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My first build, looking for comments/feedback/reviews...

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January 14, 2009 6:05:52 PM

As the topic states, I'm about to order the parts for my new build. :sol:  :sol: 

I don't have much experience, my last comp consisted of parts from 2 different computers. So there wasn't much choice. I've especially waited till now since my original config included the phenom 9950 BE and given the Phenom 2 was about to come out I decided to wait.

My goal is to build a computer that will last me about 2-3 years, given the OCing capabilities I hope to keep the rig somewhat up2date for that period of time.




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I am planning on getting the following products:


CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 940

MOBO: M3A79-T Deluxe (790FX / SB750)

RAM: 4096 MB (2x2048) OCZ DDR2-800 CL4 (4-4-4-15) RAM Kit - Reaper HPC Edition

HDD: SAMSUNG 1000GB HD103UJ 32MB SATAII

GPU: PowerColor RADEON HD 4870 PCS+

PSU: Xilence Redwing Gaming Edition - 600W

Case: Aerocool Hi-Tech 7 Pro - Big Flow Version

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I hope everyone has some good feedback! ;) 

Thnx in advance.


- Shugs




January 14, 2009 6:32:32 PM

-1 agh no go for ocz. your talking about a bunch of messy wires for a ocz.

750w Corsair or 620w Corsiar.
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January 14, 2009 6:40:47 PM

thanks for the input guys, only one problem with getting a corsair or the OCZ, they are cost about 1/3 more than the Xilence (in holland), except possibly the 550w corsair (is within the budget), but I don't know whether that can sufficiently power the rig.
January 14, 2009 6:46:25 PM

Or possibly the OCZ GameXStream 600 Watt ATX 2.0...although here is the link to the info on the Xilence 600W, in case anyone wants to have a look...given its specs i think it can adequately compete with the others (given its price / performance)
January 14, 2009 7:22:09 PM

Drop the Phenom. Get a P45 or X48 and a Q9550 and enjoy the much better performance. At stock the Phenom 2 and the Q9550 are pretty close, but the Phenom 2 is clocked much higher stock with much less overclocking capacity. At 3.2-3.4 GHz the Q9550 will totally defeat the Phenom at 3.8Ghz and the Q9550 can easily hit 4 Ghz+, the Phenom can not. Also you wont need as good a motherboard for the Q9550 so you should be able to make up the cash.

These brands make good PSUs: PC Power and Cooling, Corsair, OCZ, Seasonic, and Antec. Get a 600w+ PSU. If you get a 750w+ you can crossfire another 4870 for pocket change later on.
January 14, 2009 8:00:35 PM

your talking about a phenom 2 and a Q9550 with a low end psu and that card your not going to get much of anything done.

Corsair 620w or 750w isn't that pricey if your talking about a 4870 and Q9550...

im sitting with a 800w kingwin in my pc but, there out of stock right now.
a c 172 à CPUs
January 14, 2009 11:22:57 PM

Your choice of video cards indicates that this is a gaming machine. If this is a completely new build, go Intel.

I recently - like yesterday - replaced a Q6600 with a Q9550. It took me less than 10 minutes to get it running at 3.6 GHz. With my case and HSF, I know that I can run faster.

Your memory is basically being underclocked right now. If you were OC'ing your Q6600 to 3.6 GHz (400 MHz X 9), your memory would be running 1:1.

I do not know if AoC supports multiple cores. Most current games do not. That is why a fast C2D will beat a medium speed C2Q.

If your Q6600 has a late model G0 core stepping (especially with a good VID), you can certainly get more speed from it. I was running a Q6600 at 3.6 GHz until very recently (yesterday) when I replaced it with a Q9550.

Your slowdown is more likely due to Vista. I have no idea how well Vista manages memory.

----------
Overclocking since 1978 - Z80 (TRS-80) from 1.77 MHz to 2.01 MHz
January 15, 2009 4:02:50 PM

What kind of motherboard for the Q9550 would you guys advise then? I've been looking a bit, but not too familiar yet with the various boards offered by the different brands. The board would have to be crossfire compatible (with 2x PCI-16X when crossfireing).

