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AMD calls Nvidia's marketing bluff.

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a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 12:33:07 AM

http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=20820

Key points :-

Huddy told HEXUS NVIDIA tended to work on a "different philosophy" to AMD. "AMD is competing on the basis of technology, whereas Nvidia is competing on the basis of marketing" he told us, adding, "I'm not a marketing guy, I'm an engineer".

"We've been working on DX11 games," said Huddy emphasising that, last time around, it had taken NVIDIA at least six months after DX10 launched before any game titles followed. AMD is working on over 20 titles currently in development, with two titles - BattleForge and Stalker - already available in DX11.

"NVIDIA is simply trying to market its way out of being late out with DX11 hardware"
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 12:42:50 AM

I'm glad ATi is actually pushing DirectX 11. Even though I don't plan on upgrading to a DirectX 11 card any time soon, I'm so sick of hearing about games still using DirectX 9. It's almost like people are using a "Don't fix it if it isn't broken" mentality for technology, christ -- If there's one place to not use that mentality.

Also I think it's funny people are saying DirectX 11 is gonna be like 10 when, like mentioned in the post, there's already a good handful of games out citing it even before it was released officially, when it took DirectX 10 six months. Please. :p  We can't say that NVidia seems to want to push any new technology on anyone, they seem to be happy with reusing things, if you know what I mean. :sarcastic: 
a c 130 U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 12:47:26 AM

I'm glad ATI is doing this. This'll pressure nVidia, as well as gain some favour for ATI. It's about time ATI/AMD got the respect that the company deserves.
Related resources
October 23, 2009 1:17:49 AM

And their new gpu design that is great for high end computing ie to replace their Tesla line is not a great little marvel of design.

Did huddy also mention that when nvidia released a card the G80 it totally crushed the 2k series that ATI had out?

Nvidia is late with DX11 Hardware but really is it needed currently? It's not like ATI has a super cheap 50ish dollar card they can put in oem computers for windows 7 i'm sure as far as Nvidia is concerned they would have liked to come out before ATI in DX11 but delaying it for awhile wont hurt them as long as their product is an improvement over ATI's in performance.

The statement above is marketing by Huddy; you can't denounce marking and put yourself head in the same statement it's inherently hypocritical.
a c 271 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
a c 171 Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 1:18:53 AM

jennyh said:
http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=20820

Key points :-

Huddy told HEXUS NVIDIA tended to work on a "different philosophy" to AMD. "AMD is competing on the basis of technology, whereas Nvidia is competing on the basis of marketing" he told us, adding, "I'm not a marketing guy, I'm an engineer".

"We've been working on DX11 games," said Huddy emphasising that, last time around, it had taken NVIDIA at least six months after DX10 launched before any game titles followed. AMD is working on over 20 titles currently in development, with two titles - BattleForge and Stalker - already available in DX11.

"NVIDIA is simply trying to market its way out of being late out with DX11 hardware"

Or could be viewed as a company trying to hide a problem of their own making. [:mousemonkey]
http://www.techspot.com/news/36689-sources-say-amd-didnt-order-enough-40nm-wafers-for-evergreen.html
a c 130 U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 1:24:35 AM

IzzyCraft said:
And their new gpu design that is great for high end computing ie to replace their Tesla line is not a great little marvel of design.
What on EARTH makes you think gamers need that?! It's money out of our pockets!
Did huddy also mention that when nvidia released a card the G80 it totally crushed the 2k series that ATI had out?
That is then. THIS IS NOW.
Nvidia is late with DX11 Hardware but really is it needed currently?Yes, It's not like ATI has a super cheap 50ish dollar card they can put in oem computers for windows 7 If you've seen ATI's charts, sub-$100 HD5K series cards will be coming out before GT300!i'm sure as far as Nvidia is concerned they would have liked to come out before ATI in DX11 but delaying it for awhile wont hurt them as long as their product is an improvement over ATI's in performance.Uh. NO. nVidia will lose plenty of market share due to ATI's aggressive Price/Performance.

