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Will TIVO record programs without service ?

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Anonymous
April 20, 2005 2:29:04 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality

Thanks,
Chris
Anonymous
April 20, 2005 7:37:10 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

In article <1114018144.470740.7470@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
socialism001@yahoo.com wrote:
> I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
> for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
> me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
>
> Thanks,
> Chris

The Toshiba (and Pioneer, if you can still find one) DVD/TiVo combo
units come with free basic (3-day guide) sevice. My 80-hour Toshiba
SD-H400 was $150 after rebate, which is less than Best Buy wants for an
80-hour non-DVD TiVo.

However if you ever try the paid subscription, you'll probably want to
keep it.

Jim

Don't feed the Comcast rumpswab, it needs your nourishment to thrive
Anonymous
April 20, 2005 8:25:37 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

>I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
>for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
>me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality

Yes. Pick up a Toshiba SD-H400:
http://www.tacp.toshiba.com/dvr/product.asp?model=sd-h4...

It was available last week from Overstock.com last week for $210, but
has since sold out.

It comes with Tivo Basic, a no-fee version of Tivo"
http://customersupport.tivo.com/knowbase/root/public/tv...

We own 2, and just bought a 3rd from Overstock last week. No monthly fee,
most of the Tivo goodness; we use it like a very fancy VCR.
Related resources
Anonymous
April 20, 2005 8:40:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

Old Replay Panasonic Showstoppers don't have any fees, but there should have
been one last upgrade for the date and time to be manually configured.
Anonymous
April 20, 2005 9:33:04 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On 2005-04-20, socialism001@yahoo.com <socialism001@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
> for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
> me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality

If you want a VCR, why don't you just get a VCR?
Anonymous
April 20, 2005 9:33:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Mike Hunt" <in2sheep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:116d4igaevufaca@corp.supernews.com...
> On 2005-04-20, socialism001@yahoo.com <socialism001@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
> > for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
> > me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
>
> If you want a VCR, why don't you just get a VCR?

Now, that is a really lame response. The picture is better, plus doesn't
degrade when being played a bunch of times. There are a lot of nice
features to the Tivo that could be provided without a subscription. If
there was such a thing as a digital vcr (like Tivo but without the program
guide), I think a lot of people would get that before getting a sbuscription
based DVR.

I've said before that the subscription price is just too much for the
service. I have Tivo and love it, but I get it free with my level of
Directv, which includes a couple devices in my house. If I had to pay for
the service, I probably wouldn't get it (I'd get another media option that
is does not come with such a high monthly fee). I would much rather pay a
higher price for the box and then have no (or low) monthly fee. $13/month
is WAY too high for them just to provide a TV guide - IMHO.

I really think in order to succeed, Tivo should become a software company.
Charge fair market value for the box, add a fee for the software and then a
small monthly fee for programming only if the user wants the programming.
However, the software should still be fully functional without the program
guide.

Jim
April 20, 2005 9:33:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Scooby" <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote in
news:a027a$4266ad24$a22770bd$11560@ALLTEL.NET:

> "Mike Hunt" <in2sheep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:116d4igaevufaca@corp.supernews.com...
>> On 2005-04-20, socialism001@yahoo.com <socialism001@yahoo.com>
wrote:
>> > I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly
>> > fee for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my
>> > VCR allows me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
>>
>> If you want a VCR, why don't you just get a VCR?
>
> Now, that is a really lame response. The picture is better, plus
> doesn't degrade when being played a bunch of times. There are a
lot
> of nice features to the Tivo that could be provided without a
> subscription. If there was such a thing as a digital vcr (like
Tivo
> but without the program guide), I think a lot of people would get
that
> before getting a sbuscription based DVR.
>
> I've said before that the subscription price is just too much for
the
> service. I have Tivo and love it, but I get it free with my level
of
> Directv, which includes a couple devices in my house. If I had to
pay
> for the service, I probably wouldn't get it (I'd get another media
> option that is does not come with such a high monthly fee). I
would
> much rather pay a higher price for the box and then have no (or
low)
> monthly fee. $13/month is WAY too high for them just to provide a
TV
> guide - IMHO.
>
> I really think in order to succeed, Tivo should become a software
> company. Charge fair market value for the box, add a fee for the
> software and then a small monthly fee for programming only if the
user
> wants the programming. However, the software should still be fully
> functional without the program guide.
>
> Jim
>
>
>

Didn't Replay try the free service/high price model for awhile. It
did not work out for them. If you want TiVo-like functionality
without the subscription, buy a capture card for your computer.
There are a bunch of cheaper options.
Anonymous
April 20, 2005 9:33:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

> I've said before that the subscription price is just too much for the
> service. I have Tivo and love it, but I get it free with my level of
> Directv, which includes a couple devices in my house. If I had to pay for
> the service, I probably wouldn't get it (I'd get another media option that
> is does not come with such a high monthly fee). I would much rather pay a
> higher price for the box and then have no (or low) monthly fee. $13/month
> is WAY too high for them just to provide a TV guide - IMHO.

Umm, am I missing something, Scooby? Doesn't Tivo offer that *exact*
option? Called a "Lifetime" subscription? Simply pay the cost of the
box plus $300 and *poof*, no monthly subscription fee. That fits
*exactly* what you're describing. It's not Tivo's fault if Directv
doesn't offer that option anymore (though their montly fee is
considerably cheaper at $5 /month, just how cheap do you want it anyway?).

And it's *not* just to provide the guide, it also supplies all the
searching cabilities, the home media options, Tivo-to-go, etc. You may
not use those, but others do.

Randy S.
April 20, 2005 9:33:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 15:54:14 -0400, "Randy S."
<rswittno@spamgmail.com> wrote:

>
>> I've said before that the subscription price is just too much for the
>> service. I have Tivo and love it, but I get it free with my level of
>> Directv, which includes a couple devices in my house. If I had to pay for
>> the service, I probably wouldn't get it (I'd get another media option that
>> is does not come with such a high monthly fee). I would much rather pay a
>> higher price for the box and then have no (or low) monthly fee. $13/month
>> is WAY too high for them just to provide a TV guide - IMHO.
>
>Umm, am I missing something, Scooby? Doesn't Tivo offer that *exact*
>option? Called a "Lifetime" subscription? Simply pay the cost of the
>box plus $300 and *poof*, no monthly subscription fee. That fits
>*exactly* what you're describing. It's not Tivo's fault if Directv
>doesn't offer that option anymore (though their montly fee is
>considerably cheaper at $5 /month, just how cheap do you want it anyway?).
>
>And it's *not* just to provide the guide, it also supplies all the
>searching cabilities, the home media options, Tivo-to-go, etc. You may
>not use those, but others do.
>
>Randy S.

There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
gibberish.

Stick to something you know like the KKK.

