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Water Cooling Newbie Advice Needed - Wavemaster Cool Master Case

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July 5, 2011 6:20:26 PM

Hello,

Well, where to start...I've been keeping my eye on watercooling for about 4 years now, opting for different air cooling solutions etc and I've finally decided to take the plung!

Before:


So I've been reading watercoolinguk, tomshardware, etc with a view of "what is a good newbie system" and came across the XSPC kits - good value & good quality.

Last night I settled on XSPC Rasa 750 RX240 which comes with the;
- X2O 750 12V Pump/Reservoir - Dual 5.25" bay
- RX240 Dual Radiator

But last night I thought, eep where will it all go?

My case has 4x 5.25" bays so with the bottom one being taken up by the DVD-RW, 2x above being the X20 750, leaving 1 free at the top - excellent!

I did some googling last night, looking for the wavemaster case & previous watercooling solutions but all I can find is the 1.5 wavemaster project :o ( It did give me am idea though;
Put the rad at the front of the case vertically upwards so it would be [front of case, 2x 80mm fan's and then the rads].

Today my system shut down due to overheating (CPU is 60ish and gfx is 115ish) - yeah i know bad, hence watercooling! It comes & goes. Comes - need to de-dust, clean etc, goes. So therefore i opened up my system with a view of looking where things could go. My vertical solution by the fans isn't a go :o ( the hight isn't there. hence my post....

This leaves 2 places, either on the bottom of the case - giving air flow problems - or in the top 5.25" bay. I looked up the dimensions for the Rx240 rad, 58.5 is close, its all of the room available which made me look at the RS240 rad, 35 is good, fits in nicely but what about the fans (?), are these on top of the 35? another 25 on top is 60 which doesn't fit :o (

After:


RS240 Dimensions: 121x35x277mm (WxDxH)
RX240 Dimensions: 125x58.5x286mm (WxDxH)

I've done some before & after pictures.

My system is:
CPU: AMD Athlon II X3 440 3.0GHz 512KB L2 Cache Socket AM3 with the 4th core unlocked.
Mobo: ASUS M4A77 AMD 770 Socket AM3 8 Channel Audio ATX Motherboard
GFX: Sapphire HD 4850 1GB GDDR3 Dual DVI HDTV Out PCI-E Graphics Card
Case: Coolmaster Wavemaster

Water kit proposed: XSPC 750 RS240 from http://www.watercool...-Kit_ASLZ9.aspx
I want the extra capacity to enable me to add my GFX card at a later date.

At a later date I want to add something like this;
http://www.watercoolingshop.co.uk/Aluminium-Cooling-Res...
I have plenty of space - I have a cornor desk so have plent of space behind my monitor though its a 1.5m raise I'd say. :( 

So in summary;
- Do I have to add the +25mm onto the rad depth to get the full depth of the working rad?
- What would you advise for draining? should I add a T junction?
- Alternatively could I put i at the bottom of the case? What air flow does the rad require?
- Any advice is most welcome. I'm completely new :( 

Thanks for your help in advance.

Ben
a c 324 K Overclocking
July 5, 2011 6:29:52 PM

You will need an additional 240 rad if you are incorporating your GPU into the loop (you can go with other alternatives as well, but a single RS 240 isn't going to effectively cool a CPU+GPU loop.) XSPC rads are pretty low FPI rads, so you can get away with low to medium speed fans for them to work well. Higher speeds yield better temps, but also create more noise and usually cost more depending on fan and model. You will want to look at Skinneelabs.com and take a look at the rad with different fan speeds; however there isn't an entry for the RS series rads. They do perform very similar to Swiftech MCR series as well as HWLabs SR1 rads (not to be confused with BIX rads w/higher FPI ~30.)



I'd start there.
July 5, 2011 6:37:50 PM

Would the RX240 be enough or is it generally the 240 size?

Thanks for the links, I'll go read the reviews at Skinneelabs.
Related resources
a b K Overclocking
July 5, 2011 6:52:36 PM

you would likely need some serious fans (im guessing 80CFM or higher w/ high static pressure) in push/pull to get the RX240 to cover the gpu and cpu. I would certainly recommend at least another 120mm RX series rad in the loop if you do go for cooling the graphics card.

