Rain Fade

Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

I moved from DirecTV to Dish and the rain fade seems worse with Dish. What
can I do to get a better signal?
I have heard I can get a larger dish and that would help. Anyone know a
model number or link to a better dish? EBay have this dish?
Would I have to have a new dish aligned again?
Thanks for any help.
46 answers Last reply
More about rain fade
  1. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    Emil wrote:
    >
    > I moved from DirecTV to Dish and the rain fade seems worse with Dish. What
    > can I do to get a better signal?
    > I have heard I can get a larger dish and that would help. Anyone know a
    > model number or link to a better dish? EBay have this dish?
    > Would I have to have a new dish aligned again?

    Don't know about the part number or type, but you would most obviously
    have to re-aim the dish.
  2. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    You can find a old primestar dish, which is bigger and put your DTV Lnb's on
    it and will get better performance. They can be found for free. Drive around
    and look for one in somebody's yard. There no good anymore, primestar is no
    more.

    "AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message news:40BC927B.17C1E967@your.net...
    > Emil wrote:
    > >
    > > I moved from DirecTV to Dish and the rain fade seems worse with Dish.
    What
    > > can I do to get a better signal?
    > > I have heard I can get a larger dish and that would help. Anyone know a
    > > model number or link to a better dish? EBay have this dish?
    > > Would I have to have a new dish aligned again?
    >
    > Don't know about the part number or type, but you would most obviously
    > have to re-aim the dish.
  3. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    Perfect 10 in Little Rock, Arkansas sells DBS antennas up to 4 ft. in
    diameter. The bad news is you have to purchase one through a dealer, which they
    probably will provide.


    JustMe wrote:

    > You can find a old primestar dish, which is bigger and put your DTV Lnb's on
    > it and will get better performance. They can be found for free. Drive around
    > and look for one in somebody's yard. There no good anymore, primestar is no
    > more.
    >
    > "AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message news:40BC927B.17C1E967@your.net...
    > > Emil wrote:
    > > >
    > > > I moved from DirecTV to Dish and the rain fade seems worse with Dish.
    > What
    > > > can I do to get a better signal?
    > > > I have heard I can get a larger dish and that would help. Anyone know a
    > > > model number or link to a better dish? EBay have this dish?
    > > > Would I have to have a new dish aligned again?
    > >
    > > Don't know about the part number or type, but you would most obviously
    > > have to re-aim the dish.

    --
  4. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "Emil" <e_lucaREMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:5B%uc.5070$pO7.1419@newssvr32.news.prodigy.com...
    | I moved from DirecTV to Dish and the rain fade seems worse with Dish. What
    | can I do to get a better signal?
    | I have heard I can get a larger dish and that would help. Anyone know a
    | model number or link to a better dish? EBay have this dish?
    | Would I have to have a new dish aligned again?
    | Thanks for any help.
    |
    It's an unpleasant job, but when we had these little dishes start to break up
    during rainstorms, I had good success just walking out and wiping of the dish
    and lnb's.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  5. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    CWCunningham wrote:

    > It's an unpleasant job, but when we had these little dishes start to break up
    > during rainstorms, I had good success just walking out and wiping of the dish
    > and lnb's.

    BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!

    That's funny stuff, CW!
    You should be a "comic writer" for Letterman or Leno!
  6. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:40FC53BC.7D11601F@your.net...
    | CWCunningham wrote:
    |
    | > It's an unpleasant job, but when we had these little dishes start to break
    up
    | > during rainstorms, I had good success just walking out and wiping of the
    dish
    | > and lnb's.
    |
    | BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!
    |
    | That's funny stuff, CW!
    | You should be a "comic writer" for Letterman or Leno!
    |
    Yes I should, and yet it works anyway.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  7. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 20:13:11 -0600, "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net>
    wrote:

    >"KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    >news:40FC53BC.7D11601F@your.net...
    >| CWCunningham wrote:
    >|
    >| > It's an unpleasant job, but when we had these little dishes start to break
    >up
    >| > during rainstorms, I had good success just walking out and wiping of the
    >dish
    >| > and lnb's.
    >|
    >| BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!
    >|
    >| That's funny stuff, CW!
    >| You should be a "comic writer" for Letterman or Leno!
    >|
    >Yes I should, and yet it works anyway.
    Actually cleaning the big parabolic reflectors used
    in radar and space transmissions is a very important
    task, not for rain fade but to ensure integrity of the
    signal.
  8. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    Irwell wrote:
    >
    > On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 20:13:11 -0600, "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net>
    > wrote:
    >
    > >"KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    > >news:40FC53BC.7D11601F@your.net...
    > >| CWCunningham wrote:
    > >|
    > >| > It's an unpleasant job, but when we had these little dishes start to break
    > >up
    > >| > during rainstorms, I had good success just walking out and wiping of the
    > >dish
    > >| > and lnb's.
    > >|
    > >| BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!
    > >|
    > >| That's funny stuff, CW!
    > >| You should be a "comic writer" for Letterman or Leno!
    > >|
    > >Yes I should, and yet it works anyway.
    > Actually cleaning the big parabolic reflectors used
    > in radar and space transmissions is a very important
    > task, not for rain fade but to ensure integrity of the
    > signal.