Sean
Anonymous
April 20, 2005 9:42:49 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

>I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
>for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
>me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality

On a Series 1 standalone, YES. You get nag screens about needing
service every time you invoke something that needs the guide (which
is a lot of stuff), but you can still do time-and-channel recording.

It gets interesting trying to run a refurbished TiVo which came
with some season passes pre-programmed, but because of no subscription,
you can't see them (the trial subscription had already been used).
I eventually figured out that one of the wipe-everything-and-start-over
functions would fix this. I also decided to try out a subscription
and found it well worth it.

It is my understanding that the DirecTV Tivos won't record anything
without a subscription, and don't even make a good paperweight without
a subscription.

Gordon L. Burditt
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 12:05:56 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

In article <a027a$4266ad24$a22770bd$11560@ALLTEL.NET>,
"Scooby" <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote:

> "Mike Hunt" <in2sheep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:116d4igaevufaca@corp.supernews.com...
> > On 2005-04-20, socialism001@yahoo.com <socialism001@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
> > > for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
> > > me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
> >
> > If you want a VCR, why don't you just get a VCR?
>
> Now, that is a really lame response. The picture is better, plus doesn't
> degrade when being played a bunch of times. There are a lot of nice
> features to the Tivo that could be provided without a subscription. If
> there was such a thing as a digital vcr (like Tivo but without the program
> guide), I think a lot of people would get that before getting a sbuscription
> based DVR.
>
> I've said before that the subscription price is just too much for the
> service. I have Tivo and love it, but I get it free with my level of
> Directv, which includes a couple devices in my house. If I had to pay for
> the service, I probably wouldn't get it (I'd get another media option that
> is does not come with such a high monthly fee). I would much rather pay a
> higher price for the box and then have no (or low) monthly fee. $13/month
> is WAY too high for them just to provide a TV guide - IMHO.
>
> I really think in order to succeed, Tivo should become a software company.
> Charge fair market value for the box, add a fee for the software and then a
> small monthly fee for programming only if the user wants the programming.
> However, the software should still be fully functional without the program
> guide.
>
> Jim

It cant be. The software needs a guide.
April 21, 2005 12:24:39 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Scooby" <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:a027a$4266ad24$a22770bd$11560@ALLTEL.NET...
> "Mike Hunt" <in2sheep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:116d4igaevufaca@corp.supernews.com...
>> On 2005-04-20, socialism001@yahoo.com <socialism001@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
>> > for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
>> > me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
>>
>> If you want a VCR, why don't you just get a VCR?
>
> Now, that is a really lame response. The picture is better, plus doesn't
> degrade when being played a bunch of times. There are a lot of nice
> features to the Tivo that could be provided without a subscription. If
> there was such a thing as a digital vcr (like Tivo but without the program
> guide), I think a lot of people would get that before getting a
> sbuscription
> based DVR.

There are service free DVRs out there. They are just more expensive and
typically not as nice (nice being subjective).

> I've said before that the subscription price is just too much for the
> service. I have Tivo and love it, but I get it free with my level of
> Directv, which includes a couple devices in my house. If I had to pay for
> the service, I probably wouldn't get it (I'd get another media option that
> is does not come with such a high monthly fee). I would much rather pay a
> higher price for the box and then have no (or low) monthly fee. $13/month
> is WAY too high for them just to provide a TV guide - IMHO.

What is a fair price for a TiVo like device with no service fee? Is $350
fair? Cause that's what you can get a TiVo for with lifetime subscription
pre-paid.

> I really think in order to succeed, Tivo should become a software company.
> Charge fair market value for the box, add a fee for the software and then
> a
> small monthly fee for programming only if the user wants the programming.
> However, the software should still be fully functional without the program
> guide.

They also do that as well. Pioneer (and I think 1 other brand) offer DVRs
with TiVo basic included. No HMO features and a 3 day guide.
April 21, 2005 1:28:48 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Sean" <none> wrote in message
news:6qed6113pcnhlaumud0oanfdk3b2qj2rn7@4ax.com...
>
> There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
> Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
> gibberish.

Again, reading comprehension appears to not be your strong suit. The topic
being discussed here is a StandAlone as the poster in question who has
DirecTiVo(s) (and knows the cost of such) is talking about the "$13 a month"
model.

For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 1:28:49 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

Seth wrote:
> "Sean" <none> wrote in message
> news:6qed6113pcnhlaumud0oanfdk3b2qj2rn7@4ax.com...
>
>>
>> There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
>> Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
>> gibberish.
>
>
> Again, reading comprehension appears to not be your strong suit. The
> topic being discussed here is a StandAlone as the poster in question who
> has DirecTiVo(s) (and knows the cost of such) is talking about the "$13
> a month" model.
>
> For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
> there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
>

And here's the worst of it. In my post I specifically say:

"It's not Tivo's fault if Directv doesn't offer that option anymore
(though their montly fee is considerably cheaper at $5 /month, just how
cheap do you want it anyway?)."

So I even covered the base he was claiming I wasn't. Seriously, his
reading comprehension is majorly lacking.

Randy S.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 2:09:01 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Jack Zwick" <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:jzwick3-2A53EA.15055620042005@news1.west.earthlink.net...
> In article <a027a$4266ad24$a22770bd$11560@ALLTEL.NET>,
> "Scooby" <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > "Mike Hunt" <in2sheep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:116d4igaevufaca@corp.supernews.com...
> > > On 2005-04-20, socialism001@yahoo.com <socialism001@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
> > > > for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR
allows
> > > > me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
> > >
> > > If you want a VCR, why don't you just get a VCR?
> >
> > Now, that is a really lame response. The picture is better, plus
doesn't
> > degrade when being played a bunch of times. There are a lot of nice
> > features to the Tivo that could be provided without a subscription. If
> > there was such a thing as a digital vcr (like Tivo but without the
program
> > guide), I think a lot of people would get that before getting a
sbuscription
> > based DVR.
> >
> > I've said before that the subscription price is just too much for the
> > service. I have Tivo and love it, but I get it free with my level of
> > Directv, which includes a couple devices in my house. If I had to pay
for
> > the service, I probably wouldn't get it (I'd get another media option
that
> > is does not come with such a high monthly fee). I would much rather pay
a
> > higher price for the box and then have no (or low) monthly fee.
$13/month
> > is WAY too high for them just to provide a TV guide - IMHO.
> >
> > I really think in order to succeed, Tivo should become a software
company.
> > Charge fair market value for the box, add a fee for the software and
then a
> > small monthly fee for programming only if the user wants the
programming.
> > However, the software should still be fully functional without the
program
> > guide.
> >
> > Jim
>
> It cant be. The software needs a guide.

