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Phenom II X4 965 BE and 800 Mhz DDR2 Ram

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January 1, 2010 9:00:09 PM

Hello,

I am looking for a better cpu, and the Phenom II X4 965 BE caught my eye. Of course with it, I'll also get a new mobo. But i will not be changing my old dimms: 2x2 gigs DDR2 800Mhz Apacer.

Here's the question: Can i use those old dimms with the new cpu ?

Thank you,
Neagu.
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January 1, 2010 9:06:32 PM

neagu said:
Hello,

I am looking for a better cpu, and the Phenom II X4 965 BE caught my eye. Of course with it, I'll also get a new mobo. But i will not be changing my old dimms: 2x2 gigs DDR2 800Mhz Apacer.

Here's the question: Can i use those old dimms with the new cpu ?

Thank you,
Neagu.

In order to run DDR2 RAM with PII-955, you need an AM2/AM2+ MB that will support the AM3 PII-955.
January 1, 2010 9:14:53 PM

I'll get this mobo GA-MA790X-UD3P - Socket AM3 - Chipset 790X - ATX.

You've missread the post, I'll actually get a 965 BE at 3.4 Ghz. The question was i i can use the old dimms with the new CPU. I wan to be sure, my current dimms are compatible with the new CPU.


Related resources
January 1, 2010 9:23:39 PM

If you are going to the trouble of getting a AM3 cpu and a new motherboard, you might as well get an AM3 motherboard and new DDR3 memory. You are saving a little by keeping the DDR2 and getting a AM2+ motherboard but a year from now you will be kicking yourself for not getting the AM3/DDR3.
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January 1, 2010 9:24:12 PM

If you want to be sure they are compatible, have you looked the RAM up on the mobo compatibility list or looked for the mobo on a compatibility list or memory configurator at your memory manufacturer;s website?

How do you expect anyone here to answer the question when you have not even provided the brand and model of memory you have?
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January 1, 2010 9:24:13 PM

neagu said:
I'll get this mobo GA-MA790X-UD3P - Socket AM3 - Chipset 790X - ATX.

You've missread the post, I'll actually get a 965 BE at 3.4 Ghz. The question was i i can use the old dimms with the new CPU. I wan to be sure, my current dimms are compatible with the new CPU.

965 is a waste of the money! You can easily OC 955 to 3.4GHz WITHOUT having to touch any voltage.

As for your original question, AM3 does NOT support DDR2. However, the MB you chose is an AM2+ instead of AM3.

Check here for spec: http://www.giga-byte.com/Products/Motherboard/Products_...
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January 1, 2010 9:31:41 PM

Whether you can run DDR2 memory or not depends on MB instead of CPU
January 1, 2010 11:22:23 PM

andy5174 said:
965 is a waste of the money! You can easily OC 955 to 3.4GHz WITHOUT having to touch any voltage.




and u can OC the 965 easily over 3.8 without touching voltages.
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January 1, 2010 11:25:23 PM

Earnie said:
and u can OC the 965 easily over 3.8 without touching voltages.

Not true.

I have heard from 3 PII-955 owners that you need to increase Vcore and some other voltages for 3.8GHz.
January 1, 2010 11:28:46 PM

andy5174 said:
Not true.

I have heard from 3 PII-955 owners that you need to increase Vcore and some other voltages for 3.8GHz.



not on the 965,mine has the zalman 9900 led is running 3.81 only using the multiplier(and worth the 189$ cdn i paid for it)..my back up has the 940 and is running at 3.4 as well..
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January 1, 2010 11:37:19 PM

Earnie said:
not on the 965,mine has the zalman 9900 led is running 3.81 only using the multiplier(and worth the 189$ cdn i paid for it)..my back up has the 940 and is running at 3.4 as well..

965 is just potentially a factory OCed 955.

You might just be lucky to have one of the best chips.
January 1, 2010 11:43:08 PM

andy5174 said:
965 is just potentially a factory OCed 955.

You might just be lucky to have one of the best chips.



works for me,mine is the 140 watt chips,not the 125 watt one.
January 2, 2010 3:20:58 AM

andy5174 said:
Not true.

