http://www.theinquirer.net/inquire [...] l-problems
| Quote : WHEN WE TOLD YOU about the 'bad bumps' in the Apple Macbook Pro 15-inch models the other day, we expected it to end there.
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it keeps on looking bad for nvidia, and yet some keep on recommending them
i'm supposed to read all that?
hows about a summary?
lol
His proof that there is a problem is more convincing that anything NVIDIA has released. Not that this is directly related, but from personal experience i have seen 8000 series cards die a lot more often the i saw older 6000 and 7000 series cards die. The higher ups at NVIDIA might just be squeezing their engineers too hard to ship new product.
I currently use NVIDIA cards exclusively, but with that said, if the badaboom video encoder app didn't exsist i would already have a 4870. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
Really good read....if you aren't lazy.
good thing i sold my gaming laptop with 8600gt in it xD
i bought it from newegg for $900 and after 6 months or so I sold it for $780, not a bad loss.....no more feeling of ticking bomb when my laptop will suddenly die out :] seens like nvidia is digging its own grave right now lol gogo fanboys tell me im wrong.....
I use Nvidia cards in two of my computers, and one has been showing signs of a problem recently, though I'm not yet sure if its specifically related to all this. Another detailed explanation exists here:
http://forum.***.com/graphics-disp [...] nswer.html
"Facts and rumors about failing Nvidia chips have been spewing from all sides for months now. What's AMD's take on the issue, and why aren't we seeing similar failures from its products? We recently had a chat with Neil McLellan, AMD's director of packaging and interconnect technologies, who offered his insight and opinions about these matters.
To understand where AMD is coming from, one must go back a few years to the former ATI. Prompted by problems with packaging and interconnect materials in consoles as well as the European Union's Restriction of Hazardous Substances (RoHS) directive, ATI hired McLellan and went about rethinking its chip packaging strategy. In 2005, the RoHS directive required GPU packages to start connecting to their host boards with lead-free solder balls. ATI also took that opportunity to replace the high-lead solder bumps with so-called eutectic bumps. As you'll see in the diagram below, those solder bumps connect the silicon GPU die to the rest of the package:
A diagram of a GPU package. Source: AMD.
Why the change? High-lead bumps use 90% lead and 10% tin, while eutectic bumps switch that ratio to 37% lead and 63% tin. High-lead bumps can handle more current, but AMD thinks they're more prone to fatigue and need "comprehensive reliability engineering to be used successfully." To illustrate the fatigue issue, McLellan evoked a soda can: the tab will probably stay on if you bend it up and down slightly a hundred times, but it'll likely pop off if you bend it all the way two or three times. Similarly, high-lead bumps can fail because of repetitive heating and cooling. That's because the silicon GPU die and package substrate (see the diagram above) have different thermal expansion coefficients—2 parts per million/°C for the silicon and 30 ppm/°C for the substrate, McLellan said—which puts a significant stress on the bumps."
Notice that line on the material used: "High-lead bumps use 90% lead and 10% tin, while eutectic bumps switch that ratio to 37% lead and 63% tin. High-lead bumps can handle more current, but AMD thinks they're more prone to fatigue and need "comprehensive reliability engineering to be used successfully." So possibly the problem is two-fold; both the material of the bump that is used, and the engineering to make the high lead bump stable. So far, Nvidia doesn't seem to have mastered the engineering, and is offering lame excuses or giving no answer at all. Nvidia forgets that "No comment is a comment". By saying nothing, Nvidia leaves the speculations over what's wrong in high gear, and gives credence to the idea that they are still producing faulty cards.
Edit: Just noticed, the address I posted got blanked out. You can look in X-C-P-U-S.com under forum- video cards for the full article.
Stop with the fcuking quoting ffs, what is your problem!!!!!!!
| FHDelux wrote : His proof that there is a problem is more convincing that anything NVIDIA has released. Not that this is directly related, but from personal experience i have seen 8000 series cards die a lot more often the i saw older 6000 and 7000 series cards die. The higher ups at NVIDIA might just be squeezing their engineers too hard to ship new product.
