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Unknown heat issue is driving me crazy

Hello, community. I have a problem I cannot solve. My PC automatically shuts off while playing most modern games after 5-20 minutes. I have an aftermarket cooler for my Intel Q6600 and stock cooling on my GeForce 450. The case is open and I even have a large fan blowing on the entire unit. I have replaced the thermal paste on the cpu twice and there is new paste on it now, installed correctly (a very thin layer on the cpu with a clean heatsink pressed onto it). The heatsink is seated properly on the motherboard. RealTempGT reports core temperatures around 60 at shutdown and GPU temps also around 60. All of my drivers are up todate. When the PC restarts, I get a message, from BIOS I assume, that the shutdown was due to the CPU overheating. What am I missing here?
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  1. I would confirm your temps with 1-2 other temp monitoring programs. Core Temp, SpeedFan, CPUID HW Monitor, etc.

    Check out this thread: http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/forum2.php?config=tomshardwareus.inc&cat=29&post=268587&page=1&p=1&sondage=0&owntopic=1&trash=0&trash_post=0&print=0&numreponse=0&quote_only=0&new=0&nojs=0
  2. Some more details, if it helps. The most important stuff is above, I think. CPU shuts down with certain games due to heat regardless of graphics settings. If the PC is turned back on within a few seconds of shutting itself down, the motherboard gives the "no or bad video card" beep code. This problem happened before with an older GeForce 9800GT and did not change when it was replaced. Screenshot below is PC with almost no load.

    http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/7681/screenshotua.jpg

    Uploaded with ImageShack.us
  3. vollman1 said:
    I would confirm your temps with 1-2 other temp monitoring programs. Core Temp, SpeedFan, CPUID HW Monitor, etc.

    Check out this thread: http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/forum2.php?config=tomshardwareus.inc&cat=29&post=268587&page=1&p=1&sondage=0&owntopic=1&trash=0&trash_post=0&print=0&numreponse=0&quote_only=0&new=0&nojs=0


    Thanks for the tip. Real Temp GT and Core Temp both agree that the CPU cores are maxing out at or below 60c. However, SpeedFan reports temps around 70c.
  4. Another update, in case anyone is looking to help. I ran Dead Island, the game which seems to shut things down the fastest, in a window so that I could watch the temps change live. The CPU temps stayed in the 50's, and the GPU temp hovered around 65. This is with a fan larger than the case pointed right at it with the covers off running on high and all of the cabling secured as far from the video card as possible.
  5. give the system specs.
  6. You asked for it:


    SiSoftware Sandra

    Processor
    Model : Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q6600 @ 2.40GHz
    Speed : 2.39GHz
    Cores per Processor : 4 Unit(s)
    Type : Quad-Core
    Integrated Data Cache : 4x 32kB, Synchronous, Write-Thru, 8-way, 64 byte line size
    L2 Cache : 2x 4MB, ECC, Synchronous, ATC, 16-way, 64 byte line size, 2 threads sharing

    Computer
    Mainboard : Intel DG35EC
    BIOS : Intel ECG3510M.86A.0112.2009.0203.1136 02/03/2009
    Bus(es) : X-Bus PCI PCIe IMB USB FireWire/1394 i2c/SMBus
    Multi-Processor (MP) Support : No
    Multi-Processor Advanced PIC (APIC) : Yes
    Total Memory : 3.5GB DIMM DDR2

    Chipset
    Model : Intel Processor to I/O Controller
    Front Side Bus Speed : 4x 265MHz (1GHz)
    Total Memory : 4GB DIMM DDR2
    Memory Bus Speed : 2x 400MHz (800MHz)

    Memory Module(s)
    Memory Module : Corsair CM2X2048-6400C5 2GB DIMM DDR2 PC2-6400U DDR2-800 (5-5-5-18 3-22-6-3)
    Memory Module : Corsair CM2X2048-6400C5 2GB DIMM DDR2 PC2-6400U DDR2-800 (5-5-5-18 3-22-6-3)

    Video System
    Video Adapter : NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460 (336 SM5.0 1.43GHz, 1GB 3.6GHz, PCIe 2.00 x16)

    Graphics Processor
    OpenCL GP Processor : NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460 (336SP 7C 1.43GHz, 1GB 3.6GHz)
    Compute Shader Processor : NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460 (336SP 1.43GHz, 1GB 3.6GHz)
    CUDA GP Processor : NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460 (336SP 7C 1.43GHz, 1GB 3.6GHz)

