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Best AGP card for P-III Tualatin Processor?

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January 2, 2009 12:32:44 PM

Hi All,

Further continuation to the thread I've posted below:

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/255626-30-tualatin-mo...


Which AGP card is best for that P-III Tualatin Processor based board? I mean in terms of Performance without much MOBO over heating issues because of the added AGP card. I knew couple of 256 / 512 MB cards but am confused which one should I go for if am lucky enough to find a replacement ATX board :( 

Thanks,

~akula2
January 2, 2009 12:43:14 PM

i'm going to strongly suggest that you give up on finding such an old motherboard. you can buy the cheapest LGA775 board on newegg, and get a celeron dual core for it along with 1GB of DDR2. it'll cost you a little over $100. and by moving on to pci-express, you'll notice that video cards become significantly cheaper.
January 2, 2009 12:55:29 PM

Nik_I said:
i'm going to strongly suggest that you give up on finding such an old motherboard. you can buy the cheapest LGA775 board on newegg, and get a celeron dual core for it along with 1GB of DDR2. it'll cost you a little over $100. and by moving on to pci-express, you'll notice that video cards become significantly cheaper.



Ummm, lemme try for some more time because I've got some hope left. Else I'll take the help of my contacts in the United States to bring such MOBO to my place.

Meanwhile, any suggestions about the AGP card :) 
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January 2, 2009 1:32:37 PM

Nik_I said:
i'm going to strongly suggest that you give up on finding such an old motherboard. you can buy the cheapest LGA775 board on newegg, and get a celeron dual core for it along with 1GB of DDR2. it'll cost you a little over $100. and by moving on to pci-express, you'll notice that video cards become significantly cheaper.

i HIGHLY agree with Nik_I. even at the cheapest, the ATI 2600 is around 60$ range on newegg while the most expensive ones are 100+. even the AGP 3850 is 120-140$. NOT WORTH IT. i can not recommend you anything as it is out-dated and the price/performance ratio is terrible!

seriously, take our advice and go with LGA775. The AGP 3850 is priced at what the ATI 4850 can go for, and the 4850 will eat it for breakfast, lunch, and dinner...for a week. AGP is obsolete, there is no use going back.
January 2, 2009 1:32:42 PM

get the cheapest brand new card you can.
better, buy any old agp card you can find.


January 2, 2009 1:45:59 PM

Get nVidia GeForce FX 5xxx series AGP cards... that'll more than enough for SD RAM technology systems...
January 2, 2009 1:49:14 PM

zodiacfml said:
get the cheapest brand new card you can.
better, buy any old agp card you can find.

why would you recommend him to buy an old AGP card? the price/performance ratio is utterly terrible. many makers dont' even carry AGP cards anymore. the only ones that are left that is of any use from ATi, is the 2xxx, or 3xxx, and those carry a HEFTY premium for old-outdated technology. if you want older AGP cards, the Nvidia 5xxx-7xxx series are still out there but are worth a bit of money as well.

Chaintech Fx 5200 is the cheapest you'll find on newegg. for 20$ but thats only for display purposes, its useless for anything else remotely modern.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

this is a tech forum and he's asking for advice. and from a technical standpoint, AGP is obsolete especially if he's looking at 256/512mb cards which would the Nvidia's 6xxx series and above and the ATI's x1xxx and beyond. those carry a hefty price for such old technology which makes it NOT WORTH IT. regardless of sentiment, he can keep the old comp in storage or whatever if he doesn't want to get rid of it. with the money he might spend on an OLD agp card, he could be moving onto much better technology with a way way way better price/performance ratio.
January 2, 2009 1:59:51 PM

Well aznguy, did you miss the part where hes using an PIII? And judging by the comment 'Else I'll take the help of my contacts in the United States to bring such MOBO to my place.' a full system upgrade is gonna be difficult. Your right, this is a tech forum, and hes here because we have the KNOWLEDGE to help him make this choice, not an obligation to talk him into buying new equipment so he can stretch his e-peen.

FX5500 or ATi x15xx or x16xx are as high on the list as you want to go, anything faster is gonna get held back by your CPU.

EDIT: Read and posted to your motherboard thread. Does your Mom do any gaming? If not, grab the cheepest FX5200 you can find.
January 2, 2009 2:00:01 PM

Nik_I said:
i'm going to strongly suggest that you give up on finding such an old motherboard. you can buy the cheapest LGA775 board on newegg, and get a celeron dual core for it along with 1GB of DDR2. it'll cost you a little over $100. and by moving on to pci-express, you'll notice that video cards become significantly cheaper.