I have heard from 3 PII-955 owners that you need to increase Vcore and some other voltages for 3.8GHz.


I got to 3.9 on stock volts...(955). Guess we both got really luck then XD
January 2, 2010 7:24:53 AM

2035616,6,396567
As for your original question, AM3 does NOT support DDR2. However, the MB you chose is an AM2+ instead of AM3.

Check here for spec: http://www.giga-byte.com/Products/Motherboard/Products_...[/quotemsg said:


So it is, however that means the site I found it on has false information, because it clearly stated that mobo uses an AM3 Socket. Thanks for clearing that up, I checked Gigabyte's comparison list, and although my particular ram isn't on their compatibility list, I know the mobo is 800 mhz compatible now.

Off topic:
The 965 i found is only 13 euros more expensive than the 955. I have no experience ocing what so ever, so I'll rather get a factory overclocked CPU rather than do it myself.
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January 2, 2010 7:37:37 AM

neagu said:
So it is, however that means the site I found it on has false information, because it clearly stated that mobo uses an AM3 Socket. Thanks for clearing that up, I checked Gigabyte's comparison list, and although my particular ram isn't on their compatibility list, I know the mobo is 800 mhz compatible now.

Off topic:
The 965 i found is only 13 euros more expensive than the 955. I have no experience ocing what so ever, so I'll rather get a factory overclocked CPU rather than do it myself.

All you need is increasing the multiplier by 1.

I guaranty that NO voltage tweaking will be required at all!

It would save you 13 euros by spending merely 1 minute doing so.
January 2, 2010 8:13:03 AM

And the 955 stock fan can keep up ?
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January 2, 2010 8:15:08 AM

neagu said:
And the 955 stock fan can keep up ?

Yes! The 965 is actually an 955 with an additional 1x bin already added for you in the factory and it comes with the SAME fan as 955.
January 2, 2010 9:28:04 AM

Then I shall take your advice and buy the 955. What about a mobo for the cpu, do you have a better offer for roughly the same value ?
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January 2, 2010 9:30:51 AM

neagu said:
Then I shall take your advice and buy the 955. What about a mobo for the cpu, do you have a better offer for roughly the same value ?

Sorry, I have absolutely no idea on the price in Europe and therefore you are on your own.
January 2, 2010 10:20:47 AM

Fair enough, but I'll take global prices as a comparison too.
January 2, 2010 11:00:06 AM

somebody posted this:

"If you are going to the trouble of getting a AM3 cpu and a new motherboard, you might as well get an AM3 motherboard and new DDR3 memory. You are saving a little by keeping the DDR2 and getting a AM2+ motherboard but a year from now you will be kicking yourself for not getting the AM3/DDR3."

What if I buy this cheap ASROCK N68-S AM2+ mobo, just to use the cpu, and later when I'll have enough have money, get an AM3 mobo with DDR3 memory ? I'm a little undecided now.
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January 2, 2010 6:11:48 PM

I doubt you will see any significant performance gain with DDR3.

In addition, I would go for AM2+ as well if I were you assuming that you will keep the system for at least 3 years.
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January 2, 2010 6:31:46 PM

andy5174 said:
I doubt you will see any significant performance gain with DDR3.

In addition, I would go for AM2+ as well if I were you assuming that you will keep the system for at least 3 years.


Agree for DDR2. Until the average cas latency of drr3 lowers, DDR2 800 cas 4 and ddr3 1600 cas 8 currently feels the same.
January 3, 2010 12:28:51 PM

I have a budget or 320€

Right now i'm still undecided, I can buy:

Phenom II 955 BE + ASRock N68-S AM2+ mobo + a vid card cheaper than 130 €

130€ + 33€= 163 + 130=293 and the rest lest for shipping fees.
-OR-

Phenom II 955 BE + GA-MA790X-UD3P - Socket AM2+ - Chipset 790X - ATX
130€ + 90 €= 220 and not enough for a powerfull card.