    Storage Devices
    WDC WD1501FASS-00W2B0 (1.5TB, SATA300, 3.5") : 1TB (E:)
    WDC WD1501FASS-00W2B0 (1.5TB, SATA300, 3.5") : 1TB (C:)
    ATAPI DVD A DH20A4P (ATA66, DVD+-RW, CD-RW, 2MB Cache) : 351MB (D:)

    Logical Storage Devices
    New Volume (E:) : 1TB (NTFS) @ WDC WD1501FASS-00W2B0 (1.5TB, SATA300, 3.5")
    Hard Disk (C:) : 1TB (NTFS) @ WDC WD1501FASS-00W2B0 (1.5TB, SATA300, 3.5")
    Urlaub (D:) : 351MB (CDFS) @ ATAPI DVD A DH20A4P (ATA66, DVD+-RW, CD-RW, 2MB Cache)

    Peripherals
    LPC Hub Controller 1 : Intel 82801HB/HR (ICH8/R) LPC Interface Controller
    LPC Legacy Controller 1 : Winbond W83627DHG
    Audio Device : Intel 82801H (ICH8) HD Audio Controller
    Audio Codec : Realtek Semi 888 High Definition Audio
    Audio Device : Giga-Byte GF104 High Definition Audio Controller
    Audio Codec : nVidia 0012h
    Audio Codec : nVidia 0012h
    Audio Codec : nVidia 0012h
    Serial Port(s) : 1
    Disk Controller : Intel 82801H (ICH8) 4 port SATA Controller
    Disk Controller : Intel 82801H (ICH8) 2 port SATA Controller
    Disk Controller : Jmicron JMB368 IDE Controller
    USB Controller 1 : Intel 82801H (ICH8) USB UHCI #4
    USB Controller 2 : Intel 82801H (ICH8) USB UHCI #5
    USB Controller 3 : Intel 82801H (ICH8) USB2 EHCI #2
    USB Controller 4 : Intel 82801H (ICH8) USB UHCI #1
    USB Controller 5 : Intel 82801H (ICH8) USB UHCI #2
    USB Controller 6 : Intel 82801H (ICH8) USB UHCI #3
    USB Controller 7 : Intel 82801H (ICH8) USB2 EHCI #1
    FireWire/1394 Controller 1 : Lucent/Agere Systems (Was: AT&T MicroElectronics) FW322/323 IEEE1394 OHCI FireWire Controller
    SMBus/i2c Controller 1 : Intel ICH SMBus

    Printers and Faxes
    Printer : Microsoft XPS Document Writer (600x600, Colour)
    Fax : Microsoft Shared Fax Driver (200x200)

    Network Services
    Network Adapter : Intel(R) 82566DC Gigabit Network Connection (Ethernet)
    Network Adapter : Hamachi Network Interface (Ethernet, 100Mbps)
    Wireless Adapter : Broadcom 802.11g Network Adapter (802.11g (ERP), WEP n-bit, 412.32Gbps)

    Power Management
    Mains (AC) Line Status : On-Line

    Operating System
    Windows System : Microsoft Windows 7 Home 6.01.7601 (Service Pack 1)
    Platform Compliance : x86

    Windows Experience Index
    Current System : 5.9
  7. innocuousremark said:
    When the PC restarts, I get a message, from BIOS I assume, that the shutdown was due to the CPU overheating.


    you mean that you get that error during POST?
    if that's the case, there could be a setting in your BIOS that automatically shuts down the system when the CPU reaches certain temp.

    edit: i have Q6600 in my PC here at work, it idles at 78°c and easily breaks 100°c under load. i realize that's way too high, but it's stable (and the IT guy doesn't care).
    60°c is far from overheating.
  8. PSU?
  9. PSU is a 450w job that came with the no-name case.
  10. I am seriously not an expert, but I would get some advice from the PSU forum on troubleshooting a bad PSU and making sure that you have enough to power all of your components.
  11. Update: If I run in single-core mode, the system is stable. Wow. The zombies in dead island don't notice me anymore...but the system is stable. I have no idea what to do with this information. Also the CPU and GPU never go over 55c.
  12. maybe just slightly underpowered on PSU.. that would be my guess.. everyone says you ned these big ole 1000W bad boys,,, you dont.

    http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp

    you might ned to browse the site a bit, it looks like the re-did a few spots.. this is a free PSU calculator. punch in all your info, and hit enter. see if you are good or not.

