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PSU Overkill with some PC builders....

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October 23, 2009 5:38:49 AM

I dont understand why many buy 1000Watt PSU's, Im assuming even a 650-750w 80plus PSU can handle SLI and Crossfire will full specs and peripherals is it just marketing or just future proofing? Because it seems that PCs, SSD's, HDD's, and GPUs are becoming power efficient thus negating the fact that we need to INCREASE in PSU wattage..... its going inversely now isnt it? Tech is becoming more efficient and the smaller nm chips use less power in CPU's and GPU's but why do we see newer 1000w PSU's and more?

I can understand for quad and tri SLI/Xfire but other than that most just use 2 GPU's and still get 1000watts of power supply, is it just overkill or just coz they think its needed??

More about : psu overkill builders

October 23, 2009 8:31:35 AM

Generally a quality (Corsair, Antec, PC P&C, Seasonic) 550W PSU will power any single card, and a 750/850W will power any two cards.
October 23, 2009 8:54:40 AM

It's Future Proof and easy on the wallet in the future since you won't have to upgrade your power supply if you're going to upgrade to a maybe 5870x2 in CFX when it comes out
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October 23, 2009 1:20:35 PM

well, when you start getting into tri crossfire/sli with highend cards (aka 3xGTX285/3x5870) you actually start getting closer when you do some massive overclocks (aka all gpu's and heavily OC'ed cpu)
a c 248 ) Power supply
October 23, 2009 2:05:36 PM

What the others said. Those high power supplies are designed for systems with 3 and 4 video cards operating in tri and quad mode. Otherwise they are total overkill.
October 23, 2009 3:36:39 PM

I always overkill the PSU in my machines (1 rig has an 1100, 1 rig has a 1300) because:

a) futureproofing - never know what you will wanna add, or if the next gen of video card will spike in power use

b) expansion - if I have a RAID 0 2-drive array and decide to go with a 5-drive RAID 5, add an internal tape backup, etc., I don't wanna be 40 watts short

c) stress - if the PSU is rated at 1200W and you're only pulling 780W across it, it's not going to work as hard, produce as much heat, and most important...stress the components as if you were constantly pulling 780W across a 1000W 80% PSU

I haven't had a PSU pop in years, since I used 450W jobs that came in the case, and used 3dfx video cards.

Plus like someone said...why buy a PSU right at the threshold of what you need and save $40-125, then have to go back later and spend another $190-275 for a much bigger PSU?
a c 248 ) Power supply
October 23, 2009 3:47:56 PM

jcknouse - What on earth are you doing to pull 780 watts? Do you have an overclocked high end gaming system with 3 or 4 video cards?
October 23, 2009 3:57:17 PM

That is a very good question, since that's about what my system pulls at max load.
October 23, 2009 4:00:31 PM

JohnnyLucky - 780 was an arbitrary number. But, my old gaming rig might have drawn near that when I was multitasking.

My old gaming rig had 2x 8800GTX+s, 4-500GB HDs, 2 DVD-RWs, 4 HD cooler fans (3 mounted, 1 5.25" bay type), and 6 case fans (1 top, 1 front, 3 side 1 back) and a big CPU HSF (I think it was a NV120 or AC freezer 64...can't rememeber), plus an OCed AMD Athlon x2 9850 @ 2.8+GHz

I bet I was pulling quite a bit with all the hard drives active and video gaming...and since I had all the fans on 100%.

The rig never got overly hot tho. Imagine that :lol: 
a c 144 ) Power supply
October 23, 2009 5:30:26 PM

I doubt it. I estimate less than 500 watts:

2 GTX's - 240 watts total
4 HD - 20 watts each = 80 watts
2 opticals - 30 watts each = 60 watts
fans - maybe 40 watts
let's say 4 GB RAM - 20 watts
motherboard logic - 25 watts

I'd use a Corsair 750TX or 850TX, probably an 850. I like to run my PSU's at 50% - 70% of capacity.
October 23, 2009 6:06:53 PM

Tack on 125W for the CPU at stock 2.5GHz, and mine is OCed to 2.8+

I put my spec into an online calculator and it estimated 650-680W

It's pullin some juice tho. I haven't calculated my 720BE x4 w/8GB and a velociraptor and dual 9800GTX+s etc etc.