Agreed
with NIK_I
January 2, 2009 2:14:20 PM

B-Unit said:
Well aznguy, did you miss the part where hes using an PIII? And judging by the comment 'Else I'll take the help of my contacts in the United States to bring such MOBO to my place.' a full system upgrade is gonna be difficult. Your right, this is a tech forum, and hes here because we have the KNOWLEDGE to help him make this choice, not an obligation to talk him into buying new equipment so he can stretch his e-peen.

FX5500 or ATi x15xx or x16xx are as high on the list as you want to go, anything faster is gonna get held back by your CPU.

EDIT: Read and posted to your motherboard thread. Does your Mom do any gaming? If not, grab the cheepest FX5200 you can find.

i agree with you. i'm not talking him into buying anything, just the best he can get with his money in terms of value. i did see that he is on a PIII system, but he was asking for a 256/512 card and i'm sure you know those are still worth quite a bit. i'm sure it is difficult to get a full system upgrade, i'm just stating the possibilities of how far he can stretch his money. your opinion is valid as so is mine, we're just talking about diff. side of the spectrum.

edit* which was also y i linked him to the FX5200 in case he only needed it for display purposes or very basic gaming.
January 2, 2009 2:29:43 PM

I can see the sentimental value of the system in particular. Some people will buy a $20 glass case for a sentimental penny.

But I find that your Mom, will not notice a difference at all if you went ahead and got a socket 775 motherboard. I'm pretty sure she never really dug in and opened up the PC. Made a note of the type of processor, and motherboard. What memory she had, what type of hard drive it was. She probably can't tell AGP from PCIe slot.

Keep the current case, monitor and accessories. That's all that she looks at anyways. Massage in a socket 775 motherboard and PCIe video. Tell her that you had to reload the OS.
January 2, 2009 3:28:31 PM

I'd just go on ebay or a local trade show and pick up a Radeon 9000. I used to pair them with PIII's back in the day.
January 2, 2009 3:35:30 PM

nVidia FX5500 would best suit it.... try to get its 128 bit version...
January 2, 2009 4:22:01 PM

If you can get an ATi 9700/9800 I would recommend that over the FX5500.
January 2, 2009 4:34:08 PM

if your mom is anything like my mom, she won't even need a video card. once again im gonna suggest a 775 motherboard. heck, find one with integrated graphics. it'll most likely still be better than most of those old agp cards you'll find. also, consider that on such an old motherboard that the agp speed is probably either 1x or 2x. some cards might not even work at all.
January 2, 2009 4:59:37 PM

Wow. I'm just amazed at how people are so easily convinced by marketing....

Obviously trying to find a card with 256 or more RAM is a complete waste of time for a slow CPU user. Video ram is for a 2D frame buffer and 3D textures. We once used 16MB cards to do 32-bit color at even 1920x1440 in 2D. I'm sure you could do 32bpp at 2048x1536 with a lousy 64MB card if you happen to own an old professional 19-24" CRT.

So if you're not playing games almost any dusty old card will do the job at giving you a pretty looking desktop on even a 1080p TV with VGA

Now 3D..... the vram is used to store textures so lots of vram is desirable BUT then you need a very fast GPU to run high enough resolutions AND a very fast CPU or the vram won't get used.

512MB was too much video RAM on 7950GTs because the card wasn't powerful enough to utilize it. X1900XTs or better would but then you need a fast CPU.
1GB is too much on 8600GTs again because the cards weren't powerful enough to use it all, but the much faster 4870 sure can, but again you need a fast CPU.

The ONLY reason lower model GPUs with big vram cards exist on the market is joe sixpack thinks MORE RAM = FASTER and RAM prices fall. If you could put 80 TERABYTES of RAM on a GeForce 5200 its NOT GOING TO GET ANY FASTER!!!! Don't believe me? Grab a laptop and share 1.5GB of RAM instead of 256MB on your Intel onboard video and run some games and tell me what happens!!!! Not a damn thing. Again the only reason you can do this is so the laptop manufacturer can put a sticker on that says it has 1512MB video so they look better and sell more.

As far as AGP gaming goes 512MB would probably be used by a Radeon 3850, but you're going to need an Athlon 64 or better to drive that card to 1600+ res to start using over 256MB texture memory.

Up to 256MB would probably be used by an X1650 AGP card but you're going to need a late model Athlon XP or P4 or better to drive that card to run 1280+ res to start using over 128MB texture memory.