Not really... In order to record all movies with <name you favorite actor>
in it (or similar search), yes, you need a guide. However, as the original
post asked, to record this channel at this time with this quality, you
should not need a guide. That was the point. Let me use the functionality
of the software without having to subscribe to the guide and software
updates.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 2:35:01 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

In article <1qA9e.10673$go4.2087@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Scooby" <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote:

> > > However, the software should still be fully functional without the
> program
> > > guide.
> > >
> > > Jim
> >
> > It cant be. The software needs a guide.
>
> Not really... In order to record all movies with <name you favorite actor>
> in it (or similar search), yes, you need a guide. However, as the original
> post asked, to record this channel at this time with this quality, you
> should not need a guide. That was the point. Let me use the functionality
> of the software without having to subscribe to the guide and software
> updates.

If your time has next to zero value, fine. Get TV Guide each week and
spend hours searching for what you want to record. For most people the
hours saved by TiVo doing it all automatically makes the monthly fee a
bargain.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 3:33:53 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On 2005-04-20, Scooby <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote:
> "Mike Hunt" <in2sheep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:116d4igaevufaca@corp.supernews.com...
>> On 2005-04-20, socialism001@yahoo.com <socialism001@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
>> > for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
>> > me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
>>
>> If you want a VCR, why don't you just get a VCR?
>
> Now, that is a really lame response. The picture is better, plus doesn't
> degrade when being played a bunch of times. There are a lot of nice
> features to the Tivo that could be provided without a subscription. If
> there was such a thing as a digital vcr (like Tivo but without the program
> guide), I think a lot of people would get that before getting a sbuscription
> based DVR.

It's far from a lame response. In order to best answer the OPs question,
the OP needs to share which features of TiVo the OP values enough to spend
money on which a VCR cannot provide.

Things mentioned:
date - VCR does this and TiVo doesn't do any better
Time - " "
channel - " "
quality - VCRs can record with a similar quality as TiVo, and like a
SA TiVo, the quality is configurable

If the OP is interested in a solution without tapes since they degrade,
such a thing should be listed. There are lots of nice features of TiVo
making the subscription really quite a bargin. But, if someone wants
VCR-like features but want something that isn't a VCR, we need to be told
what additional features they are looking for which a VCR cannot provide.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 3:48:53 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Jack Zwick" <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:jzwick3-5E16A9.17350220042005@news1.west.earthlink.net...
> In article <1qA9e.10673$go4.2087@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
> "Scooby" <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > > > However, the software should still be fully functional without the
> > program
> > > > guide.
> > > >
> > > > Jim
> > >
> > > It cant be. The software needs a guide.
> >
> > Not really... In order to record all movies with <name you favorite
actor>
> > in it (or similar search), yes, you need a guide. However, as the
original
> > post asked, to record this channel at this time with this quality, you
> > should not need a guide. That was the point. Let me use the
functionality
> > of the software without having to subscribe to the guide and software
> > updates.
>
> If your time has next to zero value, fine. Get TV Guide each week and
> spend hours searching for what you want to record. For most people the
> hours saved by TiVo doing it all automatically makes the monthly fee a
> bargain.


Not really... Someone wants to record their favorite show. They know it is
on Every monday night on CBS from 7-8. Set it up. How is that any harder
than with a program guide? Many people just want to use the pause live tv
option or record what they are currently watching. Why make people pay
monthly for that? I personally have turned off the autorecord suggestions
option. Again, I've got nothing against a fee for the program guide.
However, I will soon have 3 Directivo units - If I had to pay $39 month for
program data, I'd be using something else.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 3:48:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

> Not really... Someone wants to record their favorite show. They know it is
> on Every monday night on CBS from 7-8. Set it up. How is that any harder
> than with a program guide? Many people just want to use the pause live tv
> option or record what they are currently watching. Why make people pay
> monthly for that?

Actually most people want to record a specific *show*, not a particular
channel at a particular time. For most shows those two things will
coincide *most* of the time. But some shows (like, say, Scrubs) move
all over the place all the time, and a lot of shows get preempted or
moved *some* of the time. With Tivo's full service, you can forget
about it because Tivo takes care of it for you. That peace of mind and
saving of time is part of what you are paying for.

> I personally have turned off the autorecord suggestions
> option. Again, I've got nothing against a fee for the program guide.
> However, I will soon have 3 Directivo units - If I had to pay $39 month for
> program data, I'd be using something else.

Again you are reducing the benefit to a program guide. Most of us see
it as much more than that. If it's not worth it to you buy a different
brand of DVR. Besides that 3 Tivo units wouldn't cost you $39 per
month, they'd cost you $27 per month ($13 + $7 + $7). But there's no
question that the Directivo units are a deal at $5 each per month (or
better yet free if you're paying enough for your package). I'd have
probably gone with Directv if they didn't have the stupid landline
requirement to sign up.

Randy S.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 5:14:07 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Randy S." <rswittNO@SPAMgmail.com> wrote in message
news:D 46s2t$1fpq$1@spnode25.nerdc.ufl.edu...
>
> > Not really... Someone wants to record their favorite show. They know
it is
> > on Every monday night on CBS from 7-8. Set it up. How is that any
harder
> > than with a program guide? Many people just want to use the pause live
tv
> > option or record what they are currently watching. Why make people pay
> > monthly for that?
>
> Actually most people want to record a specific *show*, not a particular
> channel at a particular time. For most shows those two things will
> coincide *most* of the time. But some shows (like, say, Scrubs) move
> all over the place all the time, and a lot of shows get preempted or
> moved *some* of the time. With Tivo's full service, you can forget
> about it because Tivo takes care of it for you. That peace of mind and
> saving of time is part of what you are paying for.
>

Right. Just saying it would be nice if that was the option of the end user.
You think it is worth the piece of mind - others don't. They just want a
simple vcr like device, but it is not worth the $$ every month.

> > I personally have turned off the autorecord suggestions
> > option. Again, I've got nothing against a fee for the program guide.
> > However, I will soon have 3 Directivo units - If I had to pay $39 month
for
> > program data, I'd be using something else.
>
> Again you are reducing the benefit to a program guide. Most of us see
> it as much more than that. If it's not worth it to you buy a different
> brand of DVR. Besides that 3 Tivo units wouldn't cost you $39 per
> month, they'd cost you $27 per month ($13 + $7 + $7). But there's no
> question that the Directivo units are a deal at $5 each per month (or
> better yet free if you're paying enough for your package). I'd have
> probably gone with Directv if they didn't have the stupid landline
> requirement to sign up.
>
> Randy S.

Actually, DTivo is $5 for ALL your units. You pay an additional $5 per
unit, but that has nothing to do with the Tivo service, it is the same if it
is a DTivo or just a plain Directv receiver. I am paying enough for the
service to be free for me. But, yes, it would not be worth it to me and I
would use something else otherwise. That's the point. More reasonable
options would probably mean more subscribers.