The statement above is marketing by Huddy; you can't denounce marking and put yourself head in the same statement it's inherently hypocritical.He just gave a few quotes; he didn't tell us how superior he is. Nor did he hold up a fake HD5.9K

a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 1:25:42 AM

Quote:
Did huddy also mention that when nvidia released a card the G80 it totally crushed the 2k series that ATI had out?


Did he mention how hard the FX 5800 got owned by the 9700? How far back is he supposed to go, just as far as the last time Nvidia won at anything?

Quote:
Nvidia is late with DX11 Hardware but really is it needed currently?


Yawn...

Quote:
The statement above is marketing by Huddy; you can't denounce marking and put yourself head in the same statement it's inherently hypocritical.


What a load of crap. The facts are plain, they really are. ATI have the cards, Nvidia don't. Where is the marketing here? Is ATI trying to sell something they don't have, or lose at? Are Nvidia marketing non-existent cards?
a c 130 U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 1:27:54 AM

chunkymonster said:
I might have given some credence to the AMD not ordering enough 40nm wafer story but this...
Quote:
According to several unnamed sources cited by Fudzilla...
as the first line in the article makes me call FUD.

Agreed. But hey, better to not have enough than too many, hmm?
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 1:30:26 AM

Quote:
According to several unnamed sources cited by Fudzilla


Wake up and smell the coffee Nvidiots. Nvidia are tanking hard and the longer you wait the more disappointed you're gonna be.

Nvidia are finished, they cannot compete with ATI's superior technology.
October 23, 2009 1:42:38 AM

Too bad i don't drink coffee and nvidia is still making a profit and is worth the same as the entire AMD that includes ATI.

So who is the idiot the person who likes a company or the person who dogmatically attacks all those who like said company.

@shadow
"And their new gpu design that is great for high end computing ie to replace their Tesla line is not a great little marvel of design.
What on EARTH makes you think gamers need that?! It's money out of our pockets!"

it's in response to
"AMD is competing on the basis of technology, whereas Nvidia is competing on the basis of marketing" he told us, adding, "I'm not a marketing guy, I'm an engineer".

I'm an engineer part of that line and basis of technology. Tech is Tech products are products just because you wont buy one doesn't mean it's worthless the statement about marking is maybe true if nvidia was making statements about gaming performance left and right but I've hardly seen anything about gaming in regards to Fermi.
----
"Nvidia is late with DX11 Hardware but really is it needed currently?Yes, It's not like ATI has a super cheap 50ish dollar card they can put in oem computers for windows 7 If you've seen ATI's charts, sub-$100 HD5K series cards will be coming out before GT300!i"

But it's not out now? why you rag on nvidia about only have cards in planning but say it's alright for ATI? It's isn't out at release of windows 7 end of story if it's out before nvidia then great for ATI then they have a strong market kind of, depends on OEM agreements.
----
i'm sure as far as Nvidia is concerned they would have liked to come out before ATI in DX11 but delaying it for awhile wont hurt them as long as their product is an improvement over ATI's in performance.Uh. NO. nVidia will lose plenty of market share due to ATI's aggressive Price/Performance.

This is true to an extent but it's not like everybody is buying new cards right now. Only a small portion of market share will be lost not everybody buys new cards every few months let alone not everyone buys new cards even once a year like i do.
--
I swear you know i don't really buy from ATI but i'm not dogmatically trig to get it destroyed ATI is competition to Nvidia which is necessary just like Nvidia is competition to ATI and again is necessary, frankly you're a fanboy when you spew hate for competition instead of just personal discord.
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 1:53:16 AM

Quote:
Too bad i don't drink coffee and nvidia is still making a profit and is worth the same as the entire AMD that includes ATI.


Nvidia aren't making a profit and haven't done in months. Without an x86 licence Nvidia are worth even less.

Quote:
So who is the idiot the person who likes a company or the person who dogmatically attacks all those who like said company.