    Wiping the water off a dish WHILE it's raining doesn't do a damned
    thing, as THAT is not what is causing the "fade."

    It's what's in the ATMOSPHERE between the satellite and the dish that
    causes it.
    Cleaning the dish of built up SNOW on the other hand....

    CW's story is too funny!
  9. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 18:20:39 GMT, KF/AKA AH#49 <AH#49@your.net> wrote:

    >Irwell wrote:
    >>
    >> On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 20:13:11 -0600, "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >> >"KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    >> >news:40FC53BC.7D11601F@your.net...
    >> >| CWCunningham wrote:
    >> >|
    >> >| > It's an unpleasant job, but when we had these little dishes start to break
    >> >up
    >> >| > during rainstorms, I had good success just walking out and wiping of the
    >> >dish
    >> >| > and lnb's.
    >> >|
    >> >| BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!
    >> >|
    >> >| That's funny stuff, CW!
    >> >| You should be a "comic writer" for Letterman or Leno!
    >> >|
    >> >Yes I should, and yet it works anyway.
    >> Actually cleaning the big parabolic reflectors used
    >> in radar and space transmissions is a very important
    >> task, not for rain fade but to ensure integrity of the
    >> signal.
    >
    >Wiping the water off a dish WHILE it's raining doesn't do a damned
    >thing, as THAT is not what is causing the "fade."
    >
    >It's what's in the ATMOSPHERE between the satellite and the dish that
    >causes it.
    > Cleaning the dish of built up SNOW on the other hand....
    >
    >CW's story is too funny!
    The snow build up could do two things,
    attenuate the signal and possible distortion
    of reflector and mis-aiming.
  10. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:40FD635D.DA2C6D9@your.net...
    | Wiping the water off a dish WHILE it's raining doesn't do a damned
    | thing, as THAT is not what is causing the "fade."
    |
    I would have never questioned that you knew what you were talking about, but if
    you believe what you've just said, then you've got at least one thing to learn,
    and you're showing a tenacious inablity to do so.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  11. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    Irwell wrote:
    >
    > On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 18:20:39 GMT, KF/AKA AH#49 <AH#49@your.net> wrote:

    > >CW's story is too funny!

    > The snow build up could do two things,
    > attenuate the signal and possible distortion
    > of reflector and mis-aiming.

    Indeed. In the winter, I've had to clear the snow off of them many a
    time.
    That includes my DISH , DirecTV, AND the 36" dishes we have for our
    international channels, which are really a lot more prone to signal
    loss.
  12. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 15:16:41 GMT, KF/AKA AH#49 <AH#49@your.net> wrote:

    >Irwell wrote:
    >>
    >> On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 18:20:39 GMT, KF/AKA AH#49 <AH#49@your.net> wrote:
    >
    >> >CW's story is too funny!
    >
    >> The snow build up could do two things,
    >> attenuate the signal and possible distortion
    >> of reflector and mis-aiming.
    >
    >Indeed. In the winter, I've had to clear the snow off of them many a
    >time.
    > That includes my DISH , DirecTV, AND the 36" dishes we have for our
    >international channels, which are really a lot more prone to signal
    >loss.
    I find the reverse to be true, my Directv and BEV small dishes
    are sensitive to rain fade whereas the 10 foot Orbitron will still
    handle the Ku and C Band signals under the same condtions,
    including looking at Panam 9 which is at a look angle of 10 degrees
    here in NW.California. The MPEG/DBS and 4dtv
    signals get through with no tiling or break up.
  13. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    CWCunningham wrote:
    >
    > "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    > news:40FD635D.DA2C6D9@your.net...
    > | Wiping the water off a dish WHILE it's raining doesn't do a damned
    > | thing, as THAT is not what is causing the "fade."


    > I would have never questioned that you knew what you were talking about, but if
    > you believe what you've just said, then you've got at least one thing to learn,
    > and you're showing a tenacious inablity to do so.

    Yeah, I've only been installing professionally for 6 years and have 6
    dishes at my own home, where it rains A LOT!

