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Can't decide which graphics cards to get.... help!

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March 25, 2009 7:39:26 PM

This is my first post so dont get mad! :p 

Okay so, i wanna build a gaming computer with the highest FPS possible.. and the 2 cards that i have found, that seem to be the best are

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...

( EVGA 017-P3-1294-AR GeForce GTX 295 1792MB 896 Bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 SLI Supported Video Card - Retail )

( ASUS EAH4870X2TOP/HTDI/2G Radeon HD 4870 X2 2GB 512-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail )

Help me choose which one would be the best for highest performance/FPS, or a card that would give me a higher FPS if there is one. Also i need help deciding on the motherboard, these are the two that i am thinking of buying.

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...

ASUS Striker II NSE LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 790i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
XFX MBN790IUL9 LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 790i Ultra SLI ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail

But i still dont know if all the stuff is compatible. but i think it is.. and for CPU i cant decide dual core - or quadcore..?

Thanks for the help in advance!

P.S If you want, build me a gaming computer, like list all the best parts for the highest possible fps, and performance THANKS!

More about : decide graphics cards

a b U Graphics card
March 25, 2009 7:54:11 PM

Best possible performance can cost a lot; any budget limit? What resolution/monitor (model # please) will you game with? You want single/dual/triple/quad GPU, one 1-2-3 cards?
March 25, 2009 7:55:42 PM

well since ur willing to spend the kind of money i would go with a quad-core, either the AMD Phenom II or Intel i7......

as for the video cards....to me it looks like you went and found the most expensive cards from ati and nvidia and are assuming that they are they best well thats not exactly true, heres my suggestions:

=AMD/ATI Based Build=
Processor - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...
Motherboard - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...
Video Card - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...

=Intel/Nvidia Based Build=
Processor - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...
Motherboard - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...
Video Card - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681...

Thats pretty much the best of the best for each.
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March 25, 2009 8:28:11 PM

Well i run my resolution at 1680X1050 for my desktop, which im assuming is the same for gaming.. (CSS) and dosent really matter on my budget right now, and that processor is DAMN EXPENSIVE, but im sure it will be the best one possible, but as for the video card (i want intel, not amd :p ) are you sure thats the best card? i thought for sure that the 4870X2 would be better than that, and the 295 also.. and I actually diden't look just for the most expensive :p , my friend has a 4850, and has the highest resolution possible, i think. because he plays on his 40 inch hd tv, and gets 300FPS.. so i figured that if i got a 4870X2 (not 2 cards but one card with 2 built in... i think) i would get like around 500-600 fps with 1680X1050.

P.S i can buy a new monitor to.. if that affects my FPS (which i highly doubt it does)
a b U Graphics card
March 25, 2009 8:52:46 PM

If you want great performance for your money, get an i7 920, get a single GTX285 and get a PSU that would support a 2nd one (~750-850W). You will same a ton of money and if you need the extra FPS, which I doubt at 1680x1050, you can always SLI a 2nd one.

You asked for the best, that is what you got ... doesn't mean that a system that would cost 25% of that won't perform 90% on par ;) 
a b U Graphics card
March 25, 2009 9:01:09 PM

Arigo said:
my friend has a 4850, and has the highest resolution possible, i think. because he plays on his 40 inch hd tv, and gets 300FPS.. so i figured that if i got a 4870X2 (not 2 cards but one card with 2 built in... i think) i would get like around 500-600 fps with 1680X1050.
The amount of FPS depends on the game and the resolution; 1000$ of video card still ave trouble coping with Crysis @ 2560x1600 for example...

BTW, there is no point in maxing FPS to that limit, the brain able to decode only about 60FPS and the eye itself is limited to about 100FPS.
March 25, 2009 9:16:10 PM

well, i guess in the end for me its either the GTX 295, or the 4870X2.... WHICH ONE? :p 
March 25, 2009 9:46:18 PM

I would also recommend a core i7 build with crossfire and SLI support

check out these mobos
Foxconn Renaissance LGA 1366
ASUS P6T Deluxe V2 LGA 1366
GIGABYTE GA-EX58-UD5 LGA 1366

your choosing is a matter of taste (I'd get me the gigabyte)

your CPU option are as follows
Intel Core i7 920 @ 2.66GHz 130W Quad-Core
Intel Core i7 940 @ 2.93GHz 130W Quad-Core

GPU if you're an ATI guy:
SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4870 1GB HDCP Ready, CrossFire
SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 4870X2 2GB HDCP Ready, CrossFire
And if you're an Nvidia guy:
BFG GeForce GTX 285 O.C. 1GB HDCP Ready, SLI
GIGABYTE GTX 295 1792MB HDCP Ready, SLI
Ati cards have a better price/performance ratio, but U should get the GTX295 if you wana aim for the top
March 25, 2009 9:58:06 PM
March 25, 2009 10:34:23 PM

Arigo said:
Well i run my resolution at 1680X1050 for my desktop, which im assuming is the same for gaming.. (CSS) ...