The idiot is the person who refuses to accept the company they like is rotten to the core. Being an Nvidia fanboy just totally defies all logic, especially now. ATI have given us faster cards at cheaper prices - sometimes 3-4x cheaper, yet still some fanboys continue to support Nvidia. What did Nvidia *ever* give you that ATI haven't offered at the same or better performance level for a LOT less?
October 23, 2009 2:12:35 AM

I have own 4 ATI cards the great little 9700 Pro which lasted 2 weeks died had to get a new one and the new one died i must have been cursed cuz i know faliure rate shouldn't be that great anyways after that great little card i held for like 1-2 years on my main system.

then i got a nvidia 6800

replaced it with a X1600 no problems fine card

Then i bought a 2600? ionno that piece of *** was nothing but headakes as it wouldn't run in 8 bit mode or some *** which totally broke some of my older games which i enjoy from time to time and i had to RMA it after a month 2nd card lasted but still hated that stupid thing it always had little headakes it wouldn't work to well with my tv at the time drivers left boxes and other *** which i had to baby a ton to get the picture right it was the first card i ever felt i wasted my money on a card

replaced that with a 8800GTS which works so great a few more months down the line i got another one and have been running it on a machine ever sense then although i use a 260 on my main computer.

basically in short
Bad shitty ass experiences with ATI cards in the past
due to manufacture issues and store issues with getting a broken card replaced
and with their drivers and CCC interface.

Never had any problems with Nvidia so far so you see why.

I don't hate one company like some people on this fourm seem to flamboyantly display i just wont buy from them.

ok mr "Being an Nvidia fanboy just totally defies all logic" so does that mean you switch favorites over time cuz i doubt it. omfglafjdofidsf DX11 *** BUY NOW BUY NOW NOTHING ELSE SHADDAUPPP DX11 OMFG LOOK HOW GREAT 5870 IS FOR IT's PRICE omfg asdfasj;dfsh EYEFINITY gahhhhhh. too bad i wont be blowing 400 bucks on a gpu any time soon and performance in the 100-200 level is not really an improvement from my 260 only good thing is HDMI audio it's equipped with but i have no faith in ATI card's and TV's

and

". ATI have given us faster cards at cheaper prices - sometimes 3-4x cheaper" well that so called 3-4 times cheaper isn't int he main stream price section 100-200 which is where i usually buy from and really where the hell is it ever 1/4th the price of another card?

Frankly I may be a fanboy but your a fanatic fanboy which is hardly a good thing to be a fanatic about anything.

the last ATI one doesn't really count it was laptop.
October 23, 2009 2:42:40 AM

jennyh said:
Quote:
Too bad i don't drink coffee and nvidia is still making a profit and is worth the same as the entire AMD that includes ATI.


Nvidia aren't making a profit and haven't done in months. Without an x86 licence Nvidia are worth even less.

Quote:
So who is the idiot the person who likes a company or the person who dogmatically attacks all those who like said company.


The idiot is the person who refuses to accept the company they like is rotten to the core. Being an Nvidia fanboy just totally defies all logic, especially now. ATI have given us faster cards at cheaper prices - sometimes 3-4x cheaper ---> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH NAME...ONE, JUST ONE! , yet still some fanboys continue to support Nvidia. What did Nvidia *ever* give you that ATI haven't offered at the same or better performance level for a LOT less?


Quality cards, quality drivers, quality cooling, exclusive features (physX), BETTER performance...

And ok theyre not cheaper, but theyre about the same price when performance is the same (ie. 4870 vs GTX260)

Ive never had the misfortune of owning an ATI card...but i know 2 people who have and they BOTH had problems with their cards. One with overheating and the other had driver issues....NEVER have i had such problems with Nvidia even from the Riva TNT2 days!! End of. Oh...and jus to add, didnt you have to RMA a 5850 recently???

And before some1 says im a feckin fanboy...please dont...