I just like beef in my supply, esp. for my next build, cause i'll start with 2 x 5850s and maybe upgrade to 2 more of them or swap out for 2x 5870x2s.

I wanna make sure to have juice. :) 
a c 144 ) Power supply
October 23, 2009 6:28:59 PM

Crap. :( 

I haven't make that kind of mistake since ... since the last time I did. :) 

The first time I ran the calcs in my head, I included the CPU and came up with about 600 watts. Then I did the add'm up and was puzzled because I seemed to have lost a hundred watts.

Actually, OC'ing a CPU does not increase the power budget that much. I OC'd a Q6600 from stock to 3.6 GHz. CPU power current increased from 8 amps to 9.5 amps as measured with a lab calibrated clamp-on ammeter.

You can approximate the increase by:
OC'd voltage squared divided by stock voltage squared times stock power consumption.
October 23, 2009 6:57:38 PM

It's okay. I think last time I put a spec for a computer up, I forgot to do certain stuff. We're all human. Well, rumor has it I am at least half-human. :lol: 

I was looking at the 1000W corsair, but I think it went off the special it had with a case. If I could get it and a good case in combo, I'd get it. I've never heard a consistently bad comment about that PSU.
October 27, 2009 4:50:14 AM

SO at least a 750 80plus PSU is garnerd and deemed a safe bet... Even for SLI? Its not like im replacing my old 550realpower 80plus as I will still use my old build for basic madia and work files but for a gaming rig I am already planning on building it early next year.... just waiting on word from Nvidias next gen GPUs and DX11 for those....

We already lost USB3.0 for at least a year so thats bad news.....
October 27, 2009 2:02:58 PM

liquidsnake718 said:
SO at least a 750 80plus PSU is garnerd and deemed a safe bet... Even for SLI? Its not like im replacing my old 550realpower 80plus as I will still use my old build for basic madia and work files but for a gaming rig I am already planning on building it early next year.... just waiting on word from Nvidias next gen GPUs and DX11 for those....

We already lost USB3.0 for at least a year so thats bad news.....


Yep, and it seems you can't get a 58xx series from NewEgg, so I can't order parts for the new machine.

I even have it queued up to order, if they'd just get them in stock!!! grrrr :pfff: 

As for SLi, what are you doing it with? if you're SLi-ing 2 295s...um...I wouldn't think a 750 would be enough.

I know you have to look at what your components are gonna draw from the 12v rails, then figure out what the PSU has on those rails (each rail's Amps and total Amps across all rails), then figure out what video card setups the available amps can support.

Thing is, I can never seem to find on AMD/ATI's video card site the amp-draw spec for the GPUs, and most video card makers don't put it in a spec that I can find.

Anyone else have details on a good site/link that has the specs for amperes used by each/any video card.

BTW, liquidsnake: From what I gather from others on here, you should be able to Crossfire 2 5850s with the Corsair 850. That's what I took from things I have been told, but I haven't verified it yet.

YMMV
a c 248 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 2:11:51 PM

jcknouse - I don't know of any chart depicting current (amps) for a variety of video cards. Technical reviews usually only show total power draw at the wall outlet for the entire system.

A high quality 600 watt power supply with 40 amps on the 12 volt rail(s) can easily power a system with two ATI radeon HD video cards. That information is right on the ATI web site. Technical reviews confirm it.
a c 243 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 2:48:14 PM

JohnnyLucky said:
jcknouse - I don't know of any chart depicting current (amps) for a variety of video cards. Technical reviews usually only show total power draw at the wall outlet for the entire system.