The Phenom 2 940 benchmarks done by the overclockers club shows that the Q9450 is basically on par with the phenom II, pretty much trading FPS when looking at the different games. Is the Q9550 that much better?


@jsc: Well currently I don't even have a Q6600, I'm still running on old P4 640 (3.2ghz) with a 7900GTO. Almost 3.5 years old. So I'm aching for new build. ;) 

I'm considering changing to a Q9550 since the price difference is only 50 euros compared to the Phenom II 940. But I only if the performance increase justifies the price increase and that the Q9550 WILL last longer then the Phenom II 940. Since I intend to wait at least another 3 years until I will start looking for a new comp to build.

Well anyways, looking forward to some mobo ideas for the Q9950. Anything with the 120-170 euro price range so about 150-220 dollars roughly estimated.

Thnx in advance!

- Shugs
January 15, 2009 4:12:51 PM

I was looking at different power supplies and came across the "be quiet! BQT P7-PRO 550W Dark Power PRO 550 Watt ATX V2.2" crossfire rdy etc, does anyone have any experience with this? or heard anything about it? I will look some more online for reviews, but wanted to ask here as well!

- Shugs
January 15, 2009 4:19:48 PM

i have a 550 powering a phenom 9500 and an 8800gt, i wouldnt advise it for a higher clocked quad core and a 4870 id look for at least 600w
January 15, 2009 4:21:19 PM

@shiftstealth: Ok thnx alot, I'll definately start lookin for 600/650 maybe 700W psus
January 15, 2009 4:23:14 PM

look at 700W if you intend in putting in another video card later. ( sli/xfire)

my friend runs a 280 and he uses a 650w with a phenom 9850
January 15, 2009 4:24:00 PM

This Antec NeoPower 650 Watt 650 EC ATX2.2, looks interesting but its got an 80mm fan which will prolly make a **** of noise when it starts to heat up.

can anyone confirm this? or possibly, argue otherwise?
January 15, 2009 4:24:51 PM

my friend has an antec, he complains about the noise but i play with headphones. i didnt think it was too bad thats actually the psu i just made an example of i believe.
January 15, 2009 4:29:18 PM

I found this one within my price range: Xilence Gaming Edition 750 Watt ATX Active PFC and allows for quad crossfire...also has 4 12V rails...sounds a bit excessive...since, if it all,I will only get a second HD4870, not planning on four lol

I'm pretty much clueless when it comes to PSUs.. I assume that the rails need atleast a decent amount of amps, I don't know what the efficiency % of the xilence is, gonna try to find out tho.
January 15, 2009 4:30:36 PM

@shiftstealth: thnx, after i posted last night i started doubting the config i had in mind! :whistle: 
January 15, 2009 4:37:01 PM

Whoa!!! Take a look at that PSU's specs:

  1. 6+2Pin PCI-Express: 1x
  2. 6Pin PCI-Express: 1x
  3.  
  4. +3,3V +5V +12V +12V -12V -5V +5VSB
  5. 25A 30A 20A 20A 0,5A - 3,0A


Two +12V at 20A is not good!!!! The Corsair 650 has 1 +12V @ 52A and 2x 6+2Pin PCI-Express connectors.
January 15, 2009 4:50:36 PM

@DXrick: like i said i'm a noob when it comes to PSUs, but isnt 2x 20A enough if I would stick to a single HD4870 1GB and for example a Q9550 or Phenom II 940.

Cuz the 650 corsair is a lot more expensive then the xilence and i'm pretty much on a tight budget. the xilence 600W is 60 euros and the corsair HX620 is 140 euros. Hugo difference, so only if its necessary i will get a better one.
January 15, 2009 4:54:12 PM

And isn't it possible to consider 2 12V rails with each 20A to be comparable to a single 40A?
January 15, 2009 5:20:21 PM

Hmm i hope someone can answer that question about the 12V rails.