A possible solution for your mounting issue could be to mount the radiator externally off the back of your case with some unthreaded standoffs.
a c 324 K Overclocking
July 5, 2011 7:00:28 PM

I think OP was originally spec'ing out the RS240 kit. If it were the RX240, you are proposing a good route to take. I'd just go one step further and simply say to start with the RX360 kit and get the GPU block.
July 5, 2011 7:12:00 PM

Yeah the orig post was looking at the RS240 (due to the size limits in the top bay). With your post and Oranges - I'm looking at the picture thread and wondering if I should put a rx360 (due to your recommendation) rad on top of the case. So;

[===3x 25mm Fans ====]
[====RX360 Rad == |x|= ]
---------Case Top ------|x|----
< side on view >
Would there need to be a gap between the rad & the case top or could it be flat against it like above?

Would putting the valves facing down towards the case top (so I can drill holes and put pipes through going direct onto the rad, like the x's in the above picture) be possible or do rads have an up & down?

Thanks for your help.
a b K Overclocking
July 6, 2011 12:58:25 AM

sorry for the confusion on RX and RS...

Yes, i agree the RX360 would definitely be best, and mounting that way on the top would work just fine. You would not want to set the rad directly on top of the case though, some spacers would be necessary to keep good airflow. I would also recommend something to prevent your tubing from scraping up against the holes you cut in your case, grommets are great for this kind of thing.

I did something similar with my case, here are some references if you are interested... This is with an off the back mount, but a top mount wouldnt be too different, you may just want more spacers to stabilize your radiator.



July 6, 2011 6:24:00 PM

Ah excellent pictures thankyou. Where do you get that kinda of size gromets from? A pumbing shop?
a c 190 K Overclocking
July 6, 2011 7:08:50 PM

Most watercooling sites have grommets in there, or yes you can look into a plumbers shop too, you want something that has a 16mm+ internal dimension (id)
as thoe hoses are 11mmID/16mmOD,
if you cut a hole in your case for them, it needs to be at least 19mm
and if your res is going into the higher drivebays, are you cutting a fillport hole above it? the res access hole is on top, so I mounted the res/pump in the lowest possible drivebays so I can filll it up :p 

Question for Orange though, why didn't you use the included 'legs' from the kit?
perfect little spacers hehe

I started with them between the lower fans and the rad, then remounted them under the fan to allow fastening to the cases pre-drilled mount holes, its an ongoing project so dont mind the mess, :) 
*edit to answer a pm, the knobs below the rad is an 8ch fan controller*

Moto
July 6, 2011 7:20:01 PM

My res is going in slots 2 & 3 of 4 leaving my top bay free. 1. DVD, 2,3 Res, 4 free. Do you think that'll be a problem?

On the 'legs', how high are they? guessing 30mm?

On GFX blocks, I have a ATI 4850, I can only find GPU blocks rather than whole blocks, do you think that'll be a problem?
a c 324 K Overclocking
July 6, 2011 7:35:29 PM

You could run universal blocks. Full cover blocks flow better and give better temps, but they are limited to only working on the card they are designed for and cost more.
a b K Overclocking
July 6, 2011 7:45:16 PM

@ OP- As rubix said, universal blocks work fine, but you will have to get some heatsinks for the ram on your card. Something like this...

https://www.jab-tech.com/Enzotech-Forged-Copper-VGA-Mem...

Also, you can use any 5.25 2 bay slots you desire.

@Moto- I didnt even know the kit came with those. either option will work i guess, the legs seem more convienient if you dont want to mess around looking for some spacers.
a c 190 K Overclocking
July 6, 2011 7:46:22 PM

Just measured the legs for you, just under 40mm from case to top of leg
I dont think you'll have sufficient access to the fillport if your res is mounted higher, that why I asked about if you were going to put a permanent fillport in through the roof maybe?
thread barb into the top port on res, tube up to top of case then a fillport through the top of the case http://www.coolercases.co.uk/acatalog/Fill_Ports.html
and as rubix says, uni blocks will be in your systems longer than a specific cards blocks, what if you spend a couple hundred on 6950 blocks, then win a pile of cash and upgrade your cards? its all new blocks time hehe
@Orange, you posted that same time as me mate, See the little blue 'spacers'? pen tops Bro, pen tops hehe, they'll be sprayed Matt black on one of the pulldowns before final build though :) 
Moto
July 6, 2011 8:17:26 PM

Thanks for your help chaps.

