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Amd 4600+ vs 5200+

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November 6, 2009 3:33:03 AM

Just got off with hp live chat support and they tell me that the 4600+ is the highest cpu that motherboard will take, needing to stay under the 65 watt spec range. Of course unavailable thru newegg and tigerdirect. The 5200+ shows the same wattage. Wouldn't this still work, or am i missing a vital spec requirement for my motherboard. Here is the motherboard specs:

Motherboard description Motherboard manufacturer's name: Asus M2N61-LA
HP/Compaq name: Nyssa-GL6

CPU/Processor Socket: AM2
Supports the following processors:
Athlon 64 X2 with Dual Core technology (64 Watt only)
Athlon 64
Sempron

Front-side bus (FSB) 2000MT/s (2.0 GT/s)

cpu-z quotes an: am2 with 940 in quotations.


Thx, Steve

More about : amd 4600 5200

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November 6, 2009 3:42:37 AM

Are they saying you need to stay within the same wattage or is that the only CPU your motherboard is compatible with?

If you get an aftermarket CPU heatsink and fan, you can go above 65nm if your mobo supports the CPU.
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November 6, 2009 3:51:41 AM

Blue, it's probably that the mobo or psu can't power more than 65w, not that it can't dissipate the heat.


The 5200 should work based on the power requirements.
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November 6, 2009 5:02:55 AM

Let me try again, having problems repying...missing fields. hp says that the 4600+ is the cpu must upgrade with, with the requirement of 65 watts for my motherboard. Of course no longer available on newegg. The 5200+ shows the same wattage. Question: is there other requirements that am needing to consider. Like stating 90nm. The funny thing is the 4600+ shows as 89 watts on ebay....not their the gospel. I have an am2 motherboard, and am being quoted as can upgraded to dual core, just as long cant exceeed 65 watts...again looking at amd 5200+, which shows as 65 watts, also the 5000+ shows the same specs....thx
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November 6, 2009 5:05:44 AM

It might be based on the architecture; Windsor vs. Brisbane, and the 65 W 5200 was a Brisbane. You should call them back and ask.
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November 6, 2009 5:08:47 AM

pepperman said:
It might be based on the architecture; Windsor vs. Brisbane, and the 65 W 5200 was a Brisbane. You should call them back and ask.


but do you think, if meet the 65 watts requirement the brisbane would still work......thx
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November 6, 2009 5:16:28 AM

I think you should be fine, but were I you, I would ask the HP rep to make sure (though the HP rep may have no idea, in which case it's a gamble).
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November 6, 2009 5:22:13 AM

he had no idea, clueless. I asked him to hazard a guess, since the 5200+ had the same wattage. He thought it would work, but wouldn't go beyond that guess. Just wanted a second "geek" input. Thanks.....Steve
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November 6, 2009 5:27:28 AM

Go with it then. Just make sure its a 65 W and you should be fine. You will need new thermal paste when you mount the heatsink/fan on the new cpu.
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November 6, 2009 5:30:10 AM

artic silver 5??? Am a father of 2 teenage daughters...looking for the cheapest way to upgrade for modern warfare 2.....do i need to say more......lol
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November 6, 2009 5:41:57 AM

If your not going to be dealing with remounting heatsinks for a long while/ever, get this one if you might do this again, get this one .
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November 6, 2009 5:46:34 AM

last question, how big a deal is the static discharge issue. Just touch the power supply or buy the wrist band. Also how tough is the heat/sink install, which does come with the cpu. Regardless, you've been a great help....thank to this newb ...Steve
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November 6, 2009 5:55:59 AM

just touch the case and/or power supply, and don't set the cpu on carpet. If you follow common sense, you don't need a wristband. You can follow this video guide (you can ignore the part about wrist and heel straps) or if you just want a picture/text guide you can look here (this one does not explain removal of the cpu, but its very simple; after removing the heatsink/fan, pull the lever up so it is 90 degrees with the board and pull the cpu straight out), but keep in mind, it may be difficult to do with the cables and psu, so feel free to remove stuff from the case (all you will need is a screwdriver, but be sure to keep track of the screws) to give yourself better access.
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November 6, 2009 6:02:41 AM

cool man....you don't know me from adam or steve...hahhaa. But, have you seen the youtube, compusa vid where they use freon or some kind of antifreeze and overclock this motherboard to 6.93 gig....very cool.
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November 6, 2009 1:08:03 PM

The problem main problem you are going to have trying to upgrade to a CPU that HP says your board will not support is the BIOS on your board. Your BIOS will not have the support built in for this processor, so when the computer boots, it is going to go kind of like ......"what the? what has my owner stuck in me?" When that happens, sometimes (actually, most of the time) the PC simply will not boot. Sometimes it will boot, but the settings will not be correct, and you will find that the CPU is set up and running at about half the speed it should. And now you have this problem since you have an HP, your BIOS will likely not let you change settings for the CPU. So when they say it won't work, I'd say there is maybe 40/60 chance at best, maybe even less, the odds are simply not with you here, good luck.
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November 6, 2009 2:41:52 PM

^ I didn't think about that, but he has a very good point; your bios may not support the Brisbane architecture (even though its just a shrunk Winsor). You knew it would be a gamble before, but the odds just changed.