    What do you do? Stand out there with a squeegee _while_ it's raining?
    I noticed that you snipped the rest of the post that explains what rain
    fade IS caused by.
    Why is that?

    Hell's bells, boy blunder!
    I have had "rain caused fade" when it wasn't even raining yet on my
    property, due to the severity of storm fronts in the south coming
    closer.
  14. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:40FE8B5A.6BB68BA@your.net...
    | CWCunningham wrote:
    | >
    | > "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    | > news:40FD635D.DA2C6D9@your.net...
    | > | Wiping the water off a dish WHILE it's raining doesn't do a damned
    | > | thing, as THAT is not what is causing the "fade."
    |
    I'm sure a few db's here or there make no difference.

    |
    | > I would have never questioned that you knew what you were talking about, but
    if
    | > you believe what you've just said, then you've got at least one thing to
    learn,
    | > and you're showing a tenacious inablity to do so.
    |
    | Yeah, I've only been installing professionally for 6 years and have 6
    | dishes at my own home, where it rains A LOT!
    |
    So it's not that you can't learn, it's just that you finished learning sometime
    back.

    | What do you do? Stand out there with a squeegee
    |
    I've had great success with a simple paper towel, I just left it on the porch on
    my way in, and re-used it whenever necessary.

    | _while_ it's raining?
    |
    You're the experienced installer ... should I have waited for better weather?

    | I noticed that you snipped the rest of the post that explains what rain
    | fade IS caused by.
    | Why is that?
    |
    Because it was irrelevant to what I was saying. I encourage you to go back and
    re-read anything you've said that you find pleasing.

    | Hell's bells, boy blunder!
    | I have had "rain caused fade" when it wasn't even raining yet on my
    | property, due to the severity of storm fronts in the south coming
    | closer.
    |
    Hmmmm, maybe a few db's can make all the difference in the world.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  15. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:40FFC097.1C9E0560@your.net...
    | CWCunningham wrote:
    | > What about this simple concept is impossible? ... I suggest it's your
    ability to
    | > grasp simple concepts.
    |
    | So let me see.
    | You wipe the rain off, get a few more db's, and the rain, which is
    | still falling, doesn't accumulate on the dish anymore?
    | BWAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA!
    |
    Windshield wipers don't prevent rain from falling, but they sure improve line of
    sight ... but I'll bet you never use them *while* it's raining.

    I wish you were worth my time, but do me a favor, act like an idiot one more
    time, there are people here who claim it's impossible to make an idiot spew
    drivel like a puppet on a string.

    | > And just so you don't feel slighted about the stuff that was snipped away,
    it
    | > all appears below.
    |
    | I already know what I wrote.
    |
    Good, just remember to blink occasionally.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================

    |
    | >
    | > | > Are you back pedalling?
    | > |
    | > | Not at all!
    | > | I'm addressing each and very issue, while YOU snip my posts, and refuse
    | > | to account for what you say, that I have proved you wrong at!!
    | > |
    | > Each AND *very* ... *BOTH*. Refuse to *Account*??? What about wiping rain
    off a
    | > dish requires an accounting? Refuse to account? Proved me wrong at? Snipped
    your
    | > posts? What the hell are you talking about? Do you have a point?
    |
    |
    | Yes, that yer a complete and utter fool.
    |
    | >
    | > | It's NOT POSSIBLE to clear the rain off a dish while it is still
    | > | raining!
    | > |
    | > And yet (most) anybody can do it easily.
    |
    | The existing rain that somehow sticks to your dish, maybe, only to be
    | IMMEDIATELY replaced with more rain!
    |
    | What? is yer dish pointed straight up?
    |
    |
    | >
    | > | Yet, you say that you do that with a wet paper towel that you keep
    | > | outside!
    | > |
    | > Zo zimple eh?
    |
    | Impossible.
    |
    | >
    | > | > Please don't bother to respond,
    | > |
    | > | Oh, but I must!
    | > | People have to know just how moronic you truly are!
    | > |
    | > So let's recap:
    | > You say it's the rain in the signal path that causes losses,
    |
    | Correct.
    |
    |
    | > I say the dish is in the signal path, and actually concentrates easily
    removed
    | > raindrops directly in the signal path.
    |
    | That's why yer insane.
    |
    | > You say removing raindrops from the dish will make no difference,
    |
    | While it's still raining, of course!
    | It's counter productive.
    |
    | > I say it makes a very measurable difference.
    |
    | I say you hallucinate a lot!
    |
    | > You say that you've spent 6 years in a deadend job.
    |
    | Five to six hundred bucks a day is a dead end job?
    | Hmm. Must be why I'm retired, and all the homes and cars and bikes are
    | fully owned by me after paying cash.
    |
    |
    | > I say I'm not suprised.
    |
    | Well, not everyone can have the glory of flipping burgers like you.
    |
    | > You think insulting potential customers makes you appear smarter.
    |
    | Yer not a customer, yer a moron that doesn't know what yer talking
    | about.
    |
    | > Given your apparent IQ, I think insulting potential customers may be your
    only
    | > chance at appearing smarter.
    |
    | I haven't insulted any "potential customer", and I never tell lies or
    | give bad advice, like you do.
    |
    |
    | > You say you must respond to show how moronic I truly am,
    |
    | That is true, and I proved it!
    |
    |
    | > I say I must respond since I'm enjoying watching you show how moronic you
    aspire
    | > to be
    |
    | Yet, yer the only person trying to remove rain with a soaking wet dish
    | WHILE it's raining, and claims to get "several db's" of added gain!
    |
    | BWAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA!
    |
    |
  16. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:


    > And just so you don't feel slighted about the stuff that was snipped away,
    > it all appears below.
    >

    Mind if I interrupt your pissing match with a question? Have you thought of
    applying a wax or other water repellant to the dish to make the water run
    off? Maybe RainX?

    As for the question whether rain on the dish affects signal strength and
    whether wax etc. helps, just perform a simple experiment:

    1. On a clear day, read signal strength
    2. Spray dish with water
    3. Read signal strength with wet dish
    4. Allow dish to dry
    5. Apply RainX and let dry
    6. Spray dish with water
    7. Read signal strength

    Frankly, I don't think enough moisture could accumulate on the dish to
    attenuate the signal measurably if measuring using the signal strength
    meter, but I haven't done the experiment.
  17. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "10Squared" <jm@10squaredcorp.com> wrote in message
    news:mkNLc.6443$yF.2454@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
    | Mind if I interrupt your pissing match with a question? Have you thought of
    | applying a wax or other water repellant to the dish to make the water run
    | off? Maybe RainX?
    |
    I had seriously considered RainX, but I'll never know if it would have worked
    since we dropped our subscription last month. I just removed the last of those
    little dishes yesterday to make room for another 10' dish. Now snow will be the
    only issue.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  18. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    10Squared wrote:
    >
    > "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:
    >
    > > And just so you don't feel slighted about the stuff that was snipped away,
    > > it all appears below.
    > >
    >
    > Mind if I interrupt your pissing match with a question? Have you thought of
    > applying a wax or other water repellant to the dish to make the water run
    > off? Maybe RainX?
    >
    > As for the question whether rain on the dish affects signal strength and
    > whether wax etc. helps, just perform a simple experiment:

    The accumulation of water on these dishes will NOT do a damned thing
    regarding reception.
    Also, anything that would make the dish "shiny" is not really a good
    thing, as that will reflect more unwanted heat into the LNB's.
  19. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    KF/AKA AH#49 wrote:

    > 10Squared wrote:
    >>
    >> "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:
    >>
    >> > And just so you don't feel slighted about the stuff that was snipped
    >> > away, it all appears below.
    >> >
    >>
    >> Mind if I interrupt your pissing match with a question? Have you thought
    >> of applying a wax or other water repellant to the dish to make the water
    >> run off? Maybe RainX?
    >>
    >> As for the question whether rain on the dish affects signal strength and
    >> whether wax etc. helps, just perform a simple experiment:
    >
    > The accumulation of water on these dishes will NOT do a damned thing
    > regarding reception.
    > Also, anything that would make the dish "shiny" is not really a good
    > thing, as that will reflect more unwanted heat into the LNB's.

    Well, looks like you win. I happened to have the ladder set up by my dish so
    I went out and sprayed it with water. Here are the results:

    Dry (before): Range 91-95, peak at 95
    Wet: Range 90-96, peak at 96
    Dry (after): Range 92-100, peak at 100

    So, no real measurable difference wet or dry, fluctuations are around the
    same approximate point and there is certainly no multi-dB loss due to
    moisture.

    Interesting point re making the dish shiny, although the paint on mine is so
    flat from weathering I don't thing RainX could have made it shiny, just
    less likely to wet.
  20. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    10Squared wrote:

    > Well, looks like you win. I happened to have the ladder set up by my dish so
    > I went out and sprayed it with water. Here are the results:
    >
    > Dry (before): Range 91-95, peak at 95
    > Wet: Range 90-96, peak at 96
    > Dry (after): Range 92-100, peak at 100


    Thank you but, this is not a matter of "who wins" or "who looses", as
    the only thing that matters is what does common sense tell one!