Parts orders from specialtech;
- XSPC Rasa 750 RX360 WaterCooling Kit : RX Series Kit
- 100mm Steel Anti Kink Spring for 7/16" (11mm) Outer Diameter Tubing : Black
- Pulse Modding 99.9% Silver Kill Coil
- XSPC Rasa High Performance Universal GPU Block : Rasa GPU

I ordered it prior to orange mentioning the heatsinks, if i dont overclock the GFX card and just run normally, will they be ok or are heatsinks a must?

Thanks for the leg info, so 40mm legs + 25mm fans + 58mm rad = 123m on top of my case?
Would there be a best configuration? Rad then fans pulling or fans then rad pushing?

Thanks for the tip on the filling loop.
a b K Overclocking
July 6, 2011 8:36:05 PM

I would go with 2 240 if you want to oc cpu and gpu. I have the 240 kit and it is not bad for the cpu.
a c 190 K Overclocking
July 6, 2011 9:18:03 PM

You could have the legs between the fan and rad, lower ıt by a few mm if it is a concern,
Yes to heatsinks, they're pennies and cant hurt, even if you dont 'need' them they help cool
Fanwise a pushpull config is generally assumed best, most would mount the rad on top of the case itself so bottom fans will pull out of the case,through the rad then top fans pulling from rad and exhausting upwards, mine are reversed,blowing towards the roof, but that doesn't affect my case temps as I sealed it with my modding antics :-p
Moto
a b K Overclocking
July 6, 2011 9:52:16 PM

getting fresh, unobstructed, cold air is the best way to get good performance out of your rad. Pulling/pushing air from your case is a common setup but may not be best, as your computer generates heat... even if you are working against the natural flow of hot air which is generally up, it will still work to your advantage to get fresh air into the radiator.
a c 190 K Overclocking
July 6, 2011 9:55:11 PM

So having it my way is probably the better set up then?,
just need to seal the top mesh of his case hehe
Moto
a c 324 K Overclocking
July 7, 2011 1:17:53 AM

The cooler the air, the better...so determine how you want to do this. If you are back mounting a rad and using standoffs, you should be fine regardless which way your airflow is going...should be enough room for cool air. The only thing you might want to be aware of is your GPUs exhausting out the back (unless you are going to WC them...or they don't have rear exhaust) or if your rad comes up behind your PSU, which I doubt since it would block your 120v power cord.

It really depends on what you are set on for your loop...depending on what you are going to run, you need to plan accordingly with the amount of rads, delta and where to get the coldest possible air.
July 7, 2011 8:37:32 PM

Bits arrive tomorrow. I was only able to find de-ionised water rather than destilled. Just needs to be cleaned more often from memory?
a c 190 K Overclocking
July 7, 2011 9:15:19 PM

If you have a couple of killcoils in there you shouldn't need to drain it too often, some say sixmonthly, annually and I've read of one guy who is 2 years and counting without cleaning his loop out,
Best plan I can figure is plain distilled/ deionised and coils, no other biocides or dyes etc,
If you can't buy distilled and really prefer it to plain deionised, distill it yourself :-)
Its not hard
Moto
a b K Overclocking
July 7, 2011 10:44:34 PM

Good luck on the setup superted! be sure to leak test thoroughly before powering on your loop and the system at the same time!
July 8, 2011 2:08:20 AM

here is a tip...don't spend the money for fitting above 1/4 inch....it does not make that much difference in water cooling...what matters is how efficient is your radiator at cooling the liquid....the water temp will level off at some point. I have a 3x120 rad on i7 920 3.0 volts and two gtx 480 sli @1.125volts.....my system never goes above 60C under 100 % stress...yes cpu and both video cards are under full stress.
July 8, 2011 2:11:56 AM

almost forgot...the larger the rad the lower you can run the fan, therefore less noise...the temps will go up a little but liquid is much better when compared with air cooling...in order for air cooling to compete with liquid the fans have to move a lot of air which means more noise....hope this helps
a c 324 K Overclocking
July 8, 2011 2:37:11 PM

Quote:
here is a tip...don't spend the money for fitting above 1/4 inch


What are you talking about? There is a massive difference in flow rates and delta for a loop using 1/4"ID tubing to 3/8" or 1/2"ID tubing.
!