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H60, Push vs Pull default instruc. Pull?

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October 22, 2011 9:11:57 AM

From what I've read it seems that push is better than pulling in respect to fan placement but all of the install videos I've seen using 1 fan seem to have the fan pulling air with the radiator inside and the fan outside adjacent to the outer case. Why is this? Am I missing something?
a b K Overclocking
October 22, 2011 10:04:12 AM

Either way you look at it, the fan is pulling from one side and pushing it on the other.
A Push Pull Config is with 2 fans, never with a single fan.
Air on the outside of the case is cooler than the air on the inside of the case thus the Air is pulled into the case and the Radiator is placed behind it allowing cool air to flow over the cooling fins of the rad.
The pic you saw with the Fan outside the case must have been because the pipes of the H60 are not detachable thus the user must have not had the idea of mounting the Fan and the rad inside the case pulling air in, or then , he might not have had enough space to mount both of them within the case because of a NB heatsink.
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a b K Overclocking
October 23, 2011 4:44:35 AM

Somewhere I heard that pull is a better option than push because the fan has a "dead spot" in the center when pushing, but the flow of air is even when pulling.

I've seen tests though, and the difference isn't significant. You're fine either way as long as the fan is exhausting out the case.
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a c 330 K Overclocking
October 24, 2011 1:30:03 AM

For most medium or lower speeds, pull works better...but it's only a slight margin. Differences are typically environmental when using the same fans in push or pull. Push/pull with low/med speed fans can get close to push OR pull with higher speed fans in some instances (depending on rad model and fans in question).
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October 24, 2011 6:53:27 AM

My Phenom II x3 720 maxes out at 3.7Ghz, 2.6ghz FSB, and 2.6Ghz HT freq. @1.45 volts on cpu and 1.35 NB. The max temp after ten minutes or so of 100% usage is 93F and idles at 67F. When I remove the side panel and place a box fan on low setting next to the case max temp is 85F and 59F idle. Still I can't go any further than this speed, I don't think it's the heat. What limits overclock besides temperature . .there seems to be a transient quality of chip but what variables does that entail?

Thanks.
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a c 330 K Overclocking
October 24, 2011 1:39:01 PM

Your hardware is often one of the biggest limitations: your motherboard might not be able to control voltages well enough to remain stable, your RAM/speed/voltage might not be up to par for the stepping or speeds you want to use or your PSU may not be able to deliver power that is clean or stable enough for your MB...which might starts the cycle over. Between hardware limitations, BIOS setting limitations and user error you have 95% of the reasons hardware doesn't OC like you intend. Temps really account for very little cause for overclocking failure.
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a b K Overclocking
October 25, 2011 2:38:55 AM

Yup, I agree, the temps really do account for very little. An OC will go to the max that the hardware will allow itself to be pushed, mainly, the RAM, NB,SB and CPU frequencies, temps are only kept under decent limits to a save ourselves from sheer catastrophe. Other components on the the Mobo will also effect the max you can take the Mobo frequencies to, thus they vary between different manufacturers and different models.
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a c 100 K Overclocking
October 27, 2011 10:07:08 PM

Just to go back to the original question, IMO I'd try to go with pull, and put a shroud around it. You could probably even just use black electrical tape - the point is to force the fan to suck the air through the rad and not let it get air in from the small gaps between the rad and the fan. It should have a pretty uniform air movement through the rad this way (in theory). I just did some work on my loop and when I took off my fans (they were in push) I could see a ring of dust with a dead clean center, so obviously it's not the most optimal cooling to have just push.
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October 30, 2011 12:43:16 AM

On my 1090t i using a H60 with it pulling and exhausting out the back. I tried it pulling cool air from outside and the cpu temps stayed the same but the gpu temps went up by 4*.
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a b K Overclocking
October 30, 2011 5:13:00 AM

@bhilly82
When using the Corsairs for pulling air into the case we usually have a case with a top exhaust fan. That makes it more efficient.
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October 30, 2011 6:37:05 AM

@bhilly82, Very True! I just switched my H60 fan from intake to exhaust and my GPU temps went down by about the same margin 3-4 degrees C. Now that the thermal paste has settled my max temps are 87 F at max load after some hours of Battlefield 3. Last question then I will award alyoshka with best answer for his insightful posts, What effects will my ram timings and speed have on the overclock specifically and can I do any damage to my CPU with the overclock due just to increase in voltage over time even if I go no further than 1.45v? I know that was a 2 pronged question but I think you're up to it!