Are you only going to run CSS on this machine??? You could save hundreds by just going for a mid range configuration.
Quote:
(i want intel, not amd :p )

Phenom II would potentially beat out your LGA 775 build, unless you went down the i7 path.

--Edit--
I'm not sure the CPU cooler you picked out supports i7 boards. I see you bought a retention bracket with it.

-The reviews for the chosen power supply are at best flakey. I'd suggest this for your needs.
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139009


-Buy your CPU from Tiger Direct, it's a bit more that $300 shipped.
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=4240166&SRCCODE=GOOGLEBASE&cm_mmc_o=TBBTkwCjCVyBpAgf%20mwzygtCjCVRqCjCVRq

-The GTX 295 is cheaper on Zip Zoom Fly.
http://search.zipzoomfly.com/?Key=gtx+295&Category=00&x=0&y=0
March 26, 2009 12:53:03 AM

g3force said:
Are you only going to run CSS on this machine??? You could save hundreds by just going for a mid range configuration.
Quote:
(i want intel, not amd :p )

Phenom II would potentially beat out your LGA 775 build, unless you went down the i7 path.

--Edit--
I'm not sure the CPU cooler you picked out supports i7 boards. I see you bought a retention bracket with it.

-The reviews for the chosen power supply are at best flakey. I'd suggest this for your needs.
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139009


-Buy your CPU from Tiger Direct, it's a bit more that $300 shipped.
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=4240166&SRCCODE=GOOGLEBASE&cm_mmc_o=TBBTkwCjCVyBpAgf%20mwzygtCjCVRqCjCVRq

-The GTX 295 is cheaper on Zip Zoom Fly.
http://search.zipzoomfly.com/?Key=gtx+295&Category=00&x=0&y=0


Well, id rather order it all from newegg.ca (i live in canada so shipping will cost A LOT less) and also so it all comes at once.. but thanks, that new PSU looks better, and brought the overall price down, and about the CPU cooler, the tuniq tower, my friend has it and its massive, it works very very well, so i think that it would do some good to this computer too, and yes CSS is my main game, but i also want a very very good computer, to run the newer games (crysis, far cry 2) and so on.. and are you sure 850W would be enough to power all that?

And also i read some reviews on some websites.. i googled gtx 295 vs 4870X2, and it looks like the 295 is more powerful then the 4870.. so im leaning towards the gtx 295, but i still want to know which one would be better.
a b U Graphics card
March 26, 2009 1:22:24 AM

For canadian prices/store, check www.shopbot.ca (price check) and also check www.directcanada.com, they don't charge shipping for orders over 300$ including cases; it can be a 35-50$ saving. Some store also don't charge provincial taxes, only federal. All that can sum-up to a big difference.
March 26, 2009 1:35:09 AM

Arigo said:
Well, id rather order it all from newegg.ca (i live in canada so shipping will cost A LOT less) and also so it all comes at once.. but thanks, that new PSU looks better, and brought the overall price down, and about the CPU cooler, the tuniq tower, my friend has it and its massive, it works very very well, so i think that it would do some good to this computer too, and yes CSS is my main game, but i also want a very very good computer, to run the newer games (crysis, far cry 2) and so on.. and are you sure 850W would be enough to power all that?

And also i read some reviews on some websites.. i googled gtx 295 vs 4870X2, and it looks like the 295 is more powerful then the 4870.. so im leaning towards the gtx 295, but i still want to know which one would be better.


The power supply picked should be enough for two GTX 295s in SLI.
I've found the same power supply for a lower price on Newegg... Doh, I'm an idiot
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139009&Tpk=corsair%20850tx

Also, the GTX 295 flattens the 4870 X2, though the price is alot steeper.

---Keep in mind that the power supply is not modular, so you won't be able to remove the unused cables from your case.

a b U Graphics card
March 26, 2009 1:52:53 AM

Quote:
Also, the GTX 295 flattens the 4870 X2, though the price is alot steeper.


No, it doesn't.