If you had 2 cars by 2 different company's ....one had no end of problems and the other ran fine without a hitch for years...which one would you vote for!?

ATI is to NVIDIA as VAUXHALL is to BMW
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 3:05:27 AM

There is so much BS in this thread I don't think I have the time to reply to it all. Anyone basing the quality of a company's product by a few people's experiences HAS to be delusional. For starters, the board partners are the ones you should be complaining to, you know, the ones that actually make the cards. Secondly, my own experiences are that both companies make quality products. However, I won't be drawing any conclusions based on that like the rest of you.

Oh, and yes we need DX11. You people can drag your technological feet all you want but nothing is ever "good enough."
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 3:05:45 AM

Fanboy alert!

Sorry smoggy, had too. And that line, 'never had the misfortune' blah blah is about as biased as you can get. Furthermore you never having an ATI card really sinks your argument. I've had several of both, and I really think they are about equal. They both have their problems, but most of the time they both work.
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 3:10:38 AM

jennyh said:
Quote:
According to several unnamed sources cited by Fudzilla


Wake up and smell the coffee Nvidiots. Nvidia are tanking hard and the longer you wait the more disappointed you're gonna be.

Nvidia are finished, they cannot compete with ATI's superior technology.


You sir sound like a fanboy of club ATI.

a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 3:14:05 AM

invisik said:
You sir sound like a fanboy of club ATI.

That would be "ma'am" actually ;) 
October 23, 2009 3:20:02 AM

EXT64 said:
Fanboy alert!

Sorry smoggy, had too. And that line, 'never had the misfortune' blah blah is about as biased as you can get. Furthermore you never having an ATI card really sinks your argument. I've had several of both, and I really think they are about equal. They both have their problems, but most of the time they both work.


Biased? Its not as if ive based my opinion on bullshit because from my experience ATI cards have problems, Nvidia cards dont...what do you want me to say?? Just imagine this response to someone that asks my experience with ATI vs Nvidia:

'Well, from my experience the only ATI cards i have personally come across had problems and Nvidia had no problems...but get the ATI card!'

@ randomiser... Dont you think its a HUGE co-incidence that the ONLY ATI cards i have come across were crap?? If they were soo few and far between then surely neither of them would get a bad one, or even just one of them?

Go to ATI subsection in forum, now look down the list....i see MANY MANY posts about problems....

Now do the same with Nvidia...

Proof and pudding come to mind?
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 3:26:46 AM

What we are trying to explain to you is you have based your opinion on just one or two cases out of thousands of cards sold. And you just said it wasn't your experience but someone else's. I hate to burst your NVidia bubble, but they are defective too, they have driver problems too (Win Vista at release anyone?).
October 23, 2009 3:29:39 AM

Vista was a load of balls, so was DX10...

Was ATI not in the same boat.... i dont know?

I thought everything had problems with Vista @ release!!
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 3:33:06 AM

There was a pie chart floating around showing something like 30% of Vista crashes were because of NVidia Drivers. ATI was a lower, but not great. Yeah, Vista was a mess on release, but that is no excuse for poor driver support.

Ah, here it is:

http://arstechnica.com/hardware/news/2008/03/vista-capa...
October 23, 2009 3:34:37 AM

Thats an unfair comparison because i bet LOADS LOADS more computers use Nvidia cards (and chipsets) than ATI?
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 3:37:07 AM

smoggy12345 said:
Biased? Its not as if ive based my opinion on bullshit because from my experience ATI cards have problems, Nvidia cards dont...what do you want me to say?? Just imagine this response to someone that asks my experience with ATI vs Nvidia:

You have based your opinion on a tiny sample, so yes, that is bias.

smoggy12345 said:
@ randomiser... Dont you think its a HUGE co-incidence that the ONLY ATI cards i have come across were crap??

Yes I do. Because I haven't come across any cards that have been crap (except by design, such as noisy fans). But I guess my experience doesn't matter because it's not yours.

smoggy12345 said:
Go to ATI subsection in forum, now look down the list....i see MANY MANY posts about problems....