The reason that I'm reducing this to program data is that is the only thing
I see (other than O/S updates) as a real subscription service - something
actually being provided monthly for the fee. The other features that people
are pointing out should not be something you pay for every month - it is
part of the software. Pay once for the software, monthly for updates and
program guide. I use a lot of software and I sure don't pay monthly for all
the nice features. On some, I have annual support/maintenance contracts.
But, those are ones that I choose to do so for the program updates and
support. I mean seriously, use this as an analogy with just about any other
product... You buy a fridge, first you shell out $1000 for it. Then,
imagine if you have to pay $50/month if you want to have it actually cool
your food. Yes, you should have to pay for the electricity to use it, but
not any more to the people who made the fridge in the first place.

BTW - you can get around the landline requirement with Directv. Use a
regular landline to register and get your first round of software updates,
then use a sleeper.iso with the monty hack. It simulates a call every day
and will never time out. Not that I've done this <grin>, but it is what
I've heard. It also gives you the usb/network options as well.

Jim
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 5:14:08 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

> Right. Just saying it would be nice if that was the option of the end user.
> You think it is worth the piece of mind - others don't. They just want a
> simple vcr like device, but it is not worth the $$ every month.

Well, I can't argue with you there, but it looks like Tivo has decided
that that's not a profitable option for them to offer, whether you agree
with it or not.


> Actually, DTivo is $5 for ALL your units. You pay an additional $5 per
> unit, but that has nothing to do with the Tivo service, it is the same if it
> is a DTivo or just a plain Directv receiver.

Yes, though that's a rather technical distinction, it's $5 per month per
Directivo regardless.

> I am paying enough for the
> service to be free for me. But, yes, it would not be worth it to me and I
> would use something else otherwise. That's the point. More reasonable
> options would probably mean more subscribers.
>
> The reason that I'm reducing this to program data is that is the only thing
> I see (other than O/S updates) as a real subscription service - something
> actually being provided monthly for the fee. The other features that people
> are pointing out should not be something you pay for every month - it is
> part of the software. Pay once for the software, monthly for updates and
> program guide. I use a lot of software and I sure don't pay monthly for all
> the nice features. On some, I have annual support/maintenance contracts.
> But, those are ones that I choose to do so for the program updates and
> support. I mean seriously, use this as an analogy with just about any other
> product... You buy a fridge, first you shell out $1000 for it. Then,
> imagine if you have to pay $50/month if you want to have it actually cool
> your food. Yes, you should have to pay for the electricity to use it, but
> not any more to the people who made the fridge in the first place.

Well perhaps we should look at it this way, Tivo is offering program
updates w/ a mandatory support/maintenance contract. You may want that
contract to be optional, but it's not. I agree with you that I think
Tivo would get a lot more customers with a monthly charge closer to $5
per month rather than $13. But would it get them enough more customers
to improve their bottom line? I'd say Tivo's decided that it wouldn't.


> BTW - you can get around the landline requirement with Directv. Use a
> regular landline to register and get your first round of software updates,
> then use a sleeper.iso with the monty hack. It simulates a call every day
> and will never time out. Not that I've done this <grin>, but it is what
> I've heard. It also gives you the usb/network options as well.

Bah, close to $100 to hook the line up, $35 for a month's service, $30
disconnect fee and *then* I'd have to start hacking the unit. I'll wait
'till they drop the requirement (they'll have to at some point, I keep
hearing about a *lot* more people w/ no landlines like me).

Randy S.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 6:07:43 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Randy S." <rswittNO@SPAMgmail.com> wrote in message
news:D 4709d$1gji$1@spnode25.nerdc.ufl.edu...
>
> > Right. Just saying it would be nice if that was the option of the end
user.
> > You think it is worth the piece of mind - others don't. They just want
a
> > simple vcr like device, but it is not worth the $$ every month.
>
> Well, I can't argue with you there, but it looks like Tivo has decided
> that that's not a profitable option for them to offer, whether you agree
> with it or not.
>

And, Tivo is in danger of going out of business if they don't come up with a
better business strategy.

>
> > Actually, DTivo is $5 for ALL your units. You pay an additional $5 per
> > unit, but that has nothing to do with the Tivo service, it is the same
if it
> > is a DTivo or just a plain Directv receiver.
>
> Yes, though that's a rather technical distinction, it's $5 per month per
> Directivo regardless.
>

Yes, but if you used a SA Tivo, it would be the $5 + the Tivo fee. It just
means that if (for example) you have 3 receivers in your house (1 DTivo and
2 standard), then you convert to a second DTivo unit, there is no additional
charge. Subtle technical difference, but important none the less.

> > I am paying enough for the
> > service to be free for me. But, yes, it would not be worth it to me and
I
> > would use something else otherwise. That's the point. More reasonable
> > options would probably mean more subscribers.
> >
> > The reason that I'm reducing this to program data is that is the only
thing
> > I see (other than O/S updates) as a real subscription service -
something
> > actually being provided monthly for the fee. The other features that
people
> > are pointing out should not be something you pay for every month - it is
> > part of the software. Pay once for the software, monthly for updates
and
> > program guide. I use a lot of software and I sure don't pay monthly for
all
> > the nice features. On some, I have annual support/maintenance
contracts.
> > But, those are ones that I choose to do so for the program updates and
> > support. I mean seriously, use this as an analogy with just about any
other
> > product... You buy a fridge, first you shell out $1000 for it. Then,
> > imagine if you have to pay $50/month if you want to have it actually
cool
> > your food. Yes, you should have to pay for the electricity to use it,
but
> > not any more to the people who made the fridge in the first place.
>
> Well perhaps we should look at it this way, Tivo is offering program
> updates w/ a mandatory support/maintenance contract. You may want that
> contract to be optional, but it's not. I agree with you that I think
> Tivo would get a lot more customers with a monthly charge closer to $5
> per month rather than $13. But would it get them enough more customers
> to improve their bottom line? I'd say Tivo's decided that it wouldn't.
>

Well, let's just say the device is $200. A $13/month = $159/year is a VERY
high maintenance contract. Even with programming guide included.

Actually, just for information, Tivo only gets about $1-$2/month from DTV
subscribers. So, someone has decided that it can be profitable to get a
small amount with lots of subscribers. They've recently made a similar
agreement with Comcast. Would my model increase profits? Couldn't say for
sure, but I believe it could if done right.

>
> > BTW - you can get around the landline requirement with Directv. Use a
> > regular landline to register and get your first round of software
updates,
> > then use a sleeper.iso with the monty hack. It simulates a call every
day
> > and will never time out. Not that I've done this <grin>, but it is what
> > I've heard. It also gives you the usb/network options as well.
>
> Bah, close to $100 to hook the line up, $35 for a month's service, $30
> disconnect fee and *then* I'd have to start hacking the unit. I'll wait
> 'till they drop the requirement (they'll have to at some point, I keep
> hearing about a *lot* more people w/ no landlines like me).
>
> Randy S.