With even the 1.4GHz Tualatin P!!! the most sensible card you can hope to run is probably a 9800pro 128MB. You might be a little faster on a 6800 Ultra but you won't likely be using all of its 256MB RAM with that CPU, just getting bit better performance because its a faster GPU and a faster model Tualation might be able to push it harder than a 9800.

Long story short OP, unless you change your board and CPU stop looking a big VRAM cards!!!! Even if you get a 3850 AGP for free its not going to do you any good at all. There's also a good chance that an old P3 board is going to have a 4X AGP slot at the most and will put out too much voltage to run late model (AGP 8X/3.0) cards anyway. You might smoke up another board or your new card.
January 2, 2009 5:36:43 PM

^ +1 some good info there.

However to the defense of myself and many folks, we were responding to the requirements that the OP ask, which is an AGP card that has 256mb to 512mb.
January 2, 2009 6:12:04 PM

"There's also a good chance that an old P3 board is going to have a 4X AGP slot at the most and will put out too much voltage to run late model (AGP 8X/3.0) cards anyway. You might smoke up another board or your new card."

Such thing won't happen....................................................
January 2, 2009 6:44:00 PM

aznguy0028 said:
i can not recommend you anything as it is out-dated and the price/performance ratio is terrible!

seriously, take our advice and go with LGA775. The AGP 3850 is priced at what the ATI 4850 can go for, and the 4850 will eat it for breakfast, lunch, and dinner...for a week. AGP is obsolete, there is no use going back.


Thanks a ton dear friends for the active responses. Many have recommended me to go with the LGA775 stuff and quoted AGP being obsolete too. She does use a high end Lenovo Core 2 Duo Thinkpad (SL series).

Issue is never about dumping that PC or AGP being outdated. It's about retaining that PC with a good upgrade forever as it's her first PC (April 2000) which carries many good memories and successes. It's kind of sentiment to her. So I've thought to go with the MOBO/RAM/AGP upgrade instead of trashing that PC and gifting her a Core 2 Quad desktop. Let it cost me $300 or more I don't really mind for her happiness :) 
January 2, 2009 6:54:52 PM

flyin15sec said:
I can see the sentimental value of the system in particular. Some people will buy a $20 glass case for a sentimental penny.

But I find that your Mom, will not notice a difference at all if you went ahead and got a socket 775 motherboard. I'm pretty sure she never really dug in and opened up the PC. Made a note of the type of processor, and motherboard. What memory she had, what type of hard drive it was. She probably can't tell AGP from PCIe slot.

Keep the current case, monitor and accessories. That's all that she looks at anyways. Massage in a socket 775 motherboard and PCIe video. Tell her that you had to reload the OS.


My dear friend it's not like that, she runs Bulk Drugs & Pharma companies :)  Her knowledge is good enough (to manage) as she keeps tab on the company resources like the existing Linux Cluster and Apple Machines (apart from regular work force Intel workstations/laptops).
January 2, 2009 7:01:35 PM

rickzor said:
"There's also a good chance that an old P3 board is going to have a 4X AGP slot at the most and will put out too much voltage to run late model (AGP 8X/3.0) cards anyway. You might smoke up another board or your new card."

Such thing won't happen....................................................


You got it buddy. AGP support will be 4x max to my understanding for the MOBO which am looking for. Looks like AGP 4x 256 MB card might be the best fit for the requirement (Monitor is Samsung 17"). What you guys says :) 
January 3, 2009 7:48:07 PM

Update:

Bad luck as am unable to find a 4x AGP card locally! Looks like I've to depend again on the US or UK market (along with the MOBO) to procure one 256MB card :( 

Any specific model number dear friends if you could retrieve the good old H/W stuff :) 
January 3, 2009 11:40:51 PM

I put a Nvidia FX5200 128MB into an old Pentium3 1GHz 100FSB slot 1 CPU worked fine together. That's an AGPx8 card and the motherboard was ms6119 AGPx2 board.

Even Ran Rome total wars on it.
January 4, 2009 8:20:53 PM

meanmachine said:
I put a Nvidia FX5200 128MB into an old Pentium3 1GHz 100FSB slot 1 CPU worked fine together. That's an AGPx8 card and the motherboard was ms6119 AGPx2 board.

Even Ran Rome total wars on it.


I've found only this one till now:

nVIDIA GeForce 6800XT 6800 256MB AGP 4x/8x Graphic Card.