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do you have 2 pay for that badaboom app
Ranger not to be rude but. It would be easier if you explained your point.
not to seem dumb, but i think its pretty self explanatory
that's why I choose evga for both my 8800 nvidia, for the lifetime warranty...
so if my 8800gts 320mb blows... I'll RMA the card and get a new one... and maybe a upgrade...!
| nocteratus wrote : that's why I choose evga for both my 8800 nvidia, for the lifetime warranty...
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Same reason for getting EVGA cards here. That, and the 90 day step up policy that they have. Also might add that of the four EVGA cards that I have purchased through the years, not one of them have failed.
the lifetime warranty is great, but your missing my point, that its not ok for a company (any company) to lie and cheat to its customers and expect said customers, to show any brand loyalty, when things are going wrong...
am i thick, am i asking to much....
and can someone, please tell me the price of cheese
no, i get your point...
Nvidia cheats its customer. But at the same time compagnies offering nvidia products offers lifetime warranty.
The card I have works great. And if someday I have problems with it I'll RMA the card and get and new one...
I choose Evga before Nvidia... the reasons for evga are for the warranty, customer service and 90-days step-up program... but they only offer Nvidia base video card... if they had ATI I'll probably have 2 ATI right now instead of Nvidia
| nocteratus wrote : no, i get your point...
|
Ok
Nvidia make graphic GPU's,
pass on to PNY, ASUS, EVGA, MSI, and so on yada yada yada!!!! who we buy from
Where i live ASUS cards = return/ replace with 2 year warranties (i can live with that)
PNY = 1 year (from top of my head)
No one buys direct from Nvidia as far as i'm aware. So how are Nvidia cheating, i really can't be bothered to read that stuff Ranger posted,
Thanks
| Pharo Surreal wrote : Ok
|
well don't, what are you massogonistic, im more than positive that you can get some help for that sort of compulsive disorder...
i feel all good inside, helping some one, such as yourself
| rangers wrote : well don't, what are you massogonistic, im more than positive that you can get some help for that sort of compulsive disorder...
|
Thanks for the help
Im so glad i made you feel all good,
Any time!
| rangers wrote : well don't, what are you massogonistic, im more than positive that you can get some help for that sort of compulsive disorder...
|
Well, at least in the eyes of some here, its you that has the problem. Nvidia may make a faulty product, and I do believe that is the case. However, various companies that sell the cards made using Nvidia products warranty them against failure, replacing any card that does fail. So the effect to the customer is functionally the same as if there was no failure in the Nvidia cards. If anyone should be angry, it would be the companies selling the cards, as they bear the financial burdens of Nvidia's processors. Beyond that, as many people in this forum replace/update their video cards fairly often, its very likely that they will never suffer the effects of Nvidia's deception. That is, the card may fail in three or four years of use, but it will already have been discarded before that failure occurs.
As for that word, "massogonistic", I have never heard of it before, nor can I find it in the dictionary. Maybe its you that needs some help.
no problemo
Seeing as you've been warned before for posting the entire article, I'll just say something fast before the thread gets locked. It should be obvious by now to any non fanboy that Nvidia has some problems. "Going big" while AMD "went small" is just the first problem. Renaming of old cards as new ones and using bad a manufacturing process are also problems they have right now.
With the lifetime warranty that some companies offer however, I'm not sure this is an issue. It also seems to be related to temps, so if you never shut your PC/laptop off, this won't effect you. (I don't have a laptop, and never turn my PC off, or standby for that matter.) I'm not sure how big of an issue this will be for most. While I would certainly avoid any Nvidia laptop, desktop cards shouldn't be a problem.
With any luck rangers, you'll just get a temp ban. Perhaps you can get help for your need to push the envelope.