Xbitlabs generally provides a chart that compares power consumption of several card's in thier reviews ( not always though )
a c 248 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 2:53:04 PM

Delluser1 - Just total power consumption/draw at the wall outlet or does it also show current (amps)?
a c 243 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 2:59:38 PM

Just card consumption
a b ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 3:00:31 PM

xbitlabs has measured only the cards power usage in their reviews for quite some time and now the people at Techpowerup have updated their testing rig to measure just the cards power usage as well

edit here's the listing from their most recent review
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Inno3D/GeForce_210/2...
a c 243 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 3:09:39 PM

Kari said:
xbitlabs has measured only the cards power usage in their reviews for quite some time and now the people at Techpowerup have updated their testing rig to measure just the cards power usage as well

edit here's the listing from their most recent review
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Inno3D/GeForce_210/2...

Caught on to that last week, haven't gotten used to it yet, but they do provide larger comparison charts.
October 27, 2009 3:32:38 PM

JohnnyLucky said:
jcknouse - I don't know of any chart depicting current (amps) for a variety of video cards. Technical reviews usually only show total power draw at the wall outlet for the entire system.

A high quality 600 watt power supply with 40 amps on the 12 volt rail(s) can easily power a system with two ATI radeon HD video cards. That information is right on the ATI web site. Technical reviews confirm it.


That would be for a standard build though, right? Rated for single HDD, single burner, no OC type thing?

I usually end up figuring out the draw is watts / 12v for video cards when I find it. I didn't know it was on the ATI website. I had been going to their gaming card reference to see the PSUs that they tested, and it seems lacking for the 5800 series in Crossfire.

BTW, I found on another website a thing that said supposedly ATI didn't order enough wafers from TSMC for the 5800 series, so that's why they're in such short supply. Supposedly the 5800x2 series is out next month. Might have to wait and see how their release impacts the 5700 and 5800 series.

Like I've said before, maybe I'm just paranoid. But, I like putting in a PSU that doesn't have to strain to do the work. Plus, I always SLi (haven't used ATI since the Rage Fury Maxx, but looking to build an ATI Crossfire build next time), have multiple HDDs/DVD-ROMs, etc. So, I've never really sat down and figured if the 1100W supply was too much or not.

I guess I'm king of PSU overkill with an ABS Tagan 1300W PSU huh? :lol: 

Thanks for the info tho, Johnny. I'll look more at the ATI site.
October 27, 2009 3:34:35 PM

Kari and DellUser:

Thanks. I'm gonna bookmark those at home. :) 
a c 248 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 4:48:59 PM

jcknouse - It would work with an overclocked Intel Core i7 920 system with two 5870's in Crossfire mode . Hardcore gaming sessions use much less power than stress testing with OCCT or Furmark. Have you bothered to look at the technical reviews?

Kari - Very nice chart. I'll have to add it to my references.

"Maximum: Furmark Stability Test at 1280x1024, 0xAA. This results in a very high non-game power consumption that can typically be reached only with stress testing applications."
October 27, 2009 7:26:53 PM

JohnnyLucky said:
jcknouse - It would work with an overclocked Intel Core i7 920 system with two 5870's in Crossfire mode . Hardcore gaming sessions use much less power than stress testing with OCCT or Furmark. Have you bothered to look at the technical reviews?


Yeah I have. I have read Toms for years and have for about a year looked at sites like AnandTech and OverClockersClub and what not.

I just tend to build a box different. I add fans, run 2-5 HDDS, dual DVD-RWs, etc. I have a bit more power consumption than a Tom's box with a single HDD, single DVD, single video card, etc. I almost build PCs for gaming like a fileserver to maximize the disk access speed for improved gaming performance.

As for hard core gaming sessions...well...I have run 10 sessions of Shadowbane along with Ventrilo and AGC on 4 cores and peaked all 4 cores and brought my machine to a crawl. So even tho I don't run something like Crysis, I task a machine really hard.

