Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

Why is my water cooling setup so hot! 33* when im in internet explorer

Last response: in Overclocking
Share
December 26, 2011 2:38:45 AM

Hello Everyone :) 
Merry christmas and all the best for the new year before i start :p 
I have just installed my water cooling system but find it's running a touch hot. Rite now with just internet expolorer, it's at 33* ¬_¬ And when playing in battlefield it rackes up to a nice 72*!!!
I have checked that everything is runningin the correct direction, it's an EK H30 120 kit.
My radiator is sat inside my antec 1200 case against the top back fan with another noctua fan both blowing air out past the radiator. I just cannot understand how it's so hot! I'm using the EK HF CPU Block, full nickel plated, the pipes are all connected correctly but im just completely baffeled as to how it's still so hot?
Thankyou for any advice that you leave and for all of your time.

Noahscorp
a c 330 K Overclocking
December 26, 2011 3:19:39 AM

33C is fairly normal idle temps...why do you think this is hot?

If you are seeing 72C at load, you definitely have problems.

For reference- loop order does not make a difference on temperature.

FYI- 'pipes' are actually 'tubing'.
a b K Overclocking
December 26, 2011 3:56:33 AM

what CPU???
Related resources
December 26, 2011 4:19:35 AM

Is your CPU overclocked?

Have you checked TIMM on CPU block?

Your idle temp is OK, but your load temps are a little high.
December 26, 2011 8:08:01 AM

Hello and thankyou for your replies, my TIM is fine, I checked that when opening up the CPU block yesterday and its all fine. My CPU was overclocked so i pulled it back to factory but it made no difference to the temperature.
The reason i thought 33* was a little hot is because my previous fan was able to keep it nearly 10* cooler than that :p 
Thanks again for the replies
December 26, 2011 8:11:50 AM

Oh, AMD 970 BE is the CPU :) 
a b K Overclocking
December 26, 2011 9:25:21 AM

Even with extra rad space, my i5 sits at about 30-35C depending on if I have my heat on.

Do you have any air bubbles in the loop at all (especially the radiator)? They can kill your heat transfer and seriously reduce cooling ability.

Other than that and the aforementioned TIM/mounting, I can only think of not having enough rad space as a cause of the higher load temps.
December 26, 2011 9:29:19 AM

Well i imagine a new RAD next month then, would you suggest a 240 would be enough to cool a CPU as well as a GTX 580?
And it's maily a worry because it differes in such a big range, when im just browsing, it can be anywhere between 29* and 42* :S
I have 2 fans on the radiator and the air is quite hot when im playing BF3 when i put my hand behind my case :S
a b K Overclocking
December 26, 2011 10:19:33 AM

maybe you should ditch the watercooling, as a cheap air cooled hyper tx3 would keep temps lower than 72c. Either something is wrong with that watercooler, or its just a crap watercooler. Id say more likely something wrong with the water block or seating/mounting of the waterblock.
December 26, 2011 10:29:45 AM

I can't just ditch it after so much bluddy work on it, and it's so much quieter than my fans, even though i do love them but water cooling is the future now :p 
The kit is an EK H30 120 but I bought the full nickel CPU block (which ill change back to the plexi when i get the correct bracket ;) ) then re-sell it. So if it is the block ill find out later in the week.
It is the least powerful kit of them all I imagine with the pump not being that strong:
Model: EK-DCP 2.2
Rated voltage: DC12V +/-10%
Starting voltage: DC 8V above
Power Consumption: 6.5W +/-10%
Load current: 0.62A +/-10%
Q-max: 400 L/hr +/-10%
H-max.: 2.2m +/-10%
Size: 52 x 45 x 50mm
Life Expectancy: 50000/hrs at 25°
Noise: 17.2 dB

But it should be enough surely just for the CPU?
I'll have a play around moving fans etc around the radiator, i have a more powerfull push and a less powerful pull so ill try swapping things about later in the day and give some feedback then :) 
a b K Overclocking
December 26, 2011 12:20:34 PM

I would guess that your problem is not enough Radiator space. If i am not mistaken you have one 120mm radiator?

If so... that is not enough, which is why you are seeing very hot load temps.

To cool your GPU and CPU I would recommend a 360mm radiator along with your 120mm for nice temps.

If it doesn't bother you, and there is no room in your case, you can always mount a 360mm radiator externally off the back, or wherever is best for you.
December 26, 2011 12:58:25 PM

This is true however im only cooling my CPU, with this setup i would expect to cool better than a Corsair H50 water cooling kit.
The only difference i can see is that the corsair has a half-as-thin radiator to allow better air flow.
With this radiator I find it fairly thick and the air that flows through it with a single fan is extremely little, but i have 2: Inside case-Push-Radiator-Pull-Outside case
a c 239 K Overclocking
December 26, 2011 2:42:08 PM

orangejuice789 is right a single 120 radiator isn't going to do much, it's on the same cooling plane as the Corsair H50, which really does not best the high end air coolers.

