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Defective CPU??

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January 18, 2009 7:05:40 AM

Anything that seems to be processed by the CPU seems to lag my pc. For example, bots, mapping, ai, ETC. When i say lag, im not talking about ping. Im talking about FPS/Visual lag. Don't get it wrong, im not playing crysis either. Most the games i play are 10 year old games (quake 3 and cs 1.6) so please don't suggest getting "BETTER/FASTER" hardware.

If i play an offline game with AI. bots (for ex: quake 3), things get really choppy. The more bots i add the laggier it gets, ranging from one to eight bots. However, using the same settings, number of players and map, the choppyness is reduced by 85%... but there's still some minor graphical chops but it cannot be compared when there's AI. This happens in all games, but much worse in heavy AI based games with bots

Real time gameplay vs a recorded demo seems to be completely different. If i play real time, i get lag. However... if i watch a replay of the same game from a recorded demo, there's no chops anywhere.

What can cause a conflict like this? I mean the CPU calculates all the AI so it has to be the cpu right? Can there be anything else that can cause something like this?

I don't think i can pass prime95 stress test at stock voltage. Using stock settings (1.325 vcore), my cpu cores get up to 75+ in almost 10 seconds or so. However using 1.2vcore seems to be stable

SPECS:
win xp pro sp2
corsair 1gb
7600gt 512mb evga
gigabyte ga-945p-s3 (latest bios)
E6300 @ 2.45 (50idle, 60 load @ 1.2vcore)
100hz

So far things ive tried:
Reformat
Virus/spyware check/defrag
drivers
Different psu/gpu/ram/psu/mobo
reinstall games
video settings / vsync / aa / etc
Dual core fixes

More about : defective cpu

January 18, 2009 1:25:46 PM

You need to double check that your heatsink assembly is properly attached. I assume your using the stock Intel cooler with their wonderful push-pin system. If its getting that hot that fast, odds are that your cooler is not making good contact with the CPU.

Also be sure to get some new thermal compound. Arctic Cooling MX-2 or Arctic Silver 5 are the accepted standards, although any thermal paste is better than trying to recycle whats already on there. Clean thoroughly with alcohol and let dry before applying new compound. It doesn't take much, maybe a spot the size of a grain of rice. Other users recommend spreading that over the CPU, I personally let the pressure between the HSF and CPU do my spreading for me. Its a matter of preference.

Also, have task manager up while running these games, and see if your CPU is spiking near 100% use.
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January 18, 2009 2:41:43 PM

amount of RAM might be on the low side?
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January 18, 2009 11:20:34 PM

B-Unit said:
You need to double check that your heatsink assembly is properly attached. I assume your using the stock Intel cooler with their wonderful push-pin system. If its getting that hot that fast, odds are that your cooler is not making good contact with the CPU.

Also be sure to get some new thermal compound. Arctic Cooling MX-2 or Arctic Silver 5 are the accepted standards, although any thermal paste is better than trying to recycle whats already on there. Clean thoroughly with alcohol and let dry before applying new compound. It doesn't take much, maybe a spot the size of a grain of rice. Other users recommend spreading that over the CPU, I personally let the pressure between the HSF and CPU do my spreading for me. Its a matter of preference.

Also, have task manager up while running these games, and see if your CPU is spiking near 100% use.


Heatsink is mounted correctly and paste is also fine. If it wasn't, id be seeing 70c idle (which has happened once or twice). I used to have a artic cooler 7 before the pins before, and the temps weren't that great on stock 1.325vcore either. At 100% fan and 100% load, temps went up to mid/high 60's in a few seconds.

CPU usage seems normal, nothing taking usage except the game im playing. Whatever game im running, it runs around 50%, which is normal for dual cores correct?

13thmonkey said:
amount of RAM might be on the low side?


Are you kidding me? These kinds of responses are ridiculous. Do you know that quake 3 came out in 1999 and counter strike in 2000? Thats 10 and 9 years respectively. Do the **** math. 1GB of ram is OVERKILL for these old games. Im pretty sure 512mb of ram was considered AMAZING.

Should i buy a 4780x2 as well? After all my 7600 is on the "low" side as well. Then again, this "low" card can max out cs at 500 fps, but oh i need still a better card. /sarcasm
January 19, 2009 12:52:58 AM

It seems to me that your problem is heat related. My laptop has terrible cooling and when it starts getting really hot, games and video playback starts to chug, then if I blow cold canned air into it, it speeds up again.

I dont know much about C2D's but 50C at idle seems really high to me. What does your case cooling look like? Also make sure that all your fans are are at full capacity in the bios.
January 19, 2009 1:23:03 AM

nsimo86 said:
It seems to me that your problem is heat related. My laptop has terrible cooling and when it starts getting really hot, games and video playback starts to chug, then if I blow cold canned air into it, it speeds up again.

