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WEI score went down for my SSD?

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November 28, 2010 2:43:17 AM

I have a Crucial RealSSD C300 128GB Solid State Drive. when I first put the computer together and ran the WEI I got a 7.9 for this drive. Just recently I decided to re-run the assessment and the score dropped to 7.5. I decided to try re-installing the Marvell SATA 6 GB/s Controller driver and the score actually increased to 7.8. I assume some viruses actually got in and corrupted the drivers, since I had a ton of viruses when I scanned. Now I'm just concerned why it's stuck at 7.8 and not 7.9. I know that it's a very small difference and kind of silly to rely on WEI, but it still bothers me that this drive used to get a 7.9 score. Are there any other drivers that could have been corrupted that would affect the Disk score? There are no more viruses on this computer, I scanned with a few different ones, like Malware-Bytes and Avira, and it removed all of them.

I know a .1 difference is very small, but I don't like the fact that it's lower than what I originally had, even if I can't really notice a performance decrease. I really wish I could figure out why it's not receiving the 7.9 score anymore.

More about : wei score ssd

a b G Storage
November 28, 2010 3:23:38 AM

Your virus scanners may have removed the viruses from your computer but they cannot undo the damage that the virus has done. If your hand gets a bacteria or infection and needs to be amputated, the anti-biotic you take or disinfectant may kill the bacteria or infection but your hand cannot be UN-amputated and put back. Same goes for viruses. More over, just because Malware-Bytes and Avira scanned doesn't mean anything, you might still have plenty of viruses.
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November 28, 2010 10:15:56 AM

over time your SSD will get slower and that's why your score is .1 less.
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a b G Storage
November 28, 2010 10:43:45 AM

How full is the drive? SSDs tend to slow down a bit when they are near to full.

Honestly though, I wouldn't worry about it too much. Your drive is fine - it still outscores (barely) my X25-M G2.
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a b G Storage
November 28, 2010 2:40:51 PM

cjl said:
How full is the drive? SSDs tend to slow down a bit when they are near to full.

Honestly though, I wouldn't worry about it too much. Your drive is fine - it still outscores (barely) my X25-M G2.


What does your X25-M G2 get?...mine gets a 7.8.
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a b G Storage
November 29, 2010 6:46:53 AM

Really, don't worry about it. WEI is a completely meaningless metric.
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November 30, 2010 2:24:29 PM

hmmm well I was curious so I did some research and it seems ssd's really do slow down the more you use them, although it seems that only write speed is largely affected. I ran a disk read/write monitoring program that I had run when I first got the ssd, and it seems that my write speed did decrease a little from it's initial speed, which would explain the slight score decrease. That's pretty unfortunate that that happens, though from what I read, a secure erase/format would restore the drive back to its initial speed?

To be honest, I'm also not entirely sure if the computer is virus-free, so I probably will just do a fresh install of windows, which means I might as well do the secure format too.
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November 30, 2010 7:09:44 PM

yea no kidding lol that's why I was considering not giving my primary gaming computer an internet connection. I can accept the problem with the SSD's, as the decrease in performance is barely noticeable (if at all), and takes a long time. But the viruses are just ridiculous, and can screw your system up so fast. It doesn't seem to matter how careful I am on the internet, I always get loaded with them. And it's like blackhawk said, you can remove them, but the damage is already done.
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a b G Storage
November 30, 2010 7:48:45 PM

IDK about you guys but my SSD has trim and I've had it for a year and its write speed is practically the same...actually it is the same. SO you if your SSD has trim there is no point in the secure format, just reinstall windows and it will be fine. And yoshinat0r, viruses must love your PC lol, i've had my system for a year and I do tons of web browsing and i never had a virus, actually had 1 but removed it. You sure you are using a good AV, updating it and using your firewall?
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a b G Storage
November 30, 2010 8:15:20 PM

blackhawk1928 said:
What does your X25-M G2 get?...mine gets a 7.8.


7.6.
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December 1, 2010 9:38:19 AM

blackhawk1928 said:
IDK about you guys but my SSD has trim and I've had it for a year and its write speed is practically the same...actually it is the same. SO you if your SSD has trim there is no point in the secure format, just reinstall windows and it will be fine. And yoshinat0r, viruses must love your PC lol, i've had my system for a year and I do tons of web browsing and i never had a virus, actually had 1 but removed it. You sure you are using a good AV, updating it and using your firewall?


It depends on how you are using your SSD. If it only has the OS on it and all other documents on a HDD then you are not writing to the SSD enough to cause any degradation.

