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Two GTX 295's or two GTX 285? Other sites says gtx 295's

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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May 26, 2009 11:08:02 PM

Ok guys sorry I'm asking this again, but I read a few post in slizone.com that the gtx 285 in sli out performed two gtx 295's in sli (quad sli as they call it). But I read a few sites crowning the GTX 295 as being the king of all video cards at the moment, I read it from here on toms hardware and xbitlabs.com. I know these two webpages are respectable ones but now I'm all confused. Here is the 18 page review on the gt 295 where they crown it as being the best video card to date, over the gtx 285 and the radeon 4870 and 4870 x2's. But the community at slizone.com says otherwise. Its hard to argue against a 18 page extensive review but the slizone.com forums completely confused me.

Here is just 1 of many post on slizone.com claiming the 295's are obsolete to a 285: http://forums.slizone.com/index.php?showtopic=35736


Here is the link to that 18 page extensive review of the gtx 295's beating EVERYTHING: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/evga-gef...


Here is some questions I have:


1. What are gtx 295's? Is it a gtx 260 or gtx 275 (is this an OC version of the 260?) with dual cores or is it gtx 280's with dual cores?

2. Is the only con of the gtx 295's the memory? Its about 1.8 gigs of memory, 200 less than a 285, does that 200 megs makes that much of a difference?

3. I read a few older post and seen the ati 4870 x2's on toms hardware and xbitlabs that were the top video cards before the 295's came out, is this true? What are the 4870 x2's? two 4650's?

4. Also read on another site where they had an 18 page review on the gtx 295, showed the most extensive test I ever seen in which the gtx 295's beat every setup there was, and they had many setups such as 285's in sli, 4890's in sli, 4870's x2 in xfire and 4870's in tri-xfire? ( 1 4870 x2 and 1 regular 4870 I beleive). The gtx 295's beat all of them in this extensive review, and its pretty convincing as it was such a complex test, testing 10+ games with the highest resolutions + many more test. Check it out guys http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/evga-gef...

Tell me what you think, and hopefully the decision I'll make will be a a lot easier and less confusing. Thanks all!


Sam
May 26, 2009 11:13:23 PM

Edit: the xbitlabs test link I psoted tested only 1 gtx 295's against everything, but it still performed amazing. Anyone know why they didnt test it in quad sli?
May 26, 2009 11:46:13 PM

Two GTX 295's are better than two GTX 285's, I think where you are confused is that someone did 3 GTX 285's vs 2 GTX 295's (Tri-sli vs quad-sli). In that comparison the GTX 285's usually come out on top due to the fact that they have faster processing cores and less perfomrance is lost in GPU scaling.
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May 27, 2009 4:33:20 AM

thekid, I think it was two 285 cards is where people said was better than two 295's. They were also saying 1 295 = two 275's. here is a link from slizone.com, it seems as everyone from slizone.com says the same thing that 285s in sli is far superior. Did you also check out the xbitlab.com link I posted? its pretty interesting. Thx for your help thekid, more input is def appreciated :) 
May 27, 2009 4:36:46 AM

No. Two GTX 285's do not match two GTX 295's. Two GTX 285's would beat a single GTX 295 (which has two GPU's inside of it...is that where you are confused?). It would take three GTX 285's to beat two GTX 295's, and it would go back and forth between titles and resolutions.
May 27, 2009 3:57:48 PM

I understand what you are saying, and this is why I'm confused ebcause in slizone they say 285's in sli is better than 295 in quad sli. Here is the link to just one of the post that they have like this: http://forums.slizone.com/index.php?showtopic=35736
can you read and tell me why they think its better? thanks thekid.
May 27, 2009 3:59:34 PM

btw is it confirmed that 1 gtx 295 is actually two 275's? I always thought 1 gtx 295 = two 280's.
a b U Graphics card
May 27, 2009 4:17:23 PM

bodyops said:
btw is it confirmed that 1 gtx 295 is actually two 275's? I always thought 1 gtx 295 = two 280's.


They are roughly the same as a couple of 275's. Not 280's.

As for the post you linked in slizone. They are telling the OP that 2 285's would be better for HIS system, not every system. I.e. it is silly to spend the money on 2 295's unless you are playing at 30" native res, for 1920*1200 sli 285's is far better bang for buck.

xthekidx is correct in saying that 3 SLI 285's is the best for 30" res, but that 2 295's will generally beat 2 285's.

All the article is saying is that there is a point where spending mroe oney just isn't worth it.
a b U Graphics card
May 27, 2009 4:26:18 PM

Both setups are overkill, and I strongly recommend avoiding dual GPU solutions due to driver issues (And short overall useful lifespan...).
May 27, 2009 6:20:21 PM

Thx daedalus and gamerk for the info. So for the system I am going to run which is:

Micro atx NZX rogue cube case: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

MB: ASUS Rampage II Gene LGA1366 mATX

Dual gtx 295 quad sli

6 gigs of ram

1200 PSU (which is the best 1200 W PSU btw?)

920 core i7 cpu

Windows Vista Ultimate 64 bit.