The 4870x2 'flattened' the gtx280. That was a dual gpu vs a single gpu and was to be expected. The gtx295 isn't that much better than the 4870x2. Better yes, flatten? No.
March 26, 2009 4:32:09 AM

One benefit in getting the GTX295 over the 4870 X2 is that the X2 HAS to run in crossfire mode, which I gather can have some setup issues (as does SLI) while the 295 is a single GPU.

However, for your purposes, you don't need huge video performance with that monitor... the monitor DOES matter, not because of the screen size, but because of the standard resolution... for example a 1920x1200 needs to do at least 4 times the calculations of a 960x600 screen.

In practice, since you are building from scratch, you are probably better off getting an i7-920. Get 6 or 12 GB of memory, a decent SSD with a 1TB Data Disk and a single GTX295. You can then upgrade your graphics easily in a year or two when/if you want to play something that exceeds its capabilities. The Phenom II is a nice option if you are on a budget, but why go to Sizzlers when you can afford Ruths Chris ?
March 26, 2009 10:46:20 AM
March 26, 2009 11:12:31 AM

Siggy19 said:
One benefit in getting the GTX295 over the 4870 X2 is that the X2 HAS to run in crossfire mode, which I gather can have some setup issues (as does SLI) while the 295 is a single GPU.

However, for your purposes, you don't need huge video performance with that monitor... the monitor DOES matter, not because of the screen size, but because of the standard resolution... for example a 1920x1200 needs to do at least 4 times the calculations of a 960x600 screen.

In practice, since you are building from scratch, you are probably better off getting an i7-920. Get 6 or 12 GB of memory, a decent SSD with a 1TB Data Disk and a single GTX295. You can then upgrade your graphics easily in a year or two when/if you want to play something that exceeds its capabilities. The Phenom II is a nice option if you are on a budget, but why go to Sizzlers when you can afford Ruths Chris ?


The 295 is two GPUs as well so still uses an internal SLi bridge, there's no difference in the set-up of the two cards. The 285 is the single GPU version.
a b U Graphics card
March 26, 2009 12:18:11 PM

As ixion said, the GTX295 is a dual-GPU card, some kind of GTX260x2 I think (die-shrinked + some extras). For the best single-GPU, you have to get the GTX285.
March 26, 2009 12:50:44 PM

i think i have a pretty good feel for what your looking for so heres the build i suggest...

Processor - Intel Core i7 920
CPU Cooler - ZALMAN CNPS9700 (Im pretty sure this is compatible with the i7s but i m not completely sure)

Motherboard- MSI X58 Pro

Memory - G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) (x 3 = 12GB)

Video Card - GIGABYTE GV-N295-18I-B GeForce GTX 295

Hard Drive - Western Digital Caviar Green WD10EADS 1TB

Case - Antec Nine Hundred
Power Supply - COOLER MASTER UCP RS700-AAAAA3 700W

TOTAL = $ 2,090.00 (Does Not Include Shipping or Tax, Approx. $2,200 - $2,300 with Shipping & Tax)

This build is made assuming that you do not need a Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse, Speakers, or Operating System. So let me know if u need any other suggestions.
March 26, 2009 7:04:11 PM

lasoski311 said:
i think i have a pretty good feel for what your looking for so heres the build i suggest...

Processor - Intel Core i7 920
CPU Cooler - ZALMAN CNPS9700 (Im pretty sure this is compatible with the i7s but i m not completely sure)

Motherboard- MSI X58 Pro

Memory - G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) (x 3 = 12GB)

Video Card - GIGABYTE GV-N295-18I-B GeForce GTX 295

Hard Drive - Western Digital Caviar Green WD10EADS 1TB

Case - Antec Nine Hundred
Power Supply - COOLER MASTER UCP RS700-AAAAA3 700W

TOTAL = $ 2,090.00 (Does Not Include Shipping or Tax, Approx. $2,200 - $2,300 with Shipping & Tax)

This build is made assuming that you do not need a Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse, Speakers, or Operating System. So let me know if u need any other suggestions.


If i used this build.. what kind of FPS would i get..? (on 1680X1050, highest settings everything on css?) and are you sure 700W would be enough to power this beast? :p 

And, i would want a top of the line motherboard, (if that isen't already) and a REALLY good video card.
March 26, 2009 7:53:00 PM

the build is suggested above is overkill for css, the build above is more for games like crysis. i dont really know the exact numbers but believe me that system will run css above and beyond what anyone would need.

the motherboard and video card that i suggested in the build are both very high quality products, msi and gigabyte are pretty good brands.