Now do the same with Nvidia...

Proof and pudding come to mind?

Thanks for pointing out that there are n00bs with problems in both sections, that only further cements my argument.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 3:40:51 AM

I don't know the market share breakdown, so that would lessen that somewhat. I don't think though that it is 3 to 1. In fact, a quick browse shows it less than 2 to 1. Anyway, my main point was that they both have issues at times.
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 3:43:23 AM

I wish people would stop throwing that graph around actually. It's 1.5 years old.
October 23, 2009 3:47:10 AM

Randomiser, we are all entitled to our opinions...

We jus happen to have different ones haha :D 

Your opinion counts....but, to me, my personal experience counts more
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 3:54:08 AM

Personal experience is fine, and important to state in some situations (especially when it is being requested). But it should never be elevated to a point where it us used to support an argument. The moment it is used to make a sweeping statement such as "ATI cards are crap" or "NVIDIA cards are better," whether explicit or implied, is when personal experience is being used as more concrete evidence than it really is. Why? Because you could be talking out of your ass for all we know :) 
October 23, 2009 4:07:29 AM

Remember folks! Spend, spend , spend! These console ports will really need the muscle lol.
I have a hard time wrapping my head around the idea someone could get so worked up or devoted to any company that is in the game to do one thing and one thing only. Part the consumer from their money. A person could say one is cheaper, one is better, one is evil, bla bla bla but they are cut from the same cloth. One may do a better job at a given time of winning public opinion battles but neither can maintain dominance long enough to puff their chests out about. Have your favorite by all means but that doesnt change the truth that this is one part of the market with no bad choice. Both make good products and bad like it or not.
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 5:38:00 AM

Ok, so, if I say Ive never owned a certain product, was convinced theyre better cooling, perf etc etc quality etc, gee would I be thought of as a fanboi? Hmmm...

http://gpucafe.com/2009/10/modern-gpu-failure-rates-1h0...
Looks like nVidia is getting better, as their last review showed them doing even worse.
Now, since Ive owned both, read alot, visit 5 other forums, I see that claims are made by nVidia fans, then theres nVidia problems, which somehow go ignored by those same nVidia fans.
My experience has been that theyre about the same, depending on series, sometimes they run hot, are loud, sometimes they are quiet and cool.
My reading shows this as well, theyre about the same, tho nVidias failure rates have been slightly higher in the high end and of course, should I mention mobile? Or, the fact that nVidia was sued for NOT having DX10 capability for quite awhile AFTER Vistas release, meaning, their drivers were duds.
Why do I bring this all up? Because some people drink the koolaid, and Im here setting the facts aright again.
Both companies are good and solid, all the rumors dont mean squat when you read about owners problems, and again, not only as an owner of both, I also read about the same on both concerning problems.
So, all those that are afraid to try something new, being as there are currently shortages of 58xxs, thats all good, its just means more for those who will
October 23, 2009 6:07:09 AM

I find it an oddity in reliable products i've had an extremely unreliable experience with ATI ofc that was quite awhile ago, What's that in context of market share is what i'm wondering or is that pre adjusted for that.

Comparison of failure rate of 260 vs 280 is amazing in difference on one hand the GT200b vs GT200 failure rate.


http://xtreview.com/addcomment-id-9516-view-Graphic-mar...

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

shows Nvidia has a considerable market share difference, more then i thought they had but i doubt this is just dediciated video cards for market share which would be more helpful i have a feeling that is a bit more even, i wanted to draw from mouse sources to get a more reliable pattern but you get the jist.
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 6:27:01 AM

NVIDIA has alot of sales through OEM PCs, which are what many people in the steam survey would be using.
October 23, 2009 6:33:12 AM

Yeah i would like a graph of just Dedicated cards as even integrated cards as intel is on that list seem to make it. But alias i cannot find such a graph and data hunting is hardly fun to look up each card on steam and categorize it and then try something to cross reference with it.