I dont know much about C2D's but 50C at idle seems really high to me. What does your case cooling look like? Also make sure that all your fans are are at full capacity in the bios.


Although my cpu is quite hot, it's not hot enough to be causing throttlebacks. It's quite coincidental that this problem happens on my brothers AMD (which idles at 32 and load at 46). So it's not temp related
January 19, 2009 4:19:31 AM

CS 1.6 played flawlessly on my athlon x2 5400 and radeon 4850, although i've only played online and not with bots. Does CS lag when you play online as well?

It could be a problem with OpenGL, quake 3 is an OpenGL game and CS can be run with OpenGL. Have you tried using direct3d rendering in CS?

Is there a program that both you and your brother are running in the background like anti-virus that could be hogging resouces.

The last thing you could try is reinstalling your OS.

I still think it could be temperature related as you have to undervoltage your cpu to get it to run and its still running really hot.
a b à CPUs
January 19, 2009 4:59:36 AM

im honestly speechless bro. my 450 mghz comp ran quake 3 just fine at 1280 resolution. seems like you either have a serious driver error, really bad settings for these games, or a virus is bypassing your antivirus software. have you formatted? i really doubt its a defective CPU cuz i have never heard of a bad cpu still being able to run applications.

also: 70+ degrees @ stock voltage = something wrong with your heatsink / thermal paste whether you admit it or not.
January 19, 2009 7:17:07 AM

nsimo86 said:
CS 1.6 played flawlessly on my athlon x2 5400 and radeon 4850, although i've only played online and not with bots. Does CS lag when you play online as well?

It could be a problem with OpenGL, quake 3 is an OpenGL game and CS can be run with OpenGL. Have you tried using direct3d rendering in CS?

Is there a program that both you and your brother are running in the background like anti-virus that could be hogging resouces.

The last thing you could try is reinstalling your OS.

I still think it could be temperature related as you have to undervoltage your cpu to get it to run and its still running really hot.



Yep, online it chops as well, but not nearly as bad with bots. Direct3D, tried that.

No similiar program running in the background.

I've already reinstalled my os about 9 times total i believe (I've tried win 2000, xp home, xp pro, xp 64bit, vista)

Temperature related, MAYBE. But let me ask you something then. Why are my chops reduced by 80% WHEN there's no AI? Why are chops reduced by 100% TOTALLY when i watch DEMOS/REPLAYS? Demos and replays, they skip most cpu calculations, if not all, they're just simply reading off a file and replaying the graphics and sound, correct? I can play a game and lag like **** with fps drops every second down to 10. When i watch the demo, it's fluid. How does that make sense?

werxen said:
im honestly speechless bro. my 450 mghz comp ran quake 3 just fine at 1280 resolution. seems like you either have a serious driver error, really bad settings for these games, or a virus is bypassing your antivirus software. have you formatted? i really doubt its a defective CPU cuz i have never heard of a bad cpu still being able to run applications.

also: 70+ degrees @ stock voltage = something wrong with your heatsink / thermal paste whether you admit it or not.



Thats 70+ on prime95. Idle is 55 with stock vcore. Nothing wrong with the heatsink or paste, i know how to install 775's.

It does sound like a driver error, but what exactly? It's not gpu drivers, it's not chipset drivers, it's not mobo bios. The only thing that comes to mind is AUDIO drivers (i use onboard sound). However, i've tried disabling the audio and it did not help.

My linux-elitist friends totally blame windows.
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January 19, 2009 11:06:28 AM

Demo's are fluid as all the rendering/AI calculations are already done. Its like watching a CGI movie as opposed to rendering one.

CPU could be throttling at around 65C or so, have realtemp running while playing and alt-tab when you start to get laggy.

I think RAM is an issue. Yes, the games are old, but were origonally run on Win 98, not XP, which requires far more resources to run. XP could be eating just enough resources to slow the system itself down. Could also be all those windows XP background tasks eating up extra CPU power...Try using taskmanager to see how much CPU power you are using in-game; i'm interested to see the CPU charts...
January 19, 2009 11:16:15 AM

gamerk316 said:
Demo's are fluid as all the rendering/AI calculations are already done. Its like watching a CGI movie as opposed to rendering one.

CPU could be throttling at around 65C or so, have realtemp running while playing and alt-tab when you start to get laggy.

I think RAM is an issue. Yes, the games are old, but were origonally run on Win 98, not XP, which requires far more resources to run. XP could be eating just enough resources to slow the system itself down. Could also be all those windows XP background tasks eating up extra CPU power...Try using taskmanager to see how much CPU power you are using in-game; i'm interested to see the CPU charts...


When playing quake 3 or cs 1.6, i have about 600mb free ram.

