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Should i upgrade my cpu?

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July 7, 2009 9:06:50 AM

My current machine is used solely for gaming
currently my setup is

MOBO: GIGABYTE GA-MA790X-UD4P
cpu: AMD 64 x2 6400+ Windsor (Stock at 3.2) 2mb cache
VIdeo Card: Ati 4850 (Will buy a 2nd and crossfire soon)
Ram: ocz 4gb ddr2 800 (But if i bought a better processor may upgrade)


I'm considering the following 2 processors, but would like to know.
would i see a large difference in gaming by switching to those 2 ?
Would they be worth about $100


I would upgrade to either

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

or


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Another Important thing to add is that I would overclock either of them (probably to about 3.5 ghz)

More about : upgrade cpu

a b à CPUs
July 7, 2009 9:44:47 AM

You would notice significant difference with both the CPUs...
I would suggest the X3 over the X2 as you would get an extra core,hence better in other multi-threaded apps...Though there is news that the X2 can be unlocked to a Quad but not sure if your mobo can do it...

But I would suggest you first invest in the 4850 now and then save money and get the X4 940/ 920 rather than any of these CPUs as that would be a better upgrade...
July 7, 2009 10:13:09 AM

actually i just checked and i guess my mobo is supposed to be great for unlocking the extra cores, in which case unlocking the duo core might be my best option.

but do you think an unlocked duo core phenom 2 would perform as well as a an actual quad core? like the 940 ?
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a b à CPUs
July 7, 2009 12:13:52 PM

^ Well I don't know how successful you would be at unlocking the cores...But it is well worth the try...And if the unlocked cores are stable, then you can get performance similar to that of 920 or maybe even the 940...

And just a heads up...once you have unlocked the cores, the CPU temp diode would stop functioning...So you might not be able to get real-time temps of the CPU...
a b à CPUs
July 7, 2009 5:49:22 PM

get the tri
July 8, 2009 6:03:48 AM

gkay09 said:
^ Well I don't know how successful you would be at unlocking the cores...But it is well worth the try...And if the unlocked cores are stable, then you can get performance similar to that of 920 or maybe even the 940...

And just a heads up...once you have unlocked the cores, the CPU temp diode would stop functioning...So you might not be able to get real-time temps of the CPU...


Thanks for taking the time to respond to me, but i have a 2 part question for you,

would I get a better performance improvement (overall) from buying the 4850 now over a new cpu?

also do you think it'd be worth it to get the 1 gb version for an extra $20 ?
July 8, 2009 6:45:21 AM

I'll try and answer your questions. I had a 512MB 4850 before there was a 1GB version, and I wish it had a larger frame buffer. If you have a 512MB now, then you should stick with the same for your crossfire setup. My last CPU was also an Intel E6750, which at stock speeds, is equal to the 6400+ X2 in most cases.

I would assume you would get a better benefit out of an extra card over the CPU upgrade depending on the resolution you game at. This will also be a factor that you need to consider. If you game at anything less than 1680x1050, Crossfire isn't a very good choice. If you game at 1680x1050 or higher resolution, Crossfire is a great choice.
July 8, 2009 7:35:25 AM

one-shot said:
I'll try and answer your questions. I had a 512MB 4850 before there was a 1GB version, and I wish it had a larger frame buffer. If you have a 512MB now, then you should stick with the same for your crossfire setup. My last CPU was also an Intel E6750, which at stock speeds, is equal to the 6400+ X2 in most cases.

I would assume you would get a better benefit out of an extra card over the CPU upgrade depending on the resolution you game at. This will also be a factor that you need to consider. If you game at anything less than 1680x1050, Crossfire isn't a very good choice. If you game at 1680x1050 or higher resolution, Crossfire is a great choice.



that's the thing, my monitor runs at 1360 x 768

So i'm considering waiting and saving for a 4890 (about $170 on newegg)

I don't think a 4870 would improve my gameplay too much..