However, if you have only the SDD with everything on it and you are doing a lot of writes and deletes then you will see degradation faster.
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December 1, 2010 12:45:14 PM

Actually I forgot I had all of my firewalls turned off because I do a lot of LAN gaming with my friends and it always interferes. Maybe that could've been some of the issue :na:  Also I've been going without an active AV guard for a long time, only just recently started using one. Normally I've just been scanning with Malware-bytes every day or so, guess that's not really good enough lol
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a b G Storage
December 1, 2010 6:19:53 PM

Yoshinat0r said:
Actually I forgot I had all of my firewalls turned off because I do a lot of LAN gaming with my friends and it always interferes. Maybe that could've been some of the issue :na:  Also I've been going without an active AV guard for a long time, only just recently started using one. Normally I've just been scanning with Malware-bytes every day or so, guess that's not really good enough lol


Wow...and you're surprised?
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a b G Storage
December 1, 2010 9:42:10 PM

Having a firewall off essentially places are target on your computer. Not only is it open to attack , but it also tells every computer that does a port scan which of its ports are open and which are closed, so it's basically telling the whole world "I have x,y and z security holes, come and attack me!"
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a b G Storage
December 1, 2010 10:07:03 PM

I can't imagine going for even a second without a Firewall and AV guard...having nothing is just crazy. For "reasonable" security you should have a firewall, user account control on, an anti-virus/anti-malware guard and a password IMO.
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December 2, 2010 2:52:54 AM

Well as far as firewalls go, I was always told that they're pretty useless, never really knew for sure myself. Having no AV guard, however, I know was pretty bad. I just didn't realize how much malware and viruses would actually attack your computer if you didn't have those things. Now I'm a little more knowledgeable to say the least XD
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a b G Storage
December 2, 2010 6:32:35 AM

If you have a router then it will most likely have a firewall (unless that is what you disabled). Router/hardware firewalls are generally pretty good because they don't just keep ports closed, they hide them as well, although I'm sure there are software firewalls that also do this. When a port scanner probes your computer the router simply doesn't respond and the computer doing the scanning doesn't know any better so moves onto the next target. If you're using NAT (which you almost certainly are if you have a router) then the router will never respond even to legitimate packets unless they are a reply to a connection initiated by a computer on your network, or if you've explicitly allowed an external computer to initiate a connection with a computer on your LAN (ie. port forwarding).
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December 9, 2010 3:11:18 PM

Upon doing a fresh install of Windows 7 and re-running the WEI score, it has dropped to 7.6. Oh joy lol I'm beginning to not even care about WEI at this point, it seems so inconsistent. Just to see why exactly it was getting a 7.6, I typed "winsat disk" into the command prompt and these were the results:




To compare, I ran a new ssd benchmarking tool called AS SSD and here are the results I got from that:




The AS SSD results are just about on par with the rated speeds of this drive, but the results of winsat are showing a seqeuntial read speed of 258 MB/s, which is significantly lower, about 100 MB/s drop. I don't know what exactly to believe.
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December 9, 2010 3:39:35 PM

try using atto benchmark,your results are much better than my ocz vertex 2 90gb!
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December 9, 2010 4:11:23 PM

Results of ATTO:



I found it kind of odd that the read speed dropped about 50 MB/s on 1024 KB, unless that's normal for the speeds to kind of fluctuate, don't really know.
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a b G Storage
December 9, 2010 11:37:17 PM

Benchmarking hammers the drive, especially AS-SSD. If you want the drive to live long enough to be used for what you bought it for I suggest you stop worrying and just use it ;) 
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December 11, 2010 11:45:27 AM

randomizer said:
Benchmarking hammers the drive, especially AS-SSD. If you want the drive to live long enough to be used for what you bought it for I suggest you stop worrying and just use it ;) 



NO KIDDING!!!!!!
Must people dont know this and they keep testing their SSDs.

People really need to learn how to and take the time to research things on the internet.
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December 11, 2010 2:44:33 PM

mark_k said:
over time your SSD will get slower and that's why your score is .1 less.



why is this ????
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December 11, 2010 4:45:16 PM

I was only wondering why the windows harddisk assessment was showing a much lower sequential read than all the other programs I was using to test the drive. Things like that just bother me, I can't help it. I'm much more concerned with numbers than the actual feel of the performance, it's just the way I've always been.
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a b G Storage
December 11, 2010 11:35:08 PM

Yoshinat0r said:
I was only wondering why the windows harddisk assessment was showing a much lower sequential read than all the other programs I was using to test the drive. Things like that just bother me, I can't help it. I'm much more concerned with numbers than the actual feel of the performance, it's just the way I've always been.