I did another test. I ran stress program in the background while gaming which took up around 593ram and 50% cpu and cores up to 65/63c. Along with whatever game i was playing, it added to 100% cpu usage. The lag felt no different really. When playing against ONE bot, there is little choppyness in the first 3-5 minutes. After those first minutes, the choppyness becomes constant and heavy. However, simply restarting the game makes the choppyness cycle start over (which sounds like a ram issue).

I don't think its overheating. I forgot to mention that i've used my stock cooler for only 4 days or so. I used to use a Artic cooler 7 @ 3000 rpm (100% fan) and load while gaming was around low 50's (it is not that good, but def not enough to throttleback)

Could be the ram sticks, but i remember running memtest86 a while back with no errors. Theoretically, if the ram is the culprit, then the sticks are simply defective, it's not because i dont "enough" ram. I've tried isolating and trying each stick out. I've also bought 2x1gb ram a while ago, adding it to a total of 3gb. HOWEVER, i mixed the 2gb with my current 2x512mb...so if these 2 sticks are broken, then it fubared my ram extra ram setup. Since i dont have any cd's left to burn for memtest, i guess imma do a prime95 run tonight. 70/68c is really scary, i hope i dont burn my chip lawl.

For some reason my vcore stays at 1.296 even though i set it to stock 1.325vcore on bios. Hmm
January 19, 2009 11:18:39 AM

Have you checked for spyware on your CPU?
January 19, 2009 11:22:06 AM

pr2thej said:
Have you checked for spyware on your CPU?


Thats noob sh|t cmon, im way beyond spyware or virus.
January 19, 2009 12:06:09 PM

I ran prime95 for about 5 minutes. My cores were up to 74/72 and kept on climbing, it's **** insane. If the heatsink is fine, (paste shouldn't even account for so much heat) then the chip has to be defective. I don't hear people getting these temps with stock heatsink.
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January 19, 2009 12:53:04 PM

Looks like you have a heat problem to me. You should be in the idle temp area of around 32-36, and under full load running prime less than 60. The CPU is not defective, the way you have mounted the heatsink, or the heatsink itself has problems. May not be all that is wrong, but it is something you need to fix.
If you are running XP, 1 gig of RAM should suffice. You may get some slowdowns, more RAM would help, but not enough to cure all your problems.
What about your HDD? Drivers loaded correctly?

a b à CPUs
January 19, 2009 3:32:12 PM

such a strange problem... consider the heat to be a problem woodfly. see if you can crank the AC and put your computer right next to it or hook up a bunch of fans to an open case and see if temp drops can boost ur fps. even a little FPS increase with a little temp decrease will narrow the issue down.
January 19, 2009 10:09:25 PM

werxen said:
such a strange problem... consider the heat to be a problem woodfly. see if you can crank the AC and put your computer right next to it or hook up a bunch of fans to an open case and see if temp drops can boost ur fps. even a little FPS increase with a little temp decrease will narrow the issue down.


Nothing helps the temp. NOT AC, fans or taking side panels off. Sure it drops my idle temps by 2-4, but the load temp is what counts. The only thing that helped my load temp was lowering vcore, adding a artic freezer 7 @ 3000rpm. Still then, temps werent that great.

jitpublisher said:
Looks like you have a heat problem to me. You should be in the idle temp area of around 32-36, and under full load running prime less than 60. The CPU is not defective, the way you have mounted the heatsink, or the heatsink itself has problems. May not be all that is wrong, but it is something you need to fix.
If you are running XP, 1 gig of RAM should suffice. You may get some slowdowns, more RAM would help, but not enough to cure all your problems.
What about your HDD? Drivers loaded correctly?


HDD drivers? There aren't any drivers for HDD. Windows detects them automatically
January 19, 2009 10:56:29 PM

How did you clean the thermal paste off the cpu when you changed heatsinks. Foreign substances could be causing it to run hot, otherwise the chip itself is probably defective in some way (especially if it does the same thing on another mobo)
January 19, 2009 11:06:43 PM

nsimo86 said:
How did you clean the thermal paste off the cpu when you changed heatsinks. Foreign substances could be causing it to run hot, otherwise the chip itself is probably defective in some way (especially if it does the same thing on another mobo)



With alcohol of course.. I know what im doing :X

And yes, i actually bought a spare mobo to troubleshoot and whatnot. It happens in this new mobo as well.