    > So, no real measurable difference wet or dry, fluctuations are around the
    > same approximate point and there is certainly no multi-dB loss due to
    > moisture.

    Notice the fluxuation...PERIOD!
    I can't help but believe that "CW" also noticed the same ones while he
    was hopelessly wiping off a wet dish, only to have it keep getting the
    same wetness, ....but the CLOUD COVER moved while his measurements were
    taken! :>
    Clouds have a tendancy to do dat!


    He will NEVER simply understand that simple factor, but will continue
    to say and believe otherwise!
    (sigh)


    > Interesting point re making the dish shiny, although the paint on mine is so
    > flat from weathering I don't thing RainX could have made it shiny, just
    > less likely to wet.


    True!
    The finish used on some dishes can indeed oxidize so VERY bad, where
    the coating becomes "chalky" at best, to starting to rust at worst.

    A VERY mild soap and water solution with a rinse of clean water every
    now and then will CLEANSE the dish, so that the goop and dust that does
    accumulate will NOT degrade the OEM finish.

    I have also been a highly successful auto-body Professional for 27
    years, so I know about paints and coatings as well!
  21. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:41000717.8BBEA010@your.net...
    | Thank you but, this is not a matter of "who wins" or "who looses", as
    | the only thing that matters is what does common sense tell one!
    |
    "Looses" Yes ladies and gentlemen, he does all the spelling himself.

    | "fluxuation"
    Spelled by a professional dish installer.

    Clearing the rain off my dish is just a simple concept that has proven itself
    many times in practice. My only remaining interest in this conversation is
    watching an idiot entertain the multitudes.

    You should rest now, there could be a discussion of tractor pull rules tomorrow,
    and you don't want to forget your all important blinking excercises.


    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  22. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    CWCunningham the desperate idiot wrote:

    Nothing!

    So I offer:
    http://www.kcdiy.com/ShopSpec.htm
    ...for all your sat-wiping needs!
  23. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:41002E7D.A0F3B70B@your.net...
    | CWCunningham the desperate idiot wrote:
    |
    | Nothing!
    |
    | So I offer:
    | http://www.kcdiy.com/ShopSpec.htm
    | ...for all your sat-wiping needs!
    Twitch-o-rama
    Do it again, do it again.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  24. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:

    > "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    > news:41000717.8BBEA010@your.net...
    > | Thank you but, this is not a matter of "who wins" or "who looses", as
    > | the only thing that matters is what does common sense tell one!
    > |
    > "Looses" Yes ladies and gentlemen, he does all the spelling himself.

    That's actually an accepted alternative spelling for loses. But, BFD.
    Spelling comments on Usenet are the last bastion of the person losing an
    argument.

    >
    > | "fluxuation"
    > Spelled by a professional dish installer.
    >
    > Clearing the rain off my dish is just a simple concept that has proven
    > itself many times in practice. My only remaining interest in this
    > conversation is watching an idiot entertain the multitudes.

    You need to perform the experiment on a clear day in order to ascertain
    whether you are needlessly exposing yourself to injury, sickness, and death
    by lightning. You would be sorely missed on Usenet. Really.
  25. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    10Squared wrote:
    >
    > "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:
    >
    > > "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    > > news:41000717.8BBEA010@your.net...
    > > | Thank you but, this is not a matter of "who wins" or "who looses", as
    > > | the only thing that matters is what does common sense tell one!
    > > |
    > > "Looses" Yes ladies and gentlemen, he does all the spelling himself.
    >
    > That's actually an accepted alternative spelling for loses. But, BFD.
    > Spelling comments on Usenet are the last bastion of the person losing an
    > argument.

    That's all he has in his arsenal.
  26. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "10Squared" <jm@10squaredcorp.com> wrote in message
    news:S18Mc.18155$yF.15482@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
    | "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:
    |
    | > "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    | > news:41000717.8BBEA010@your.net...
    | > | Thank you but, this is not a matter of "who wins" or "who looses", as
    | > | the only thing that matters is what does common sense tell one!
    | > |
    | > "Looses" Yes ladies and gentlemen, he does all the spelling himself.
    |
    | That's actually an accepted alternative spelling for loses. But, BFD.
    | Spelling comments on Usenet are the last bastion of the person losing an
    | argument.
    |

    Ah, but I haven't lost any argument. It's like arguing over the result of adding
    2 and 2, the facts remain the facts. There's no argument that will change a
    fact, and there's nothing a collection of agreeing authorities can do about
    that, ask the Catholic church how successful they were at making earth the
    center of the universe ... it just doesn't work.