In the meantime, I was thinkin that i will just stick to the phenom II 940 since I predict the performance increase will be minimal and most likely not even really noticeable at those levels. Especially since it will cost me more money to get the Q9550 I will invest that money in a better aftermarket cooler and if necessary a better PSU and last but not least, i spent a lot more time checkin out the AMD setup and i don't want to jump into a intel setup whose socket type will be outdated soon.
January 15, 2009 6:21:30 PM

@ DXrick: Strange, I believe that is an outdated version, since this is the one I was talking about:

http://www.xilence-lab.de/News-Details-Engl.19+M58f7c76...

according to the specs on the site it has a 4+4pin power connecter and a 13,5 cm fan...Also the specs in the link do not match the ones on the site...

PS the question is already answered, I read a FAQ on PSUs ;) 
January 15, 2009 6:24:17 PM

The difference between the Phenom 2 and the Q9550 is actually really large. The Q9550 is faster clock for clock. The Phenom 2 3.0 Ghz is behind the Q9550 2.8 Ghz. This is bad because the average overclocking ceiling seems to be about 3.6 ghz on the Phenom and 4 ghz on the Q9550. With the Q9550 being clock for clock faster and able to overclock 1-1.2 Ghz on air while the Phenom 2 can only do .6-.7 Ghz on air, it really is no contest. I recommend a P45 because the difference between x8/x8 and x16/x16 was overblown a while back and really isn't much of a difference. This difference is so important because the performance difference will really show itself with a long lasting build, not to mention the huge difference in overclocking.

Good P45 board, it will run at x16/x8 which does not hurt performance:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
January 15, 2009 6:24:20 PM

lol also meant to thank u for ur input! so thanks :) 
January 15, 2009 6:44:33 PM

@The_Blood_Raven: First of all thanks for your input! I am kinda doubting whether the price difference equals the performance increase. I also read (don't remember where) that intel is about rdy to drop socket 775. So i don't know whether it is worthwhile to invest in it since I will possibly loose the option to pick up a different maybe better CPU after a year or 2. I don't want to exclude the fact that I may still randomly decide to quickly upgrade the CPU. Since the Asus board is AM3 ready, it would still be possible to install a AM3 chip down the road.

Knowing this, would you still advise the Q9550?....the thing is, I was pretty set on the config w/the Phenom II, and your input is making me doubtful. :pt1cable: 
January 15, 2009 6:53:17 PM

Well, I can't find that brand on my usual US sites. Hopefully the next version doesn't have the same problem with the unstable 12V rails.

If the PSU dies, it can take your system with it. :ouch: 
January 15, 2009 6:57:01 PM

#$%^@
January 15, 2009 7:22:11 PM

@DXrick: I don't know if that product is offered within the
US, according to the site the companiy mainly supplies the German and UK market.

I read the review, but the unstable V12 rails were still within the ATX norm or? Atleast I hope the new version is indeed more stable :p 
January 15, 2009 7:49:57 PM

Thanks blackpanther26!

I just ended up ordering the phenom 2, since it was still quite a price difference (compared to Q9550), it seems that the prices in europe are higher then they are on newegg, and that even in euros (so much for exchange rates). Total rip off!

I'm pretty much time pressured right now into ordering the build since I only have a short time frame where I don't have to work / study. I spent quite some time on looking into the AMD system, and tbh I shortly looked into the intel cpu/mobo and looks appealing but Its gonna cause too much of a delay and I'm not even totally convinced that it will be a noticeable increase in performance.


Anyways, my thanks and appreciate to everyone for their input!

- Shugs
January 15, 2009 8:19:11 PM

Err...appreciation* ;) ....so much for the ability to edit msgs!!
a b à CPUs
January 16, 2009 11:56:49 AM

The_Blood_Raven said:
Drop the Phenom. Get a P45 or X48 and a Q9550 and enjoy the much better performance. At stock the Phenom 2 and the Q9550 are pretty close, but the Phenom 2 is clocked much higher stock with much less overclocking capacity. At 3.2-3.4 GHz the Q9550 will totally defeat the Phenom at 3.8Ghz and the Q9550 can easily hit 4 Ghz+, the Phenom can not. Also you wont need as good a motherboard for the Q9550 so you should be able to make up the cash.

