Tom's Hardware: Topic New Build Help? - UPDATED
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Hey folks, I'm getting ready for my first build and my budget is from $1000 to $1100. I'm not a huge gamer but I do play some games and would like to play newer stuff. I also use photoshop a good bit. My thing is that I want this one to last awhile and to be upgradable when it gets a little long in the tooth.
Here's what I'm looking at, and I would really appreciate some feedback, including possible upgrades that stay within budget.
Newegg Wishlist
This is a little over $900, but does not include a power supply. Can you suggest one? I was thinking in the neighborhood of 750W.
Message edited by blackwood on 03-03-2009 at 08:02:02 PM
You're off to a good start, but there are some changes that should be made.
First off, I'd ditch that slow Green HD and pick up this instead:
Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] wd6401aals $79.99
That HD is faster, has 140GB more capacity, and costs the same.
Next, you can do much better on the RAM. That RAM needs 2.1v to get 5-4-4-18 timings. This kit runs at the standard 1.8v and has tighter timings for less:
mushkin 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6820146731 $49.99
Just buy two of those kits if you want 8GB.
Are you sure you need two DVD burners? Even if you do, you'll want to ditch the IDE drive for the SATA model. The SATA model is even cheaper!
LG 22X DVD±R DVD Burner with LightScribe Black SATA Model GH22LS30 - OEM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6827136153 $23.99
If you really want two burners, you should get two different brands so that if one drive won't read a disk you can try the other one. I really like Samsung burners.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 2x&x=0&y=0
One of these PSU's would be great:
PC Power & Cooling S75CF 750W EPS12V SLI NVIDIA SLI Certified (Dual 8800 GTX and below) CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6817341011 $119.99 - $20 MIR
or
CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] -_-Product $114.99 - $25 MIR
Message edited by shortstuff_mt on 02-25-2009 at 05:58:32 PM
you dont need 8 gb of ram
Wow, thanks a lot for the in-depth post, shortstuff_mt.
HardDrive: I picked the one I did because it was not OEM. I know that the OEM stuff doesn't come with cables and such usually.. will I need those? I'm pretty noobish, obviously.
Memory: Thanks for the tip. Those are even cheaper.
DVD Burners: You know, you're probably right. I only picked two because that's what I've always had. When I think about it, I certainly don't need the other. I was also trying to avoid OEM here as well, though I certainly didn't mean to choose the IDE model. Oops.
Power Supply: Thanks! I chose the Corsair.
A couple more quick questions:
Would anyone recommend a different case or is that one pretty good?
Since I'm pretty new to building computers, would you guys recommend that I buy one of those anti-static wrist-straps? They're cheap.
Any other thoughts?
Looks like I'm going to have some extra room in the budget for a new back-lit keyboard.
Message edited by blackwood on 02-25-2009 at 07:07:40 PM
| Outlander_04 wrote : you dont need 8 gb of ram |
You're right, I really don't. I also don't need 750W power supply either right now. I wanted to get them however, because in a year or two, I might want to upgrade some things. The prices aren't bad and it can't hurt, right?
Message quoted 1 times
Message edited by blackwood on 02-25-2009 at 07:12:05 PM
Message edited by blackwood on 02-25-2009 at 07:12:05 PM
I'm with the OP on the 8GB of RAM. With the low prices, why not get it now before the prices go up? I've also been considering upgrading from 4GB to 8GB just due to the low prices, even though I don't "need" it right now.
You don't need to worry about the retail/OEM thing. Your motherboard will come with SATA cables and your case will come with screws and various parts.
I really like the Antec 300 case, I don't see any reason to pick something different. If you're looking for some alternate suggestions, this one's a pretty good deal:
COOLER MASTER RC-690-KKN1-GP Black SECC/ ABS ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6811119137 $79.99
| shortstuff_mt wrote : I'm with the OP on the 8GB of RAM. With the low prices, why not get it now before the prices go up? I've also been considering upgrading from 4GB to 8GB just due to the low prices, even though I don't "need" it right now.
|
Thanks. In that case, I'll stick with the Antec. Would you recommend that I pick up some extra fans? It looks like it has room for three more; one on the side and two up front. Any other accessories I might need?
Grab 2 of these for the Antec 300 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6835209006
These are the same fans as in the case, they are 2-ball bearings meaning they last longer, and have variable RPM, so you can set all the fans to a desired speed. I would just stick with the 2 front fans sucking in air, and the back and top fan pulling out air, this keeps negative pressure in the case and force it to draw in cool air from the side.
| Transmaniacon wrote : Grab 2 of these for the Antec 300 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6835209006 These are the same fans as in the case, they are 2-ball bearings meaning they last longer, and have variable RPM, so you can set all the fans to a desired speed. I would just stick with the 2 front fans sucking in air, and the back and top fan pulling out air, this keeps negative pressure in the case and force it to draw in cool air from the side. |
Thanks mang. Those have been added. Here is current wishlist:
Hows that look, folks?