:(  im kinda stuck in a tough place
July 8, 2009 1:31:38 PM

Another 4850 would just create more of a bottleneck, at the moment the old CPU is the bottleneck. Go for the X3 Phenon, as I've read unlocking the third core on the X2 Phenons isn't the best option as these CPUs are normally X2s becuase the third CPU doesn't meet the requirements for an X3
a c 83 à CPUs
July 8, 2009 5:58:24 PM

Even a 4670 begins to bottleneck an Athlon X2, I don't even want to imagine how badly you'll bottleneck if your crossfire 4850's at such a low resolution. Right now a single 4850 should be more than enough for any game at that res, any low fps problems your having are probably cpu related.
July 8, 2009 7:13:59 PM

You are using a low resolution so Crossfire would be a waste of money. A new CPU would be the best option with your current monitor.
a b à CPUs
July 9, 2009 4:23:48 AM

@thiisonecrazy, one-shot has given you the correct suggestion...

And for you resolution, the HD 4850 would be suffice for now...I would suggest you get a new CPU rather than an another 4850...It should help little to improve the frame-rates and overall system performance...
But the main reason not to go for another 4850 is - ATI is set to launch newer DirectX 11 cards( Not only high-end but also mainstream cards too) by October or by latest this year-end...So get newer card then...
July 9, 2009 7:22:36 AM

gkay09 said:
@thiisonecrazy, one-shot has given you the correct suggestion...

And for you resolution, the HD 4850 would be suffice for now...I would suggest you get a new CPU rather than an another 4850...It should help little to improve the frame-rates and overall system performance...
But the main reason not to go for another 4850 is - ATI is set to launch newer DirectX 11 cards( Not only high-end but also mainstream cards too) by October or by latest this year-end...So get newer card then...




yeah i believe you are correct,I'm trying to decide if i should get

AMD Phenom II X3 720 for $119.00


or if it would be worth it to spend the extra money and get

AMD Phenom II X4 920 for $149.99


although because of my motherboard i think i'd have a good chance at unlocking the 720's fourth core if i needed too.

do you think the 920 would be worth the extra $30?
a b à CPUs
July 9, 2009 11:57:29 AM

If you can confirm for sure that you can unlock the 4th core on your mobo, then stick with the X3...

If you are doubtful, then the X4 920 would be better...As it is a quad-core

But I would suggest, you hold on till you can get the X4 940 rather than the 920 as the 940 has unlocked multiplier, would overclock easier and better than the 920...

So if you dont overclock, then the 920 is more than suffice ...
But if you are planning for overclock, then the X3 720/ X4 940 are better...
July 9, 2009 9:51:58 PM

gkay09 said:
If you can confirm for sure that you can unlock the 4th core on your mobo, then stick with the X3...

If you are doubtful, then the X4 920 would be better...As it is a quad-core

But I would suggest, you hold on till you can get the X4 940 rather than the 920 as the 940 has unlocked multiplier, would overclock easier and better than the 920...

So if you dont overclock, then the 920 is more than suffice ...
But if you are planning for overclock, then the X3 720/ X4 940 are better...






yeah at this point i'm thinking about getting the AMD Phenom II X3 720 and overclocking, but i don't think i would unlock the fourth core, i've read about a lot of people having stability troubles when they do.

what i'm thinking now, is that i don't think the 940 would be worth the extra $65 because i'm using my rig solely for gaming, and most games can't utilize quad cores yet? (or tri core for that matter?)

am i correct in thinking so?


i also just noticed the hyper transfer is slightly faster on the 720, isn't that why these processors are a big improvement over my 6400+ the hyper transfer speed & larger cache?


(just wanted to say thanks again, i know i'm asking a lot of questions but your helping a lot)
a b à CPUs
July 10, 2009 3:53:55 AM

The X3 is a very solid option if your rig is solely used for gaming...Like you said most of the games don't utilize more than 2 cores properly...but things are changing...Games are being optimized to utilize more than 2 cores...(same story when the dual-cores were introduced - initially questioned but now it is a standard)

So lets put it like this...
If you are planning to keep your PC for more than 1+ years, then the X4 940 is a good buy as quads would serve you longer...
But if its likely you would change/ upgrade your PC again in a year, then get the X3...

And as for the improvement over that 6400+ - Oh YES it will be a very good improvement as the X3 has newer and far better archietecture than the 6400+ and like you said more cache and faster HT...

Glad I could help :) 
July 10, 2009 7:30:33 AM

gkay09 said:
The X3 is a very solid option if your rig is solely used for gaming...Like you said most of the games don't utilize more than 2 cores properly...but things are changing...Games are being optimized to utilize more than 2 cores...(same story when the dual-cores were introduced - initially questioned but now it is a standard)

So lets put it like this...
If you are planning to keep your PC for more than 1+ years, then the X4 940 is a good buy as quads would serve you longer...
But if its likely you would change/ upgrade your PC again in a year, then get the X3...