A friend actually recommend I buy a ZOTAC GF 250 GTS 512mb 256-bit for 90€ instead of a GF 250 GTS 1gb 256-bit for 115 under the pretext that 256-bit cards do no use the full 1gb video memory.

Is it true ?

What video card would you actually recommend I get ?
a b à CPUs
January 3, 2010 12:41:56 PM

HD5750 if you are on a tight budget.
January 3, 2010 1:29:12 PM

Why would i get that one ?
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January 3, 2010 1:39:21 PM

What PSU do you have and will it support a faster video card?
What CPU and mobo do you have? Instead of wasting money on interim parts, and depending on your other equipment, about which you have told us nothing, why not just get a real good vid card now that you can move over to your new system later?
January 3, 2010 7:10:23 PM

Curent rig:

Mobo: Gigabyte GA-G31M-S2L
PSU: FSP Blue Storm II 500 Watts
CPU: Intel C2D E8200 @ 2.6 GHz
GPU: GeForce POV 8800 GT
Ram: 2x2GB 800mhz Apacer


Possible rig1

Mobo: Gigabyte GA-MA790X-UD3P - Socket AM2+ - Chipset 790X - ATX
PSU: same
CPU Phenom II 955 BE
GPU: same
Ram: same

Possible rig 2

mobo: ASRock N68-S Socket AM2+
PSU: same
CPU: Phenom II 955 BE
GPU: ZOTAC 250 GTS AMP! Edition 1 GB
RAM: same

Notice that one of those Possible rigs doesn't have a new GPU, because if I buy the Gigabyte mobo I won't afford the new GPU. But I'm not sure if I should buy the expensive mobo now or later.
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January 3, 2010 8:09:10 PM

Given your current rig and budget limitations, the choice is clear. You should buy just a good graphics card now and save the rest towards your next major upgrade - to include CPU, mobo, and RAM (and maybe later, down the road, if you want to use two graphics cards, you could then add a new PSU and a second graphics card).

Why? Because the system you have will get a major boost just from a better graphics card – and that is the current weak spot in your configuration. Why waste money upgrading other components now that will have little if any impact on current gaming if you don’t add the video card., or why waste money on interim components that won’t get you any more without the complete upgrade of CPU, memory, and mobo as the next step after adding just the graphics card.

And when sizing the card to buy now, get what you want for your next system. It might be bottlenecked and not reach its full potential in the current system – so what? You can enjoy the better performance now and get more out of it later when you upgrade – without wasting any money on interim components.

You might want to read the article linked below about balanced systems to see what to expect from combinations of video cards and CPU. Among other CPUS benchmarked, it uses the E6300 and E8400 – your E8200 falls in between the two – approximately one quarter from the E8400 as shown on this set of benchmarks showing the three CPUs:

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/desktop-cpu-charts-q...

Your 8800 GT is also not included in the benchmarks – it is older and slower than anything shown. This next chart compares yours with two that are included, the GTX 260 and 285. Notice that by moving up just to the 260 you get about a 50% increase in performance:

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/gaming-graphics-char...

Now with that in mind, review the article on balancing your system – I linked to the GTA game page for a quick shot to see what I am talking about, then go back to front page to read more about how to interpret the test.:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/build-balanced-plat...

The review clearly shows the major increase in performance you can get by just increasing your graphic cards now – and how you can further improve performance later by then upgrading the CPU and related components.

If it were me, I would not upgrade until I see the new offerings nVidia is expected to release this quarter. I still think they have the long run lead over ATI – especially with Physx. However ATI does have the better graphics cards at the moment strictly looking at current prices and performance.
January 4, 2010 6:53:31 AM

Rockyjohn, do you have msn ?
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January 4, 2010 7:18:42 AM

@ rockyjohn

Quote:
There are 10 kinds of people in the World...Those who understand binary, and those who don’t!


LOL, you are wrong!

There are only "2" / "10 base 2" kinds of people in the World...Those who understand binary, and those who don’t!
January 4, 2010 7:59:45 AM

By reading those charts, I'm not sure which card to choose for GTA IV, I can afford the 275GTX and the HD4890. Which one would be better one my current system ?
January 4, 2010 8:08:38 AM

I can see the point about only boost the grafx card. as a stopgap. And if you get a good grafx card, even better for transfer to new sys - but by that time, even better grafx might be out - it's endless when you start playing the "future card".