To get the highest stable overclock from your AMD 970 BE you have to keep it cool even just cooling the CPU she gets hot, just for reference purposes I have the same CPU, and a AMD 965BE, and a AMD 940BE.

The 940BE on air cooling I never got stable past 3.8ghz, it's stable right now at 3.9ghz with clocking room to spare, however that machine is water cooled now running a 240 and a 360 together both are dual flow radiators with shrouds, just to cool the CPU.

I set that up as a testing platform to see how far of an overclock water cooling would allow that was not reachable before, I just shared that with you so you could realize what it really takes to overclock your 970BE to the 4.0ghz range and beyond and keep it cool enough to achieve the stability.

However to get the best cooling you can get out of what you've already bought, you'll need to have the radiator completely unrestricted, meaning you may have to remove your rear exhaust built into case air grid and do not use a fan directly on the radiator pushing!

Why?

Because the fan motor body blocks airflow and on a 120 radiator you don't have a whole lot of area to give up, so here's the best solution, use a 120 shroud on the exhaust side of the radiator with a high airflow cooling fan pulling the air through the radiator.

With nothing at all blocking the intake side of the radiator.
December 26, 2011 3:01:23 PM

No i agree now with talking to a friend.
I tried swapping fans, turning them up/down/different speeds etc.
Comparing it with the H50 is because that's what he has. After a little research I can only come to the following conclusion that the water just isn't sticking around in the radiator for long enough to get any cooling in so gradually heats everything up including the rediator. So my conclusion is either a weaker pump by faaar or a bigger radiator :p 
Bigger radiator i think will be best :D 
I've clocked my 970 to 4200Mhz but I hear a lot of people saying that AMD run hotter than Intel, but still, a bigger radiator is on the list next month :) 
Thankyou everyone for replying and helping :) 
All the best to all for the new year!
December 26, 2011 3:31:37 PM

Aaaah ok i understand now, i read about using a shroud but couldnt quite understand why it worked better, now i do though so thankyou :) 

But still i think a bigger Radiator will allow the water to stay in there to cool a little more rather than dashing through it and receiving hardly any beneficial cooling what so ever :) 
a c 239 K Overclocking
December 26, 2011 3:36:43 PM

True but even if you go that route use a shroud to take advantage of as much cooling area as possible.
December 26, 2011 3:55:27 PM

I shall indeed, i have a nice pile of MDF that would do the job nicely with some paint work, or some old fans and ill cut out the fan.
Thanks again Ryan :) 
a c 330 K Overclocking
December 26, 2011 5:27:42 PM

You really need more radiator than you currently have to be effective. A single 120 isn't really an effective cooling surface, even when used with a closed loop cooler...the only way this actually is somewhat effective is due to the dismal flow rates provided by those coolers. You have a good kit, you just got the smallest one, for whatever reason. This is the kind of scenario where doing a bit of research can have a profound impact on your end result and overall perception.
December 26, 2011 5:36:58 PM

Aaah im of the magority of young people that DONT research, or research very little, but when such a kit comes, it's which can i afford rite now? OR if one comes on offer grab it!
Its just a way some people learn, including me :p  So, this was on offer for £99.99 for a day so i grabbed it, now understand and learn that a 120 radiator with a strong pump is as good as not really having a radiator at all, it just flows by far too fast.
So it'll be a 240/360 depending on if i can really get to hacking away some side pannel :p 
But thanks for your feedback :) 
a c 330 K Overclocking
December 26, 2011 5:46:18 PM

No, you definitely want a radiator- you never want to run a loop without some way of dissipating heat, otherwise it wouldn't take long for the temps to build up with no place to go. Plus, most pumps have an operating ceiling of 60-65C (water temp) so you run into issues of not only overheating your system, but killing your pump with heat at the same time.
December 26, 2011 7:24:41 PM

You mis-understood me :) 
My watercooled system at the moment has a small radiator and a fast pump so, the water doesnt stick in the radiator long enough to cool down enough to keep the system cool.
This means that the water leaving the radiator isnt cooled enough to counter the heat it gains from the CPU so it gradually gets hotter and hotter untill it reaches its peak which is sadly at 72ish* :( 
I'll order a 240 radiator where the water should circualte for long enough to cool down :) 
December 26, 2011 11:15:39 PM

Perfect: http://lkaestner.com/computer/22-watercooling1x1
I'll eventually have 2 240's set as: Fan Shroud Radiator lcasel Radiator Shroud Fan
(Unless someone can suggest something else? I cant quite think of an optimal order)


Edit:
Or:
http://cdn.overclock.net/a/a2/a2bc3d36_vbattach141759.p...
BUT IN REVERSE SO:
Fan - Shroud-Radiator-case-shroud-fan-shroud(or gap to allow some sort of cooling)-radiator.