700W should be plenty but im not 100%, maybe someone else can answer that question better.
March 26, 2009 8:19:11 PM

lasoski311 said:
the build is suggested above is overkill for css, the build above is more for games like crysis. i dont really know the exact numbers but believe me that system will run css above and beyond what anyone would need.

the motherboard and video card that i suggested in the build are both very high quality products, msi and gigabyte are pretty good brands.

700W should be plenty but im not 100%, maybe someone else can answer that question better.


would that mobo be better then the Asus Striker II Extreme, because that board looks SICK, and if i was to use the striker, would i be able to put an AMD processor on it ( http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E1681... ) and a gtx 295.? because right now, that AMD processor looks REALLY good.. that 1300 dollar intel processor ( 3.2 ghz quad core) compared to the 3.0 ghz quad core AMD one.. for only 380 dollars.. i think i would want the AMD processor.. So my question right now is.

Is the Asus striker II extreme, better then the mobo you just told me to get? and
Could i run an, AMD Phenom II with a Asus striker II extreme, and a GTX 295? :p  thanks!
March 27, 2009 1:59:20 AM

well getting the AMD PII 940 changes a lot if thats what you wanna do let me know.

oh and btw i build myself a computer last week with that processor and so far everythings great.
March 27, 2009 2:00:38 AM

The striker II is an Intel core 17 board so no you can not run a Phenom II. You are going way overkill for the game you want to play. You can run a 9800+ at the res you want to and get same results as a gtx 295. If you are going core i7 you do not need anything over a 920. If you want you can oc it to compete with the 965.
a b U Graphics card
March 27, 2009 2:23:09 AM

chef7734 said:
The striker II is an Intel core 17 board so no you can not run a Phenom II. You are going way overkill for the game you want to play. You can run a 9800+ at the res you want to and get same results as a gtx 295. If you are going core i7 you do not need anything over a 920. If you want you can oc it to compete with the 965.


He also wants to be able to play Crysis and Farcry 2 at high detail levels. I was going to say something similar in regards to the serious overkill this would be to just play CS:S, but kept reading... And technically, 7-series nVidia and X1XX ATI cards have more than ample power to play CS:S. A 9800 begins to become overkill for that game, even with the modifications over the years.

While I truly admire the power of Core i7, the price of an i7 system, complete with X58 mobo, tri-DDR3, just plain pushes me away. I'd sacrifice the performance hit going to a Phenom II vs i7 setup if it would save me a couple hundred bennies, and it would, easily.
March 27, 2009 2:27:11 AM

op said the highest possible FPS, so do triple sli with 3 gts 295 or 4 gts 295.
March 27, 2009 2:30:45 AM

Zenthar said:
The amount of FPS depends on the game and the resolution; 1000$ of video card still ave trouble coping with Crysis @ 2560x1600 for example...

BTW, there is no point in maxing FPS to that limit, the brain able to decode only about 60FPS and the eye itself is limited to about 100FPS.


yes...there is....future games will slow that 100 fps to 30.
March 27, 2009 2:33:54 AM

You can not sli more than 2 gtx 295 together. And would get higher performance out of 3 285 vs 2 295.
March 27, 2009 2:41:10 AM

chef7734 said:
You can not sli more than 2 gtx 295 together. And would get higher performance out of 3 285 vs 2 295.


true, but that is a driver issue, not a hardware limit atm

March 27, 2009 2:50:45 AM

Ther is only one nipple on the gtx 295 thus only able to run one sli bridge. For multi card sli a bridge has to be attached to all the cards which requires 3 bridges or 1 bridge with 6 connectors on it. It is a hardware limit.

March 27, 2009 2:56:15 AM

cards are perfectly capable of communicating across the pcie bus, it was just nv's decision not to. as a matter of fact, how do you think all these lovely utilitis alter your fan speed or windows knows all about your card.
March 27, 2009 2:57:55 AM

royalcrown said:
cards are perfectly capable of communicating across the pcie bus, it was just nv's decision not to. as a matter of fact, how do you think all these lovely utilitis alter your fan speed or windows knows all about your card.