    #49 decided early on that acting rude would make him sound credible, and many
    people may believe his version, but it has no bearing on the facts. If he wants
    to bring that kind of weak stuff to a battle of wits, I can play along. Pointing
    out his spelling errors is all about playing his personal ridicule game, at
    least I haven't been as rude as he, but then I'm not the one trying to prove
    something.

    Looses is a word, but in that context, it's as poorly spelled as fluxuation. If
    I win, does that mean he loose?

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  27. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    CWCunningham the "brain faded" wrote:
    >
    > "10Squared" <jm@10squaredcorp.com> wrote in message
    > news:S18Mc.18155$yF.15482@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
    > | "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:
    > |
    > | > "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    > | > news:41000717.8BBEA010@your.net...
    > | > | Thank you but, this is not a matter of "who wins" or "who looses", as
    > | > | the only thing that matters is what does common sense tell one!
    > | > |
    > | > "Looses" Yes ladies and gentlemen, he does all the spelling himself.
    > |
    > | That's actually an accepted alternative spelling for loses. But, BFD.
    > | Spelling comments on Usenet are the last bastion of the person losing an
    > | argument.
    > |
    >
    > Ah, but I haven't lost any argument. It's like arguing over the result of adding
    > 2 and 2, the facts remain the facts.

    And the facts are in!
    You are constantly and consistently wrong!
    I have the laws of physics to back me up, after all.

    Also, (heh heh) You HAVE lost all rational arguments, all future
    credibility, and possibly any female company that you might have had or
    will eventually have, that reads your stump silly stupid posts! :/


    That's why you had to resort to "spelling lames" instead of the real
    facts regarding satellite reception and rain fade.


    That's why NOBODY has come to your rescue in regards to being able to
    keep a dish dry WHILE IT IS RAINING.... WITH A WET PAPER TOWEL!

    I do admire yer tenacity though, even though all that you think is all
    wrong.

    I bet that when you get your 10 foot MESH dish, you will be out there
    trying to "wipe it down" so as to eliminate the "EVIL RAIN DROPS" each
    and every time it rains!

    Now then, speaking about the dead end jobs you mentioned;

    Do you think you will be able to flip a decent burger safely the next
    time I'm in your neck of the woods, or are you still washing the
    latrines at the local JCPENNY food courts?
  28. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    CWCunningham wrote:
    >
    > "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote:

    > | I do admire yer tenacity though, even though all that you think is all
    > wrong.


    BWAAAAAAAHAHAHAHHAAAAAAAA!!!

    "I, CWCunningham, can wipe a dish off with a wet paper towel WHILE IT'S
    RAINING, AND get MORE DB's in measurable signal strength!"
    --CWCunningham--

    What does that "CW" stand for?
    The two kinds of music you listen to?

    Country AND Western?
  29. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:410183CD.E58E7D4C@your.net...
    | What does that "CW" stand for?
    | The two kinds of music you listen to?
    |
    | Country AND Western?
    |
    Resorting to ad-hominem attacks is the first sign that you're losing an argument
    one usenet. Have you got nothing at all? Please bring it on, anything, or are
    you nothing but weak!

    | "I, CWCunningham, can wipe a dish off with a wet paper towel WHILE IT'S
    | RAINING, AND get MORE DB's in measurable signal strength!"
    | --CWCunningham--
    |
    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  30. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    CWCunningham wrote:

    >
    > | "I, CWCunningham, can wipe a dish off with a wet paper towel WHILE IT'S
    > | RAINING, AND get MORE DB's in measurable signal strength!"
    > | --CWCunningham--
  31. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:410199F9.9991A9AF@your.net...
    | CWCunningham wrote:
    |
    | >
    | > | "I, CWCunningham, can wipe a dish off with a wet paper towel WHILE IT'S
    | > | RAINING, AND get MORE DB's in measurable signal strength!"
    | > | --CWCunningham--
    So that's it, you've literally got nothing? No mathematical proof, no laws of
    physics, no response. Nothing? Just your fervent bilief that you're right
    despite evidence to the contrary?

    You've got nothing?

    I, CWCunningham, have succesfully added db's to my signal strength with a mere
    paper towel during a rainstorm, and you can do it too. Anyone with a modicum of
    intelligence can do it. Just read my first post in this thread to see how simple
    it is.

    But please Mr. twitch, do that dance again. It's so .... <and fill in this blank
    here ... it must be your turn>
    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  32. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    CWCunningham wrote:

    "I, CWCunningham, can wipe a dish off with a wet paper towel WHILE
    IT'S
    RAINING, AND get MORE DB's in measurable signal strength!"
    --CWCunningham--
  33. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    And so you've learned something, wasn't so tough eh?