While it's very possible Nvidia cheated its customers, you have to realize Nvidia has a responsibility to its investors, its employees, and its suppliers/supplied (Evga, XFX, etc.). If they hadn't gone for such a quick fix, it could cost the company significantly more, which in turn hurts investors, employees, and everyone down the road. While I admit that customers are incredibly important, a company has to watch out for everyone, including itself. And if they can take a cheap way out, and save themselves huge layoffs, that's better for the consumer in the long run than a dead Nvidia.
| Sailer wrote : Well, at least in the eyes of some here, its you that has the problem. Nvidia may make a faulty product, and I do believe that is the case. However, various companies that sell the cards made using Nvidia products warranty them against failure, replacing any card that does fail. So the effect to the customer is functionally the same as if there was no failure in the Nvidia cards. If anyone should be angry, it would be the companies selling the cards, as they bear the financial burdens of Nvidia's processors. Beyond that, as many people in this forum replace/update their video cards fairly often, its very likely that they will never suffer the effects of Nvidia's deception. That is, the card may fail in three or four years of use, but it will already have been discarded before that failure occurs.
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i dont think your entitled to come in, the post was not for some one with the IQ of an ameba
im on fire tonight
| Sailer wrote : Well, at least in the eyes of some here, its you that has the problem. Nvidia may make a faulty product, and I do believe that is the case. However, various companies that sell the cards made using Nvidia products warranty them against failure, replacing any card that does fail. So the effect to the customer is functionally the same as if there was no failure in the Nvidia cards. If anyone should be angry, it would be the companies selling the cards, as they bear the financial burdens of Nvidia's processors.
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True though i think no one loses out:
These companies that buy Nvidia GPU's know what they're getting they don't worry about RMA's because most times they can get the product back, and recycle/reuse components to re-sell. (Well the big ones can easily).
eg. Sell 10 million, RMA 50,000. 10,000 of the RMA's re-cycled/reusable, profit 10- 15% they don't give 2 f**ks. RMA's
ASUS in the UK 2 year warranty, product f**ks up within 2 years they send you a re-furb (recycled/rebuilt bulls***)
It works, customers happy, company's very happy as it hardly loses out.
Companies that need to send out new units, they're the ones who suffer, but quality is at a price
| 4745454b wrote : Seeing as you've been warned before for posting the entire article, I'll just say something fast before the thread gets locked. It should be obvious by now to any non fanboy that Nvidia has some problems. "Going big" while AMD "went small" is just the first problem. Renaming of old cards as new ones and using bad a manufacturing process are also problems they have right now.
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warned, Ive not had a warning, if you have a problem i suggest you take it up with one of the mods
Jaydee is the true inventor of the name of this thread. I remember the flames going around. Nice ol' thread.
Just in case people can't really bring themselves to read this I will summarize:
nVidia: <Gives Apple a well deserved Middle Finger>
Apple says: But I just want to make bad art and listen to Coldplay!
| squatchman wrote : Just in case people can't really bring themselves to read this I will summarize:
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lol i like this version.
| squatchman wrote : Just in case people can't really bring themselves to read this I will summarize:
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got to admit , that version sounds better
ah yes..the inquirer. it has to be true.
Along this line of thought, good read
http://techreport.com/discussions.x/15707
intresting read jaydee. i would dare say there is some truth to that but at the same time he is obligated to glorify their processes.
| Sailer wrote :
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Well, misogynistic is a word, but I don't really see how it applies.
| cjl wrote : Well, misogynistic is a word, but I don't really see how it applies. |
It seemed to me to be a misconstruction of masochist and misogynist, but why point out such obvious errors. After all, the OP thought that I had the mental ability of an amoeba, so what would be equivalent to his brainpower?
| Sailer wrote : It seemed to me to be a misconstruction of masochist and misogynist, but why point out such obvious errors. After all, the OP thought that I had the mental ability of an amoeba, so what would be equivalent to his brainpower? |
Whow
Drifting way off topic, feel like some of my old English teachers just logged in to correct everyone!!!
let it go dude everyone F*s up once in a while.
Not everyone uses a decent browser with spell check.
| jaydeejohn wrote : Along this line of thought, good read
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read that last night jaydee, good read all the same
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