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Gigabyte EX58-UD5 and Decreasing RAM Problem

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Anonymous
a b V Motherboard
September 19, 2009 7:49:51 AM

Apologies in advance for my lack of technical expertise but I am in need of help. I recently purchased a EX58-UD5 MOBO and am running 12 gigs of RAM via CORSAIR XMS3 12GB (6 x 2GB) modules. I set the BIOS to optimized settings and only changed the logo screen option.

During post the MOBO sees all 12 gigs of RAM as does Vista 64. However, after an hour or two and a reboot the MOBO and vista only see 8 gigs...two hours after usage they see 4 gigs. My assumption is that they RAM is getting hot with use and becoming inaccessible. 30 minutes after shutdown all 12 gigs reappear.

I am running six fans and a Zalman CPU cooler with the fans set at max...CPU/GPU temps are all in the high 30s and low 40s.

Should I check anything else before RMA ing the RAM...could it be the board?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.
a c 177 V Motherboard
September 19, 2009 3:30:10 PM

How fast are you clocking the RAM? ...and at what voltage?
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a c 177 V Motherboard
September 19, 2009 4:00:56 PM

I can speak highly of these:
http://a-power.com/product-4468-0-1
and, if you're interested in one, I'd 'snap it up' now, as I don't believe they're actually made any more... The fan is an abysmally poor, clear, lighted POC - I pulled mine, cut off the inner 'wings' that appear to merely block air, plopped on a good 60mm PWM fan, and dipped the mounting feet in a 'liquid rubber' that is made for tool handles, and can be found at any good-sized hardware store, as I wasn't too fond of the raw aluminum edges 'clamping on' to the multi-layered circuit boards that constitute a stick of RAM; and I was lucky enough to find an older model which 'leans' to one side, which make CPU fan clearance a non-issue (and, I got it dirt cheap, as they were a discontinued item - $11.00!)





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Anonymous
a b V Motherboard
September 19, 2009 4:35:34 PM

bilbat said:
How fast are you clocking the RAM? ...and at what voltage?

Thanks for the reply, here is the information I have on hand that I think may be relevant:

Memory Frequency: 1066 (Auto)
Dram Timing Selectable: (SPD)
Profile DDR Voltage 1.5V (greyed out)
QPI Voltage: 1.175V (greyed out)

In a following section:
DRAM Voltage 1.5 Auto

Channel A Data Vref: .750V Auto
Channel B Data Vref: .750V Auto
Channel C Data Vref: .750V Auto

Channel A Address Vref: .750V Auto
Channel B Address Vref: .750V Auto
Channel C Address Vref: .750V Auto

DDR15V: 1.520V
+5V: 5.107V

In the time it took to check the forum and reboot my RAM went down to 8 Gigs.
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a c 177 V Motherboard
September 19, 2009 10:38:31 PM

That's about as slow and as low as they'll go; it may not be a heat problem - you might try bumping up the RAM voltage a bit, and see if it helps. Memory speed does not matter on these boards - the difference between 1066 (the only speed Intel supports) and 1600 is imperceptible in actual operation... Also, a large number of people with either inaccesible, or 'disappearing' RAM have turned out to have bent CPU socket pins - might want to check 'em carefully...
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Anonymous
a b V Motherboard
September 20, 2009 3:30:52 AM

Well, it looks like the RAM kit may have been the culprit. I switched them out with Kingston KHX1600C8D3K3/6GX modules and so far under identical conditions no loss of RAM following reboots. I ran some memory intensive apps (sound production programs) and tested the memory via the vista utility and got temps up to high 80s F...all seems okay so far. Very strange problem considering the decrease in 2 gig increments which corresponded to the size of each stick.

Considering the new modules and my lack of technical know-how, should I simply set everything to auto in Bios or will I be cheating myself out of noticeable performance improvement without tweaking? The sole reason I upgraded to a 64 bit environment was the added ram needed for sound production apps (Sonar 8, numerous VSTs, etc.)