I just thought of something that I should have asked before; what is your current cpu and the rest of your system specs (psu, ram, video card, etc.)? You said you want to play MW2, but depending on your current cpu, you might be able to play it fine right now.
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November 6, 2009 3:04:32 PM

amd single core 3500+, 2gb ram, nvidia 9400gt, 300 watt power supply. I meet the min specs, just was hoping to upgrade the cpu. HP tech quoted the 4600+ amd, but nobody seems to have them anymore, but will keep looking.
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November 6, 2009 3:14:35 PM

You'd probably get a decent performance increase with a gpu upgrade; maybe to an HD 4650 or 4670, keeping in mind your psu limitations.

These are from newegg.com; it doesn't matter which one you choose, the only real difference is the brands; Saphire has the best cooling design for the 4670's but the 4650 is so low-power (consumption, not performance) it really doesn't matter.
HD 4650~$50
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=E...

HD 4670~$70
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=E...
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November 6, 2009 3:32:35 PM

ok. Another question what does this mean in the cpu:

Manufacturing Tech 90 nm.....CMOS Technology 90nm SOI....Is that what was referring to by the "BIOS" able to identify. Also motherboard specs shows as "AM2" SOCKET but staying under the 65watt spec. But this 4600+ shows as 89 watts...Just trying to learn here.
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November 6, 2009 3:47:58 PM

Windsors were manufactured with a 90 nm process where Brisbanes were manufactured with a 65 nm process, but that's not everything the BIOS has to recognize; there are subtle changes in the microcode for each cpu family, which could prevent your mobo from recognizing a Brisbane.

There were "energy efficient" versions of the Windsors that had a tdp of 65 Watts, which included a 4600 and ran up to the 5200 (but those were very, very rare). The numbered naming scheme unfortunately doesn't have any bearing on the tdp.
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November 7, 2009 12:59:48 PM

I know this may be a little late, but if you have a processor based on 90nm tech, and you are going to try to upgrade to a processor with 65nm technology? Now that I see that, your odds of that processor upgrade working on your motherboard would be almost "0". This can be a problem even on a self build where you can update your BIOS and can manually make changes in the BIOS, and still yet not all boards can make this upgrade. With a prebuild, you pretty much just hit a solid road block, not a lot you can do. The last resort would be if you could find a BIOS update SPECIFICALLY for your motherboard that SPECIFICALLY says it will support 65nm tech CPU's. If you can find that, do the update and not kill your motherboard in the process, the CPU might work.
Again, good luck with this, you will need it.
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November 7, 2009 7:57:54 PM

No, its not too late. Buying on this Tuesday or was going to.

so HP is saying that i can upgrade up to the amd x2 4600+, My research is showing there's a 3800+, 4400+ and 4600+. These are models that i can locate online, am meaning. So your saying I have to match the 90nm technology also, on top of the wattage of 65 watts. Right now my cpu-z is showing my single core 3500+ with 90nm tech on the motherboard. Helpppppppppppppp
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November 7, 2009 8:03:07 PM

Product Name: AMD Athlon 64 X2 4600+ Dual Core Processor 2.4GHz, 2x512KB, 1000MHz Bus, Socket AM2 - MPN: ADO4600IAA5CU
Product ID: ADO4600IAA5CU

Category: AMD Athlon 64 Socket AM2

Manufacturer: AMD

Description: AMD Athlon 64 X2 4600+ Dual Core Processor 2.4GHz, 2x512KB, 1000MHz Bus, Socket AM2 - MPN: ADO4600IAA5CU


AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 Dual-Core Details
Processor AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 Dual-Core
Model 4600+
Ordering P/N (Tray) ADO4600IAA5CU
Ordering P/N (PIB) ADO4600CUBOX
Operating Mode 32/64
Stepping F2
Frequency 2400Mhz
HT Speed 2000
Voltage 1.20V/1.25V
Max Temp 55-72°C
Thermal Power 65W
L1 Cache 128KB x2
L2 Cache 1MB
CMOS Technology 90nm SOI
Socket Socket AM2


