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Which laptops are NOT outsourced?

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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
May 24, 2004 4:29:40 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

I was reading this enlightening article about how 90% of laptops
are made on contract to brand-name companies:

http://www.notebookcomputers.com/madebywho.asp

and it made me wonder several things:

1) Are the computers made by these non-brand-name
manufacturers even DESIGNED by the brand-name
companies?

2) Which brand-name laptops are made by the brand-name
company themselves?

3) Is there any difference in quality between brand-name
manufactured laptops and those outsourced?

4) Which outsourced laptop models are the same across
brand-names (i.e. is the IBm Thinkpad T41 the same as
the Dell Whateveritscalled?)

Anyone know the answers to this question?

More about : laptops outsourced

Anonymous
a b D Laptop
May 24, 2004 7:08:38 PM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Anonymous User" <googleTrashBin@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:39af109b.0405232329.3941b895@posting.google.com...
> I was reading this enlightening article about how 90% of laptops
> are made on contract to brand-name companies:
>
> http://www.notebookcomputers.com/madebywho.asp
>
> and it made me wonder several things:
>
> 1) Are the computers made by these non-brand-name
> manufacturers even DESIGNED by the brand-name
> companies?

Sometimes. More often these days, the ODMs do a lot of the design work.

>
> 2) Which brand-name laptops are made by the brand-name
> company themselves?

Fewer and fewer. IBM and Toshiba still make some of their own machines.
Very few others do.

>
> 3) Is there any difference in quality between brand-name
> manufactured laptops and those outsourced?

Own-manufacture systems tend to be high-end; the low and mid-range are
almost
all outsourced - it's difficult to make a universal comparison.

>
> 4) Which outsourced laptop models are the same across
> brand-names (i.e. is the IBm Thinkpad T41 the same as
> the Dell Whateveritscalled?)

It varies by the month, and even within model lines. IBM sources ThinkPad R
systems from Wistron and LG both - and makes some itself, for instance.
Fewer and fewer models are identical across manufacturers.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
May 24, 2004 8:18:19 PM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Edward J. Neth <ejn63@netscape.com> wrote:
>
> It varies by the month, and even within model lines. IBM sources
> ThinkPad R systems from Wistron and LG both - and makes some itself,
> for instance.

Actually, that's no longer true. IBM sold all of their laptop plants to
other companies last year and these companies now manufacture all Thinkpads
for IBM.

They're still designed by IBM and must meet IBM quality control standards,
but IBM itself is no longer in the laptop manufacturing business.

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Related resources
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
May 24, 2004 11:38:20 PM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

..
>
> They're still designed by IBM and must meet IBM quality control standards,
> but IBM itself is no longer in the laptop manufacturing business.
>
Interesting. We will see if this means better or worse quality. No doubt
it means they can be made for less.



--
Jim Walker
Northern Virginia
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
May 25, 2004 12:19:50 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Jim Walker <walkerjd1@att.net.net> wrote:
>>
> Interesting. We will see if this means better or worse quality. No
> doubt it means they can be made for less.

If the several T40s, T41s and the X31 I have had my hands on recently are
any indicator, the quality is, if anything, better!

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
May 25, 2004 12:26:00 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

SOME Toshiba laptops are actually made by Toshiba, others are outsourced.

Generally, if the computer is outsourced, it's designed by the firm that
built it not the firm that it was being built for. However, this is not
an absolute rule.

In the case of Toshiba, the quality of the Toshiba-built models is MUCH
better than of the outsourced models. However, there is a substantial
price difference (about $200-$300).


Anonymous User wrote:

> I was reading this enlightening article about how 90% of laptops
> are made on contract to brand-name companies:
>
> http://www.notebookcomputers.com/madebywho.asp
>
> and it made me wonder several things:
>
> 1) Are the computers made by these non-brand-name
> manufacturers even DESIGNED by the brand-name
> companies?
>
> 2) Which brand-name laptops are made by the brand-name
> company themselves?
>
> 3) Is there any difference in quality between brand-name
> manufactured laptops and those outsourced?
>
> 4) Which outsourced laptop models are the same across
> brand-names (i.e. is the IBm Thinkpad T41 the same as
> the Dell Whateveritscalled?)
>
> Anyone know the answers to this question?
May 25, 2004 2:07:38 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

JHEM wrote:
> Jim Walker <walkerjd1@att.net.net> wrote:
>
>> Interesting. We will see if this means better or worse quality. No
>>doubt it means they can be made for less.
>
>
> If the several T40s, T41s and the X31 I have had my hands on recently are
> any indicator, the quality is, if anything, better!
>
The majority of the IBM Thinkpads are built in China, most definitely
cheaper... not many countries left that can compete at that price point...