And as for the improvement over that 6400+ - Oh YES it will be a very good improvement as the X3 has newer and far better archietecture than the 6400+ and like you said more cache and faster HT...

Glad I could help :) 





even though i could buy either, i think i'm going to go with the 720 ( i already have a badass cpu cooler) and overclock it like crazy.

i think it'll be a big improvement from my 6400+ (i've been having some frame rate issues running games maxed out).

I figure i'll should be able to run most games maxed out at my resolution now.
(especially because i run them of 10,000 rpm hard drives, not cd's, and with my new processor and a 4850 i should be good)
I figure by the time i consider it outdated they will have a quad core with higher clock speeds for about $100-$150 or so and i can just replace it then.

man this was a tough choice, thanks for all the help :D 
your the best dude :sol: 
a b à CPUs
July 10, 2009 9:28:43 AM

^ Really good decision...Even my choice would have been the X3 :D 

And adding one more 4850 would give a potent rig, which can run games @ highest settings even @ 1920X1200...

And you can overclock that X3 720 to 3.4GHz+ easy...It comes with unlocked multiplier like I had pointed out before so overclocking should be pretty easy...
Here are few articles that should help you out...
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/phenom-overclock-at...
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/phenom-ii-overclock...

:) 
July 14, 2009 5:39:00 AM

gkay09 said:
^ Really good decision...Even my choice would have been the X3 :D 

And adding one more 4850 would give a potent rig, which can run games @ highest settings even @ 1920X1200...

And you can overclock that X3 720 to 3.4GHz+ easy...It comes with unlocked multiplier like I had pointed out before so overclocking should be pretty easy...
Here are few articles that should help you out...
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/phenom-overclock-at...
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/phenom-ii-overclock...

:) 




Just got my 720 today and already have it overclocked (couldnt unlock 4th core).

Running 3700 mhz stable (on all 3 cores of course)

Surprisingly my frames per second in games hasn't increased at all.

this leads me to believe that there is another bottleneck, im thinking it's my ram?

I'm running ddr2 800

(my systems takes up to 1200 actually 1333 if overclocked)

I'm guessing thats my bottleneck?

what do you think ?
a b à CPUs
July 17, 2009 4:08:53 AM

^ Well maybe but I doubt that's the reason...
Why not try to O/C your RAM too...

And what games do you play ?? Most of the older games, would be more of GPU dependent rather than CPU dependent...Only the newer and upcoming games would see a good improvement with the X3...
And in other general tasks would surely notice gains with the X3...
If you want to notice significant difference, then another 4850 would certainly help...
So when you have 2x HD 4850s, then the CPU power would come into play...that time, you would see that the X3 would easily keep up with the 2x HD 4850, which would have been tough for your older CPU...
July 17, 2009 7:31:31 AM

You mentioned faster HTT.

The 6000+ uses HT1 = 2000 mhz
The 720 BE uses HT3 = 4000 mhz

I am not expert on all this stuff (yet) but that HTT is the link between memory and cpu. And that is a very simple explanation.

Can you describe your oclox method? Did you use bios or AOD? There are a lot of things to learn about oclox. And I am not there yet on that info either. But I know you can play with some dangerous stuff like voltages etc and esp when you play w the htt and the north bridge stuff - be careful - get help.

= ALSO = It seems to me I recall mention once on the AMDzone forums, that the dual cores use a dual cpu driver - I am not sure but this might be why the fps frame rate is the same. I think you have to uninstall the dually driver - and I am not sure if you need a driver for the Phenom II 720 BE as well. Sorry for lack of details - but I would almost bet the you have a dual core driver holding your fps down. In effect, the sys might think it still has a dual core. Ph II is a very different cpu. Look into that.

also info on htt - tek stuff
http://www.amd.com/us/products/technologies/hypertransp...
http://www.hypertransport.org/
http://www.hypertransport.org/default.cfm?page=HyperTra...

AMD support probably has info on cpu driver if required - but it's probably need to uninstall the dual core driver - then you go zoom zoom. :) 
July 22, 2009 9:38:29 AM

so your saying that i need to uninstall dual core optimizer, i'm not sure where it's located or what name it goes by....

Would a fresh os install fix this problem?
!