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Ram speed vs CPU mhz increase?

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a b à CPUs
January 4, 2012 4:14:02 AM

Hello
Thank you for reading this
I have a Phenom II x 4 925 C2 non-BE 925 2.8ghz OCd to 3.5ghz
14 x 250
CPU VID 1.49v
NB freq 2250
NB voltage increased slightly
HT 1800
HT voltage increased slightly
RAM DDR3-1333 @ 1333 forced timings back to default 9-9-9-24
ram voltage 1.56v
max load temp in 68F room is @54
idle 38C
6 hours tested stable with Prime95 64-bit stress test with OCd GPU stress test running also

so my question is:
I am pretty sure I can hit 3.7-3.8
just bump up CPU VID to 1.51
lower ram to 1066
but I am thinking that by lowering ram from 1333 to 1066 that
the 200mhz CPU performance I gain will be lost from the the lowered RAM Speed
Am I right or wrong?
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
January 5, 2012 12:25:35 PM

Underclocking the RAM has a minimal effect on the overclocking of the CPU.

My i7-920 is OCed to 3.82 GHz and at this OC my 1600 MHz Corsair Dominator RAM is underclocked to 1,452 MHz (this is what I got at the set multipliers). If I raise the RAM multiplier, then my RAM will run at over 1,800 MHz which I am not happy about (too high).

The RAM manufacturers usually squeeze a lot of performance out of their RAM modules, andOCing RAM is not usually recommended. Hence the underclocking of my RAM from 1,600 t0 1,452 (that's what it turned out to be).

You will not see much under performance by underclocking your RAM.
a b à CPUs
January 5, 2012 12:30:45 PM

so the CPU increase will be more performance
losing ram speed wont matter if I read you right
cool
I dont think I will OC any heavier but was just curious
right now I am limited by cooling
really dont want to raise the CPU Voltage higher than 1.49
I had it at 1.51v and my temps went over 62c on the CPU
running Prime95 for an hour in a 68F room
so that is too high for temps in my opinion
but later on when I get a better CPU HSF then I will have to try it
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a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
January 5, 2012 12:33:08 PM
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king smp said:
so the CPU increase will be more performance
losing ram speed wont matter if I read you right
cool
I dont think I will OC any heavier but was just curious
right now I am limited by cooling
really dont want to raise the CPU Voltage higher than 1.49
I had it at 1.51v and my temps went over 62c on the CPU
running Prime95 for an hour in a 68F room
so that is too high for temps in my opinion
but later on when I get a better CPU HSF then I will have to try it

Correct! The CPU overclock will be far more effective than OCing the RAM.

OC the CPU and take whatever speed you get (even a slight underclock) out of the RAM.
a b à CPUs
January 5, 2012 12:38:52 PM

Best answer selected by king smp.
a b à CPUs
January 5, 2012 12:40:13 PM

thank you Ubrales
I know you know your tech
so that is much appreciated
I am going to keep my 3.5 settings for now
but just wanted to know for info sake
thanks again
you are the best!
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
January 5, 2012 12:46:16 PM

Thanks King! Good luck!
a b à CPUs
January 5, 2012 10:58:38 PM

that is good info Mal
I dont think I will try to go higher than 3.5
the extra 200mhz isnt worth it except for bragging rights
"a difference you cant notice isnt truly a difference at all"
I was just curious from a technical point of view
my main goal now is to lower as much voltage from CPU,NB,IMC,RAM and HT as possible while keeping her stable at 3.5ghz
I will probably during hot summer months either get a better cooler
(Hyper 212+ probably)
or just drop her to a lower speed and voltage
I just dont like big heavy coolers
i wish they made a cheap 92mm that does the job well
really dont want a 120mm cooler
not even sure it can fit
I will open a new thread asking for best smallest cooler under $40
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
January 5, 2012 11:06:23 PM

The Prolimatech Megahalems are great if you have sufficient clearance between the RAM and the heatsink. Tall RAM with cooling fins will cause an interference.
a b à CPUs
January 5, 2012 11:19:38 PM

nice cooler but out of my price range
the most I can spend would be $50 and rather keep it as under as possible
more than likely go with a Hyper 212+
but I might look at some Zalman 92mms
heard good things about them
a b à CPUs
January 5, 2012 11:51:19 PM