Scotland, Hungary and Guadalajara are no longer in the laptop business
albeit that they(the plants)were sold by IBM to Sanmina-SCI, IBM moved
the work to te Far East.
The T series is inhouse IBM designed, the others are Wistron & LG, all
good boxes, just identify your needs and match the price...
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
May 25, 2004 7:41:31 PM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Jim <JTHendry@nospamUKlinux.net> wrote:

> The T series is inhouse IBM designed, the others are Wistron & LG, all
> good boxes, just identify your needs and match the price...

The X series, like the T series, are designed in-house by IBM.

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
May 26, 2004 9:48:47 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Are there any actual comparison tests that are not opinion but fact? Middle
priced machines. quiet fans, battery life?


"Barry Watzman" <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote in message
news:40B25A67.5000702@neo.rr.com...
> SOME Toshiba laptops are actually made by Toshiba, others are outsourced.
>
> Generally, if the computer is outsourced, it's designed by the firm that
> built it not the firm that it was being built for. However, this is not
> an absolute rule.
>
> In the case of Toshiba, the quality of the Toshiba-built models is MUCH
> better than of the outsourced models. However, there is a substantial
> price difference (about $200-$300).
>
>
> Anonymous User wrote:
>
> > I was reading this enlightening article about how 90% of laptops
> > are made on contract to brand-name companies:
> >
> > http://www.notebookcomputers.com/madebywho.asp
> >
> > and it made me wonder several things:
> >
> > 1) Are the computers made by these non-brand-name
> > manufacturers even DESIGNED by the brand-name
> > companies?
> >
> > 2) Which brand-name laptops are made by the brand-name
> > company themselves?
> >
> > 3) Is there any difference in quality between brand-name
> > manufactured laptops and those outsourced?
> >
> > 4) Which outsourced laptop models are the same across
> > brand-names (i.e. is the IBm Thinkpad T41 the same as
> > the Dell Whateveritscalled?)
> >
> > Anyone know the answers to this question?
>
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
May 27, 2004 7:01:14 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Anonymous User wrote:
>
> I was reading this enlightening article about how 90% of laptops
> are made on contract to brand-name companies:
>
> http://www.notebookcomputers.com/madebywho.asp
>
> and it made me wonder several things:
>
> 1) Are the computers made by these non-brand-name
> manufacturers even DESIGNED by the brand-name
> companies?
>
> 2) Which brand-name laptops are made by the brand-name
> company themselves?



AFAIK, Panasonic notebooks are
built entirely by Panasonic. I
could be wrong of course.



dk
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 2, 2004 9:01:22 PM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

googleTrashBin@yahoo.com (Anonymous User) wrote in message news:<39af109b.0405232329.3941b895@posting.google.com>...
> I was reading this enlightening article about how 90% of laptops
> are made on contract to brand-name companies:
>
> http://www.notebookcomputers.com/madebywho.asp
>
> and it made me wonder several things:
>
> 1) Are the computers made by these non-brand-name
> manufacturers even DESIGNED by the brand-name
> companies?

This would be variable to certain extents

>
> 2) Which brand-name laptops are made by the brand-name
> company themselves?

Look for the business ranges of well-known laptop manufacturers:

Dell Latitude
Apple Powerbook and iBook
IBM T and X series
Compaq Armada's
Toshiba Tecra's

There are others but I think you can be pretty sure about these.

>
> 3) Is there any difference in quality between brand-name
> manufactured laptops and those outsourced?

The brand-name manufactured laptops will almost most always be better
quality (it doesn't really make economic sense to make it in house of
less quality), but the difference depends. Difference between
latitude and inspiron (in terms of reliability, not apparent feel of
quality) is supposedly quite large. Difference between T and R series
thinkpads is not so large.

>
> 4) Which outsourced laptop models are the same across
> brand-names (i.e. is the IBm Thinkpad T41 the same as
> the Dell Whateveritscalled?)


There is no other laptop like the T41 except the 14" T42 and T40. You
can't be referring to the D800 - which is much larger than the T
series (and apparently, of worse apparent quality- though I'm sure
they're reliable)

The same laptop shells can be seen in "noname" brands - you'll notice
some laptops look very similar - they are rarely from the big name
manufacturers.

>
> Anyone know the answers to this question?

I'm not in the business, but this is my general impression from doing
this kind of research before purchasing my laptop. A bit of advice if
you're buying your first laptop - they're fragile and break easily. I
recommend getting an extended warranty and a good quality laptop -
when they're shiny and new you don't see the potential hassle they can
cause by breaking down, which they do on a 100x more frequent basis
that a desktop.

Duncan.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 3, 2004 5:07:42 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

All the suppliers outsource the designs.