I guess I just have a different build methodology with my systems than you and others. Nothing personal.
a c 139 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 7:42:02 PM

jcknouse said:
I almost build PCs for gaming like a fileserver to maximize the disk access speed for improved gaming performance.
Improved gaming performance? How do you figure that? How much performance increase are you getting?
a c 139 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 7:59:57 PM

liquidsnake718 said:
I dont understand why many buy 1000Watt PSU's
A lot of people just want to believe their brand new system is a fire breathing, extreme top of everything else, rad instrument of destruction.
When in fact it's just a bit above average, fairly dainty, resource economizing consumer expendable electronic device.
a c 248 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 8:43:14 PM

WR2 - ROFLMAO :lol: 
a b ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 11:02:27 PM

Nobody in this thread seems to have twigged onto the efficiency aspect. Most PSUs have their peak efficiency at around 50% of their rated load. That means that you should use a 1000W PSU for a system that actually consumes about 500W of power. If you do this, you'll be drawing less power from the wall socket than if you use a 500W or 600W PSU.
a c 139 ) Power supply
October 27, 2009 11:52:28 PM

sminlal said:
Nobody in this thread seems to have twigged onto the efficiency aspect.
What is the difference in efficiency between 1000W PSU @ 50% load and 600W PSU @ 82% load.
What is the difference in efficiency between 1000W PSU @ 15% idle load and 600W PSU @ 25% idle load.
Where do PCs spend more time - idle or full load?

a c 248 ) Power supply
October 28, 2009 12:13:41 AM

Sminlal - I agree with WR2. It is extremely difficult, if not impossible, for a power supply to consistently operate at peak efficiency for a prolonged period of time. That's why modern power supply efficiency is measured over a broad operating range from 20% to 100% of load.

There is another inherent problem. How does one determine what the average load will be for each user? Last January Tom's Hardware published an excellent article about power consumption during actual gaming sessions. A typical sysytem with one video card very rarely used more than 300 watts while gaming. That is much lower than the OCCT and Furmark tests used in technical reviews. Those create a lot more stress than any game ever could.
a b ) Power supply
October 28, 2009 3:13:16 AM

Fair comments. What makes sense is to try to estimate the power that your system will drawing most of the time, and buy the most efficient PSU for that load, as long as the PSU can also handle the peak demand of your system.

The point is though, that when selecting a PSU it's prudent to consider efficiency as well as total rated power.
October 28, 2009 5:59:25 AM

jcknouse said:
Yep, and it seems you can't get a 58xx series from NewEgg, so I can't order parts for the new machine.

I even have it queued up to order, if they'd just get them in stock!!! grrrr :pfff: 

As for SLi, what are you doing it with? if you're SLi-ing 2 295s...um...I wouldn't think a 750 would be enough.

I know you have to look at what your components are gonna draw from the 12v rails, then figure out what the PSU has on those rails (each rail's Amps and total Amps across all rails), then figure out what video card setups the available amps can support.

Thing is, I can never seem to find on AMD/ATI's video card site the amp-draw spec for the GPUs, and most video card makers don't put it in a spec that I can find.

Anyone else have details on a good site/link that has the specs for amperes used by each/any video card.

BTW, liquidsnake: From what I gather from others on here, you should be able to Crossfire 2 5850s with the Corsair 850. That's what I took from things I have been told, but I haven't verified it yet.

YMMV



I don't want to SLI a GTX295, but if I decide to get the GTX285 now then wait for the next gen MB's, I think it will be worth getting another one later on... Or should I wait for the GTX3xx cards?

I am an Nvidia guy and I will not get the 5850 or 5970... even if and when they have the x2 or 5890....