Thanks
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a c 177 V Motherboard
September 20, 2009 12:46:52 PM

Just need to do a 'load optimized defaults' from the BIOS - that forces the system to read the SPD/EPP/XMP off the RAM, and sets all the 'autos' properly (among other things); as I said, the 1156/1366 processors exhibit almost no observable difference at higher RAM speeds, so parameter 'tweaking' should always be 'aimed' toward stability, not speed. If you have good stability after a load optimized, you're good. An increase in CPU 'oomph' will show up in transcoding, as will the use of 'multi-threaded' apps... If you're interested (and have other than stock cooling, I can work up a low-voltage, minimal OC that will show up in a faster, more 'fluid' system - and I need the experience :pt1cable:  As more of these boards are showing up (and most of the 'gotchas' are getting conquered), more people are asking about them...
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Anonymous
a b V Motherboard
September 20, 2009 4:49:19 PM

Hi Bilbat. Yes, I'm open to suggestions. What I have is an Antec Twelve Hundred case with six fans and a Zalman CNPS9500A heat sink/fan combo which seems to keep the CPU quite cool. Internal temps are staying steady at around 37 to low 40 deg. C.

The new RAM kit and current settings appear pretty stable but I can sense that I'm not tapping intothe full potential of the system. Thanks again - look forward to your input.
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a c 177 V Motherboard
September 20, 2009 6:21:59 PM

I'll see what I can come up with - I haven't yet gotten any feedback from my first try, but I do have a lot of reasearch resources - should be able to make a noticeable difference!
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September 24, 2009 5:22:55 AM

For some reason my username would not register and was changed to anonymous and I've now re-registered. Still open to any suggestions on optimal settings.
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a c 177 V Motherboard
September 24, 2009 1:37:25 PM

Will try to get 'em for you today - just had seven teeth out(ch!) yesterday, and dentures fitted - need some projects to keep me distracted from the pain... :cry: 
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a c 177 V Motherboard
September 25, 2009 2:13:26 AM

Well - don't think I'll make it yet tonight - I have numbers, but formating and putting together instructions will take a bit yet... Hang on!
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a c 177 V Motherboard
September 25, 2009 3:45:01 PM

GA-EX58-UD5
http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Products/Motherboard/Product...
Intel i7-920 x20mult 2.666GHz .80-1.375V OC to 3.4GHz
http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=37147
Kingston KHX1600C8D3K3/6GX (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3-12800: 8-8-8-24-1t 1.65v nominal
http://www.valueram.com/datasheets/KHX1600C8D3K3_6GX.pd...

If you haven't yet done it, I would start by going to BIOS F9e; you can find it here:
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/263130-30-mobos
then, start with a BIOS' "Load Optimized Defaults"...

Before we start ramping things up, I want to teach you a new skill involving the BIOS: Do the <DEL> at the boot to enter the BIOS; notice, at the bottom, the <F11> "Save CMOS to BIOS" - hit this, and you should get a menu that will show a number (the count varies by BIOS) of empty 'slots', each of which will store an entire set of BIOS parameters, to be re-loaded from the corresponding <F12> "Load CMOS from BIOS"; this is a wonderful overclocker's feature. What I do with it, is to save my 'baseline' working parameters, so if I change something that 'irritates' the board, and forces a reset of all the parameters to defaults, or, even worse, get so screwed up I need to do a 'clear CMOS', I can get back to my starting point with no effort, and without having to remember 85 separate settings! Another thing it prevents is two hours' troubleshooting, having forgotten a change to a crucial parameter - like, "wait a minute - didn't I have the Trd at seven?!" It's pretty self-explanatory, and I alway urge people to start right away by taking the time to give the 'slots' names that mean something: in two hours, "Try2" and "Try3" will not be very helpful, but "450@+10MCH" and "450@+15MCH" will! Another use is for 'green' settings; overclocks, as a rule, do not 'play well' with green features, such as 'down-clocking' and 'down-volting'; with the storage slots, you can set up one profile, say "Green", with all the settings at 'stock' values, and all the 'green' features
enabled; another, say "Balls2Wall" with a full overclock, and all the 'green' stuff turned off... Another neat feature of this 'slot' system is, for most BIOS, the mechanism itself will keep track of which ones have booted successfully, and how many times (up to, I believe, a max of five)!


On the "MB Intelligent Tweaker(M.I.T.)" page:

"CPU Clock Ratio" to "20x"
"CPU Frequency" - this one can't be set, it's calculated, and will change when we set the next few items...