    Nothing you typed screams " heat issue causing shut down here" might be numerous things adding up to it.
  13. Cheap PSU's almost always do not live up to their sticker potential. You should check out the recent PSU article on Tom's...it's pretty good coverage of good vs. bad PSUs and what to look for. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/power-supply-psu-review,2916.html
  14. Thank you for all of the feedback. I somehow neglected to mention that my motherboard reports a thermal trip both in post and in the bios info, if I go into it. If the PSU were inadequate, it would just shut off, right? But the motherboard is almost certainly shutting itself off due to heat sensor data and is reporting that.

    EDIT: Tested with minimum devices connected. Power requirements far exceeded by my PSU, but problem still exists.
  15. I think that shutting down is only one possibility with a bad PSU. It could also start a fire or send too much power to components and fry them.

    IMO seriously, stop using that PSU and get a new one. The life you save may be your computer's. ;)


    EDIT: I don't know if you read this yet, so here is a link.

    http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/power-supply-psu-review,2916.html
  16. I don't see how this could be the PSU, considering that the motherboard is telling me directly that the CPU temp is to blame. Could it still be the PSU?
  17. innocuousremark said:
    I don't see how this could be the PSU, considering that the motherboard is telling me directly that the CPU temp is to blame. Could it still be the PSU?


    you are correct. i don't believe it's the PSU either.
    is this the error you see diplayed during POST: "PROCESSOR_THERMAL_TRIP_ERROR"? does the BIOS have some kind of CPU temperature threshold setting? if so, can you change it?

    edit: i also see the DG35EC motherboard board is "designed to support processors with a maximum wattage of 95W" (page 15), yet the Q6600 CPU has a TDP of 105W. are you willing to try underclocking the CPU?
  18. Branden said:
    you are correct. i don't believe it's the PSU either.
    is this the error you see diplayed during POST: "PROCESSOR_THERMAL_TRIP_ERROR"? does the BIOS have some kind of CPU temperature threshold setting? if so, can you change it?

    edit: i also see the DG35EC motherboard board is "designed to support processors with a maximum wattage of 95W" (page 15), yet the Q6600 CPU has a TDP of 105W. are you willing to try underclocking the CPU?


    The BIOS is pretty lackluster. There is neither any control option for temp threshold nor for underclocking. Or is that not how you do it? I will look into it. As previously mentioned, running in single-core mode helps a lot. At this point I am planning on buying a new motherboard to solve this problem anyway.
  19. New motherboard did not fix the problem. New PSU is next...
  20. Hope it fixes the problem for you!
  21. New PSU did not fix the problem, but made it take longer to happen. The only components left from when this started are the CPU, RAM, and case. Stats from a stress test that caused a shutdown after approximately 80 minutes. Could it be the CPU? I'm at a loss at this point.

    DATE TIME MHz C0 C1 C2 C3 NV LOAD%
    09/15/11 03:16:40 2399.95 46 51 46 46 66 64.2
    09/15/11 03:20:00 2399.95 46 51 47 47 66 63.5
    09/15/11 03:23:20 2399.95 47 52 47 48 65 70.1
    09/15/11 03:26:40 2399.95 47 51 47 47 66 60.7
    09/15/11 03:30:00 2399.95 47 52 47 47 65 63.6
    09/15/11 03:33:20 2399.95 47 51 47 48 65 68.6
    09/15/11 03:36:40 2399.95 45 49 45 46 56 72.3
    09/15/11 03:40:00 2399.95 48 52 48 49 65 73.8
    09/15/11 03:43:20 2399.95 47 52 47 48 66 68.2
    09/15/11 03:46:40 2399.95 47 51 47 48 66 63.2
    09/15/11 03:50:00 2399.95 47 51 47 48 66 65.4
    09/15/11 03:53:20 2399.95 47 52 47 48 65 66.9
    09/15/11 03:56:40 2399.95 48 52 48 49 65 73.7
    09/15/11 04:00:00 2399.95 48 52 48 48 65 73.8
    09/15/11 04:03:20 2399.95 48 52 48 49 65 74.0
    09/15/11 04:06:40 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 74.1
    09/15/11 04:10:00 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 73.7
    09/15/11 04:13:20 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 74.1
    09/15/11 04:16:40 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 74.1
    09/15/11 04:20:00 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 73.8
    09/15/11 04:23:20 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 73.4
    09/15/11 04:26:40 2399.95 48 52 48 49 65 74.0
    09/15/11 04:30:00 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 74.0
    09/15/11 04:33:20 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 73.6
    09/15/11 04:36:40 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 74.0
    09/15/11 04:40:00 2399.95 48 54 48 49 65 73.8
  22. what PSU did you get (specs)?
  23. what mobo did you get?
  24. Cooler Master GX Series 650W ATX 12V V2.31 80 PLUS SLI Ready Power Supply RS650-ACAAE3-US