Water flows from pump to the outside radiator to leave most heat outside, then to the inner radiator and back around?
a c 330 K Overclocking
December 27, 2011 12:06:36 AM

You don't necessarily need shrouds, but they help somewhat.

Quote:
You mis-understood me
My watercooled system at the moment has a small radiator and a fast pump so, the water doesnt stick in the radiator long enough to cool down enough to keep the system cool.
This means that the water leaving the radiator isnt cooled enough to counter the heat it gains from the CPU so it gradually gets hotter and hotter untill it reaches its peak which is sadly at 72ish*
I'll order a 240 radiator where the water should circualte for long enough to cool down


OK- slow down a little- you are operating on some very common newbie misconceptions about watercooling.

I've been watercooling for about 9.5 years- I knew what you were talking about, and it's incorrect. The amount of watts being dumped into the loop is more than the radiator can dissipate. This is why the temps will climb as they do, not anything to do with the rate of flow in your loop. In all reality, you want higher flows, not slower flows- regardless of how much radiator space you have. Higher flow rates contribute to a better delta in your loop, which is what you want. Slowing flow due to a small radiator is counter-intuitive based on the 'water being in the radiator longer to cool down'...this would mean that the water has more time to absorb even more heat when in contact with the water blocks. So, if you are slowing the flow down with the idea you are allowing the rad to cool more effectively, you are allowing the water to absorb more and more heat watts as it travels over the waterblocks, which means you are hypothetically fixing one issue and creating another one, elsewhere.

You'll need to plan for a loop that works for you- not directly follow a diagram that someone else drew. It's a good idea to look at diagrams and photos for ideas, but you really want to make sure the plan and build suits your needs directly. I think you'd only need the space of a single 240 overall for a CPU only loop, but adding a single 240 to your current 120 would help, unless you have plans to expand the loop in the future.

Quote:
Water flows from pump to the outside radiator to leave most heat outside, then to the inner radiator and back around?


Loop order does not matter- at all. This is covered in the watercooling sticky. Water temps are within 1-5C (tops) at any single point within the loop. You just don't want your pump to suck air.
a b K Overclocking
December 27, 2011 12:32:22 AM

I have issues with those diagrams in the link. What's the point of a reservoir that doesn't feed into the pump?
a c 330 K Overclocking
December 27, 2011 12:38:18 AM

They made those loops more complicated than they need to be...you can use those same components and make routing the tubing far simpler. These diagrams look like they are similar to those in the late 90's and early 2000's before people really started to understand that loop order does not matter for temperature performance.
December 27, 2011 8:14:33 AM

Thankyou for the advice Rubix, i see what you mean if the rate of flow slows down, it will counter the cooling by warming up just as much.

The diagrams were more of a rough guide as how to work with 2 radiators to give an idea :) 

So are you saying that even if i did radiator shroud fan, it would be the same as fan shroud radiator?
Thanks for your input though :)  All of it is appreciated :) 
a b K Overclocking
December 27, 2011 11:40:11 AM

those diagrams are wild.

@ OP- If you asking about push/pull, yes either one will work.

Also, are you set on shrouds? I don't think you will really need them, can you explain why you are interested in having them?
December 27, 2011 12:05:06 PM

As ryan said, if you want to test it, put your hand just over a fan, you dont feel any air where the motor is on the fan, so if that's against your radiator, the cone of "dead" air in front of the fan doesnt cool anything, where as if you have a bit of a space between your fan and radiator the dead air disappears :) 
a c 239 K Overclocking
December 27, 2011 2:52:15 PM

noahscorp said:
As ryan said, if you want to test it, put your hand just over a fan, you dont feel any air where the motor is on the fan, so if that's against your radiator, the cone of "dead" air in front of the fan doesnt cool anything, where as if you have a bit of a space between your fan and radiator the dead air disappears :) 


Excellent Explanation! :) 
December 27, 2011 3:58:31 PM

OOOOoooooooo kaaayyyyyyyyy....
To put a long story short and to try and escape some humiliation... Why, do all of the temperature reading software read my GTX580.... instead of my CPU, yet think they are the same?

This kind of fixes my problem too ;) 
And after putting the fans on my card at 40% instead of default 20%, load temp on my 580 is 50-55* ;)  Thankyou all for your time though XD
a b K Overclocking
December 27, 2011 4:41:42 PM

good to see you got it sorted out.
a b K Overclocking
December 27, 2011 9:33:51 PM

noahscorp said:
OOOOoooooooo kaaayyyyyyyyy....
To put a long story short and to try and escape some humiliation... Why, do all of the temperature reading software read my GTX580.... instead of my CPU, yet think they are the same?