On the "Advanced CPU Features" sub-page:

"Intel(R) Turbo Boost Tech" to "Enabled"
"CPU Cores Enabled" to "All"
"CPU Multi Threading" to "Enabled"
"CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E)" to "Disabled"
"C3/C6/C7 State Support" to "Disabled"
"CPU Thermal Monitor" to "Enabled"
"CPU EIST Function" to "Disabled"
"Virtualization Technology" to "Enabled" - this allows use of Win7's fantastic VirtualXp feature...
"Bi-Directional PROCHOT" to "Enabled"

On the "Uncore & QPI Features" sub-page:

"QPI Link Speed" to "x36" (may 'bump' to x44 later...)
Uncore Frequency" to "20" (may 'bump' to x22 later...)
Isonchronous Frequency" to "Enabled"

On the "Advanced Clock Control" sub-page:

>>>>>Standard Clock Control<<<<<
"Base Clock (BCLK) Control" to "Enabled"
"BCLK Frequency (MHz)" to "160"
"PCI Express Frequency (MHz)" to "101" (not auto)
"C.I.A.2" to "Disabled"
>>>>>Advanced Clock Control<<<<<
"CPU Clock Drive" to "800mV"
"PCI Express Clock Drive" to "900mV"
"CPU Clock Skew" to "0ps"
"IOH Clock Skew" to "0ps"

On the "Advanced DRAM Features" sub-page:

"Performance Enhance" to "Standard"
"Extreme Memory Profile (X.M.P)" to "Disabled"
"System Memory Multiplier (SPD)" to "10x"
"DRAM Timing Selectable (SPD)" to "Manual"

>>>>>Channel A/B/C Timing Settings: (all the same)

>>>>>Channel A Standard Timing Control:
"CAS Latency Time" to "8"
"tRCD" to "8"
"tRP" to "8"
"tRAS" to "24"


Italicized values should be good in auto after "Load Optimized Defaults"; have put in some 'check me' values [I'm uncertain yet about some - please post back with your 'auto's], but to start, leave in auto...

>>>>>Channel A Advanced Timing Control:
"tRC" to "36"
"tRRD" to "5"
"tWTR" to "6?"
"tWR" to "12"
"tWTP" to "24?"
"tWL" to "7"
"tRFC" to "88"
"tRTP" to "8"
"tFAW" to "??"
"Command Rate (CMD)" to "1T"
>>>>>Channel A Misc Timing Control
"Round Trip" to "??"



On the "Advanced Voltage Control" sub-page:

>>>CPU
"Load Line Calibration" to "Disabled"(this works differently on different boards - on mine, it's worse "enabled" than "disabled" - the function is supposed to cure a phenomenon called Vdroop - the CPU voltage regulation circuit causes the CPU core voltage to sag, or 'droop' under high loadings; hopefully, we're going to be at a low enough voltage to just ignore this...)
"CPU Vcore" to "1.35"
"QPI/VTT Voltage 1.150v" to "1.374" May need to bump for stability
"CPU PLL 1.800v" to "Auto"

>>>MCH/ICH
"PCIE 1.500v" to "1.5"
"QPI PLL 1.100v" to "1.2"
"IOH Core 1.100v" to "1.2"
"ICH I/O 1.500v" to "1.5"
"ICH Core 1.1v" to "1.2"

>>>DRAM
"DRAM Voltage 1.500v" to "1.66"
"DRAM Termination 0.750v" to "Auto"
"Ch-A Data VRef. 0.750v" to "Auto"
"Ch-B Data VRef. 0.750v" to "Auto"
"Ch-C Data VRef. 0.750v" to "Auto"
"Ch-A Address VRef. 0.750v" to "Auto"
"Ch-B Address VRef. 0.750v" to "Auto"
"Ch-C Address VRef. 0.750v" to "Auto"


On the "Integrated Peripherals" page:

"USB Storage Function" to "Disabled"

And that should do it!