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  34. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    CWCunningham wrote:
    >
    > And so you've learned something, wasn't so tough eh?

    It was easy to see that yer a bloody idiot that believes in the
    impossible.
  35. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:41026933.9E78838E@your.net...
    | CWCunningham wrote:
    | >
    | > And so you've learned something, wasn't so tough eh?
    |
    | It was easy to see that yer a bloody idiot that believes in the
    | impossible.
    |
    Do the dance monkey boy, do the dance.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  36. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    KF/AKA AH#49 wrote:

    > WhyMe wrote:
    >>
    >> http://www.spacecom.com/customer_tools/html/body_rain_fade.htm
    >
    > Only in the atmosphere, like I said!
    > But even THEIR "description" is misleading, as it mentions "rain
    > drops", as rain doesn't become "droplets" until the WATER VAPOR in the
    > clouds coagulates into them, heavy enough to fall!

    Clouds form when water vapor encounters temperatures at or below the dew
    point. So the water in clouds is condensed water or ice, not water vapor.
    The problem with CW's theory is that the signal attenuation is dependent on
    the distance it travels through the medium causing the attenuation. Clouds
    have finely dispersed droplets so the total distance through an attenuating
    medium is small, and water on a dish is too thin to cause significant
    attenuation. In heavy rain the total distance through the attenuating
    medium may become significant enough to degrade the signal.
  37. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    On Sat, 24 Jul 2004 22:52:33 +0100, 10Squared <jm@10squaredcorp.com> wrote:

    >KF/AKA AH#49 wrote:
    >
    >> WhyMe wrote:
    >>>
    >>> http://www.spacecom.com/customer_tools/html/body_rain_fade.htm
    >>
    >> Only in the atmosphere, like I said!
    >> But even THEIR "description" is misleading, as it mentions "rain
    >> drops", as rain doesn't become "droplets" until the WATER VAPOR in the
    >> clouds coagulates into them, heavy enough to fall!
    >
    >Clouds form when water vapor encounters temperatures at or below the dew
    >point. So the water in clouds is condensed water or ice, not water vapor.
    >The problem with CW's theory is that the signal attenuation is dependent on
    >the distance it travels through the medium causing the attenuation. Clouds
    >have finely dispersed droplets so the total distance through an attenuating
    >medium is small, and water on a dish is too thin to cause significant
    >attenuation. In heavy rain the total distance through the attenuating
    >medium may become significant enough to degrade the signal.
    >
    >
    Frequency and wavelength also come into play.
    Ku at around 12ghz is more prone than C Band
    at around 4ghz.
  38. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    10Squared wrote:
    >
    > KF/AKA AH#49 wrote:
    >
    > > WhyMe wrote:
    > >>
    > >> http://www.spacecom.com/customer_tools/html/body_rain_fade.htm
    > >
    > > Only in the atmosphere, like I said!
    > > But even THEIR "description" is misleading, as it mentions "rain
    > > drops", as rain doesn't become "droplets" until the WATER VAPOR in the
    > > clouds coagulates into them, heavy enough to fall!
    >
    > Clouds form when water vapor encounters temperatures at or below the dew
    > point. So the water in clouds is condensed water or ice, not water vapor.
    > The problem with CW's theory is that the signal attenuation is dependent on
    > the distance it travels through the medium causing the attenuation. Clouds
    > have finely dispersed droplets so the total distance through an attenuating
    > medium is small, and water on a dish is too thin to cause significant
    > attenuation. In heavy rain the total distance through the attenuating
    > medium may become significant enough to degrade the signal.


    He really should get a Windshield/Dish wiper system!

    Perhaps he can use the one from his Yugo?
    :>
  39. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:4102E22B.75F12554@your.net...
    | He really should get a Windshield/Dish wiper system!
    |
    | Perhaps he can use the one from his Yugo?
    |
    The only problem with each counter theory, is that it fails to explain how
    removing standing water from the dish and lnb could fail to improve the signal
    path.

    Some of you are actually intelligent, so I'm sure you'll understand these simple
    facts:
    1) The signal at the lnb is as weak as it get's after having been attenuated by
    the atmosphere and your dish.
    2) Standing water on the dish attenuates the signal more than any water anywhere
    else in the signal path.
    3) There is nothing you can do about signal attenuation between your dish and
    the satellite, but you are in total control of any attenuation that occurs
    afterwards.

