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Whispers: problems arise between Microsoft and Intel

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November 23, 2009 5:14:52 AM

About War and Peace
Mon, 2009-11-23 02:46 | whispers
Intel and AMD come to an arrangement and now AMD can cheerfully present new roadmaps without worrying about pesky patents. In return, problems arise between Microsoft and Intel. The Redmonders were actually planning to advice against the application of Nehalem Xeons under Windows Server 2008 R2.

» Read more: http://top500.org/tags/whispers

support from M$: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/975530
November 23, 2009 12:48:06 PM

How do you find this to be significant? Just curious.
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November 23, 2009 1:34:48 PM

"The Redmonders were actually planning to advice against the application of Nehalem Xeons under Windows Server 2008 R2."

Is payment for services a motivation?
Is there a problem here that the two will not resolve?
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November 23, 2009 2:30:21 PM

Google already does it...

I'm not understanding how hardware structure and advising against using a processor that uses problematic timing has anything to do with payment for services.

The problem is that technology was built on something that was being changed... so now they have a product that is considered unreliable.

But what's the big deal?
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November 23, 2009 5:24:26 PM

It is a coincidence of course but the first part of your sig statement, "Alcoholism is a disease,", fairly well answers your question. Alcoholism is not a disease unless you believe it is. Alcohol is addicting. The symptoms of alcoholism are symptoms of drug addiction. The disease can be described as the dependence, the physical and psychological dependence, the one demanding and being dependent upon the other.

The analogy is the devastating, fatal, affects of the combination of M$ and Intel. It is also a sign of the times. Cancer is the disease.

The discussion should/could proceed trying to answer the questions, mundane questions at best.

So here we go:
Do you consider yourself an Alcoholic, and...
what's this...? -"- a symbol for What's this
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November 23, 2009 5:50:42 PM

Its a quote from Mitch Hedberg.

Regarding your OP though, Intel made a product that used an old timing system and the new system doesn't use it. They stated that it would not be a good idea to use that processor that is built off an older timing feature... and it has a lot of interrupts in it which would be a problem.

Basically what this article is saying is that Intel spent a lot of money making a worthless processor because Microsoft is attempting to do things a little more efficiently. It has nothing to do with your thoughts about charging for a service.

I'm a bit stumped as to your reasoning and random posting as well.
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November 23, 2009 6:40:54 PM

That's what I thought, your motivation. Your sig is coolness and beyond understanding, clever quote.
That is if you are not an Alcoholic. :) 

I believe that there is more to the situation than has surfaced because M$ has posted the solution
or they say that they have a fix that can be emailed... I also believe that we are talking about Intel's
Nehalem... fodder for Cerebral Hemorrhage (headache), and that is not random lol.

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November 23, 2009 6:48:37 PM

Its far more viable that Microsoft does not want the instability of the server because of the hardware. A hotfix only fixes a small issue of the OS running, what happens when other software is installed, etc?

As an IT Admin, I would not use that Intel processor in a server. Microsoft is smart to not recommend using it because of the potential headache should a server start experiencing other issues which relate to that issue.

As far as paying for a Service, Microsoft already has a new rental program, or leasing program available. You don't own the software, you lease the use of it.

Microsoft already has people working against them but I can assure you that Win2k3 is as stable at any Linux competitor. The servers are solid and with Win2k8 coming out, you'll want to main that status. No sense in allowing potentially flawed hardware be the problem.

I believe the uptime of a Win2k3 (Not sure about Win2k8 yet) was around 99.998% a month. The .002% loss can be attributed to installing updates for the most part.
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November 23, 2009 6:58:25 PM

I understand... and of course you are probably correct in your assumptions. What has been nagging at the back of my brain for sometime now is that larabee is about to become a failure...
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November 23, 2009 8:04:28 PM

I don't bother following hardware for the most part. It changes so often that it doesn't matter. Larrabee will most likely be a prototype that, if lucky, gets released in limited form from its initial design. It'll be changing so much... but they need to build hype around it. Much like Processors.. they build them and then come out with newer ones out of no where.

I don't get it.. all the flaming and fighting that goes on over hardware. Wait a couple weeks and it'll all be changing again. Its under constant development, yet people get so fired up and watch so intently, even though they're most likely well over a year or more behind where the development really is.

They're close to releasing the the GPU.. which means they're probably already developed a second or third generation version of it right now and waiting for this first version to hit the market at excessively high prices, so those people get it, test it out, and then complain like crazy about it, or rave on about it... and then they go about fixing it.

Ever wonder why bleeding edge technology is so expensive? Hardware or Software? They only want the 'must haves' to buy it, test it, and then everyone else can buy it. It doesn't have much to do with production... its a way of getting select people to test it out. Someone willing to drop $500 on a brand new video card is probably more technically adept at finding problems and solution than your average Joe who thinks $100 is too much.
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November 23, 2009 9:34:55 PM

-"-
You were saying? Gulftown ES
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December 15, 2009 12:51:25 PM

Processors are years in the making. Each processor is another stepping stone to the next. I can already tell you that they're already a few processosrs ahead of making this one.

As soon as this one is launched, in a few months they'll be talking about the next great processor coming up.

Its a moot point. Hardware is like a drawing. You draw one thing, then you get ideas for more things, and you keep adding to that drawing. Eventually that small drawing is huge. That large center piece is now a small item in the vast scheme of things. That is hardware.

Look at the history of hardware. Things advance, then they become smaller. The CPU used to be huge, now they're getting smaller. Now not only are they smaller, now they have 2 cores.. then 4 cores, so on and so forth.

Its pointless to follow hardware as closely as you have done.
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December 28, 2009 2:48:46 PM

riser said:
Its a quote from Mitch Hedberg.

Regarding your OP though, Intel made a product that used an old timing system and the new system doesn't use it. They stated that it would not be a good idea to use that processor that is built off an older timing feature... and it has a lot of interrupts in it which would be a problem.

Basically what this article is saying is that Intel spent a lot of money making a worthless processor because Microsoft is attempting to do things a little more efficiently. It has nothing to do with your thoughts about charging for a service.

I'm a bit stumped as to your reasoning and random posting as well.


riser said:
Its far more viable that Microsoft does not want the instability of the server because of the hardware. A hotfix only fixes a small issue of the OS running, what happens when other software is installed, etc?

As an IT Admin, I would not use that Intel processor in a server. Microsoft is smart to not recommend using it because of the potential headache should a server start experiencing other issues which relate to that issue.

As far as paying for a Service, Microsoft already has a new rental program, or leasing program available. You don't own the software, you lease the use of it.

Microsoft already has people working against them but I can assure you that Win2k3 is as stable at any Linux competitor. The servers are solid and with Win2k8 coming out, you'll want to main that status. No sense in allowing potentially flawed hardware be the problem.

I believe the uptime of a Win2k3 (Not sure about Win2k8 yet) was around 99.998% a month. The .002% loss can be attributed to installing updates for the most part.


You guys forgot to add that the timing problem in question is based on a feature than no product EVER used up until this point. MS considered the interrupt "unreliable" in all previous VMs. No other company uses this timer.

The problem was exposed when MS released the first product to EVER use this timer and Intel seems to have issues with it.

Intel was unable to recognize the problem since there was no software to test it with. I guess it's called bad luck.

All other VMs from other companies work just fine.

You also forgot to add that using an i7 with VMware(which works splendidly on i7s), or any other VM on the market, will *crush* anything AMD has to offer when using MS's VM.

AMD does use less overall power with their newest 6-core CPUs, but Intel is darn close and Intel packs more omph per core.

Hope Intel fixes this though.
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