Edit: I still have some cash left in the budget. Should I stay with the processor I have or upgrade to the Q9400?
Intel Core2 Quad Q9400 2.66GHz 6MB L2 Cache LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Processor - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6819115131
Message edited by blackwood on 02-26-2009 at 05:56:51 AM
| blackwood wrote : You're right, I really don't. I also don't need 750W power supply either right now. I wanted to get them however, because in a year or two, I might want to upgrade some things. The prices aren't bad and it can't hurt, right? |
Yes it can hurt . Some one published a link here a while back about relative performance between 4 and 8 gig of ram . The general consensus of the guy that wrote the article is that extra ram always helps , BUT in many games adding ram dropped frame rates slightly .
The biggest gains were in encoding and productivity apps and even then you didnt get much gain . Definitely not worth the money .
Have a look in task manager and see how much ram your computer uses . This is dependent on windows and the apps you use .
| Outlander_04 wrote : Yes it can hurt . Some one published a link here a while back about relative performance between 4 and 8 gig of ram . The general consensus of the guy that wrote the article is that extra ram always helps , BUT in many games adding ram dropped frame rates slightly .
|
That's interesting. I'd like to read that article.
The loss of frames was so small it was within the margin of error. I'd just get the 8GB now, especially if you will be doing any video editing with the machine. I often use 85%+ of my 4GB when doing video editing.
For the same price of your the Q6600 and the mobo you have you could get a Phenon II 940 and decent mobo. That Q6600 has been great for a long time, but the 940 would be a better pick for the money. Just a thought...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Comb [...] mbo.159867
Message edited by bossman34 on 02-26-2009 at 06:13:54 AM
| shortstuff_mt wrote : The loss of frames was so small it was within the margin of error. I'd just get the 8GB now, especially if you will be doing any video editing with the machine. I often use 85%+ of my 4GB when doing video editing. |
Yeah, honestly, I don't mind a slight decrease in framerates if it helps in other areas. I was thinking about getting into some video editing, and I do use photoshop quite a bit. So what do you think about the processor issue? Is it worth upgrading from the Q6600 to the Q9400 for around $30? I think I might be getting close to finalizing this thing.
I have a Q9400 and i love it. I have it stable at 3.0ghz on stock air with only changes to the FSB (idle temps @ 35, full load @ 51). I'm going to push it more when I get a better cooler. But, like i said, I would at least consider the 940...it's a nice cpu!
The Q6600 vs Q9400 is a tough one for me. The Q9400 has a 160MHz speed advantage, but it also has 2MB less L2 cache. Another thing is that the Q9400 is a 45nm chip so it will run cooler. I guess if the budget can stretch another $30, the Q9400 would probably be worth it. If you're already feeling like the budget is maxed out, you certainly don't have to feel bad about "settling" for the Q6600 since it's still a great chip.
Another thing I wanted to mention is that I actually prefer this RAM, but it was $59.99 earlier today. It's back down to its normal $49.99 now.
G.SKILL PI Black 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] lack%20800
I use the PI black in my personal rig as well as a few recent builds. I haven't been disappointed with it yet.
| bossman34 wrote : I have a Q9400 and i love it. I have it stable at 3.0ghz on stock air with only changes to the FSB (idle temps @ 35, full load @ 51). I'm going to push it more when I get a better cooler. But, like i said, I would at least consider the 940...it's a nice cpu! |
I'll probably stick with the Intel, since while I am not even close to being an expert on them, I am certainly more knowledgeable about them than I am with AMD. Also, I know AMD makes good stuff, but you are literally the first person to recommend one to me since I started planning this build. What's that all about? Seriously. I was just talking to a friend of mine who is an engineer at AMD the other day and even he didn't pipe up and say something when I mentioned that I was about to start my first build. lol
| shortstuff_mt wrote : The Q6600 vs Q9400 is a tough one for me. The Q9400 has a 160MHz speed advantage, but it also has 2MB less L2 cache. Another thing is that the Q9400 is a 45nm chip so it will run cooler. I guess if the budget can stretch another $30, the Q9400 would probably be worth it. If you're already feeling like the budget is maxed out, you certainly don't have to feel bad about "settling" for the Q6600 since it's still a great chip.
|
Yeah, I don't think the extra 30 bucks is gonna hurt me at this point. Also, I noticed that you recommended that RAM in another thread and was wondering why you didn't mention it here. lol I'll give them a go.