Jeez Mal save that for my "cheap lightweight cooler" thread
I think you just won best answer LOL on that one
cheap
light weight and small
excellent feedback on Egg
quiet
good brand
I just saved that one as a favorite
I was looking at this
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

but the Egg doesnt seem sure of AM3 compatiblity
and I like the look of the Scythe a little better


a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
January 5, 2012 11:55:49 PM

King, you should start that thread, and mal has already provided you the answers.
a b à CPUs
January 6, 2012 12:16:59 AM

found it on Ebay for same price with free shipping
so if it doesnt come back to egg i can get it there
I was going to buy 2 x 2gb Patriot ram to make 8gb
but think I will wait and get cooler
seems like a more important upgrade
I am setting up a auto shop with upgrades/installation
next week (quoting parts tonite and will see the owner Mon AM)
so with that job I can afford to splurge LOL
and a better cooler is a worthwhile investment
could save my computer down the road
a b à CPUs
January 6, 2012 12:26:56 AM

i am in 4th place in OCing rank right now
aint that an effin joke
My last system I OCd was an Athlon XP 1800 LOL
the whole trick is to open question threads
and also look for 0 reply threads to get best answers
I am not doing it intentionally to rank high
just want to learn
but OCing forum is the easiest one to mess up and fry a posters tower
so I am very cautious with the advice I give
I did mess up and recommended raising BCLK on a Sandy
but thankfully another poster answered that one
really doing more reading that answering
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
January 6, 2012 11:26:40 AM

king smp said:
i am in 4th place in OCing rank right now
aint that an effin joke
My last system I OCd was an Athlon XP 1800 LOL
the whole trick is to open question threads
and also look for 0 reply threads to get best answers
I am not doing it intentionally to rank high
just want to learn
but OCing forum is the easiest one to mess up and fry a posters tower
so I am very cautious with the advice I give
I did mess up and recommended raising BCLK on a Sandy
but thankfully another poster answered that one
really doing more reading that answering

As long as one does not exceed the CPU manufacturer's Upper limit on voltage, it should be ok. Also, running any electronics hot (higher voltages combined with poor heat transfer will create this) will reduce the life somewhat. No real good supporting data on this though.
a b à CPUs
January 6, 2012 1:03:31 PM

I really wanted 3.5ghz on my PHII x 4 925 stock 2.8
I had it stable as far as shutdownds go
but on Prime95 blend test I would fail on one core
test would keep running on 3 cores but the 4th core would keep failing
blend test failing is an indicator of RAM errors
so after almost spending all night
playing with timings,ram voltage and speed

I gave up and set it to 3.3ghz and dropped the ram down from stock 1333 to 1066
and let the mobo do the rest on auto tune settings
now it has passed a half hour of blend (further than I was getting)
Later I will do a couple of hours of Prime95

I realized after many restarts and tries
that I was battling to get 200mhz extra
stock I am at 2.8
running at 3.3 and should be real stable
at 3.5 it wouldnt crash but got error on P95

so I thought to myself
why am I killing myself (and my computer) for 200mhz
really a 200mhz difference isnt even noticeable except in benchmarks

"a difference that isnt noticeable isnt truly a difference at all"
a wiser man than me said that

I got caught up in wanting bragging rights to say I OCd to 3.5
not for any actual performance difference

and you know what really bothers me?

that Mal was friggin right AGAIN!
I am so tired of him being right
It is really friggin annoying :)  LOL
he warned me not to go too nuts
would I listen?
Nooooo
but the good thing is
I really learned alot from this experience
as a tech who gets paid to fix computers
increasing your learning curve is invaluable
I learned alot about how an AMD CPU functions concerning
HT,ram speed,NB frequency etc
in less than a week
I have spent many hours poring over OCing articles and forums
and enjoyed the crap out of myself
even at 2am in the morning when I BSOD and had to keep restarting
and wanted to kick in the side of the computer LOL

now running at 3.3ghz
All voltage is auto tuned and temps are great
I will run P95 for a few hours to double check but should be stable
A lesson learned

a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
January 6, 2012 2:46:34 PM

I have my own views regarding stress tests. Let the CPU manufacturers and research labs do it. My method is to use conservative settings in OC and start using the system. If I get a BSOD and my voltage is set low, I just bump it up a notch. I currently have a 42% OC on my i7-920 (DO) and no BSODs for the past 18 months.