    MSI G31TM-P21 LGA 775 Intel G31 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
  25. Cooler Master GX Series 650W is bad efficiency .get fail review in HardOCP. i think your CPU is
  26. i must make this point again as i suspect it could very well be the problem:
    - your Q6600 has 105 watt TDP
    - your old DG35EC mobo only supported 95 watt CPU
    - your new G31TM-P21 mobo only supports 95 watt CPU
    - if the Q6600 starts demanding more than 95 watts and doesn't get it something bad is likely to happen (ie. crash)
    - you said yourself that if you run in single core mode you experience no issues
    - any CPU running on fewer cores will never demand it's full TDP rating (ie. a Q6600 running only single core will likely never demand >95 watts)
  27. Thanks for the replies. It makes sense that it could be a wattage issue, but that doesn't explain all of the evidence so far. If that were true, why would the new power supply have greatly reduced but not eliminated the problem? Why would this problem never have happened in the first 32 months of operation? Finally, why would putting extra cooling on the case make the problem better? None of that seems related to wattage, but it's definitely related to the problem.
  28. the hotter your equipment is, the less efficient it is. this is why people are telling you about cooling.
  29. Mrthorp said:
    the hotter your equipment is, the less efficient it is. this is why people are telling you about cooling.


    Naturally, but how is this related to the problem? Even though the motherboard is reporting a heat issue, none of the sensors do. GPU temps are under 70 and CPU temps are under 60. These are very reasonable temperatures. Also, the PC ran stably with these temperatures for over 2 years before the problem arose.
  30. were you not just wondering about your PSU? if your PSU is cooler, it might work better.

    dont give me attitude for trying to help out your problem. suck it up and sit there with a busted machine for all i care.

    all anyone is this thread is doing is trying to help you with your bizarre, seemingly undiagnosable heat issue.
  31. Relax, Mrthorp, I wasn't giving you attitude, I was asking you questions to get more of the great info you guys have been giving me so far. I do appreciate the advice. And yes, this is quite a bizarre problem indeed. The most reasonable answer at this point, as far as I can tell, something in the CPU is going bad after almost 3 years of continuous use. That doesn't seem that plausible to me, but I don't know of any other problem that could account for all of the "symptoms" so far. Maybe it's still under warranty...
  32. Best answer
    innocuousremark, it's one of two problems: a bad CPU or a wattage issue.
    none of the evidence confirms one way or the other.

    when you got a new mobo you got one that STILL isn't designed to handle your 105 watt CPU, so you've neither confirmed nor disproved that it might be a wattage issue and as such haven't confirmed nor disproved it's a faulty CPU either.

    so now you're left with two options:
    1) replace the CPU (presumably with yet another Q6600). if the the problem goes away then you had a bad CPU, if not then you've just wasted $$ replacing a perfectly fine CPU.
    2) replace your mobo with one rated to handle a 105 watt CPU (you really should have confirmed this before buying the new one). if the problem goes away then it was a wattage issue, if not then it's a bad CPU and you wasted $$ on yet another mobo.

    don't like the prospect of potentially wasting $$? then find a friend with compatible hardware and start swapping CPUs and mobos around.
  33. Well, I think we've reached the end of this road (until I get more hardware, in which case I will post in this thread again). That's the best answer anyone can give me at this point, I think. Thanks for all your help, forum community people!
  34. Best answer selected by innocuousremark.
  35. The problem has been solved: It turns out the new PSU is actually stopping the shutdowns. I took the old PSU apart and not only was it disgustingly dirty and dusty, but there was a bulging capacitor in there as well. Why this was reported as a thermal issue I may never know, but the PSU was the problem.
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