I guess Newegg, zipzfly and tiger direct sales over a year would do it but ionno if that is disclosed.

But basically the thing still is is that failure rate in context. More people have nvidia more failure is bound to occur.
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 7:16:34 AM

jennyh said:
http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=20820

Key points :-

Huddy told HEXUS NVIDIA tended to work on a "different philosophy" to AMD. "AMD is competing on the basis of technology, whereas Nvidia is competing on the basis of marketing" he told us, adding, "I'm not a marketing guy, I'm an engineer".

"We've been working on DX11 games," said Huddy emphasising that, last time around, it had taken NVIDIA at least six months after DX10 launched before any game titles followed. AMD is working on over 20 titles currently in development, with two titles - BattleForge and Stalker - already available in DX11.

"NVIDIA is simply trying to market its way out of being late out with DX11 hardware"


Hubby is completely right here. nVidia relies since the G92 series on marketing only. They haven't brought anything new to the table since. And now because they are late to the fight they try to minimize the impact of DX11 and put the emphasis on lame physics. Ooo...shiny.
I am happy for ATI because lately they are the only company pushing GPU to evolve and become better gaming tools for the masses. Price/performance is unbeatable. Remember 4870 & 260 price difference ;)  .If the mentality of nVidia is to rape the customers with expensive cards then I personally hope they lose all the market share they got. But if they come with a good product at an affordable price then I will take back everything bad I said about them.
@IzzyCraft and smoggy12345. Guys come on, all people here try to convince you that things are not that green as you see them. JDJ, randomizer, TGGA (people with more experience than 100 of you) are putting logical arguments on the table and you just choose to ignore them. I seriously think you should stop and admit that not everything is green now.
October 23, 2009 7:54:53 AM

I already did logic with the statement

How does one claim nvidia isn't doing anything about hardware when they are finalizing a release of a completely new from scratch gpu design, instead of just a revision here and there. Nvidia has pulled back on production and basically handed out end of life *** here and there.

Nvidia is competing on the basis of marketing alone is bullshit it's just huddy sore on nvidia having a bigger market share when nvidia slaps its name on just about everything what do you expect Nvidia has gone out and made a name for it self. Are you saying the revisions to the G92 isn't the same as revisions ATI do on their cards every year? the G92 is just an older design but ATI has been revising their older design just like Nvidia for years Nvidia didn't change much because it works, works well and cheap are you going to deny the G92 is a performer? Not as great as 4770/4850 for the price of GTS 250 but performance is performance.

Wth does ATI's advertisement goes well if it's from their fans it goes like "ATI better then Nvidia" who goning to go
ATI over Nvidia like AMD over Intel one puts their name out there one does not.

"We've been working on DX11 games," well i'm sure nvidia will too once they can hand out DX11 cards and do their little twimtbp both companies do that both companies help game devs again this is nothing new this is just twisting words. IE marketing!

Basically the article goes like this
Nvidia is getting market share by marking although ATI has gained market share over the few months and so i'm the not marketing guy is going to rag on nvidia for marketing while praising everything we are doing IE PR or MARKETING.

Frankly that's what it's bull it's self inflammatory.

Yes ATI has DX11 cards out before Nvidia YES the 5870 and 5850 are wonderful single gpu cards for price/performance. Is it going to make me buy it, hell no i wasn't going to buy a card too soon anyways i can at least wait to see if the new gpu from nvidia is a flop before i buy.

@faliure rate
Nvidia failure of the cards listed 17.2 vs 19.9 not sure if correlation vs causation is to blame as ATI heavy brands have high failure rates but it's basically the same failure rate.
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 9:43:49 AM

Nvidia 8600m overheating problems anyone?

Both ATI and Nvidia have issues, end of story,

Frankly, I don't care if the sticker on my GPU says Nvidia or ATI as long as it does what I want it to. :) 
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 9:51:19 AM

The point is izzy, Nvidia are bribing microsoft to name them as dx11 partners while they don't even have a dx11 card. Did you read it at all?