They all read and write different data. Many companies rate their drives using ATTO because it typically produces bigger numbers.
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December 12, 2010 11:00:56 AM

Quote:
The good news is that after an initial dip in performance, SSDs tend to level off..

Users typically notice that an SSD drive runs at the manufacturer's stated peak I/O performance at first, but soon after that it begins to drop. That's because, unlike a hard disk drive, any write operation to an SSD requires not one step, but two: an erase followed by the write.

When an SSD is new, the NAND flash memory inside it has been pre-erased; Users start with a clean slate, so to speak. But, as data is written to the drive, data management algorithms in the controller begin to move that data around the flash memory in an operation known as wear-leveling. Even though wear-leveling is meant to prolong the life of the drive, it can eventually lead to performance issues.

SSD performance and endurance are related. Generally, the poorer the performance of a drive, the shorter the lifespan. That's because the management overhead of an SSD is related to how many writes and erases to the drive take place. The more write/erase cycles there are, the shorter the drive's lifespan. Consumer-grade multi-level cell (MLC) memory can sustain from 2,000 to 10,000 write cycles. Enterprise-class single-level cell (SLC) memory can last through 10 times the number of write cycles of an MLC-based drive.

A brief refresher on the difference between the two technologies: SLC simply means one bit of data is written to each flash memory cell, while MLC allows two bits, or more, to be written to cells. MLC drives are notably less expensive than SLC drives.

Manufacturers moderate how long the flash memory in an SSD will last in several ways, but all involve either adding DRAM cache -- so data writes are buffered to reduce the number of write/erase cycles -- or using special firmware located in the drive's processor or controller to combine writes for efficiency.

According to Bob Merritt, an analyst with research firm Convergent Semiconductors, another element of SSD longevity is whether extra memory cells are available and, if so, how many. Some manufacturers over-provision storage, so that when blocks of flash memory wear out, additional blocks become available. For example, a drive may be listed as offering 120GB of memory, but may actually contain 140GB of capacity. The extra 20GB remains unused until it's needed.

The performance problems involving Intel's consumer-grade X25-M SSD were related to its wear-leveling algorithm.

At its most basic, wear-leveling algorithms are used to more evenly distribute data across flash memory so that no one portion wears out faster than another, which prolongs the life of whole drive. The SSD's controller in wear-leveling operations keeps a record of where data is set down on the drive as it's relocated from one portion to another.


Wow this post is very unlike your other posts of "+1".
I would almost think that this is a case of plagiarism.... :ouch:  ...just kidding.... :love: 
Great information! Where did you get this information from?
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December 12, 2010 2:36:28 PM

is there a program that can erase or restore your SSD ???? Or maintain it ?
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a c 353 G Storage
December 12, 2010 5:35:28 PM

My turn +9.99 ^
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January 11, 2011 7:42:14 AM

Just had new system built. Primary HD (for OS) is Corsair F120 SSD, second HD (Programs and Data) is a Seagate Barracuda 2TB SATAIII. The builder must have run a WEI assessmentof 7.6 for primary disk tranfer rate.
I assume Internet Explorer(8) is on the primary drive. Will deleting temp. internet files, browsing history, etc. often, degrade the SSD?
Another question- After surfing for awhile my Cached memory greatly increases and the "Free" Physical Memory- according to Task Manager falls below 500MB. (I have 6GB RAM) Is this normal? When I restart the system, the Cached mem greatly reduces and the Free mem almost matches Available mem.
This leads me to my last question for now- Is there anyway of "freeing" the Cached Mem without restarting the system? Or is it best to restart?
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a b G Storage
January 11, 2011 8:04:15 AM

grilldog said:
Will deleting temp. internet files, browsing history, etc. often, degrade the SSD?

If you want to avoid degrading the SSD then you need to prevent the writes in the first place. The frequency of deletion isn't important, only the amount of data that is deleted, which is going to depend on how much is actually written. It's not really an issue unless you're writing huge amounts. Windows is forever writing data anyway.

grilldog said:
Another question- After surfing for awhile my Cached memory greatly increases and the "Free" Physical Memory- according to Task Manager falls below 500MB. (I have 6GB RAM) Is this normal? When I restart the system, the Cached mem greatly reduces and the Free mem almost matches Available mem.
This leads me to my last question for now- Is there anyway of "freeing" the Cached Mem without restarting the system? Or is it best to restart?