With my spare PSU, seems to be a bit smoother

Right now im using 1.190 vcore and idle is around 47/44. Load goes to low 50's. The choppyness is BETTER for sure but not by much. This crap cpu has to be defective!
a b à CPUs
January 20, 2009 12:17:38 AM

Interesting... you know i had a similar problem with an old 1 gigh celeron processor i had. my 450 meghz celeron would run applications MUCH smoother than my 1 gig did. i never narrowed down the problem though... even changing ram sticks, gpu etc etc. its weird to me that you added an aftermarket heatsink and still have this issue.

one question: how are your refresh rates? as in, when you are running multiple applications does it lag at all when switching between?

also: have you tried formatting or switching HDDs at all?
January 20, 2009 2:32:06 AM

werxen said:
Interesting... you know i had a similar problem with an old 1 gigh celeron processor i had. my 450 meghz celeron would run applications MUCH smoother than my 1 gig did. i never narrowed down the problem though... even changing ram sticks, gpu etc etc. its weird to me that you added an aftermarket heatsink and still have this issue.

one question: how are your refresh rates? as in, when you are running multiple applications does it lag at all when switching between?

also: have you tried formatting or switching HDDs at all?


I've tried using 60, 75, 85 100, 120 or 140 refresh rate. Makes no difference

I like using 140 though. No lag when switching apps.

Yes, i've tried reformatting over 10 times. Changing os from win 2000, xp home, pro, 64bit, vista, ubuntu

Also tried changing a HDD out.

Ive tested/changed every pc part out except for my CPU, and maybe ram (since i mixed it with my current ram)
a b à CPUs
January 20, 2009 2:35:28 AM

weird bro... so weird. i personally cannot see what the hell is wrong with the processor unless i mess with it myself. if you cannot return it then i suggest maybe updating the bios on your mobo see if that helps anything.
January 20, 2009 2:59:39 AM

werxen said:
weird bro... so weird. i personally cannot see what the hell is wrong with the processor unless i mess with it myself. if you cannot return it then i suggest maybe updating the bios on your mobo see if that helps anything.


Yeh already tried updatin bios


Too bad i lost my receipt so i won't be able to rma... guess imma just get a e7300

January 20, 2009 7:40:30 AM

woodyfly said:
Thats noob sh|t cmon, im way beyond spyware or virus.


Sigh...

Just tryna cheer you up ya miserable git.
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January 20, 2009 9:32:04 AM

woodyfly said:
Nothing helps the temp. NOT AC, fans or taking side panels off. Sure it drops my idle temps by 2-4, but the load temp is what counts. The only thing that helped my load temp was lowering vcore, adding a artic freezer 7 @ 3000rpm. Still then, temps werent that great.



HDD drivers? There aren't any drivers for HDD. Windows detects them automatically



If your drives are SATA drives, then yes, there are drivers for the controller which can make a HUGE difference in your HDD speed. The standard drivers windows installs are not always the best choice.
For instance, I have a Seagate 320gig SATA II drive that Windows will load the drivers for just fine.
Run hard drive tune, and it gets like a max of 12meg per second transfer speed, and you can tell it, everything is dirt slow.
Load the SATA controller drivers off the disk that came with the motherboard, bingo....130meg per second transfer rates.

May or may not be your case at all, just trying to be helpful....although from most of your posts you act like an arrogant ungrateful ass who has no clue how to fix his own problem, and yet scoffs at nearly every piece of advice given. Of course the advice may or may not apply, we are not all sitting right in front of your system where we can personally see what you may or may not have screwed up.
If someones advice is not pertinent, then a causual "thank you, I did try that" is the proper response.
January 20, 2009 10:28:04 PM

jitpublisher said:
If your drives are SATA drives, then yes, there are drivers for the controller which can make a HUGE difference in your HDD speed. The standard drivers windows installs are not always the best choice.
For instance, I have a Seagate 320gig SATA II drive that Windows will load the drivers for just fine.
Run hard drive tune, and it gets like a max of 12meg per second transfer speed, and you can tell it, everything is dirt slow.
Load the SATA controller drivers off the disk that came with the motherboard, bingo....130meg per second transfer rates.

May or may not be your case at all, just trying to be helpful....although from most of your posts you act like an arrogant ungrateful ass who has no clue how to fix his own problem, and yet scoffs at nearly every piece of advice given. Of course the advice may or may not apply, we are not all sitting right in front of your system where we can personally see what you may or may not have screwed up.
If someones advice is not pertinent, then a causual "thank you, I did try that" is the proper response.


Um, every HELPFUL post i replied with an elaboration. The jackass that told me about cleaning up spyware or virus obviously didn't read jack squat on my opening post. I have a right to be angry because ive already tried so many things, and EVEN listed them, and then he's gonna tell me to try it again?

So far things ive tried:
Reformat
Virus/spyware check/defrag <--- READ THIS ?
drivers
Different psu/gpu/ram/psu/mobo
reinstall games
video settings / vsync / aa / etc
Dual core fixes

Anyways, My SATA drivers were installed from the chipset drivers it seems. Under device manager it says INTEL 82801 ICH7 FAMILY sata controller. Im guessing it's already installed?
January 20, 2009 10:36:59 PM

The spyware comment made by pr2thej was a joke referring to another thread where someone reviewed a cpu at newegg and said that the CPU had spyware on it.
!