Once again, when Nvidia don't have anything to show they throw a bunch of money at pretending they do.

Then the same tired old arguments get brought up, 'my ati cards broke more' etc. Did any of you mention drivers I wonder?

So we show a bunch of graphs that prove that ati's are no worse than nvidia's are for breaking - and in fact are a bit better. We show links that prove Nvidia has more driver issues than ATI in Windows.

How many false excuses are nvidia fanboys gonna bring up?
a c 271 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
a c 171 Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 10:36:11 AM

jennyh said:
Quote:
According to several unnamed sources cited by Fudzilla


Wake up and smell the coffee Nvidiots. Nvidia are tanking hard and the longer you wait the more disappointed you're gonna be.

Nvidia are finished, they cannot compete with ATI's superior technology.


I love the way that if a rumour comes from Charlie and or Fud that is anti NV you hold it up as gospel truth but a rumour cited by Fud about AMD/ATi has to be BS :lol: , would it be more believable if it came from Charlie?
October 23, 2009 10:45:34 AM

Huh, I have had 1 ATI card (3850) fail on me and I have had 3 nVidia (8800 GT,8800 GTS 512, and GTX 260) cards fail on me... NVidia must suck balls because I had a few bad experiences, until I RMA'd... Guess I'll never buy nVidia again, regardless of performance, because it is such a hassle to RMA...

Yep, that makes total sense /s
a c 271 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
a c 171 Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 10:49:20 AM

The_Blood_Raven said:
Huh, I have had 1 ATI card (3850) fail on me and I have had 3 nVidia (8800 GT,8800 GTS 512, and GTX 260) cards fail on me... NVidia must suck balls because I had a few bad experiences, until I RMA'd... Guess I'll never buy nVidia again, regardless of performance, because it is such a hassle to RMA...

Yep, that makes total sense /s

Maybe you just need to steer clear of cards with a 'T' in the name. [:mousemonkey] :lol: 
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 11:58:03 AM

brockh said:
I'm glad ATi is actually pushing DirectX 11. Even though I don't plan on upgrading to a DirectX 11 card any time soon, I'm so sick of hearing about games still using DirectX 9. It's almost like people are using a "Don't fix it if it isn't broken" mentality for technology, christ -- If there's one place to not use that mentality.

Also I think it's funny people are saying DirectX 11 is gonna be like 10 when, like mentioned in the post, there's already a good handful of games out citing it even before it was released officially, when it took DirectX 10 six months. Please. :p  We can't say that NVidia seems to want to push any new technology on anyone, they seem to be happy with reusing things, if you know what I mean. :sarcastic: 


1: XP Can only run DX9, and no game (Battleforge being the exception, and it simply didn't sell) will flat out abondon the XP market.

2: DX10 adoption has been fast; I usually takes a good 2 years for a new DX standard to gain traction, and the fact that the majority of games have a DX10 mode is actually suprising to me.

3: Does it really matter? Fact is, every DX9 game looks better then the previous one, so why have the devs waste time making two seprate rendering engines (DX9 and DX10+)?
October 23, 2009 12:12:30 PM

I think ATI should worry about weather their hardware works before they should go after nVidia. I own 2 computers with 5850's in crossfire and they both have the same issue of a HUGE mouse pointer. I wish I was alone but forums are full of people having this issue and they don't even admit there is an issue! I just think before you say we're first with DX11 hardware you should ask yourself if it works!
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 12:17:24 PM

biscuit60140 said:
I think ATI should worry about weather their hardware works before they should go after nVidia. I own 2 computers with 5850's in crossfire and they both have the same issue of a HUGE mouse pointer. I wish I was alone but forums are full of people having this issue and they don't even admit there is an issue! I just think before you say we're first with DX11 hardware you should ask yourself if it works!


