MicroATX MB selection...

[darkfa8]

I'm looking to build a new system to replace my aged P4 2.4 OC system and the MicroATX platform has my interest since I'm looking to save physical space, money and try and get a bit better performance.

Shouldn't be too difficult.

However, I'm undecided on a MB. My initial pic is the ASRock G41M-LE from the System Builder's $600 PC, but am wondering if there are any other options in this price bracket that offer good OC-ability, and upgrade flexibility... I may wind up keeping my next computer another 5+ years.

 

[obsidian86]

wel for the upgrade flexibility 775 platform is already in the morgue wait for intels i5 or i3 sockets or if you want something now the amd am3 platform

 

[darkfa8]

i'm looking to try and keep the component cost to under $300.

I already have:
WD 300 Raptor
Sony Optiarc 7240s

So, I just need:
CPU: E5200 66.99 Newegg
Artic Cooling Freezer 7 Pro $13.98 open box Newegg
MB: ASRock G41M-LE 47.99 open box Newegg (looking for alternatives)
Memory: Patriot PVS24G6400LLK 4GB $59.00-$20 rebate=$39.99 Newegg
Case: HEC 6K60BS Mini Tower $31.99 Newegg
GPU: Sapphire Radeon HD 4770 512mb $109.99 (undecided on if this is the card for me, was looking at the HD 4870, but may be overkill for me (graphic design work, flight sim))

total at the moment = $310.93 + tax + shipping = ~$362

Sure, I could wait until the next generation, but I've already waited 6 years or so since I originally purchase this P4 2.4. I feel steeping into a OC dual core will already be blowing the doors off my P4 by leaps and bounds.

Currently, my system is starting to show more frequent BSOD, likely from my OC (running upwards of 3.0ghz, just lowered today to try and take some strain off). So, I can't wait another couple of months really.

I appreciate your insight, especially since I wasn't privy to those new sockets.

I'm open to more advice, I just have to keep things within budget. Either way, anything I get that is from the last 1-3 years is going to be faster than my current system.

 

[obsidian86]

power supply?

 

[obsidian86]

and intels next gen will be kicking round in a month

 

[darkfa8]

i have an Enermax 430 watt PSU at the moment, I presume i'll be needing 500w+

 

[Onus]

This $25 Rosewill micro-ATX case comes with a free card reader, has a 120mm fan, and can take another up front: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811147111. The HEC case you've listed has just an 80mm fan, and appears to take more of those smaller, whinier fans in front.
Consider an AMD 550BE. At stock, it beats the pants off the e5200, and also overclocks well. The e5200 may OC higher, but that might bring it to parity at the expense of more heat and possibly reduced lifespan.

 

[obsidian86]

the amd 250 also compares favorably

 

[Onus]

For an HD4770, your 430W Enermax will be sufficient.

 

[darkfa8]

The AMD 250 looks interesting for the money. It's a tough decision especially since I'm coming from such an old CPU and I don't have an unlimited budget =\

 

[obsidian86]

well amd makes sense that all am3 processors can fit in to older am2+ boards an use ddr2 an ddr3 ram so when you need another upgrade you can jus get ddr3 ram an board an reuse the cpu

 

[darkfa8]

that does sound good. now i'll just have to find a good microatx mb that will be flexible with future expansion...

and a good CPU cooler too.

 

[obsidian86]

you ganna be using a 32bit or 64 bit os

 

[darkfa8]

32 bit winxp pro corporate

 

[shortstuff_mt]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.240746 (Gigabyte GA-MA785GM-US2H + AMD Athlon II X2 240 Regor 2.8GHz combo) $122.98

G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK - Retail $59.99

 

[logainofhades]

I would go with a Phenom II and AM2+ motherboard considering your budget. Not sure if an all AM3 and DDR3 M-atx build is possible given your budget. The cooler you chose would not work with an AMD setup so that would have to be changed. Everything else would work.