Keep in mind the software only reads the chip temps, not the coolant temps, and is dependent on the amount of heat removed.

My CPU temp readings are generally higher than my GPU temps because the heat from my GPU >>> heat from CPU, which causes much faster conduction on the GPU block, etc etc.
December 28, 2011 7:55:16 AM

Thanks OJ :) 

And i know it reads the chip temps but it's only a guide to go by :)  I just find it weird why SpeedFan which i've used for a long time has the wrong temperature reading under CPU, it's the first time so far, and it's the same for other software I just tried that friends have recommended :S
But thankyou again for everyone's help :) 
a b K Overclocking
December 28, 2011 11:15:59 AM

Speedfan is really inconsistent. Try using RealTemp for the CPU and MSI Afterburner for the GPU and you should get much better results.
December 28, 2011 11:37:04 AM

Yeah RealyTemp is one of the others that i tried, it still put my GPU under the CPU's temp :S
a c 330 K Overclocking
December 28, 2011 2:06:34 PM

You can choose not to have RealTemp report your GPU temps...just uncheck it in the configuration box.
a c 190 K Overclocking
December 28, 2011 4:18:23 PM

Also, if not previously mentioned (didn't read all posts here)
bear in mind your room temp, if your sat in a 40'C house, you're never getting a 25-30' idle :p 
Also, bigger rads ftw :)  (and overkill never hurts hehe)
Moto
a c 330 K Overclocking
December 28, 2011 5:06:11 PM

Yeah, you can never go below ambient air temperature with air or normal watercooling.
a c 239 K Overclocking
December 28, 2011 5:38:08 PM

rubix_1011 said:
Yeah, you can never go below ambient air temperature with air or normal watercooling.


Affirmative!
a c 190 K Overclocking
December 28, 2011 5:38:58 PM

^Gods know he's tried hehe :p 
Moto
December 29, 2011 11:17:36 AM

Bigger rads indeed but with an anctec 1200 case and 6HDD's all in a single raid, theres not too much space available but 2 240's shouldnt be a problem to take advantage of the 2 exhaust fans at the back :D 
a c 190 K Overclocking
December 29, 2011 3:07:10 PM

To the hells with it all!

a 240 on the back, one inside the roof and a 360 mounted over the top (if you really want to go mad) oughta sort it out hehe,
hard drives don't have to go in the hard drive cage though you know, even wityh six I'm sure you can can other places for them to live, giving you radspace in there
Moto
December 29, 2011 5:47:47 PM

ill bee able to get 2 240's, on on the back on the outside and one on the inside in a row, but with a gap between them.
I've seen some mods with 360's on the inside but i cant say i like any of them :S
So perhaps a different case in the future... perhaps a lian-li.....Or an SSD and use the front bays for a 360... hmmmm
But i do love my 6HDD's on a riad, its awesome and works so well, so a lian-li it is :p 
a c 190 K Overclocking
December 29, 2011 5:57:02 PM

I like how your starting to think now,
You see a mod someone else has done, think its not quite what you want/need and adapt to fit, I like the 240's plan, I would check out 360 options and yes, next case you buy you'll be viewing it for its potential, not as a finished item,
Welcome to the club hehe....
Moto
a b K Overclocking
December 29, 2011 7:51:24 PM

noahscorp said:
Yeah RealyTemp is one of the others that i tried, it still put my GPU under the CPU's temp :S

use HWmonitor. I wouldn't use anything else.
December 29, 2011 10:06:28 PM

haha cheers moto ;)  The antec cases are more of a "dead-end" case BUT amazing cases all the same.

iam i have just downloaded HWMonitor and it picks up my CPU temp as it should so thankyou for that :) 
a c 100 K Overclocking
January 3, 2012 9:20:04 PM

pff I have a 240 in my Antec 900! A 1200 should have no problem, plus do a 240/320 on back. Or else they also have a rad that fits on the top exhaust fan, the 180mm one.
a c 330 K Overclocking
January 4, 2012 12:08:47 AM

Someone needs to make a case completely out of Novas.

I volunteer if someone has a credit card # I can borrow. :D 
a b K Overclocking
January 5, 2012 6:40:32 PM

I wanted thr get the MM Extended UFO with two triple triple side panels to make a wind tunnel of sorts. Then I wont need to run my heater at all.
a c 330 K Overclocking
January 5, 2012 6:44:12 PM

We went a bit off topic, but good build idea.

Haven't heard back from the OP- wonder what the end result was?

First time I've heard that a water pump was too loud for someone, especially for the cooling benefits...most power supply or case fans make more noise than pumps do...
!