You mean to say that you don't have access to a single POTS line at work,
neighbor, friend's house? Use it once and then monty away.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 6:07:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

Scooby (mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net) wrote in alt.video.ptv.tivo:
> > "Randy S." <rswittNO@SPAMgmail.com> wrote in message news:D 4709d$1gji$1@spnode25.nerdc.ufl.edu...
> > > Right. Just saying it would be nice if that was the option of the end
> > > user.
> > > You think it is worth the piece of mind - others don't. They just want
> > > a
> > > simple vcr like device, but it is not worth the $$ every month.
> >
> > Well, I can't argue with you there, but it looks like Tivo has decided
> > that that's not a profitable option for them to offer, whether you agree
> > with it or not.
> >
>
> And, Tivo is in danger of going out of business if they don't come up with a
> better business strategy.

Since there are non-TiVo DVRs available (both with and without DVD
recorders in the units) that don't require a subscription, if your
statement was correct, these units would be selling like hotcakes and
TiVos would be the also-rans.

Yet, stores like Best Buy and Circuit city don't carry a single non-DVD
recorder DVR *except* for those with TiVo software. Heck, there's even
a Sony DVR that has CableCard so it is digital cable compatible (including
HDTV), yet you can hardly find any store that sells it, although I did
find one place:
http://www.fotoconnection.com/viewitem.php?IndexID=9270

TiVo is steadily adding subscribers while sales of DVRs without TiVo
software are dropping. Only provider-supplied DVRs have anywhere near
the same growth as standalone TiVos. So, when people choose to buy, they
buy TiVo. I think that bodes well for their business strategy.

--
Jeff Rife | "This? This is ice. This is what happens to
| water when it gets too cold. This? This is
| Kent. This is what happens to people when
| they get too sexually frustrated."
| -- Chris Knight, "Real Genius"
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 6:46:39 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

Gordon Burditt wrote:
>>I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
>>for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
>>me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
>
> On a Series 1 standalone, YES. You get nag screens about needing
> service every time you invoke something that needs the guide (which
> is a lot of stuff), but you can still do time-and-channel recording.

I was going to mention looking at http://www.servicedvr.com/ for
purchasing a refurbished Series 1 TiVo, but their online store
(BUY A TiVo) appears to be out of stock.
-Joe
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 2:27:22 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

Thanks everyone for your reponses. I think for my purpose Tivo might
not be my best option. Think I'll get a DVD Recorder and use my VCR a
bit more. Tivo does have some nice features so who knows I might get
one for my parents but for me I think the DVD Recorder is all I need.

Chris
April 21, 2005 2:36:45 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 18:34:48 -0400, "Randy S."
<rswittNO@SPAMgmail.com> wrote:

>Seth wrote:
>> "Sean" <none> wrote in message
>> news:6qed6113pcnhlaumud0oanfdk3b2qj2rn7@4ax.com...
>>
>>>
>>> There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
>>> Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
>>> gibberish.
>>
>>
>> Again, reading comprehension appears to not be your strong suit. The
>> topic being discussed here is a StandAlone as the poster in question who
>> has DirecTiVo(s) (and knows the cost of such) is talking about the "$13
>> a month" model.
>>
>> For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
>> there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
>>
>
>And here's the worst of it. In my post I specifically say:
>
>"It's not Tivo's fault if Directv doesn't offer that option anymore
>(though their montly fee is considerably cheaper at $5 /month, just how
>cheap do you want it anyway?)."
>
>So I even covered the base he was claiming I wasn't. Seriously, his
>reading comprehension is majorly lacking.
>
>Randy S.


It seems your typing comprehension needs some help:

And it's *not* just to provide the guide, it also supplies all the
searching cabilities, the home media options, Tivo-to-go, etc. You
may
not use those, but others do.

What a dolt you are Randy. Are you inbred?

Sean
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 5:48:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

> Well, let's just say the device is $200. A $13/month = $159/year is a
VERY
> high maintenance contract. Even with programming guide included.

High according to who?

> Actually, just for information, Tivo only gets about $1-$2/month from DTV
> subscribers. So, someone has decided that it can be profitable to get a
> small amount with lots of subscribers. They've recently made a similar
> agreement with Comcast. Would my model increase profits? Couldn't say
for
> sure, but I believe it could if done right.

Bear in mind that DirecTV also handles ALL support contact for the DirecTivo
customers. They don't call Tivo. Customer Service cost are a huge bite and
$2/month per customer seems about right.
Anonymous
April 21, 2005 6:03:18 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

socialism001@yahoo.com wrote:
> Thanks everyone for your reponses. I think for my purpose Tivo might
> not be my best option. Think I'll get a DVD Recorder and use my VCR a
> bit more. Tivo does have some nice features so who knows I might get
> one for my parents but for me I think the DVD Recorder is all I need.
>
> Chris
>

You might want to consider getting a Tivo DVR combo unit w/ Tivo Basic.
That way you can try out the premium features and see if it's worth it
to you, but revert to the basic option if you decide against it.

Randy S.
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 9:49:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

>> Thanks everyone for your reponses. I think for my purpose Tivo might
>> not be my best option. Think I'll get a DVD Recorder and use my VCR a
>> bit more.

If tivo came with the basic "vcr" functionality, time/channel/quality, people
would have a chance to see if the paid service was worth the $13/month over
and above the vcr functionality. Meaning, if the service was really good,
people would pay it instead of using the vcr-only function.
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 9:54:45 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

>Thanks everyone for your reponses. I think for my purpose Tivo might
>not be my best option. Think I'll get a DVD Recorder and use my VCR a
>bit more. Tivo does have some nice features so who knows I might get
>one for my parents but for me I think the DVD Recorder is all I need.

If you trust rebates at all, circuit city has their 40hr tivo for $199 now
(21st), with a $100 rebate from CC till the end of the month, AND the $100
rebate from tivo if you subscribe to the service till the rebate arrives, then
you can cancel service and have a paperweight with a nice hard drive to take
out. Basically it's being advertized as free after rebate, but of course you
pay sales tax if your state charges it.
It's a really cheap way to see if the service is worth it or not, if not,
sell the tivo on ebay.
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 12:35:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

> If tivo came with the basic "vcr" functionality, time/channel/quality,
people
> would have a chance to see if the paid service was worth the $13/month
over
> and above the vcr functionality. Meaning, if the service was really good,
> people would pay it instead of using the vcr-only function.

Trouble is those initial customers are often where the greatest support
costs lie. Bringing on a boatload of newbies constantly calling with
questions without having the subscription dollars to back up the costs
wouldn't be very fiscally sound. Sure, there's plenty of potential to call
it a marketing expense. Market penetration, however, is continuing to gain
at a steady pace. At some point it might be useful to offer alternatives
but probably not without a greater paying subscriber base. Economies of
scale are a very tricky balance.
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 12:37:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

> I'm making a nonsense argument? Asking to pay a reasonable fee for
service?

