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The power of DX 11 Explained by Anandtech

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January 31, 2009 3:22:46 AM

Difference between Dx10 & Dx10.1 also much different..


a c 169 U Graphics card
January 31, 2009 7:33:18 AM

thnx for the link l1quid :) 
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January 31, 2009 9:42:36 AM

Quote:
Along with the pipeline changes, we see a whole host of new tweaks and adjustments. DirectX 11 is actually a strict superset of DirectX 10.1, meaning that all of those features are completely encapsulated in and unchanged by DirectX 11. This simple fact means that all DX11 hardware will include the changes required to be DX 10.1 compliant (which only AMD can claim at the moment). In addition to these tweaks, we also see these further extensions


just reminds me the reason nvidia didn't come out with a dx10.1 card, is they didn't have the tech to make a card the same as ATI and win, and its the reason why im going to hand the dx11 battle to ATI.


how many games released last year where still dx9
January 31, 2009 10:35:54 AM

Good another plus for me when choose the 4830 instead of a 9800gt.
January 31, 2009 10:51:31 AM

rangers said:
Quote:
Along with the pipeline changes, we see a whole host of new tweaks and adjustments. DirectX 11 is actually a strict superset of DirectX 10.1, meaning that all of those features are completely encapsulated in and unchanged by DirectX 11. This simple fact means that all DX11 hardware will include the changes required to be DX 10.1 compliant (which only AMD can claim at the moment). In addition to these tweaks, we also see these further extensions


just reminds me the reason nvidia didn't come out with a dx10.1 card, is they didn't have the tech to make a card the same as ATI and win.


Could you post your source information which explains in explicit detail as to how you came to this conclusion, i've still never seen an Nvidia press release that stated "we didn't make a dx10.1 card, because we knew we were too dumb to make one" ......? I mean for christ sake 1 Nvidia (or AMD for that matter) circuit engineer has probably more brainpower than half of the graphics and displays forum combined.

I guess as far as dx9 games goes, several major AAA titles that were dx9 only were Fallout 3 and Call of Duty World at War, i'm fairly certain Left 4 Dead was DX9 but I could be wrong there. I guess more to the point, there was a number of dx9 titles, some of which have the best gameplay of all 2008 titles and are the higher review rated, this is possibly because dx10 doesn't offer enough benefits over dx9 circa 2008 to adapt it, however times are now changing.

I think its likely that ATI will lead dx11 and Nvidia will reverse engineer their design to create their own dx11 product, however nothing is set in stone yet and AMD and Nvidia both are not financially healthy at the moment.
January 31, 2009 11:03:32 AM

I wish I could say this is exciting but in reality most games will still be mainly DX9 with a couple DX10/11 features thrown in on top for the next 2 years at least.
January 31, 2009 1:02:19 PM

Most games are still DX9 because most gamers are still on Windows XP. This might change when Windows 7 comes out, but right now developers don't have much reason to put DX 10 in their games.
a b U Graphics card
January 31, 2009 2:38:53 PM

If you want a little more detail go check out the p0werpoint presentations from Gamefest 2008, there's alot of info there, especially with regards to the limitations and benefits of older hardware and how to exploit the new features. There's like 3 or 4+ presentations on Tesselation under DX11 alone.

And this is where it was put pretty clearly, unlike some people thought in other threads, no the ATi tesselator will not work with DX11 specific Tesselation, and would need additional codepath support.

* - edited to break smart-link ad on 'powerp0int pres..' which might confuse people to thinking that it's the Gamefest stuff.
a b U Graphics card
January 31, 2009 2:56:55 PM

ovaltineplease said:

I guess as far as dx9 games goes, several major AAA titles that were dx9 only were Fallout 3 and Call of Duty World at War, i'm fairly certain Left 4 Dead was DX9 but I could be wrong there. I guess more to the point, there was a number of dx9 titles, some of which have the best gameplay of all 2008 titles and are the higher review rated, this is possibly because dx10 doesn't offer enough benefits over dx9 circa 2008 to adapt it, however times are now changing.


Either that or because they just were good gameplay which had nothing to do with them being DX9 SM2.0 or DX9 SM3.0 either, but if you think about it the game you list were built on old engines, which says more about the quality and longevity of the engine and the houses that use them than anything about DX9 or DX10 themselves.