This was the dual processor that was going to buy, the specs. Thanks again.
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November 9, 2009 1:08:30 AM

again, just trying to learn here. Why wouldn't the 5200 work, if 65 watts and 90nm too. Is it the motherboard and being a 64 watt socket?? I'm finding one or two 4600+ online, but am reading reviews and some are getting missing pins on the chip, dead chips, and many other poor reviews. Starmicro was where was going to order but when comes to buying chips, they seem to tell you, "once out the door, your on your own.....thx again.
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November 9, 2009 1:17:35 AM

I think your mobo might be limited by the stepping of the cpu as well as the tdp; the 2.4 GHz 65 Watt variant is the highest frequency with the F2 stepping, where anything higher has the F3 stepping (keep in mind though that this is just a hunch, but it makes sense with what the HP rep told you-the highest you can get is a 4600).

Just curious, how much do they charge for the cpu at starmicro?
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November 9, 2009 1:26:49 AM

$48, plus you have to choose from a 30- to 180 day extended warranty. Thats the chip only, heatsink fan is another $10 for the am2 socket. So just for knowledge sake the 4400+, next step down has a 65nm tech though. So this probably wouldn't work since my board shows as 90nm. HP saying can go up to the 4600+. But when quized the HP rep, she/he says this spec doesn't matter....far as if will work.
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November 9, 2009 1:41:34 AM

Were I you, I would stick with the 90 nm variants, and the 4600 X2 doesn't sound like a bad deal to upgrade your computer (its a lot cheaper than doing a total rebuild). Though the HP rep didn't know about the specs, someone probably did when they wrote the manual for the mobo, and since they listed 4600 as the max, there's probably a reason. You can try for a 65 nm if you want, but it may not work (if you decide to go this route, I recommend getting one from newegg, as they carry a full 3-year warranty from the manufacturer, and the price should be comparable or lesser- Athlon X2 5200 Brisbane (65 nm) ).
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November 9, 2009 1:46:56 AM

so another question, on cooling. There thermal paste is $3 and again the fan is only $10 w/alum and not copper. Should i invest in better heatsink and thermal grease/paste or not. I've read about artic 5 and thermal lake fans, but am hoping to keep the cost down. Got two teenage daughters that have to answer to first.

I've read forums that some have needed to reinstall windows, but hp says my pc will notice the cpu change and not need to do this. Guess i'll find out.
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November 9, 2009 1:51:45 AM

You don't need to reinstall windows; were you doing a new mobo, yes, but a cpu, no.
The heatsink/fan on your current cpu should do just fine (its only 65 watts), but you will need thermal paste. This is best bought at a local computer shop, as the shipping tends to be more than the cost through online retailers. As for the type, it really doesn't matter, but make sure its paste not ceramique (ceramique is for chipsets and such where the heatsink won't ever be replaced).
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November 9, 2009 1:56:51 AM

so i can skip the heatsink purchase??? Should i clean off the current heatsink, the fan is caked with dust right now, underneath the fan. but sure could clean it off though. Thought would need a heatsink for dual core cpu. How about the static surge factor, some say buy the wrist strap and others say just touch the power supply. Been on so many forums, forget if you've already covered this....thx.
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November 9, 2009 2:04:09 AM

Just use common sense (don't work on your pc while on a carpet) and touch the psu before you start (turn the psu off before you start taking stuff apart, though). A good way to clean a heatsink/fan is taking the fan off (should have four screws) and while holding the blades (so they don't overspin) vacuum both the fan and the heatsink. Oops! or glu-be-gone work the best for removing thermal paste, but isopropyl (rubbing) alcohol works too, but be careful not to bend the pins (unless you're just chucking the old cpu, but I recommend keeping it in case the new one is DOA or fails after a certain time). The amount of cores doesn't necessarily affect the type of fan you need (though it affects power usage, which affects tdp). The type of fan you need is based on the tdp, and since your current and your new cpu have the same cpu, the same fan will work just fine.
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November 9, 2009 2:10:54 AM

so amd has a overclocking program, i don't see my cpu or chipset on the list of exceptions. Can i over clock, or does it depend on my bios?? I've tried by accessing my bios on my single core and it won't allow me to even access that column to change the settings. Just wondering if this amd program will allow me to speed up my cpu. Yes, glutton for punishment.
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November 9, 2009 2:15:24 AM

Unfortunately, since your system is a prebuilt system (by a company), the bios locked for OCing. Since your chipset is Nvidia (6100), the AMD software won't work either. You can try a program called speedfan, and dabble with the clock generators; I've only been able to find the correct clock for one of three computers I've tried this on, but to be honest I didn't look terribly hard. You can try looking for your mobo's clock generator, but you may or may not find it.
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November 9, 2009 2:19:37 AM

Last question and will leave you alone, and by the way thank you for all your help.