Guys what will be your suggestion? Has anyone brought this card or know the cards performance? I mean with the P-III MOBO :sleep: 
January 5, 2009 12:23:39 AM

AGP: go for NVidia chip. ATI has many problems to support AGP bus since Catalyst 7.8.
6800XT: not a bad choice.
January 5, 2009 2:14:06 AM

Not sure, but I used to work in Tualitin, OR. Intel is only a few miles away.
January 5, 2009 6:20:09 AM

Uhm.....is the guy thinking of gaming , decoding HD video, multi monitor or just an display card for the desktop. If gaming is his plan forget about a graphic card upgrade. Choose a x1××× card or higher for decoding video and finally any cheap card with dvi and vga will suit you well for multi monitors.
January 5, 2009 12:40:17 PM

zigonneux said:
AGP: go for NVidia chip. ATI has many problems to support AGP bus since Catalyst 7.8.
6800XT: not a bad choice.


Alright, thank you for ack'ing it but do you have any other cards in your mind so that I can specifically search for? I mean specific model number(s).
January 5, 2009 12:45:20 PM

cyber_jockey said:
Uhm.....is the guy thinking of gaming , decoding HD video, multi monitor or just an display card for the desktop. If gaming is his plan forget about a graphic card upgrade. Choose a x1××× card or higher for decoding video and finally any cheap card with dvi and vga will suit you well for multi monitors.



My mom won't play games so that AGP card is not meant for high performance results. Idea is, me gonna buy a Samsung 19" LCD Monitor. So, obviously on that P-III machine it's better to have an AGP card. Isn't it? So, it's mostly for display to support high resolutions of that 19" monitor. Also AGP cards come with LCD/TV out support too. What's your suggestion like? Any specific card which you can recommend for this requirement with only AGP 4x pipeline?
January 19, 2009 11:51:37 PM

I'm using a PIII 1.4g,Celeron PIII 1.4g, and a dual processor PIII 1.4g.The Celeron 1.4g is on asus tuv4x and is using a Radeon (Ati) 9550 256mb, benchmarked at 35 fps and the PIII 1.4g is on a gigabyte 6vtxe and is using a Radeon 9550gt 128mb, benchmarked at 41 fps. I tried to use Radeon x1300 256mb but I encountered issues and crashes although it benchmarked 51 fps on both flatforms (btw, the gt and the standard radeons benchmarked the same either on a slower celeron or a faster pentium. I was not able to use an agp card on my dual processor since it has no agp slot but I was lucky enough to buy a 128 mb Sparkle 6200, which benchmarked at 21 fps on an Intel Sai2 server board). I'm using a 22" Acer lcd monitor which has dual inputs so I can switch between computers as my usage demand.
What I'm trying to say is there is no reason to upgrade unless you are into video editing or you are into gaming. Since upgrading to Lga 775 would also mean upgrading your rams and processor; I would not even consider an lga based on a lower than than core2 or quad core series since the earlier socket 478's, X2's ,939's are and lga 775's are such an energy suckers and would be very impractical for normal office work and normal home use (unless you are a gamer, video editor, or just a show off).
The old PIII's (Tualatin based)more than do their jobs and are very energy efficient. True it would be much cheaper then to upgrade to pci-e and ddr2 or to higher 512 agp's with their respective motherboards and processors, nut it would be much costlier in the long run to maintain them since they are power hungry. Compare the 9550's power consumption of less than 30w against the power consumption of the 512mb Gts or the x3800's, these video cards consume more power than the motherboard and processors combined! And if you are just going to watch downloaded videos, office, powerpoint, excell and surfing with a 200 to 600w power consumption, which a 100w power consumption or less ith the old PIII's!
Ever wonder why power supplies nowadays are in the range of 500w or more? So much for energy efficiency!
The only performance/efficent systems are those based on the "E" series of Pentiums, but again if you are just going to use them for normal office work or just plain surfing? Imagine running 100 units using 200w system against 100 units using 100w each system for the same workload, multiply that for at least 8 hrs a day and 251 days a year over a period of 3 - 5 years.
That is the reason it is not cost efficient to upgrade if do not really need the upgrade. As long as you can still find spare parts for your old rig and you really know what and where to look (I just bought my agp's last December brand new at a very low price since they were on sale since many are into the pci-e bandwagon), keep on using them. Help save the planet earth. enjoy.
January 20, 2009 1:45:42 AM

I've read both your forums and I feel you. Good Luck, my man :p 
January 20, 2009 3:41:35 PM

I'm sure eBay has an old Radeon 7000 or 9000 card floating around.
!