I like playing Labyrinth and Crayon Physics on the iPod and Desktop, and probably spend more time playing them than any other game, neither of which would need more than 6.0 (you could move to DX8.1+ for Labrinth for realtime reflections), but it has nothing to do with their DX support or effects and says nothing about my appreciation of good effects.

The main thing about DX10 is that the most beneficial features were left on the cutting room floor due to nV, and then split in a separate iteration, delaying the most anticipated features (performance gains with visual improvements, not picking one or the other) until later. While ranger may have put it in a more red vs green fashion it is correct to say they couldn't do it because they didn't have the tech, just like ATi couldn't do SM3.0 initially and nV struggled with SM2.0 and couldn't do 8.1, it's simply that they were banking on certain features being more important to their architecture, not that people are smarter or better than their counterpart engineers. That M$ changed the goal-posts, just like they did for intel with Vista, just makes it harder to say what would or wouldn't have been. Their changes/choices for DX9/SM2.0 benefited ATi, their choices for DX10 benefited nV. Such is life.

Hopefully with a single implementation it will focus the developers. Also the compute shader support would be great, and should provide wider benefit than just tack-on gaming features long term, and development in other areas will come back to help game developers as well.
January 31, 2009 8:50:57 PM

It is allso guite possible that if the first DX10 version would have been like DX10.1 there would have been only one DX10 card maker for long time. If so, there would be even less games using DX10 features than today. The good part would have been that those parts would use todays DX10.1 features (maybe...)...

All in all the article is guite positive about DX11. Just hope that now both companies would support it. If one of them is left out, the adaptation can take a little bit longer...

Some comments in Anandtech talks about the thing that because the consoles are now mainly at level of dx9 features, it has been one reason of slow DX10 adaptation. Do you think that it will hinder allso DX11? Also does anyone has an idea if those "next generation" consoles support dx10 or dx11 features? On the other hand, todays consoles allready have some of that tessalation features in them though. Maybe it's one of those "earlier" features that got supported by game makers in the near future?
February 1, 2009 9:59:49 AM

DX10.1 - technechly this is directX 10 , service patch 1

Not directX11 for anyone mislead.

It like me saying counterstrike 1.6 (its still cs 1 just its been service patched to that level *6*)

For anyone looking in word wars about this game, yes its still updating today but through steam and not a main game sVpatch. Steam enhances there platform to enhance the game. Not the game that enhances steam ^^.
a b U Graphics card
February 1, 2009 10:20:58 AM

Having tessalation on conso;es already, and adding on thru DX10 to DX11, and having pretty much only the teesalator HW as being fixed, it should take off much better than DX10, as it needed Vista, which was new, and it was new as well, now Vista/W7 has been around for awhile, the SW will be much more friendlier to write/create, theres a historyu already with DX10 and consoles will need an update withing the next year or two, and should be in dev soon, so yeah, DX11 will take off much better, as also, the entire industry needs this, wants this, and Im talking from Asus to Intel, as its MT forwards looking, and thats where everyone is heading, and from my understanding, MT should work in a DX11 game regardless of HW, at least for the cpus, dont think the gpus will unless theyre DX11 compliant. Maybe Ape knows more on this
February 1, 2009 10:22:54 AM

DX10.1 Games include Stormrise, BattleForge, Cloud 9 etc.

FRom Wikipedia:
Direct3D 10.1 sets a few more image quality standards for graphics vendors, and gives developers more control over image quality. Features include bigger control over antialiasing (both multisampling and supersampling with per sample shading and application control over sample position) and more flexibilities to some of the existing features (cubemap arrays and independent blending modes). Direct3D 10.1 level hardware must support the following features:
Mandatory 32-bit floating point filtering.
Mandatory support for 4x anti-aliasing
Shader model 4.1
Direct3D 10.1 runtime can run on Direct3D 10.0 hardware, unlike Direct3D 10 which strictly required Direct3D 10-class hardware and driver interfaces, but new features will be supported exclusively by new hardware.
Though this was made mandatory only with Direct3D 10.1, all Direct3D 10 parts out there support at least 4x multisampling and 32-bit floating point filtering, so this is not a new feature per se, just a change in wording of the specification.
a b U Graphics card
February 1, 2009 10:36:48 AM

Tho, the difference to my understanding is, DX10, you dont get the optimisations in DX10.1 regarding AA. So, itll run on 4xAA, just take a higher performance hit in DX10 only vs DX10.1, as seen in a few titles when using DX10.1 and its HW
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