Now this post made my day. How in hell do you think that the size of the mouse pointer is even remotely related to the card you have?
a c 271 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
a c 171 Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 12:19:58 PM

biscuit60140 said:
I think ATI should worry about weather their hardware works before they should go after nVidia. I own 2 computers with 5850's in crossfire and they both have the same issue of a HUGE mouse pointer. I wish I was alone but forums are full of people having this issue and they don't even admit there is an issue! I just think before you say we're first with DX11 hardware you should ask yourself if it works!

:o  You're taking a bit of a chance, sticking your head above the parapet like that.
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 1:06:09 PM

Both ATI and Nvidia have issues, end of story, said:
Both ATI and Nvidia have issues, end of story,


crazy thing is NTUNE can't remember my fan settings after a reboot. while CCC can do that with ease. a feature as simple as that and fail at it, is inexplicably moronic.

and no i dont want to use rivatuner as my system goes BSOD galore installing that (whether it was my old 4870 or my gtx260) software.

on topic:

why are people feeding off marketing propaganda from nvidia and ati?
a c 271 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
a c 171 Î Nvidia
October 23, 2009 1:12:36 PM

wh3resmycar said:
crazy thing is NTUNE can't remember my fan settings after a reboot. while CCC can do that with ease. a feature as simple as that and fail at it, is inexplicably moronic.

and no i dont want to use rivatuner as my system goes BSOD galore installing that (whether it was my old 4870 or my gtx260) software.

on topic:

why are people feeding off marketing propaganda from nvidia and ati?

Something to do whilst waiting for their card to return from being RMA'd?
October 23, 2009 1:18:37 PM

IzzyCraft said:
I find it an oddity in reliable products i've had an extremely unreliable experience with ATI ofc that was quite awhile ago, What's that in context of market share is what i'm wondering or is that pre adjusted for that.

Comparison of failure rate of 260 vs 280 is amazing in difference on one hand the GT200b vs GT200 failure rate.

http://xtreview.com/images/intel%20g%20market%20share.gif
http://xtreview.com/addcomment-id-9516-view-Graphic-mar...


shows Nvidia has a considerable market share difference, more then i thought they had but i doubt this is just dediciated video cards for market share which would be more helpful i have a feeling that is a bit more even, i wanted to draw from mouse sources to get a more reliable pattern but you get the jist.



It also shows AMD/ATI are growing twice as fast as Nvidia in Q2. Just thought I would point that out.
a b U Graphics card
October 23, 2009 1:36:07 PM

OK, lets look at what huge dies do.
"@faliure rate
Nvidia failure of the cards listed 17.2 vs 19.9 not sure if correlation vs causation is to blame as ATI heavy brands have high failure rates but it's basically the same failure rate."
First off, its not as you said, its as the graph says. Were talking percentages here. This is the whole of their findings, not just a few cards, so an overall aspect has to be considered here.
Like I said, they did this awhile ago, and it was much worse for nVidia, and theyve obviously improved, and that improvement is due to the G200, as it was woefully failing,
I posted those marks when it came out, and if you care to look it up, youll see what Im saying.
Maturing comes slower on a larger process, and it wont usually quite reach a smaller dies success rate, regardless of who you are, as both companies use TSMC, and thats just the way it goes.
Dont defend their failures, as they are high, and the 280 was horrendous.
Now, everyone waiting for G300, I hope it is affordable and does well, because we all know how the 2900 turned out, and it wasnt pretty.
The only savings grace for the 2900 was its price.
@ biscuit, have you downloaded the WHQL drivers? Those betas do have a few bugs, and the mouse pointer has been fixed. Its a bug. On a beta driver.
Now we can say, "ATIs drivers suck" or, we can say "I wonder when the G300 will be out?"
Yes, ATI rushed a few things, and everythings still falling in place. It means to me that these cards arent getting everything out of them yet, and that more perf is yet to come.

October 23, 2009 2:05:07 PM

lol @ all the charts and bickering over this giant piece of flamebait. shame on you guys for not locking it when it got stupid.
!