I am happy as a polecat in a cactus patch! :D 

When I buy a new car, I don't run it at redline just to see how it performs!
a b à CPUs
January 6, 2012 7:40:23 PM

that might make sense
but I felt better
I ran Prime 95 -64bit for 6 hours on blend tests with zero errors
at 3.3ghz (stock 2.8)
now I know that it is very stable and can relax
at 3.5 it wouldnt blue screen but I was getting an error with p95
which was memory related
so though it wouldnt crash it wasnt running properly
when I get better cooling I might try it again
but for now I am happy with a 500mhz increase
my temp after 6 hours of P95 was 52c in a 68F room
so not too bad for a stock AMD cooler
a b à CPUs
January 6, 2012 7:49:54 PM

I know I can get 3.5
but until I get new cooler I am going to wait
I will try again with that Scythe you listed
I didnt like the temps going over 55c in a 68f room
this house can get up to 75F in the summer
the extra 200mhz isnt worth the temp increase
I might take it up to 3.4 tonite without changing anything else
and see if it is stable
but I am not messing with voltages right now
if I can get 3.4 without upping voltage then cool
but will wait to raise voltage when I have the new cooler
a b à CPUs
January 6, 2012 10:23:42 PM

Quote:
psssst.
I told you so..



hee hee hee
I am one of those people that got to F-up and learn for themselves
actually I learned alot about OCing
and I know I can get 3.5 stable but just dont like the temps
because of the voltages I need to use

and that Ebay listing is the exact same one I picked out LOL
hopefully in the next couple of weeks I can order it and 4 more gigs of ram
got a gig doing a auto shop POS computer network upgrade (HDs,Ram and new software install)
so Daddy is going to get some new toys :) 


a b à CPUs
January 7, 2012 12:45:33 PM

well
couldnt help myself
clocked it back to 3.5ghz
didnt realize it was so easy
I just raised my base clock to 250 x 14
used CPU volts 1.48
lowered ram from 1333 to 1066
everything else set to default and auto
ran for an hour no erros
max temp was 59 until I opened a window a little next to the computer
temp went down to 55c
to maintain this OC I definitley need a better CPU HSF
the case has altogether 4 80mm,2 120mm,1 60mm so plenty of air flow
so even though the AMD stock HSF looks decent enough
it is really lacking
when are Intel and AMD ever going to make decent OEM HSFs
you know they could if they wanted to

I cant believe for the past few days I have been killing myself
with adjusting HT,NB,Timings etc

from reading the guides to OCing Phenom IIs you would think you have to
do that
but really dont
the mobos Auto settings take care of everything
they really need a good Phenom II OCing guide that also shows how to OC non-BEs
I asked one of the mods
and the answer was Overclockers only use the BEs
but I thought the idea of OCing is to get more performance out of cheaper parts
there area alot of 920,925,940,945 etc that with a decent OC are very capable CPUs
even though they are not BEs
a b à CPUs
January 7, 2012 1:38:57 PM

I love when you get grumpy
and I dont know why they havent closed this yet
and thanks for the cooler suggestion
that was exactly what I was looking for
a b à CPUs
January 7, 2012 2:26:58 PM

I wonder if you can put Toms down on a resume LOL
Pro bono work
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
January 7, 2012 2:59:33 PM

king smp said:
I wonder if you can put Toms down on a resume LOL
Pro bono work

Yes, very definitely. And add a line explaining what Tom's is all about, and your contributions. At the bottom of your resume under "Other skills"
a b à CPUs
January 7, 2012 3:15:06 PM

Ubrales said:
Yes, very definitely. And add a line explaining what Tom's is all about, and your contributions. At the bottom of your resume under "Other skills"



I actually used it on my resume for Staples just like you said
focused on the helping people aspect
I just thought I would be the only one :) 
!