Cached memory is memory that is being used by SuperFetch. It's prefetching data for commonly used programs and putting it in memory so that when you run those programs some or all of the data is already there and doesn't need to be read from the HDD/SSD on demand. If a running application requires more memory than is available then some of the cached memory will be freed to accommodate it. There's no need to worry about having a lot of cached memory, it's purely part of Windows' default memory management policy. You can disable the SuperFetch service if you want though.
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January 11, 2011 11:43:29 AM


New system:
i7 950 cpu
Win7 Professional
Asus Sabertooth X58 Motherboard
CoolerMaster V6GT CPU cooler
Corsair F120 SSD as Primary "C" drive for OS
Barracuda 2TB SATAIII for data(and I hope for programs) "D" drive
Thermaltake 650W Modular PSU
6GBs HyperX CL9 RAM
Asus DVD burner

Quote:
If you want to avoid degrading the SSD then you need to prevent the writes in the first place
I checked and found IE8 on Primary "C" SSD. Does this mean it's best to put IE8 on my secondary "D" data drive (Barracuda 2TB SATAIII) so that the TempInternet files are written to it instead of the SSD Primary OS drive. Can it be put on my "D" drive?
Is it possible to make the 'data' that Windows is 'forever writing' to be written on the 'D' drive? I think I've found out how to create Document, Music, Picture, and Video folders on my "D" drive so that respective files will be save to them instead of the Document folders in Win7 on the OS drive. Is there any other data that can be made to be written on my "D" drive?

Along this line of thinking, should I put Windows Office 2010 on my "D" drive instead of the SSD to make all Documents be written to my "D" data drive? Is it possible? I would think that with a SSD OS drive, it would be advisable. In my old system I had Outlook Express ask for my password before it downloaded emails from my main email provider (which I never gave). And I made OExpress ask for my password before I sent an email. I saved almost all emails I sent by OE. Many of the emails I send have pictures, either single large files or many small files, so that the email sizes are frequently 3MB+. This is why I want to put Office on my "D" drive. Not to mention saving all my other documents and pics.

You mentioned that Superfetch can be disabled and malmental said that Superfetch is disabled on SSDs.
Is this something that is done automatically by Win7 Professional or should it have been done by the system builder? How do I check if Superfetch is disabled? If it isn't should I make the system builder aware that it isn't and ask the they disable it?

My old computer was an AMD 2600+, WinXP, 80GB SATAII hard drive. I skimped on the CPU and OS version. and didn't want to make the same mistake again. I didn't plan on getting a new computer when I did, but when Fry's had the i7 950 for a one day only sale price of $199, I felt I had to jump in and get a new comp. I had heard of SSD's and took the plunge, but knew that a 120GB HD wasn't enough for Office, World of Warcraft, PhotoShop and my evergrowing photo library of pics. With the advise of a computer salesman I put a system together in the store, spur of the moment. I've had to become a quick study of the newer hardware and OS. It's a bit overwhelming. THANK YOU and all of the knowledgable posters for your help!!

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January 11, 2011 7:45:51 PM

OOps, my bad.
It's an EVGA GTX470 SC
W/stock settings on all hardware
I get WEI scores of:
7.5 for CPU
7.5 for Memory
7.8 for Graphics and Gaming Graphics
7.6 for Primary HD

I will note that the SSD was a return. After I decided to get the Corsair, when the salesman checked to see if there were any in stock. The return was the only one. It has full factory warranty.
I did notice that the first time I turned it on the Windows did a Disk Check and there were a few orphaned files that were dealt with. From what I know now, this may have been from the first buyer's install. If the orphaned files were from the first buyer and were deleted or written over, does this affect the amount of usable space on my drive? I realize that not all of a disk drive's capacity is usable when it is intstalled. (Mine has a capacity of 111GBs of the 120 that its is rated according to System Properties. My secondary drive has 1.81TB capacity out of 2 that it is rated.) Also, did this possible 1st use and deletion of any programs/files by the 1st owner cause any degradation of the drive so that it got only a 7.6 WEI HD score? It's rated at 285MB/s-read and 275MB/s-write. For it being a return- should I have gotten a discount?
All I know is that I am happy that Windows 7 Pro loads in under 55 seconds.