Thanks again for you time guys.
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October 30, 2011 7:05:06 AM

@alyoshka, I do have a top fan. I have the Thermltake V9 Black http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168....
I couldn't use the side fan but the top fan is exhausting the air out the top, and my gpu temps did go up with the fresh air from the back. I do have a heat pump of a graphics card.
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a b K Overclocking
October 30, 2011 9:01:18 AM

I wonder why that happened, In my HAF 932s and 922, it seems to be quit the opposite. With SLI and CF configs on, only thing different in the 922s was I had to put the side panel fan on, of course, I used the same HAF 932 Side Panel fans on the 922s and it did really get down the temps quite a notch.

But what I did notice in the HAFs was that a bottom intake fan which I had mounted with a speed controller did increase the temps of the GPUs when it was turned on half it's speed and on full it even got the temps higher, the lowest was attained only at the least RPM of that bottom mounted intake fan.
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a c 100 K Overclocking
October 30, 2011 3:35:53 PM

mancid rilk said:
@bhilly82, Very True! I just switched my H60 fan from intake to exhaust and my GPU temps went down by about the same margin 3-4 degrees C. Now that the thermal paste has settled my max temps are 87 F at max load after some hours of Battlefield 3. Last question then I will award alyoshka with best answer for his insightful posts, What effects will my ram timings and speed have on the overclock specifically and can I do any damage to my CPU with the overclock due just to increase in voltage over time even if I go no further than 1.45v? I know that was a 2 pronged question but I think you're up to it!

Thanks again for you time guys.


Ram timing and speeds affect the overclock in the sense that if it's tied into the FSB, then you'll need to choose an FSB that can allow the RAM to run at it's rated speed. You can OC RAM, but let's say you go from 1600mhz to 1800mhz, then that would require an increase in the timings as well (such as from 8-8-8-24 to 9-9-9-27). As far as performance go, RAM is one of the least performance affecting pieces of hardware. Yes, it can help to have faster RAM but it's not going to really matter compared to the CPU OC and having an SSD and fast GPU.

As for burning out the CPU, yes you can even at 1.45V. Technically. I don't know as much about AMD OCing so maybe they handle a little more voltage, but I do know that over 1.4V on Intel CPUs can burn them out in a few months. I think I just read about it too in one of Tom's more recent articles although I can't recall which one.
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August 31, 2014 5:05:13 PM

alyoshka said:
Either way you look at it, the fan is pulling from one side and pushing it on the other.
A Push Pull Config is with 2 fans, never with a single fan.
Air on the outside of the case is cooler than the air on the inside of the case thus the Air is pulled into the case and the Radiator is placed behind it allowing cool air to flow over the cooling fins of the rad....


I'm no fluid dynamics expert by a long shot but I think this is not correct. The side of the fan that faces the rad should have a difference of efficiency in principle at least. "Pushed" air is a more efficient method of transferring heat than "pulled" air. "Astra.Xtreme" explained it best here...he said "Turbulent flow is more efficient than laminar flow."

Secondly the ability of air to transfer heat via convection is only governed by the speed with which the air is moving or the pressure differential. "Astra.Xtreme" the sly dog said it best here again and I quote...

"It really doesn't matter what kind of air you blow through the radiator. It will still dissipate heat. For example, if the ambient air temperature is 150 degrees in your bedroom and you sit in front of a fan, the air feels colder and it cools you off. The air is still 150 degrees that's being blown at you, but it still cools you down. Same principle applies in a PC."

Of course you also have the added complication that the fans themselves are generating heat.So I just got a H60 for my new build and I'm gonna have a Noctua NF-P12 externally mounted and the radiator inside with the stock corsair fan mounted internally pushing air on to the rad.

With the immense amounts of heat coming up from your gfx card and being sucked back into the case I can honestly see no advantage to an intake system as recommended by corsair even with top mounted exhausts but I'm willing to try a few different setups and see which one comes out on top in the real world.
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