 mV at +12V2, 19.2 mV at +5 V and 13.2 mV at +3.3 V"


Antec Earthwatts 500w tested at 115.4% load
Quote:
"noise level increased just a little bit on the +12 V inputs, going to 26.2 mV on +12V1 and 25 mV on +12V2. These results are spectacular (the limit is 120 mV and any power supply capable of maintaining a noise level below 60 mV is a good product and we are talking about a power supply which noise level is almost five times lower than the limit). Noise on the other outputs remained the same"


PCP&C Silencer 610w tested at 118% load
Quote:
"voltages and noise level within the proper working range"


Ah, here is proof of your claim!
The Huntkey Green Star 450w PSU.
Quote:
Huntkey 450 W (LW-6450SG) exploded when we tried to pull 450 W from it using a load pattern that respects the limits printed on the product box (test six) and also using a load pattern that pulls more power from 12 V outputs and less power from 5 V and 3.3 V outputs (test five). This means that this power supply isn’t capable of delivering its labeled power in continuous mode being, as matter of fact, a 360 W power supply.

Oh, wait.
Read a little further down and you see...
Quote:
On the tests the power supply worked correctly, voltages were really stable, inside a 3% limit from the nominal voltage – which is really great, as the limit is 5% –, except the -12 V output. This output was at -11.20 V and -11.41 on tests 1 and 2. Even though ATV12V standard sets -12 V tolerance at 10% (which means it can go from -10.80 V to -13.20 V) we would like to see this output closer to the nominal -12 V voltage.

So, at 80% load, even this low end PSU is still within it's specified voltage range.
Sorry but it is not looking to good for your arguments today...

Please do not push people who do not know any better into making terrible choices on this forum.


Q:
How Much Power Can a Generic 500 W Power Supply Really Deliver?
A:
"The maximum amount of power we could extract was 250 W" not to mention the ripple...

Q:
How Much Power Can a Corsair VX450 Deliver?
A:
"We could make our 450 W power supply to work stable at 570 W at 48º C and with 81% efficiency!"
!