Apparently your idea of reasonable and that of several million others
disagree.

> So, you think that just because one company fails at something means that
> means that nobody could ever make it work?

The video industry is littered with the remains of idiots that thought they
could do it better/faster/cheaper. And yet Tivo soldiers on...

> Look at the companies doing well with the open license. Who'd have ever
> thought that you could be successful giving away your product?

In the video distribution market? Name the successful ones.

> I disagree about the 'need' for an updated program guide for much of the
> tivo features. You don't need the program guide for a lot of what tivo
> does. And, specifically what the OP was asking for.

And yet the guide data is part-and-parcel to why the Tivo is what is it and
why people love using it. Sure, a VCR-without-tape certainly has value;
just not to the market segment Tivo is appealing to (quite successfully as
well).

> > Utter nonsense. You're willing to pay for program data. But not
monthly?
> > Just what do you expect here? As for breaking updates out a la carte,
the
> > market doesn't usually take to the idea.
>
> I meant not paying monthly for the O/S updates. Yes, I would happily pay
a
> reasonable fee for guide data. Not sure what you mean about the updates,
> but most software will let you pay for an update as you want. You don't
> have to update on their someone else's schedule.

Trying to justify it with the old "I don't want to update on their schedule"
argument is just lame. Even more so given that DirecTV updates are well out
of sync with the main branch. If you're gung-ho to avoid the updates it's a
simple telnet hack to tell the unit not to do it. But using that as some
sort of justification for a lower monthly cost just doesn't wash.

> Maybe you aren't either <grin>. While you are correct that the grammar is
> incorrect (really a typo), it was a legit word - A spell checker would not
> have caught it, grammer checker might have. Okay, I'm guilty of not using
a
> spell checker. I usually do pretty well without one. Get over yourself,
> already. This is supposed to be fun!!!

And it'd have caught 'grammer' too. If you're going to make nonsense
arguments don't expect not to be shot down on all fronts.
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 1:58:31 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"wkearney99" <wkearney99@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:sOidnX31GboqbfXfRVn-ow@speakeasy.net...
> > I'm making a nonsense argument? Asking to pay a reasonable fee for
> service?
>
> Apparently your idea of reasonable and that of several million others
> disagree.
>

Just because somebody pays something, doesn't mean it is reasonable. If
they charged $50/month there would still probably be people that pay it
(many would do it grudgingly, but they would still do it). I guess you could
say that there are billions that don't think it is reasonable cause they are
not paying it. I do agree that we all have an opinion of what is
reasonable. Tivo certainly hasn't found the right balance yet of what
people consider reasonable, while still being profitable, so your argument
is pretty weak.

> > So, you think that just because one company fails at something means
that
> > means that nobody could ever make it work?
>
> The video industry is littered with the remains of idiots that thought
they
> could do it better/faster/cheaper. And yet Tivo soldiers on...
>

Yea, Tivo keeps clicking on losing major amounts of money. Last fiscal
year, they lost $79 million of revenue of $172. Do the math. Without a
major change in strategy, this company will join that list of failed idiots.

> > Look at the companies doing well with the open license. Who'd have ever
> > thought that you could be successful giving away your product?
>
> In the video distribution market? Name the successful ones.
>

Honestly, I don't know the video distribution market well enough to answer
that. The point was a general one. Just saying that sometimes people can
make things work when it goes against the conventional wisdom of your
average person. Some of the most successful people failed many times before
finding the right answers.

> > I disagree about the 'need' for an updated program guide for much of the
> > tivo features. You don't need the program guide for a lot of what tivo
> > does. And, specifically what the OP was asking for.
>
> And yet the guide data is part-and-parcel to why the Tivo is what is it
and
> why people love using it. Sure, a VCR-without-tape certainly has value;
> just not to the market segment Tivo is appealing to (quite successfully as
> well).
>

Yes, and if people want to keep paying for that, great. However, I believe
(and there certainly has been enough noise about it) that a non-sub dvr that
works like a vcr is in demand. They've got the technology - why not offer
it? Count up the vcr's that they could replace and that people would buy if
there was not a high monthly sub with it. Tivo only has one flavor - full
service. Most products will offer levels of options for the simple reason
that not everyone wants to pay for all the options. Think about auto
dealers. How successful do you think a dealer would be if the only cars he
offered were fully loaded? Would he sell some? Absolutely. But, most
people don't want to pay for options they won't use. Even luxury car makers
offer different flavors and options.

> > > Utter nonsense. You're willing to pay for program data. But not
> monthly?
> > > Just what do you expect here? As for breaking updates out a la carte,
> the
> > > market doesn't usually take to the idea.
> >
> > I meant not paying monthly for the O/S updates. Yes, I would happily
pay
> a
> > reasonable fee for guide data. Not sure what you mean about the
updates,
> > but most software will let you pay for an update as you want. You don't
> > have to update on their someone else's schedule.
>
> Trying to justify it with the old "I don't want to update on their
schedule"
> argument is just lame. Even more so given that DirecTV updates are well
out
> of sync with the main branch. If you're gung-ho to avoid the updates it's
a
> simple telnet hack to tell the unit not to do it. But using that as some
> sort of justification for a lower monthly cost just doesn't wash.
>

If you update all your software the moment a patch comes out, then you are
foolish. I always lag behind to make sure that a release is stable before
upgrading - and usually don't upgrade at all unless there is reason to.
Again, look at all the people complaining about v7. They are looking for
ways to go back to the old version. Should you have to pay extra monthly to
hack your box so that you can stay on a stable release?

> > Maybe you aren't either <grin>. While you are correct that the grammar
is
> > incorrect (really a typo), it was a legit word - A spell checker would
not
> > have caught it, grammer checker might have. Okay, I'm guilty of not
using
> a
> > spell checker. I usually do pretty well without one. Get over
yourself,
> > already. This is supposed to be fun!!!
>
> And it'd have caught 'grammer' too. If you're going to make nonsense
> arguments don't expect not to be shot down on all fronts.
>

Okay, first, not ALL spell checkers check grammar. I use Outlook Express
for my newgroup reading. It does not check grammer. And, did you even test
this yourself? I put my paragraph in Word, which does auto spell and
grammar check. No dice. You should know what you are talking about before
giving someone else such a hard time.

Again, this is supposed to be fun, educational and entertaining. Why get
hung up on some pissy grammar/spelling argument? What does that really have
to do with Tivo service. Are you really wanting to discuss the Tivo issue
or just get in someone's face?