    And for the unintelligent, a few more facts.
    1) Dishes that experience rain fade are not separated from the atmosphere.
    2) Water does not congeal.
    3) Surface tension causes water to cling at all angles to gravity.
    4) If you can read, you will clearly see that I've never suggested that clouds
    aren't major contributors to rain fade.
    5) You can pretend it's impossible to improve your signal path, but you'll only
    be pretending, the rest of us will be enoying TV.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  40. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:

    > "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    > news:4102E22B.75F12554@your.net...
    > | He really should get a Windshield/Dish wiper system!
    > |
    > | Perhaps he can use the one from his Yugo?
    > |
    > The only problem with each counter theory, is that it fails to explain how
    > removing standing water from the dish and lnb could fail to improve the
    > signal path.

    Standing water? Where I am (and where I conducted my experiment) the dish is
    at such an angle that water could not stand, it would run off. If you have
    standing water then the satellite is near your zenith and you might indeed
    have more attenuation. If that were true, then the dish wiper system
    wouldn't work, you'd need the dish sump pump system. If by standing water
    you mean the dish surface is wet, you don't have sufficient amount of water
    to noticeably alter the signal strength.
  41. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    10Squared wrote:
    >
    > "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:
    >
    > > "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    > > news:4102E22B.75F12554@your.net...
    > > | He really should get a Windshield/Dish wiper system!
    > > |
    > > | Perhaps he can use the one from his Yugo?
    > > |
    > > The only problem with each counter theory, is that it fails to explain how
    > > removing standing water from the dish and lnb could fail to improve the
    > > signal path.
    >
    > Standing water? Where I am (and where I conducted my experiment) the dish is
    > at such an angle that water could not stand, it would run off.


    CW is a "Run off!" :>

    > If you have
    > standing water then the satellite is near your zenith and you might indeed
    > have more attenuation. If that were true, then the dish wiper system
    > wouldn't work, you'd need the dish sump pump system. If by standing water
    > you mean the dish surface is wet, you don't have sufficient amount of water
    > to noticeably alter the signal strength.


    It is to LAUGH LAUGH LAUGH _AT_ "CWCunningham" charlesw-at-blackfoot.net
    ....isn't it?

    Every time he posts, he says something more stump stupid that BURIES
    himself further in the virtual grave that he poetically dug!
    One has to wonder how that Boy Blunder will find people to rent a DITCH
    WITCH to fill the shallow grave he now lies in!

    It's a darn shame that the likes of his kind can't simply ADMIT to the
    errors of their ways, instead of perpetuating the loss and continuating
    the lies he tries to sell!
  42. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "10Squared" <jm@10squaredcorp.com> wrote in message
    news:%YUMc.285$Mp1.276@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
    | Standing water? Where I am (and where I conducted my experiment) the dish is
    | at such an angle that water could not stand, it would run off. If you have
    | standing water then the satellite is near your zenith and you might indeed
    | have more attenuation. If that were true, then the dish wiper system
    | wouldn't work, you'd need the dish sump pump system. If by standing water
    | you mean the dish surface is wet, you don't have sufficient amount of water
    | to noticeably alter the signal strength.
    |
    That's actually quite clever, mind if I use it in an upcoming animation?

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  43. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "KF/AKA AH#49" <AH#49@your.net> wrote in message
    news:41042CBF.E07183D@your.net...
    | It's a darn shame that the likes of his kind can't simply ADMIT to the
    | errors of their ways, instead of perpetuating the loss and continuating
    | the lies he tries to sell!
    |
    Still don't comprehend eh? Don't think about it too much, youre going to get
    there anyway.

    --
    CWC
    ============================
    It's not that nice guys finish last,
    They have a whole different notion
    where the finish line is.
    ============================
  44. Archived from groups: alt.satellite.tv (More info?)

    "CWCunningham" <charlesw-at-blackfoot.net> wrote:

    > "10Squared" <jm@10squaredcorp.com> wrote in message
    > news:%YUMc.285$Mp1.276@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
    > | Standing water? Where I am (and where I conducted my experiment) the
    > | dish is at such an angle that water could not stand, it would run off.
    > | If you have standing water then the satellite is near your zenith and
    > | you might indeed have more attenuation. If that were true, then the dish
    > | wiper system wouldn't work, you'd need the dish sump pump system. If by
    > | standing water you mean the dish surface is wet, you don't have
    > | sufficient amount of water to noticeably alter the signal strength.
    > |
    > That's actually quite clever, mind if I use it in an upcoming animation?
    >

    Be sure to post the URL. I'd like to see it.
  45. rain fade is caused by heavy rain blocking out part of signal, heavy wind can cause disk to move off signal then back on signal. The best way to stop this is get cable or a big dish satellite system $1500 to $3000. They are called BUD's or big ugly dishes. If you go this way the smallest dish you should buy is 10 feet, they have 7 and a half feet signal not as good. Check with your city to see if you need permit.
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