They say not to press down on the heatsink and crush your chip, my heatsink has springs and not screws. The videos and websites say just a screwdriver will remove and install the heatsink. Is it easy to remove and reinstall these or/and can you offer any advice to avoid any damage to the cpu. Again this is my first cpu upgrade and just trying to cover all bases.
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November 9, 2009 2:37:43 AM

No worries, that's what we're here for.

As long as your cpu is locked in the socket properly, you can't crush your chip (this is not true with older cpus without IHS's (integrated heat spreader), however, such as socket A Athlon XP's, where if you had the heatsink at an angle, you could crack the chip). That said, it shouldn't be too hard to remove and mount the heatsink. Here are some instructions for the thermal paste application (they work for any thermal paste, not just artic silver), and you said you found some heatsink video guides.
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November 9, 2009 2:58:30 AM

can i mail you my pc and u install the chip, lol
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November 9, 2009 3:11:56 AM

You'd spend a bit in shipping, but I would be fine with doing it for you. This video might help you, at least in terms of the heatsink installation (you can ignore the warnings about the thermal pad, as you will be using thermal paste).
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November 9, 2009 3:15:28 AM

didn't get a video link, please resend it.
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November 9, 2009 3:25:25 AM

no problemo, got it now.....isn't youtube great??? can i touch base with you, if i succeed or bomb...as in blow my motherboard....???
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November 9, 2009 3:31:36 AM

Sure, you can send me a message with the tom's forum messages (far right corner), or just post on this thread if you need anything. Just make sure you discharge yourself by touching the psu, don't force the cpu into the socket, follow the arctic silver instructions, and plug the fan in before you turn the pc on, and you'll be fine.
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November 9, 2009 3:35:25 AM

payday is this tuesday...cross your fingers...depending on who i order from of course, i'll touch base with you over the next 3 to 10 days...again thanks for your help...you've been a great.
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November 9, 2009 3:36:10 AM

Anytime, that's what we're here for.
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November 10, 2009 7:59:04 PM

Buying the cpu today. Far as the thermal paste, compound, grease,etc.. Which did you say again. I'm not meaning far as Artic Fox. Thought i read in forum something about conductive or non conductive. Also correct just apply about size of grain of rice or BB. Trying not to get on motherboard any spillage???
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November 10, 2009 11:02:08 PM

It really doesn't matter which thermal paste (I tend to call thermal compound thermal paste, but they're really the same thing, but you could go with thermal grease-different instructions for grease- but you don't want ceramique) you go with (I think thermal paste/compound would be easiest as you can follow the instructions below), but a non-conductive would be best in case you do get it on the mobo, and yes, you just want to use a very small amount. The arctic silver instructions are very good, and work for any thermal paste/compound regardless of brand, so I recommend following those ( here's the link again ).
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November 10, 2009 11:10:05 PM

So as this above link states, i should remove the pad on my new/old heatsink??? This should be done either path i choose???
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November 10, 2009 11:26:57 PM

If you are reusing your old heatsink, yes you will want to remove any thermal paste/pad left on the heatsink; but if you buy a new one, the thermal pad will work just fine, though removing it and replacing it as in the link's method would increase cooling performance, the difference wouldn't be enough to warrant it since you won't be overclocking (due to the locked mobo).
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November 10, 2009 11:32:00 PM

I know we've covered cracking the cpu subject and maybe am over thinking this task. But just curious, should I be careful when removing old heatsink. As in, should i rock back and fourth and make sure its lose to avoid motherboard damage, or does this rarely happen. Again this pc was built less than a year ago.
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November 10, 2009 11:39:19 PM

You do want to be careful when removing the heatsink, and a good way to remove it would be to twist the heatsink back and forth (rocking works to, but you can't rock it too much) to disconnect the heatsink from the cpu before attempting to lift it off (unlock it first, though). I've seen computers where the heatsink was pulled straight out which resulted in the pins being sheered off the cpu and left in the heatsink, thus ruining the mobo, but this won't happen if you twist the heatsink a little bit before removing it from the cpu (don't let this scare you, though, as long as you don't force it too much, you won't have a problem).

Edit: I just realized part of that didn't make much sense; the pins were left in the socket, not the heatsink.
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