These brands make good PSUs: PC Power and Cooling, Corsair, OCZ, Seasonic, and Antec. Get a 600w+ PSU. If you get a 750w+ you can crossfire another 4870 for pocket change later on.

+1 for the PSUs.
a c 107 à CPUs
January 16, 2009 11:59:59 AM

I hope you were able to get a decent PSU. Among the problems with cheap ones, 1) they are often unable to put out anywhere NEAR their claimed ratings without blowing up and/or having such unstable output that it kills attached components, and 2) they often lack decent protection circuits, meaning rather than dying quietly, they are more likely to take other things with them.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in Holland, aren't all PSUs required to have Active PFC? If so, that's a good thing, and may offer a little protection from some of the utter garbage that is somehow legal to sell in the USA.
January 16, 2009 1:09:19 PM

Onus said:
I hope you were able to get a decent PSU. Among the problems with cheap ones, 1) they are often unable to put out anywhere NEAR their claimed ratings without blowing up and/or having such unstable output that it kills attached components, and 2) they often lack decent protection circuits, meaning rather than dying quietly, they are more likely to take other things with them.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in Holland, aren't all PSUs required to have Active PFC? If so, that's a good thing, and may offer a little protection from some of the utter garbage that is somehow legal to sell in the USA.



Yeah the PSU is meets legal requirements and has all the necessary certificates and also active PFC, I think the brand is possibly so cheap since it is not offered in many countries and made in taiwan! ;) 

I find it odd that the corsair has a single 12V rail with 56A, while ATX conform refered to a maximum of 20A per 12V rail to prevent over heating and short-curcuiting.

There are also some other brands here that are quite cheap like LC-Power, but i haven't read any positives reviews on those, the Xilence 600 (previous edition) had some issues with the 12V rail on the previously mentioned review...but besides that I don't think I could find any other potentially major issues.

I was looking in to the Antec 600W of 550W it was, not sure atm anymore..and can't really check for it. But it only had a single V12 rail with i think 18A. Which is most certainly not enough to power my rig at full load.

But i'm still lookin for possibe PSU's that are within my price range. But I don't really want to spend more then 80 euro's. Which puts me in the low output PSUs of the mentioned brands by The_Blood_Raven. Atleast given the Antec example.

Have you guys ever heard about Enermax, Be Quiet and Chieftec? or are those known as low end brands?

I would prefer bein in the US since the prices there are much fairer! and mail in rebates are pimp! They never do any sales promotions like that over here, and they would definately be worth it.. At most maybe 10% discount if you get lucky. I guess there's jut not enough competition over here :S.
a c 107 à CPUs
January 16, 2009 5:56:07 PM

Enermax is mixed, but I think mostly good. I've got an Enermax Liberty now, but I've been drooling over an Antec Signature 650; sooner or later I'll replace it and put the Enermax in a test rig.
I'm not sure about the others. Three good sites that do competent technical reviews of PSUs (i.e. including load testing, waveform analysis, dissections) are www.jonnyguru.com, hardocp.com, and hardwaresecrets.com. I don't have time ATM, but look there for reviews.
January 16, 2009 6:39:36 PM

Onus said:
Enermax is mixed, but I think mostly good. I've got an Enermax Liberty now, but I've been drooling over an Antec Signature 650; sooner or later I'll replace it and put the Enermax in a test rig.
I'm not sure about the others. Three good sites that do competent technical reviews of PSUs (i.e. including load testing, waveform analysis, dissections) are www.jonnyguru.com, hardocp.com, and hardwaresecrets.com. I don't have time ATM, but look there for reviews.


Thanks a lot for the sites!!!!!!

That's what i'd been looking for but couldn't find any decent websites with reviews. I came across one a couple months ago but forgot to bookmark it and couldn't find it ever since! I will definately look into it! Thanks again.


- Shugs
!