I should point out that getting two reboots in a row here is perfectly normal behavior; it seems that, when you change certain settings (and we don't exactly know which ones - the only sure one I know is Trd - if you change it, I think you get the 'twin' reboot) it boots once to 'see where it's at', recalculates its remaining 'auto' settings, saves them, and then boots again. Three reboots in a row, however, usually indicates that the board was 'given indigestion' by your settings, and is going back to defaults. This sometimes goes astray, and it doesn't get back into proper operation - for example, at this point, mine will sometimes 'lock' itself into 111MHz x a six multiplier - and take a week to do a whole boot - that's time to do a CMOS reset, and use your 'stored' <F12> profile to get back to where you were...

Good luck!

Bill
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September 28, 2009 5:47:18 AM

Hi Bill,

Thanks for taking the time to make the suggestions. Here is what happened:

I stayed with the F7 Bios because a) I am too chicken and b) even after getting up the nerve, the flash drive with the new revision on it didn't seem to load. I think it was because of an incorrect boot order...there are so many usb choices (zip, hdd, etc.).

But I made all the changes as outlined and sure enough I got the double reboot syndrome...except just prior to reinitiating post I got the error about a boot failure due to voltage changes or overclocking and system may not match current h/w. Windows loaded and no change, same cpu speed, ram, etc.

I went back into Bios and remembered that the one thing that seemed to irk the system right off the bat was the Dram voltage, 1.66 was hot pink while one notch below, 1.65 or 1.64 was white...so I changed that, and same thing....despite bios showing the CPU at 3.20Ghz with those settings, it refuses to load the same during post as some kind of safety measure.

Any thoughts?...I've since reverted to the last known stable setting...stock.
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a c 177 V Motherboard
September 28, 2009 2:14:08 PM

Thanks for posting back!
Quote:
except just prior to reinitiating post I got the error about a boot failure due to voltage changes or overclocking and system may not match current h/w

I have seen discussion of this, but can't quickly find where... It will take me a bit of time to 'reacquire the target' :whistle:  If you're still willing, I'd like to keep working with you on this - I've gotta learn (have a 'build list of, at the minimum, two servers, a 'browser', a touch-screen 'kitchen utility' machine, and a pair of HTPCs - want to transition ALL of 'em to i7 tech!) and , and there are lots of people having great success with these setups - finally!

Quote:
I stayed with the F7 Bios because a) I am too chicken and b) even after getting up the nerve, the flash drive with the new revision on it didn't seem to load. I think it was because of an incorrect boot order...there are so many usb choices (zip, hdd, etc.)


My fault - I should have thought of this ahead of time - one of the settings we made probably disabled the ability to boot to a USB key for flashing:

On the "Integrated Peripherals" page:

"USB Storage Function" to "Disabled" : this function appears to load BIOS drivers for USB, before the system has access to the OS' MOBO drivers - and often causes strange troubles on GBs... Enable this to load your BIOS from USB, then:

On the "Advanced BIOS Features" page,
Set "Second" or "Third" "Boot Device" to "USB-HDD"
and I think you'll be ready to burn (the BIOS, that is!)

Any problems - post back - I may be a bit slow today, as a few days back I had a bunch of teeth pulled and dentures fitted - am in ungodly pain, and have to run into town to have an 'adjustment' made! :cry: 
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September 29, 2009 5:03:07 AM

Hi Bill...hope you feel better soon, tooth related pain is agonizing as it resides in the head and hence takes over one's entire sense of well being...here's to a speedy recovery.

So here is some info which may help clear some stuff up or further confound.

The USB Storage Function setting was in fact enabled as was the boot device order...still no go. So I checked out the hard disk priority and lo and behold, BIOS had designated the USB flash drive a hard disk along with my other three internal drives. So I changed the boot order and set the flash drive as the first, the hard disk with the OS as second and so on, saved to CMOS and rebooted...once post got to the boot from cd portion of things it reported "Corrupted bootable drive or partition" or something to that effect and a cursor sat blinking menacingly...I cringed and after a few minutes removed the USB drive and rebooted...and back into windows. For some reason it doesn't want to work with the flash drive despite subsequent formats and re-extracted files.
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a c 177 V Motherboard
September 29, 2009 7:25:47 PM

I know they're pretty fussy about formatting, MBR structure, and the like - seems to me I saw a 'simple' tool recently that is supposed to help - I'll see if I can 're-acquire' it and post a pointer...
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!