Not just MV but you are requited a crossfire bridge to link 2 cards also. Ohh and the 3dfx voodoo sli also required a bridge.
March 27, 2009 3:23:46 AM

chef7734 said:
Not just MV but you are requited a crossfire bridge to link 2 cards also. Ohh and the 3dfx voodoo sli also required a bridge.


yeah, but if you read about the pcie bus and how it works, you'll see it's possible..
March 27, 2009 3:25:17 AM

Yes it is possible, but not now.Which makes the advice to run 3 or 4 gtx 295 in sli not possible.
March 27, 2009 3:30:35 AM

true, so 3 285 huh ? ok that's cool, personally i don't like sli, i don't like the fact that it works sometimes...
March 27, 2009 3:32:57 AM

It is defently dependent on whether the game takes advantage of it or not. Kinda sucks if you pay 1200 on cards and the game you play does not use it. He would really be wasting money if he purchased anything in this level if all he plays cs source.
March 27, 2009 3:35:15 AM

That's kinda why I want the 285...I did think you could quad the 295, i wonder why they did not allow for quad 295 just to sell more cards..
March 27, 2009 3:39:07 AM

Quad sli is 2 dual gpu cards. Basically what you are getting is 4 260's. I am not sure if it has anything to do with bandwidth across the bus as you can only put 2 4870x2 also but can use 3 4870 something to research.
March 27, 2009 3:42:26 AM

Yeah 4 295 at folding would crush all, octo sli would need a new ps I bet !
March 27, 2009 3:44:12 AM

You can run 4 295 if you have room but only can sli 2 of them. It would defently kick ass if you could.Even 4 294 folding would still kick ass.
March 27, 2009 3:48:46 AM

I'd buy one at 339, where the 285 is but not 500...geeze. Maybe they don't wanna risk drawing 1.21 Gigawatts through the boards slots at 88 hertz ?
March 27, 2009 3:50:29 AM

Only Time will tell.
March 27, 2009 10:36:09 AM

okay,well now that i know i cant run those togheter, i either have to give up the motherboard.. or the processor.. should i keep the Asus striker II extreme? or should i keep the phenom II and make an AMD based build..

If i keep the phenom.. what would be the best mobo that would work with it, and also the best graphics card that would work with it?
March 27, 2009 12:01:05 PM

IMO you should go with the phenom and heres a AMD based build......

Processor - AMD Phenom II X4 940
CPU Cooler - ZALMAN CNPS9900LED

Motherboard- ASUS M4A79 Deluxe

Memory - Kingston HyperX 4GB (2 x 2GB) (x 2 = 8GB)

Video Card - SAPPHIRE 100251SR Radeon HD 4870 X2

Hard Drive - Western Digital Caviar Green WD10EADS 1TB

Case - Antec Nine Hundred
Power Supply - Thermaltake W0116RU 750W

TOTAL = $ 1,640.00 (Does Not Include Shipping or Tax, Approx. $1,740 with Shipping & Tax)

This build is made assuming that you do not need a Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse, Speakers, or Operating System. So let me know if u need any other suggestions.
March 27, 2009 6:46:26 PM

lasoski311 said:
IMO you should go with the phenom and heres a AMD based build......

Processor - AMD Phenom II X4 940
CPU Cooler - ZALMAN CNPS9900LED

Motherboard- ASUS M4A79 Deluxe

Memory - Kingston HyperX 4GB (2 x 2GB) (x 2 = 8GB)

Video Card - SAPPHIRE 100251SR Radeon HD 4870 X2

Hard Drive - Western Digital Caviar Green WD10EADS 1TB

Case - Antec Nine Hundred
Power Supply - Thermaltake W0116RU 750W

TOTAL = $ 1,640.00 (Does Not Include Shipping or Tax, Approx. $1,740 with Shipping & Tax)

okay that build is looking very good to me... but i was wondering.. could i put a gtx 295 in there? if i couldn't could i put 2 4870X2's?? and could you give a different case? because my friends got the same case, and i dont wanna get the same thing.. (cost under 200$) and pick out a nice lookin one.. :p  and make sure its got good airflow, etc fans and what not :p 
This build is made assuming that you do not need a Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse, Speakers, or Operating System. So let me know if u need any other suggestions.
a b U Graphics card
March 27, 2009 8:10:10 PM

You can always get the Antec Nine Hundred Two, but you will pay twice as much for it (205$). This case is more like the Antec 1200 but smaller and comes with air filters.

HOWEVER, if you buy from DirectCanada, it costs ~150$ and, if you get your order to 300$ (by getting a PSU for example, the Corsais are often cheaper than on NewEgg anyway) you get free shipping.
March 27, 2009 8:22:27 PM

what about my other questions? :p 
a b U Graphics card
March 27, 2009 8:35:40 PM

I don't think you will have any trouble fitting any video card in there. I would vote against two 4870x2, more than 2 GPU don't scale well. If you want more than the GTX295, you will have to go for two GTX285 in SLI.
March 27, 2009 9:51:17 PM
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