Anyway at least I know what kind of PSU I will need for my next build... I am planning in advance as I will use my old build for a stand alone media system...and not re-use any parts for my next PC
October 28, 2009 6:14:59 AM

sminlal said:
Nobody in this thread seems to have twigged onto the efficiency aspect. Most PSUs have their peak efficiency at around 50% of their rated load. That means that you should use a 1000W PSU for a system that actually consumes about 500W of power. If you do this, you'll be drawing less power from the wall socket than if you use a 500W or 600W PSU.



Really? This is just a suggestion right? Because if lets say the EVGA GTX285 needs at the minimum a 350Watt PSU to run, does this include the whole system when they mantion that on the box of EVGA? So that would mean its better to have a 650Watt PSU then since it is double of what the GPU requires?
a b ) Power supply
October 28, 2009 6:23:40 AM

Ideally, you'd buy a PSU that had about twice the capacity that you require in normal use (i.e., the type of stuff you do most of the time), as long as it also has enough capacity to handle your peak loads as well.
a c 248 ) Power supply
October 28, 2009 11:59:34 AM

liquidsnake718 - When video card manufacturers specify power supply wattage it is for the entire pc system. The manufacturers overestimate the requirements because people insist on buying low budget psu's of questionable performance and value. Testing during technical reviews confirm this.

The current (amps) on the 12 volt rail(s) is a bit more complicated. The current (amps) on the 12 volt rail(s) is for most, but not all, of the pc system.

Modern PSUs have at least five separate voltage rails, sometimes more. Each rail is like an independent power source monitoring and adjusting the voltage on its outputs.

The most important rail is the 12 volt rail. It provides the most wattage, usually accounting for 75% or more of the power output of the PSU. It's used by everything, from the CPU which has a dedicated 12 volt connection on the motherboard to video cards which also have dedicated 12 volt connections, case fans, pumps, hard drives, optical drives, and a few other components. Other rails of varying output power other components like the motherboard chipset, RAM, USB, and the PCI-e bus.

For example, lets say you want to use two video cards in dual operating mode and the manufacturer's recommendation is for a 700 to 750 watt power supply with a combined total of 40 amps on the 12 volt rail(s). The two video cards would conduct far less current. Testing during technical reviews confirm this. A lot depends on the configuration and use.

October 28, 2009 12:47:00 PM

WR2 said:
Improved gaming performance? How do you figure that? How much performance increase are you getting?


Well according to Tom's:

I should get about double the read performance out of my RAID 0 with 4 drives as with 2 drives.
http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/raid-matrix-charts/Average-Read-Transfer-Performance,218.html

I should get about double the write performance out of my RAID 0 with 4 drives as with 2 drives.
http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/raid-matrix-charts/Average-WriteTransfer-Performance,219.html

I figure that will be even better than just 1 HDDs performance.

Plus when you are running multiple file intensive apps at once, the disk access helps. And as I said, I was playing SB at the time I built this rig. 10 seperate processes loading graphics from disc I would think gets pretty intense.

When I built my new gaming box late last year, I went with a Velociraptor for gaming apps. I still get stuttering. Don't know why. I have 8GBs of RAM and keep my drives cleaned and optimized and unlocked and OCed the 720x4 stablely to ~3.4GHz (Prime, SuperPi, OCCT for 2 hours each). I figure it might be because I was overtasking the drive with all those instances. That's why I am considering another build with 4 drives in RAID 0 for file access (read and write) optimization.

Anyways, I didn't do all my own disk analysis of every drive configuration with 1-4 drives and RAIDs 0,1,0+1, and 5 that I could. It wasn't worth my time. I just took Tom's numbers as good to most rapidly optimize my efficiency as I could. So, I can't tell you the exact performance benefit I get filesystem-wise.

And like I said, I just build things different I guess.
October 28, 2009 12:52:35 PM

liquidsnake718 said:
I don't want to SLI a GTX295, but if I decide to get the GTX285 now then wait for the next gen MB's, I think it will be worth getting another one later on... Or should I wait for the GTX3xx cards?