Anyway, back to the nature of this thread.... My whole stance can be
summarized to this. Tivo has a great product, but shuts a lot of people out
based on the high subscription fee (again, I still fail to see the
justification for this high of a fee). There are options out there for a
lot more revenue. Since Tivo is losing (is that better?) so much money, it
is certainly worth exploring. That's all. This whole argument started
because one person asked if a non-sub option was available and he got a
really lame, in your face 'If you want a vcr, get a vcr' response. Jeepers,
what is the harm in asking?
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 4:12:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

> Anyway, back to the nature of this thread.... My whole stance can be
> summarized to this. Tivo has a great product, but shuts a lot of people out
> based on the high subscription fee (again, I still fail to see the
> justification for this high of a fee). There are options out there for a
> lot more revenue. Since Tivo is losing (is that better?) so much money, it
> is certainly worth exploring. That's all. This whole argument started
> because one person asked if a non-sub option was available and he got a
> really lame, in your face 'If you want a vcr, get a vcr' response. Jeepers,
> what is the harm in asking?

This argument is so repetitive (meaning that it keeps popping up in
different threads), because it's not provable one way or the other, and
people have strong opinions either way. Revenue != profits necessarily,
and while you may disagree w/ Tivo's business model, it just doesn't pay
to keep rehashing it. You'll just have to agree to disagree. Balancing
revenues and profits is a tricky business and fully informed decisions
require a lot more than speculating about it in a newsgroup thread.
Historically, technology venture capital think was to gain as much
market penetration as possible by offering impossibly low entry fees at
first at a huge loss, than predict recouping those losses later when
you've attained mass market appeal. But then the bubble burst, and
perhaps Tivo would rather bank on slower growth while keeping losses
under control. But again, this is all speculation, I don't have access
to the balance sheets or business plans.

I would point out that your argument about luxury brands offering
multiple levels of entry isn't always true however, many items of that
type *don't*, specifically so that their product image remains high-end
and full-featured only. There is a cachet and appeal to being perceived
as exclusive or high-end, that offering a budget model would erase.
It's similar to Warren Buffet's investment fund strategy, the shares are
upwards of $15,000 a piece because he wants only *serious* investors
involved with him. He has decided he *doesn't* want to appeal to the
mass market. Or how offering a cheap Mercedes or Ferrari could destroy
the valuable image of those products.

Randy S.
April 22, 2005 10:21:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Sean" <none> wrote in message
news:6qed6113pcnhlaumud0oanfdk3b2qj2rn7@4ax.com...
>
> There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
> Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
> gibberish.

Again, reading comprehension appears to not be your strong suit. The topic
being discussed here is a StandAlone as the poster in question who has
DirecTiVo(s) (and knows the cost of such) is talking about the "$13 a month"
model.

For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
April 22, 2005 10:21:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Sean" <none> wrote in message
news:6qed6113pcnhlaumud0oanfdk3b2qj2rn7@4ax.com...
>
> There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
> Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
> gibberish.

Again, reading comprehension appears to not be your strong suit. The topic
being discussed here is a StandAlone as the poster in question who has
DirecTiVo(s) (and knows the cost of such) is talking about the "$13 a month"
model.

For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
April 22, 2005 10:21:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Sean" <none> wrote in message
news:6qed6113pcnhlaumud0oanfdk3b2qj2rn7@4ax.com...
>
> There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
> Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
> gibberish.

Again, reading comprehension appears to not be your strong suit. The topic
being discussed here is a StandAlone as the poster in question who has
DirecTiVo(s) (and knows the cost of such) is talking about the "$13 a month"
model.

For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
April 22, 2005 10:21:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Sean" <none> wrote in message
news:6qed6113pcnhlaumud0oanfdk3b2qj2rn7@4ax.com...
>
> There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
> Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
> gibberish.

Again, reading comprehension appears to not be your strong suit. The topic
being discussed here is a StandAlone as the poster in question who has
DirecTiVo(s) (and knows the cost of such) is talking about the "$13 a month"
model.

For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
April 22, 2005 10:21:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Sean" <none> wrote in message
news:6qed6113pcnhlaumud0oanfdk3b2qj2rn7@4ax.com...
>
> There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
> Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
> gibberish.

Again, reading comprehension appears to not be your strong suit. The topic
being discussed here is a StandAlone as the poster in question who has
DirecTiVo(s) (and knows the cost of such) is talking about the "$13 a month"
model.

For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
April 22, 2005 10:21:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Scooby" <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:a027a$4266ad24$a22770bd$11560@ALLTEL.NET...
> "Mike Hunt" <in2sheep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:116d4igaevufaca@corp.supernews.com...
>> On 2005-04-20, socialism001@yahoo.com <socialism001@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
>> > for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
>> > me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
>>
>> If you want a VCR, why don't you just get a VCR?
>
> Now, that is a really lame response. The picture is better, plus doesn't
> degrade when being played a bunch of times. There are a lot of nice
> features to the Tivo that could be provided without a subscription. If
> there was such a thing as a digital vcr (like Tivo but without the program
> guide), I think a lot of people would get that before getting a
> sbuscription
> based DVR.

There are service free DVRs out there. They are just more expensive and
typically not as nice (nice being subjective).

> I've said before that the subscription price is just too much for the
> service. I have Tivo and love it, but I get it free with my level of
> Directv, which includes a couple devices in my house. If I had to pay for
> the service, I probably wouldn't get it (I'd get another media option that
> is does not come with such a high monthly fee). I would much rather pay a
> higher price for the box and then have no (or low) monthly fee. $13/month
> is WAY too high for them just to provide a TV guide - IMHO.

What is a fair price for a TiVo like device with no service fee? Is $350
fair? Cause that's what you can get a TiVo for with lifetime subscription
pre-paid.

> I really think in order to succeed, Tivo should become a software company.
> Charge fair market value for the box, add a fee for the software and then
> a
> small monthly fee for programming only if the user wants the programming.
> However, the software should still be fully functional without the program
> guide.

They also do that as well. Pioneer (and I think 1 other brand) offer DVRs
with TiVo basic included. No HMO features and a 3 day guide.
April 22, 2005 10:21:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Sean" <none> wrote in message
news:6qed6113pcnhlaumud0oanfdk3b2qj2rn7@4ax.com...
>
> There you go again Randy. Directv does not offer all those options.
> Even I know that but that doesn't stop you from posting your
> gibberish.

Again, reading comprehension appears to not be your strong suit. The topic
being discussed here is a StandAlone as the poster in question who has
DirecTiVo(s) (and knows the cost of such) is talking about the "$13 a month"
model.

For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
April 22, 2005 10:21:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Scooby" <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:a027a$4266ad24$a22770bd$11560@ALLTEL.NET...
> "Mike Hunt" <in2sheep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:116d4igaevufaca@corp.supernews.com...
>> On 2005-04-20, socialism001@yahoo.com <socialism001@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
>> > for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
>> > me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
>>
>> If you want a VCR, why don't you just get a VCR?
>
> Now, that is a really lame response. The picture is better, plus doesn't
> degrade when being played a bunch of times. There are a lot of nice
> features to the Tivo that could be provided without a subscription. If
> there was such a thing as a digital vcr (like Tivo but without the program
> guide), I think a lot of people would get that before getting a
> sbuscription
> based DVR.