Newegg.com - Open Box: ASRock A790GMH/128M AM3/AM2+/AM2 AMD 790GX HDMI Micro ATX AMD Motherboard $61

Newegg.com - AMD Athlon II X2 250 Regor 3.0GHz 2 x 1MB L2 Cache Socket AM3 65W Dual-Core Processor - Processors - Desktops $79

Newegg.com - Cooler Master Hyper TX3 Socket 775/1156/AMD 130W 92mm CPU Cooler RR-910-HTX3-GP - CPU Fans & Heatsinks $20

 

[obsidian86]

Open Box: BIOSTAR TA790GX XE AM2+/AM3 AMD 790GX HDMI Micro ATX AMD Motherboard
ASUS EAH4770 FORMULA/DI/512MD5 Radeon HD 4770 512MB 128-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video ... -
G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F2-8500C
AMD Athlon II X2 250 Regor 3.0GHz Socket AM3 65W Dual-Core Processor Model ADX250OCGQBOX - Retail
Subtotal: $284.97

 

[logainofhades]

For video card you may want to look at 4850's. Some are same price or cheaper than the 4770 and are faster.

 

[darkfa8]

I had my eye originally on the 4850's, but was then derailed by Tom's recent recommendation on the 4770. I will certainly look at the 4850s again, 512 and 1gig versions.

If I were to compromise, would it be better to buy a cheaper CPU and spend more on a GPU, or the other way around?

I also intend to set this machine up with 4GB of ram.

I wish Tom's did some more MicroATX MB comparisons, seems to be so little info out there in one spot without digging through forums like this.

The Gigabyte/AMD 280 Regor combo at $122 is a pretty sweet deal, but am unsure if that MB has good OC abilities.

BTW, here is my exact current setup:

MSI Neo-2-LS Bios V2.5
P4 2.4 Northwood PGA478 800MHz FSB OC'ed to 3.0ghz (250mhz x 12)
Swiftech MCX4000/Panaflow 80mm
(2) Corsair CMX512-4400C25PT = 1gig
BFG nVida GeForce 6600GT 128mb AGP
WD3000 VelociRaptor 300GB SATA
Sony Optiarc AD-7240S 24x DVD-RW SATA
Enermax EG465P-VE 431W

Again, I primarily do graphic/web design with Adobe CS4 and run RealFlight G4.5 flight simulator which is really taxing on my existing setup.

 

[darkfa8]

anyone else have any advice?

i'm trying to narrow down the:

AMD AM2/3 capatable MicroATX MB

AMD CPU

High Quality air CPU cooler (I will be overclocking!)

GPU (something less than $100, but is at least superior to my 6600GT)

4GB Memory that OCs well and doesn't cost a fortune

 

[shortstuff_mt]

AMD Athlon II X2 250 Regor 3.0GHz + GIGABYTE GA-MA785GMT-UD2H AM3 combo) $145.99

G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Desktop Memory Model F3-10666CL7D-4GBRH - Retail $89.99

XIGMATEK HDT-S1283 120mm Rifle CPU Cooler - Retail $36.60 - $10 MIR

Even the integrated GPU on the 785G motherboard will be considerably faster than your 6600GT, but here's a couple options for GPU's under $100:

SAPPHIRE 100245HDMI Radeon HD 4850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail $94.99

SAPPHIRE 100265HDMI Radeon HD 4830 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail $87.99

 

[darkfa8]

I'm looking at this for ~$20 more than the Athlon II 240 Regor combo with same MB:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.237632

Maybe I'll use the on-board GPU until I have some extra money for a dedicated GPU since I don't really use any software that is much inhibitted by my existing rig - so I can live with a bit less performance.

The RAM, geezz, expensive. I haven't really messed with OC ram too much, but I am trying to figure out what ram is good quality for the money. Looks like most people are suggesting the G.Skill sticks.

Not really sure on how to pic RAM....

 

[shortstuff_mt]

The system I linked above is an AM3 motherboard which requires DDR3 RAM. If you went with the combo you linked above, you could go with cheaper DDR2 RAM.

G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK - Retail $59.99

or

G.SKILL Trident 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Desktop Memory Model F2-8500CL5D-4GBTD - Retail $64.99

 

[darkfa8]

aside from price, what is the difference between the two models of G.SKILL you listed just now?

For lon term use, like 3+ years, would it be more wise to invest in the MB that supports DDR3?

 

[shortstuff_mt]

The difference between the two RAM kits is the required voltage. The more expensive kit shows that it only requires 1.8v, but the user comments indicate it needs more than that for DDR2 1066 operation. Either kit would work just fine.

I prefer to use DDR3 for any new build since it's the new standard. No future CPU's will support DDR2 RAM, so its price will continue to rise as it's phased out. DDR3 RAM prices should remain pretty stable until it's replaced with DDR4 (or whatever they will call it). DDR3 leaves a better upgrade path, but if it is stretching the budget then just go with DDR2.