+1 for the G.Skill PI Black
I use it in my rig too =)
Check this out....this might help!
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/default.aspx?b=2
Yea, the PI Black RAM is so popular that Newegg plays around with the price quite a bit depending on the stock on hand. I didn't think it was worth $10 more, but for the same price I'd definitely pick the PI Black, even though the Mushkin kit is awesome too. I've actually been thinking about getting another PI Black kit before the prices go up permanently.
The Pll 940 and a 790 series mb is a better choice that a q6600 . Its faster , uses less power and has an upgrade path since AM3 processors will also fit that mb . The q 6600 is yesterdays hero , but its time is up
and as shortstuff has told us even running a video editing app cant use even 4 gig of ram
The money yu want to spend on the second 4 gig kit is better spent elsewhere
I like how you put words in my mouth there Outlander_04. I said I'm looking to upgrade my RAM because I use 85% of my RAM by just doing video editing alone. I'd like to have a little room to do other stuff while I'm editing. I don't know why you've made it your personal mission to talk the OP out of 8GB of RAM. For an extra $50, why not have plenty of RAM? DDR2 RAM will start going up in price as DDR3 becomes mainstream - get it while it's cheap!
| bossman34 wrote : Check this out....this might help!
|
Thanks! It looks like that AMD beats out the Q6600, but is even with the Q9400. I'll probably go with the 9400 then.
Nice...you'll be happy with the Q9400. Do you plan on overclocking?? If so, I would recommend getting an aftermarket cooler. Either of these are good choices:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6835233003
or
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6835207004
Both are great coolers for nice prices!
| bossman34 wrote : Nice...you'll be happy with the Q9400. Do you plan on overclocking?? If so, I would recommend getting an aftermarket cooler. Either of these are good choices:
|
I have no current plans to overclock. I've never done it before and I doubt that it's something I'll need to do. If I did get the itch, I could always get one of those later. Thanks for the suggestion though. I appreciate everyone's input. 
Okay...one more idea for ya. Found a nice combo deal with the 9400. It's an Antec 900 which has four fans included so you can drop the 2 fans in your wish list, save $5, and get a better case!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Comb [...] mbo.159640
Message quoted 1 times
Message edited by bossman34 on 02-26-2009 at 07:56:47 AM
Message edited by bossman34 on 02-26-2009 at 07:56:47 AM
nice
| bossman34 wrote : Okay...one more idea for ya. Found a nice combo deal with the 9400. It's an Antec 900 which has four fans included so you can drop the 2 fans in your wish list, save $5, and get a better case! |
It looks like I'll save more than 5 dollars. Right on.
Edit: So the combo discount does not show up in the wishlist final price. Is that supposed to happen?
http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/ [...] r=11199506
Message edited by blackwood on 02-26-2009 at 01:59:45 PM
Yea, combos don't transfer to the wishlist for some reason.
| bossman34 wrote : Yea, combos don't transfer to the wishlist for some reason. |
Ah, okay. It looks like I might start buying parts this weekend. I'm really looking forward to this.
Alright, so I went ahead and bought the motherboard Friday, as the mail-in-rebate discount was set to expire this weekend. A couple of things have changed with the rest of the build however...
1. The memory is out of stock... How long does it take for Newegg to get stuff back in?
2. The combo deal for the Antec 900 and my processor has apparently expired. I was going to purchase those today. So there is a $40 instant rebate with the case anyway, so its still at a good price of $99. Would you guys/gals recommend a different case now that this one doesn't have the combo deal attached? I won't have any problems fitting everything in, right?
Alright, so I have ordered the following over the last few days:
GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply - Retail
Intel Core2 Quad Q9400 2.66GHz LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80580Q9400 - Retail
G.SKILL PI Black 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F2-6400CL4D-4GBPI-B - Retail x 2
Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium SP1 64-bit for System Builders - OEM
Antec Nine Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail
I think this only leaves the graphics card and the dvd burner. Here is what I'm looking at currently for those:
SAPPHIRE 100259L Radeon HD 4870 512MB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail
SAMSUNG 22X DVD±R DVD Burner with LightScribe Black SATA Model SH-S223Q - OEM
Now the only thing here not recommended to be by folks on this site is that graphics card. What do you all think of it? Is there a better option for a comparable price?(There is some flexibility here.)
Message edited by blackwood on 03-03-2009 at 08:07:48 PM
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