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Replacing Pentium 4

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June 15, 2009 4:07:11 AM

I want to replace the family's Dell Dimension 8300's P4 with a new cpu. I was thinking about replacing the mobo, proc, and video card. I'll have my own gaming rig, so I won't be using it and the family will be browsing the web and watching videos.

The Dell is:
Socket 478 mobo
Pentium 4 3.0 Ghz
Radeon 2400 Pro AGP
2.5 GB RAM

Want to upgrade to:
AMD Athlon X2 7750 Kuma 2.7 BE ($60)
budget mobo that has integrated graphics (HD 3300) (~$90-100)
Maybe buy better RAM

The upgrade would cost roughly $160.

Will I have any issues with power? The stock that came with the Dell is 250-300 watts, not sure which. Does anyone know if I would have compatibility issues also that I can't think of?

Thanks in advance.




More about : replacing pentium

June 15, 2009 4:23:00 AM

LiteBulb said:
I want to replace the family's Dell Dimension 8300's P4 with a new cpu. I was thinking about replacing the mobo, proc, and video card. I'll have my own gaming rig, so I won't be using it and the family will be browsing the web and watching videos.

The Dell is:
Socket 478 mobo
Pentium 4 3.0 Ghz
Radeon 2400 Pro AGP
2.5 GB RAM

Want to upgrade to:
AMD Athlon X2 7750 Kuma 2.7 BE ($60)
budget mobo that has integrated graphics (HD 3300) (~$90-100)
Maybe buy better RAM

The upgrade would cost roughly $160.

Will I have any issues with power? The stock that came with the Dell is 250-300 watts, not sure which. Does anyone know if I would have compatibility issues also that I can't think of?

Thanks in advance.

The biggest issue with compatibility will be the case. You will need to get a new one, unless you really plan to go through all the hassles involved with putting a mATX board into the Dell 8x00 series clamshell case. Something tells me you are not familiar with the amount of work involved with performing that task. For your sake, pick up a new case. The old PSU can be reused, but with a Kuma CPU you willl be pushing its power output pretty hard. If you said you were going to use a 45 or 65 watt Athlon X2, I wouldn't think twice about reusing that old Dell PSU, but those Kumas are little space heaters. That being said, I ran a D 805 off my 250 watt Dell PSU in my Dell 4500 without issue, but the rig did consume over 160 watts when fully loaded. I had the benefit of a kill-a-watt power meter to tell me if I was pushing the PSU too much though. For piece of mind, a quality 300 to 400 watt psu should be used, and I mean quality. If you go cheap offbrand, look for at least a 450 to 500 watt psu.
a c 85 à CPUs
June 15, 2009 4:29:39 AM

The other issue you'll have is not having a Dell bios anymore. Your copy of windows should refuse to work after that, so you'll need to pick up a new OS. (if your a student in college, head to the "bookstore". You can pick up copies there really cheap.)
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June 15, 2009 4:33:17 AM

^ Thats a good point.
June 15, 2009 4:46:59 AM

Well instead of getting a Kuma, I would get the new Athlon II 250 Regor along with an ASUS M2A74-AM mobo...the processor should be more powerful than a Kuma 7750 and the mobo is AM2+ and AM3 compatible...not to mention both dont brake the bank

CPU
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103681

Mobo
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131391

As for the OS...you could get away with using Windows 7 RC for now...or buy the OS at your college (this only applies to Microsoft sponsored schools)
a c 83 à CPUs
June 15, 2009 5:18:08 AM

You shouldn't have any power problems, as you will be using the onboard graphics instead of your old AGP video card, even if the Athlon X2 consumes more power than your P4 did the removal of the video card should easily make up for that difference. I would also recommend the Athlon II X2 250 if you can make room for it in your budget, its more powerful and more energy efficient.