There are service free DVRs out there. They are just more expensive and
typically not as nice (nice being subjective).

> I've said before that the subscription price is just too much for the
> service. I have Tivo and love it, but I get it free with my level of
> Directv, which includes a couple devices in my house. If I had to pay for
> the service, I probably wouldn't get it (I'd get another media option that
> is does not come with such a high monthly fee). I would much rather pay a
> higher price for the box and then have no (or low) monthly fee. $13/month
> is WAY too high for them just to provide a TV guide - IMHO.

What is a fair price for a TiVo like device with no service fee? Is $350
fair? Cause that's what you can get a TiVo for with lifetime subscription
pre-paid.

> I really think in order to succeed, Tivo should become a software company.
> Charge fair market value for the box, add a fee for the software and then
> a
> small monthly fee for programming only if the user wants the programming.
> However, the software should still be fully functional without the program
> guide.

They also do that as well. Pioneer (and I think 1 other brand) offer DVRs
with TiVo basic included. No HMO features and a 3 day guide.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 3:55:58 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

>For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
>there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.

My newsserver is showing six copies of this message.
April 23, 2005 4:43:01 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

<jstlucas at hotmail dot com @delete.thisstuff (Joe St. Lucas)> wrote in
message news:8agae.16913$%c1.11187@fed1read05...
> >For someone who likes to comment on other people's intelligence, or lack
>>there of, you really should learn to practice what you preach.
>
> My newsserver is showing six copies of this message.

Yup. Original was posted a few days ago. My ISP had some glitch and a
whole bunch of messages from their customers got re-posted numerous times.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 5:01:22 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Scooby" <mmscooby1@removeme.earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:511d0$426902f9$a22770bd$23993@ALLTEL.NET...
>SNIP


> Yes, and if people want to keep paying for that, great. However, I
> believe
> (and there certainly has been enough noise about it) that a non-sub dvr
> that
> works like a vcr is in demand. They've got the technology - why not offer
> it? Count up the vcr's that they could replace and that people would buy
> if
> there was not a high monthly sub with it. Tivo only has one flavor - full
> service. Most products will offer levels of options for the simple reason
> that not everyone wants to pay for all the options. Think about auto
> dealers. How successful do you think a dealer would be if the only cars
> he
> offered were fully loaded? Would he sell some? Absolutely. But, most
> people don't want to pay for options they won't use. Even luxury car
> makers
> offer different flavors and options.
>
Actually if you look at what the Japanese car makers have done, they have
reduced the number of options rather than increase them. Most Japanese cars
have 1-3 option packages ulike US manufacturers where options are priced
ala-carte. People want simplicity not complexity. Tivo has 2 options,
monthly or lifetime service. The connection I don't think you are making is
Tivo=Service (not Tivo=hardware). There are lots of DVRs that don't require
service that will do exactly what you want. So it would seem to me that you
do have options, get Tivo service or get a DVR that doesn't require service.

SNIP

> Anyway, back to the nature of this thread.... My whole stance can be
> summarized to this. Tivo has a great product, but shuts a lot of people
> out
> based on the high subscription fee (again, I still fail to see the
> justification for this high of a fee). There are options out there for a
> lot more revenue. Since Tivo is losing (is that better?) so much money,
> it
> is certainly worth exploring. That's all. This whole argument started
> because one person asked if a non-sub option was available and he got a
> really lame, in your face 'If you want a vcr, get a vcr' response.
> Jeepers,
> what is the harm in asking?
>

No harm in asking and I agree that the 'get a VCR' response was moronic. I
don't get your logic that a company that is losing money should lower its
prices on its products. If they can't make money with the existing price I
think the conventional wisdom would be to price the product to make a profit
or reduce the operating costs so that there is margin in the existing
product pricing model. Granted there is some elasticity in the market and
perhaps a lower price would garner Tivo some additional subscribers but
without an in-depth analysis it's hard to say what effect a lower
subscription rate would do to increase subscribers.

TC
Anonymous
April 28, 2005 2:21:56 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

In article <HJudnW4T_Jgc6_rfRVn-jg@comcast.com>,
Joe Smith <joe@inwap.com> wrote:

> I was going to mention looking at http://www.servicedvr.com/ for
> purchasing a refurbished Series 1 TiVo, but their online store
> (BUY A TiVo) appears to be out of stock.

Philips appears to have some:
<http://www.servicedvr.com/Extra/BuyExtraTivo.asp&gt;

--
Hank Gillette
Anonymous
April 28, 2005 3:51:25 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On 2005-04-20 13:29:04 -0400, socialism001@yahoo.com said:

> I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
> for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
> me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
>
> Thanks,
> Chris

That feature is only available on a Series 1 TIVO. The Series 2
software will not work without the service.

Go on ebay, you may find a used series 1 there.
Anonymous
April 28, 2005 6:55:02 AM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Hank Gillette" <hankgillette@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:hankgillette-19E802.22215627042005@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> In article <HJudnW4T_Jgc6_rfRVn-jg@comcast.com>,
> Joe Smith <joe@inwap.com> wrote:
>
> > I was going to mention looking at http://www.servicedvr.com/ for
> > purchasing a refurbished Series 1 TiVo, but their online store
> > (BUY A TiVo) appears to be out of stock.
>
> Philips appears to have some:
> <http://www.servicedvr.com/Extra/BuyExtraTivo.asp&gt;
>

Hank,
You provided a link to the site that doesn't have Series 1 TiVos
in stock. Servicedvr.com is not Philips owned.
It is a Philips authorized service center.

You can purchase a refurbished DirecTV DVR (DSR6000) for only
$159.95 providing you have a broken DSR6000 to return. If you don't
have a broken Philips DirecTV DVR, a refurbished DSR6000 is $249.95.

I paid $99.95 for a new Philips DSR6000 in late 2001. These things
must age like wine. . = )
Anonymous
April 28, 2005 2:53:25 PM

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Noah Body" <NoahBody@invisible.net> wrote in message
news:2005042723512516807%NoahBody@invisiblenet...
> On 2005-04-20 13:29:04 -0400, socialism001@yahoo.com said:
>
> > I'd like to get a tivo but am not interested in paying a monthly fee
> > for the schedule. Can I set TIVO to record programs like my VCR allows
> > me ? Date,Time,Channel,Quality
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Chris
>
> That feature is only available on a Series 1 TIVO. The Series 2
> software will not work without the service.
>
> Go on ebay, you may find a used series 1 there.

I thought it was only Series 1's that shipped with a certain version of the
software initially? Or maybe they all do it, but the older ones do it with
less nags?

IMO, Tivo Basic is a better way to go for this application.

Ed
84HurstOlds@nowherenow.com
!