I am an Nvidia guy and I will not get the 5850 or 5970... even if and when they have the x2 or 5890....

Anyway at least I know what kind of PSU I will need for my next build... I am planning in advance as I will use my old build for a stand alone media system...and not re-use any parts for my next PC


I know what you mean. I have used nVidia for years now. But, I'm seeing promising stuff from ATI and at a better pricepoint. Plus, most all of the AMD boards are Crossfire, including the Crosshair III and 790FX-GD70 which are rated the 2 best (as last I saw in the Tom's AM3 review).

My two boxes now have dual 9800GTXs and dual 8800GTX+s. So, I got nothing against nVidia. I am just seeing ATI with the most bang for the buck right now.

With the shortage of 5800 series ATI cards though, I am having to wait until November to see what happens. So hopefully the nVidia 300-series comes out and the 275s or 285s will be a price competitive alternative for me.
a c 139 ) Power supply
October 28, 2009 1:32:15 PM

jcknouse said:
10 seperate processes....
.... I still get stuttering. Don't know why.
I know why. And don't be surprised if, after you build your disk array, that you still get stuttering.
Very good chance you're CPU bottlenecked. Imagine how many threads a 10 game session must create.
And if your Raptor seems to be working hard during your game sessions you probably have trashing -thrashing- going on in RAM.
October 28, 2009 1:51:55 PM

WR2 said:
I know why. And don't be surprised if, after you build your disk array, that you still get stuttering.
Very good chance you're CPU bottlenecked. Imagine how many threads a 10 game session must create.
And if your Raptor seems to be working hard during your game sessions you probably have trashing going on in RAM.


That's possible. Although, I don't know if Shadowbane was multi-threaded or not. I would think that, since it was originally developed back in 2003 or so, it wouldn't have been heavily. I could be wrong.

I know I got bottlenecking on the 9850 Athlon64x2 CPU. And, I was only running 2 or 3 accounts at once on it.

As for trash in RAM, I'm not sure there either. I know each instance was about 520,000K each and having 10 of them was about 5.1GB of RAM. Being I have 8GB and running Windows XP (with non-needed services disabled), I still had about 1.3 GB of memory free. I shouldn't have been needing virtual memory or anything.

Add: Went and looked and it was a multithreaded app.
a c 139 ) Power supply
October 28, 2009 2:07:35 PM

jcknouse said:
As for trash in RAM, I'm not sure there either.
Then your Raptor is not working hard during a gaming session, right?
Haven't you check on page file usage? How many hard faults a second are you getting during gaming?
Even the lowly Vista/Win7 Resource Monitor will watch your CPU/Memory/Disk/Network activity and help pinpoint your bottlenecks.

edit; are you still running WinXP?
October 28, 2009 2:22:42 PM

WR2 said:
Then your Raptor is not working hard during a gaming session, right?


The disk light flashed a lot on the panel, and the Velociraptor was the drive that the SB app was installed to.

Haven't you check on page file usage? How many hard faults a second are you getting during gaming? said:
Haven't you check on page file usage? How many hard faults a second are you getting during gaming?


I set the page file according to some articles out there on the internet for performance. After that, I didn't think it would matter much.
As for hard faults, I'm not sure what you mean. You mean application fault errors?

Even the lowly Vista/Win7 Resource Monitor will watch your CPU/Memory/Disk/Network activity and help pinpoint your bottlenecks.

edit; are you still running WinXP? said:
Even the lowly Vista/Win7 Resource Monitor will watch your CPU/Memory/Disk/Network activity and help pinpoint your bottlenecks.

edit; are you still running WinXP?


Still using XP Pro x64.

I use the Task manager to watch CPU util.

I kinda figured with 54Mb/s wireless and a 8Mb down/1.5Mb up cable modem that my bandwidth wasn't an issue.

I really can't task anymore with Shadowbane, as the game closed a few months ago. Maybe if I find something else I can do it with, I'll try.