One other note: I transfered some 59GBs of pics to my "D" drive by way of a USB portabe HD that I use for backup. When I went through the process of removing it, I noticed that my computer gave me the option of "Ejecting" my "Corsair CSSD-F120GB2 SCSI Disk Drive", similar to the way I had to eject the USB drive. Is this normal for SSDs? Where did the "SCSI" come from?
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a b G Storage
January 11, 2011 10:17:16 PM

grilldog said:
I checked and found IE8 on Primary "C" SSD. Does this mean it's best to put IE8 on my secondary "D" data drive (Barracuda 2TB SATAIII) so that the TempInternet files are written to it instead of the SSD Primary OS drive. Can it be put on my "D" drive?

It can be but that doesn't solve the problem because the temp files are written to a hidden directory somewhere under your user directory. I can't remember exactly where as I don't use IE.

grilldog said:
Is it possible to make the 'data' that Windows is 'forever writing' to be written on the 'D' drive?

Install it on D: :)  There's ways of moving many of the temporary directories to other drives but there could be other locations, perhaps under the Windows directory, that can't be moved with a running installation of Windows. You're not looking at a major problem though. Temporary files from, say, "opening" a file in the browser as opposed to saving it, or "opening" a ZIP archive (which still requires extracting to somewhere), will add a lot more writes than this.

grilldog said:
Along this line of thinking, should I put Windows Office 2010 on my "D" drive instead of the SSD to make all Documents be written to my "D" data drive?

Normally these are saved under your Documents directory, so moving Office will only prevent the initial 1GB or so that you will write when you install it. Outlook stores emails in a hidden directory similar to IE if I recall correctly.

grilldog said:
You mentioned that Superfetch can be disabled and malmental said that Superfetch is disabled on SSDs.
Is this something that is done automatically by Win7 Professional or should it have been done by the system builder? How do I check if Superfetch is disabled? If it isn't should I make the system builder aware that it isn't and ask the they disable it?

That was a mistake on my part. I believe it is generally disabled by default, not out of necessity, but because it is less useful when the SSD is already quick. I think Windows still does some basic prefetching even when it is disabled, but it's not nearly as aggressive.
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January 11, 2011 11:31:42 PM

Quote:
OCZ Technology 60 GB Vertex 2 Series SATA II - 7.6WEI


Odd, my OCZ V2 60gig scores a 7.8.
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January 27, 2011 1:41:40 AM

Quote:
Will disk defragmentation be disabled by default on SSDs?

Yes. The automatic scheduling of defragmentation will exclude partitions on devices that declare themselves as SSDs. Additionally, if the system disk has random read performance characteristics above the threshold of 8 MB/sec, then it too will be excluded. The threshold was determined by internal analysis.


Oh? Then would someone explain to me why I had to actually disable this in Win 7 64 myself? I have two Zalman N-Series 128 GB drives I just built into my new "little beast" system (with no other drives mounted).

It appears that now in Win 7 Task Scheduler (TS) has become an integral part of the OS. In fact, Win7 Pro 64 will not even let you disable the service, at all. And in TS I found the scheduled defrag, using autoruns. Well, it isn't gonna run now! :D 

And neither is just about anything else, either- because I have disabled just about everything in there- and there is a LOT of stuff scheduled by default. And still here typing so, can't be that bad. I do all my updates manually.

Not running defrag is weird to me, as I get used to this SSD thing.
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January 27, 2011 1:37:03 PM

Thanks....Nope, not in RAID. But if they were, that might have been a possible cause, so good question!

Anyone running Win7 Pro 64 (and possibly other versions) should check this for themselves, because at least on this machine it looks like had I not caught that, Win7 would be automatically defragging my SSD's! :ouch: 

Get autoruns and see for yourself if there is a defrag scheduled, or you can also check in Task Scheduler itself- but autoruns lists them all- even opsys schedules.

And oh, malmental- my machine spec is in my sig... Click "my little beast"
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January 27, 2011 1:57:37 PM

Well, not that it matters much relevant to this thread, so sorry for the off topic post OP, but he asked...

My Little Beast
i7-2600K/Hyper 212+/ EVGA GTX 580 SC
ASUS P8P67 DL/ 8GB Ripjaws DDR3 2K
CM HAF X/ CM SP Gold 1KW/ Pioneer BR Burner
2 Zalman NS 128GB SSD/ Win 7 Pro 64/ 65 inch Mitsu DLP in 3D @2x1920x1080x60Hz

Sorry you are having trouble with the forum, malmental- you are apparently one of the top dogs around here...You contacted the mod team?
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