I am planning on building it at ibuypower.com since it has been a while since I build a computer, last one was back in 2003 and it was an agp system single card, so it was easy, now its much more complex.

Here is the link to the config page: http://www.ibuypower.com/ibp/store [...] px?mid=408

And my last questions:

1. What is, in this picture of the system being build, what is that huge heat sink and fan? Is it for the cpu? because that thing is huge compared to my brothers heat sink he has in his p6t (regular MB) asus MB with the core i7 920 cpu. He has the normal certified CPU Fan and Heatsink, but that thing in the picture is huge!

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-r...

2. Can you guys look at the ibuypower.com config page and tell me if that huge fan and heatsink is available as an option.

http://www.ibuypower.com/ibp/store/configurator.aspx?mi...

3. Also the config page list a liquid cooling cpu component, what kind of liquid cooling is that? I thought you needed a radiator for any type of liquid cooling? A radiator wouldnt fit in that Nzx case.

4. How much knowledge would I need to build this system myself if that heat sink and fan setup isnt available on ibuypower.com? In 2003 I built a barebones system with an agp MX 420 Nvidia video card (if I remember correctly). It was easy back then, psu connected to the MB, then power cords conencted to the HDD, CD/DVD rom,, IDE cables from the MB to the HDD and cddvd rom drives, and finally pop in the AGP card, install the cpu and fan/heatsink, and bam, ready to fire up. I looked at my brothers p6t system and there is so much more stuff nowadays. Dunno if I could manage to build one myself, and where I live there isn't much computer technicians who specialize in gaming rigs or even a hard fit build like this one I'm building.

I think thats all the Q's I have guys, thanks for being patient and friendly.
a b U Graphics card
May 27, 2009 6:32:33 PM

That is a Thermalright Ultra-120 eXtreme heatsink. It is for the CPu if you want to do overclockign and the like... You need to do a lot of research if you dont know that before you try to put this together. There i no option for it at the site you listed.. I doubt it would fit in the case anyway or on a micro atx board anyway. The default setting is teh regular cooler that comes with it.

The watercoolign probably has an external radiator.

What resolution are you playing at. You are blowing an insane amount of money unless you are gaming at 30" native res.

Not the case I would want if I were to overclock.. but if you don't plan on it go ahead. Will certainly be cramped in there (relatively speaking).

No offence, but I think you should have this built for you (don't be trying to change teh heatsink and such until you do some reading), it isnt hard to do it yourself but you are spendign a lot of cash on this and don't really seem to know much.. It wouldnt be worth the risk.
May 27, 2009 7:21:39 PM

Quad-SLI is a gratuitous waste of cash unless you have a 2500x1600 resolution monitor, and even then its not really necessary. What resolution will your monitor be running at? Getting two 4890's in xfire will be more than enough for anything less than 30". One GTX 285 is about right for a 19x12 res monitor IMO.
May 27, 2009 7:29:53 PM

bodyops said:
I understand what you are saying, and this is why I'm confused ebcause in slizone they say 285's in sli is better than 295 in quad sli. Here is the link to just one of the post that they have like this: http://forums.slizone.com/index.php?showtopic=35736
can you read and tell me why they think its better? thanks thekid.

I think you are misinterpreting what is being said there. If that is really what they are saying, then they are idiots. Two GTX 285's do not beat Two GTX 295's, ever. Here are some benchmarks if you don't believe me:
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3520&p=7

55FPS for GTX 295's Quad SLI vs. 35FPS GTX 285's in SLI in Crysis Warhead. Three GTX 285's got 52FPS, which is close but the Two GTX 295's are still #1.
a b U Graphics card
May 27, 2009 7:36:38 PM

xthekidx said:
I think you are misinterpreting what is being said there. If that is really what they are saying, then they are idiots. Two GTX 285's do not beat Two GTX 295's, ever. Here are some benchmarks if you don't believe me:
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3520&p=7

55FPS for GTX 295's Quad SLI vs. 35FPS GTX 285's in SLI in Crysis Warhead. Three GTX 285's got 52FPS, which is close but the Two GTX 295's are still #1.

Nah, that post is all about how it is a waste opf money to get 2 295's over a 285 for most res. Nothing about the 295's being "worsE" jsut astronomically worse in price performance at the res the OP in that post was playing at (1920*1200).