Your also going to need DDR2 memory for that Athlon X2 7750, as I believe your current build is using regular DDR.



a c 85 à CPUs
June 15, 2009 6:47:04 AM

AMD has released to many chips, I can't keep track of them anymore. I thought all the new Athlons were junk. Why is this one better then the Kuma? (wait, is kuma the old new dual core? Isn't kuma the tri core? D@mn you AMD...)
June 15, 2009 8:24:51 AM

4745454b said:
AMD has released to many chips, I can't keep track of them anymore. I thought all the new Athlons were junk. Why is this one better then the Kuma? (wait, is kuma the old new dual core? Isn't kuma the tri core? D@mn you AMD...)

Kuma = 65nm generation Athlon X2 7750
Regor = 45nm generation Athon X2 250 (2MB total cache)
Callisto = 45nm generation Phenom II X2 550 (7MB total cache)

See here about a review of last two:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/phenom-ath...

So get either Regor or Callisto, 45nm products. Do not buy the older 65nm products, if you can.
a b à CPUs
June 15, 2009 9:20:49 AM

Thats what I was thinking either the Phenom X2 or the e 5200. Both are good budget chips.

For Mobo I like the Biostar TA790gx, but any 790gx would do for that kind of machine. Newegg has a couple of micro boards with only one pci X slot for 85-90 bucks. I would look at one o them.

2gigs of ram is not bad, prolly 25-30 bucks. I would personnally spend 50-60 and get 4 gigs, its so cheap.

So, yeah about $200 for everything. Nice inexpensive upgrade for light duty, but plenty fast for the fambly.
June 15, 2009 10:51:41 AM

I don't think You need to upgrade for web browsing and videos unless they are HD
a b à CPUs
June 15, 2009 1:49:43 PM

Come on peoples, stop trying to upgrade Dells, HP's etc. with new motherboards and processors. You are simply beating a dead horse. If you feel the need for speed, put the prebuild aside for your folks or siblings to browse the web with, and just build new. It's easier, only slightly more costly, and you'll end up with a much better system overall.
a b à CPUs
June 15, 2009 2:18:52 PM

jitpublisher said:
Come on peoples, stop trying to upgrade Dells, HP's etc. with new motherboards and processors. You are simply beating a dead horse. If you feel the need for speed, put the prebuild aside for your folks or siblings to browse the web with, and just build new. It's easier, only slightly more costly, and you'll end up with a much better system overall.


This.
a b à CPUs
June 15, 2009 4:15:27 PM

CooLWoLF said:
This.

:heink: 
a b à CPUs
June 15, 2009 9:50:06 PM

Mousemonkey said:
:heink: 


haha, sorry

I was simply agreeing.
June 15, 2009 10:02:56 PM

I would like to put in a new Phenom II X2, but it isn't necessary for the family. I just want to make it faster for them because it's slower than my laptop!

We don't need a monitor, keyboard, mouse, speakers, or DVD drive/burner. So here's what I'm thinking:

AMD Athlon X2 7850 Kuma (plenty fast for them)
ASRock 790GX mobo with onboard Radeon 3300 (for movies/videos)
G Skill 2x2 GB RAM DDR2 800
Corsair 400W PSU
CM Elite 330 Case

Total: $ 302

I could go the AM3 route, but I don't think it's worth it. Would the Kuma really push out that much more heat than the Phenom II? There won't be any overclocking, at least not for a while.
June 15, 2009 10:53:50 PM

For what this PC is for, your fine with the 7750.
a b à CPUs
June 15, 2009 11:22:42 PM

Just make sure that the case isn't mBTX, as some of the Dells are, since you can't put an ATX or mATX board in such a case.
June 16, 2009 12:37:23 AM

The 8300 is too old to be BTX. It is from the 2003 socket 478 era.
June 16, 2009 12:49:53 AM

jitpublisher said:
Come on peoples, stop trying to upgrade Dells, HP's etc. with new motherboards and processors. You are simply beating a dead horse. If you feel the need for speed, put the prebuild aside for your folks or siblings to browse the web with, and just build new. It's easier, only slightly more costly, and you'll end up with a much better system overall.