"Duncan James Murray" <duncanjamesmurray@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:992f1a28.0406021601.c7b9821@posting.google.com...
> googleTrashBin@yahoo.com (Anonymous User) wrote in message
news:<39af109b.0405232329.3941b895@posting.google.com>...
> > I was reading this enlightening article about how 90% of laptops
> > are made on contract to brand-name companies:
> >
> > http://www.notebookcomputers.com/madebywho.asp
> >
> > and it made me wonder several things:
> >
> > 1) Are the computers made by these non-brand-name
> > manufacturers even DESIGNED by the brand-name
> > companies?
>
> This would be variable to certain extents
>
> >
> > 2) Which brand-name laptops are made by the brand-name
> > company themselves?
>
> Look for the business ranges of well-known laptop manufacturers:
>
> Dell Latitude
> Apple Powerbook and iBook
> IBM T and X series
> Compaq Armada's
> Toshiba Tecra's
>
> There are others but I think you can be pretty sure about these.
>
> >
> > 3) Is there any difference in quality between brand-name
> > manufactured laptops and those outsourced?
>
> The brand-name manufactured laptops will almost most always be better
> quality (it doesn't really make economic sense to make it in house of
> less quality), but the difference depends. Difference between
> latitude and inspiron (in terms of reliability, not apparent feel of
> quality) is supposedly quite large. Difference between T and R series
> thinkpads is not so large.
>
> >
> > 4) Which outsourced laptop models are the same across
> > brand-names (i.e. is the IBm Thinkpad T41 the same as
> > the Dell Whateveritscalled?)
>
>
> There is no other laptop like the T41 except the 14" T42 and T40. You
> can't be referring to the D800 - which is much larger than the T
> series (and apparently, of worse apparent quality- though I'm sure
> they're reliable)
>
> The same laptop shells can be seen in "noname" brands - you'll notice
> some laptops look very similar - they are rarely from the big name
> manufacturers.
>
> >
> > Anyone know the answers to this question?
>
> I'm not in the business, but this is my general impression from doing
> this kind of research before purchasing my laptop. A bit of advice if
> you're buying your first laptop - they're fragile and break easily. I
> recommend getting an extended warranty and a good quality laptop -
> when they're shiny and new you don't see the potential hassle they can
> cause by breaking down, which they do on a 100x more frequent basis
> that a desktop.
>
> Duncan.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 5, 2004 4:56:28 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

> >
> > Dell Latitude
> > Apple Powerbook and iBook
> > IBM T and X series
> > Compaq Armada's
> > Toshiba Tecra's

These are all made by Taiwan ODMs
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 6, 2004 7:32:04 PM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

lewdvig <plongin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> Dell Latitude
>>> Apple Powerbook and iBook
>>> IBM T and X series
>>> Compaq Armada's
>>> Toshiba Tecra's
>
> These are all made by Taiwan ODMs

Yes, but in most instances they're not _designed_ by them.

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 8, 2004 2:29:59 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

JHEM wrote:
> lewdvig <plongin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>>Dell Latitude
>>>>Apple Powerbook and iBook
>>>>IBM T and X series
>>>>Compaq Armada's
>>>>Toshiba Tecra's
>>
>>These are all made by Taiwan ODMs
>
>
> Yes, but in most instances they're not _designed_ by them.
>

Er, well, what do you think the D in ODM stands for? I think the above
list of laptops are made by Taiwanese OEMs. The distinction is not casual.

-p
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 8, 2004 2:30:00 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

plated metal <ha@yeah.right> wrote:
>
> Er, well, what do you think the D in ODM stands for? I think the above
> list of laptops are made by Taiwanese OEMs. The distinction is not
> casual.

I know exactly what the "D" stands for and it's why I responded as I did.

Of the models that were listed, the IBM T and X series, the Compaq Armada
series and the Toshiba Tecra series are all designed in-house by their
respective sellers.

All Dell and Apple laptops are ODM designs.

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 10, 2004 2:58:04 AM

Archived from groups: ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

JHEM <James@ESAD_SPAMMERS.thinkpads.com> wrote:

> All Dell and Apple laptops are ODM designs.

I'm sure that Jonathan Ives, the award winning designer of the Apple
iBook, Powerbook, iMac, G4 and G5 towers and the iPod would be
interested to learn that!

While Dell's kit is all ODM (as evidenced by the fact that you can buy
machines with identical cases to many of the Dells, but with different
manufacturer's labels), Apple's stuff is most definitely not. In fact,
if you look at the bottom of a Powerbook, towards the back end, you'll
see a silkscreened notice clearly stating 'designed by Apple in
California, assembled in Taiwan'.

Due to the non x86 nature of the motherboards those too are designed in
house at Apple. A quick check of the motherboard in the Powerbook I'm
typing this on confirms this - it carries a similar notice, stating,
'designed by Apple Computer'.

So, everything, other than obvious stuff like hard discs and other bits
and pieces is designed inhouse. It may be manufactured in Taiwanese
factories, but the design is straight out of Cupertino.

mark


--
!