Thanks for the advice.
a c 139 ) Power supply
October 28, 2009 2:56:33 PM

A hard fault is when a program is forced to use the HDD page file because it didn't find the data/program resource in RAM.
That can lead to thrashing - shuffling blocks of virtual memory between HDDs and real memory.
Which can lead to your HDD seeming to struggle when the root problem is elsewhere.
The flashing HDD activity light will never tell you if the HDD is approaching its bandwidth or IO limits.
Running 32bit games on a 64bit OS (using WoW or Windows On Windows) gets you a small CPU performance hit and running multiple instances of games is likely increased that hit. Thats in addition to the workload running the games.




October 28, 2009 3:22:08 PM

WR2 said:
A hard fault is when a program is forced to use the HDD page file because it didn't find the data/program resource in RAM.
That can lead to thrashing - shuffling blocks of virtual memory between HDDs and real memory.
Which can lead to your HDD seeming to struggle when the root problem is elsewhere.
The flashing HDD activity light will never tell you if the HDD is approaching its bandwidth or IO limits.
Running 32bit games on a 64bit OS (using WoW or Windows On Windows) gets you a small CPU performance hit and running multiple instances of games is likely increased that hit. Thats in addition to the workload running the games.
http://common.ziffdavisinternet.com/util_get_image/11/0,1425,i=113561,00.gif


I kind of figured if I had plenty of physical memory that the shuffling between virtual and physical ram of data blocks wouldn't occur.
What do I need to run to check for hard faults? I want to see if that's what's happening for some reason.

I had no idea there was a big huge hit running the 64-bit. I assumed there'd be some with the Big/Little Endian thing (or whatever MS does in the background) for compatibility.

However, I'm not explicitly calling WoW. Whenever I run a 32-bit app, the Task Manager shows it as "(appname)*32" in the listing. I'm not sure if WoW is automatically being used or what, but it seems to handle everything fine.

But, that is a sorta significant hit against my CPU...5%. And, it'd probably compound with running multiple instances and what not involving the thread management and everything.

Thanks for the info. It is much appreciated.
a c 139 ) Power supply
October 28, 2009 4:17:59 PM

jcknouse said:
I'm not sure if WoW is automatically being used or what, but it seems to handle everything fine.
WoW has to run. And there is a fair amount going on in the background and thats reflected in the slight performance hits benchmarks can detect. The article where I found that PCMark chart from mentions that "Running 32-bit apps in x64 essentially gives each application its own 4GB of virtual memory space, which isolates it from other applications."

jcknouse said:
I kind of figured if I had plenty of physical memory that the shuffling between virtual and physical ram of data blocks wouldn't occur.
Probably true for most people. As you pointed out - you use your system differently than most.

I can't recall being impressed by the WinXP Performance Monitor even with the extra Performance Monitor Wizard you could download from MicroSoft. You might be able to find a shareware utility that would work better.
The Vista and Win7 Performance Monitor versions are vastly superior. And I know there are stand-alone utilities that will let you analyze how your system uses it's resources.




a c 139 ) Power supply
October 28, 2009 4:39:27 PM

Example of the Win7 Performance monitor:
October 30, 2009 5:19:12 PM

You guys think this supply is too much for a 4-slot mobo for running 4-5770s or 4 5850s eventually?

ENERMAX REVOLUTION85+ ERV1050EWT 1050W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Certified 80 PLUS SILVER Certified Compatible w/Core i7 Modular Active PFC Power Supply - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817194039

thanks
a b ) Power supply
October 30, 2009 5:40:32 PM

phil_12 said:
It's Future Proof and easy on the wallet in the future since you won't have to upgrade your power supply if you're going to upgrade to a maybe 5870x2 in CFX when it comes out


+1 very good explanation ;) 

Once the 300 series drops I will upgrade and won't need to worry about the PSU ......
!