Dells, HP, etc....they're all just cases. Not really different from some aftermarket case, usually just more of a challenge to re-use. I find it fun. Most oem cases are sturdy and conservative. It's sometimes challenging to find a case that isn't 3 feet tall, made of cheap plastic and razor thin steel, or one that doesn't have some gay side window or goofy looking front. You can't beat the price on an oem case, as you usually already have it in front of you, for the price of free. Finally, the case we are discussing here, the Dell clamshell case, is head and shoulders better than any case you could possibly buy for under $50. Screwless design, clamshell opening that allows for full access to all components, room for two hard drives and two optical drives, integrated cable management, a nice 100mm thermal sensing rear case fan, and a pretty decent PSU to boot, especially for its time.
a b à CPUs
June 16, 2009 1:13:47 AM

Hey! I like my gay side window! haha

And the pretty blue lights....
June 16, 2009 3:16:19 AM

joefriday said:
The biggest issue with compatibility will be the case. You will need to get a new one, unless you really plan to go through all the hassles involved with putting a mATX board into the Dell 8x00 series clamshell case. Something tells me you are not familiar with the amount of work involved with performing that task. For your sake, pick up a new case. The old PSU can be reused, but with a Kuma CPU you willl be pushing its power output pretty hard. If you said you were going to use a 45 or 65 watt Athlon X2, I wouldn't think twice about reusing that old Dell PSU, but those Kumas are little space heaters. That being said, I ran a D 805 off my 250 watt Dell PSU in my Dell 4500 without issue, but the rig did consume over 160 watts when fully loaded. I had the benefit of a kill-a-watt power meter to tell me if I was pushing the PSU too much though. For piece of mind, a quality 300 to 400 watt psu should be used, and I mean quality. If you go cheap offbrand, look for at least a 450 to 500 watt psu.

Well, I checked out the motherboard in the Dell and it's an ATX mobo, not mini or micro, so there shouldn't be too much hassle getting a new one in there.

Now the decision is to get a new $300 upgrade, or spend like $160 on a mobo and cpu. Probably just gonna build from scratch. I'll need RAM anyway, so the $160 is more like $200.

Plus, I'd feel better having a case fan or two in the new case, unlike the Dell case. Only two fans, cpu and psu, lol.
June 16, 2009 7:52:20 PM

LiteBulb said:
I could go the AM3 route, but I don't think it's worth it. Would the Kuma really push out that much more heat than the Phenom II? There won't be any overclocking, at least not for a while.

Yes, 45nm Phenom II is more energy efficient when idling, which is almost always for home users, especially if you leave your computer on alot and do not play games alot.

There is no point in choosing an older chip that has been superseded in all marks. If you can't afford the Phenom X2, then buy the Athlon X2 250 since its virtually the same but with less cache, its a bit cheaper.

You do not need DDR3 memory if that was your question, just stick to DDR2-800 or DDR2-1066.
June 17, 2009 12:16:40 AM

LiteBulb said:
Well, I checked out the motherboard in the Dell and it's an ATX mobo, not mini or micro, so there shouldn't be too much hassle getting a new one in there.

You're gravely mistaken in that assessment. For your enlightenment let me pull up a forum thread where I've already proven you incorrect:
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/245821-30-moving-dell...
And before you say "but my computer is a Dell 8300!?" look at this diagram of your board, straight from the Dell manual:

Same thing. 4 screws hold your board onto the tray. The top of the board extends beyond the I/O panel. There's nothing standard about this design, and the only way to put a different board in there is to use a tray from a Dell 4500/4550, which only holds mATX motherboards, and that STILL does not free you from the fact that the front panel connectors are impossible to hook up to an aftermarket mobo, unless you do as I have already done:
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/190487-31-dell-case-w...

This isn't my first pony show.

June 17, 2009 1:50:53 AM

I stand corrected. Joe, you are absolutely right. I guess I should have looked harder. Since I didn't have the manual on hand, I googled Dimension 8300 mobo and some listings included ATX so I thought it was.

Your other thread is pretty helpful, too. Doesn't really surprise me that Dell would use a non-standard motherboard. Cheap bastards.

After reading everyone's comments, I will upgrade to a PII X2 in a budget build.
!