I max out even crysis with my 4890's... There is no need to get anything more potent than a couple overclocked 4890's/285's at this resolution. If you are playing at 30" res 3 285s/4890' kick the pants off of the 295 SLI due to memory choking on the 295. If you plan is to get teh best of the best of the best regardless of cost you shoudl go with 3 285's. 2 295's area bit of a silly place in the market.. Since you are going micro ATX 3 SLI is not an options.. so ya, 2 295's are the best performance you can get in 2 slots..
May 27, 2009 7:42:46 PM

Its all a moot point, there is no reason to get that much GPU power unless you have a 30" monitor, in which case it totally defeats the purpose of buying a micro-atx portable case, and you should just build a regular tower.
a b U Graphics card
May 27, 2009 8:19:58 PM

bodyops said:
btw is it confirmed that 1 gtx 295 is actually two 275's? I always thought 1 gtx 295 = two 280's.


No.

1 GTX295 performs on the same level as two OCed GTX260s. Even though its specs are similar to 275s, the performance is not even close.

2xGTX275s is much better than 1 GTX295
May 27, 2009 8:21:35 PM

do you have any idea how much heat is going to be stuck in that case?

a Quad GPU solution is a very bad idea for an SFF build, if you want power then go for a HAF 932 case or something like that and a trio of GTX 285's, if you want SFF then get a 4870 X2 as it's close to the GTX 295 in performance but it outputs a bit less heat.
a b U Graphics card
May 27, 2009 8:27:17 PM

I agree xthekidx... but it isnt my money, the op can throw it at whatever he wants.

Quad SLi is a waste of money, I'm not a fan of microATX either... and certainly at the specs you lsited that is gonna be one hell of a hot box.. and have fun truckign around teh 30" display with it in order to mke the cost anything near worth while :D 
May 27, 2009 8:37:33 PM

^ well if he has enough cash to buy that build he probably has enough to buy a prototype 30" flexible OLED screen.
May 28, 2009 4:52:33 PM

I'm def not going to game on a 30" monitor, gonna get a 22" prolly or maybe a 24" running at 1920 x 1250 or w/e. Thx for the input guys, I also am worried that this will be a hot box but I need to be able to carry it around, and monitor wont be an issue as I got a monitor at home and going to buy one for my dormitory.

And from those benchmark test, are they running the gpus in the same exact system? Or is it a different config for each system? Here is what a friend posted on another forum site

" yea I read it....I have read more danged reviews that I care to think about....But in 9 out of 10 of those the test platforms are not the same....I can set up two rigs 1 with gtx 260's and make it beat 280's just depends on how its setup...I have learned that many reviews are biased...plain and simple NUTZ can confirm what I say is true...I for once want to see a crossfire/sli rig setup and all the ati and nvidia cards get run through and tested with the same cpu, ram, mobo and overclocks...So there is no variance in the test platform other than the cards....Try to find that....When I get to see and unbiased testing I will believe it....Untill then I go by what I have found out from building rigs and having some really nice friends with some really nice gear they are willing to loan me from time to time...I know for certain about what works with this 790i rig because I have tried most of the possibilities..But each rigs a little different so that wont hold the same for every rig....But whatever you decide do it because it will make you happy......And good luck and happy gaming..."


Thx again for your input guys
a c 153 U Graphics card
May 28, 2009 6:22:40 PM

Bluescreendeath said:
No.

1 GTX295 performs on the same level as two OCed GTX260s. Even though its specs are similar to 275s, the performance is not even close.

2xGTX275s is much better than 1 GTX295


Yea, performance wise the 260sli, and a single 295 run within a few fps of each other.
May 28, 2009 7:00:25 PM

once again, in such a small box you're going to have over 700w of heat dissipation, in such a small area it's not a good idea, maybe if you had a single GTX 295 as it would take it down to around 400w.
May 28, 2009 9:04:25 PM

bodyops said:
I'm def not going to game on a 30" monitor, gonna get a 22" prolly or maybe a 24" running at 1920 x 1250 or w/e. Thx for the input guys, I also am worried that this will be a hot box but I need to be able to carry it around, and monitor wont be an issue as I got a monitor at home and going to buy one for my dormitory.

And from those benchmark test, are they running the gpus in the same exact system? Or is it a different config for each system? Here is what a friend posted on another forum site

" yea I read it....I have read more danged reviews that I care to think about....But in 9 out of 10 of those the test platforms are not the same....I can set up two rigs 1 with gtx 260's and make it beat 280's just depends on how its setup...I have learned that many reviews are biased...plain and simple NUTZ can confirm what I say is true...I for once want to see a crossfire/sli rig setup and all the ati and nvidia cards get run through and tested with the same cpu, ram, mobo and overclocks...So there is no variance in the test platform other than the cards....Try to find that....When I get to see and unbiased testing I will believe it....Untill then I go by what I have found out from building rigs and having some really nice friends with some really nice gear they are willing to loan me from time to time...I know for certain about what works with this 790i rig because I have tried most of the possibilities..But each rigs a little different so that wont hold the same for every rig....But whatever you decide do it because it will make you happy......And good luck and happy gaming..."


Thx again for your input guys

The anandtech review I linked used all the same system, just with different GPU's. They did a series on all the different configs you could have at that time and looked at each using the same testing setup. Here is the series:
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3517
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3518
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3520
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