I would recommend the DirectX 11 capable ATI 5000-series cards - no other cards have DX11.

Waiting for nvidia, already delayed and lost in problems, could be like waiting for a cold snap.
and some think little of PhysX.
Some think later than Q1 before they recover.


other stuff:

I cringe at the sound of words like Zotac and Asrock - Zotax is not what a friend would recommend - Asrock, I dunno, it's cheap, and they are weird.

But you have obviously, and understandably, confusion re mobo SOCKETS = sok AM2+ and sok AM3
And it is important to distiguish whether you are speaking of a cpu or a mobo.!!!

AM3 cpu's have a DUAL IMC (internal memory controller). This enables an AM3 CPU to work in EITHER a sok AM3 mobo, OR a sok AM2+ mobo.

ALSO
A socket AM2+ MOBO only uses DDR2.
A socket AM3 MOBO only uses DDR3.

You can use an AM3 cpu
>> in either an AM2+ or an AM3 mobo. (thx to the dual IMC)
but
You cannot use an AM2+ cpu
>> in an sok AM3 mobo.

"AM3" has an interesting "pin" arrangement that will fit in either mobo - but will Not allow an AM2+ cpu to fit the AM3 mobo socket.

AMD was highly acclaimed for the upgrade possibilities afforded existing customers with AM2+ mobos. note that SOME am2 socket mobos will also work but this generally not recommended even if it works due to lack of "dual plane" electrics on AM2 boards - excess details, yeh. Additionallly, a lot of the older boards can't handle 125w or 140w TDP specs.

There is no evidence to support the claim that a 965 is an ocloxd 955 - it might be higher binning.
Also in either case, you want to be sure you get a "Stepping C3" cpu. (the latest)
C3 is 125 watts but some might not be - be sure to get C3 step.

The other thing you need to know is that Socket AM3 is current and will be current through 2010 and possibly longer - that is signif cos ANY new cpu's for desktops will be DROP IN UPGRADES - replace cpu, update bios, done.

Make sure the mobo you buy is 140 watts TDP capable.

You picked a sok AM2+ MOBO so you could keep your DDR2
There is also a similar model number mobo for AM3 socket
= MA790XT-UD4P =

For futureproofing, go AM3. DDR3 is at least 5% faster, and have no fear, you can sell your old ram.

If you want the best DDR3 ram,
research OCZ 1600mhz "AMD EDITION" - in gold or platinum flavours.
Other rams work, this is the best - and you want either 2x2=4gigs or 4x2=8gigs.
This ram is made for overclocking, which you don't really want; but if you get a BLACK EDITION cpu like 965, you are going to tweak that multiplier just a little - and if you become a performance junkie, you only need look at a mobo upgrade to an MSI GD-70 = forget the rest. It's about 50$ more; but that's max performance kind of board made for oclox like crazy - it's the hot stuff. but you don't really need it.

for confirmation or more info see AMDzone.com

I used to participate in a thread called EZ Guide to socket AM3 at the zone - the thread has deteriorated lately - but it was started on basic research even before AM3 was available.

Everybody was confused about the socket switch and what works where - you are not alone.

Hope this helps you make an intelligent decision for a smarter choice solution for what "you personally" really want to do.

ask at the zone, they know this stuff inside out.

peace.
January 4, 2010 8:25:41 AM

neagu said:
By reading those charts, I'm not sure which card to choose for GTA IV, I can afford the 275GTX and the HD4890. Which one would be better one my current system ?


Either will work.

I recommend you read up on the ATI 5000 series cards.

I think you have some research to do generally; that means slow it down for now; make educated decisions.

I guess this is all part of the process. :D 
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January 4, 2010 1:15:07 PM

neagu said:
By reading those charts, I'm not sure which card to choose for GTA IV, I can afford the 275GTX and the HD4890. Which one would be better one my current system ?

My recommendations, in order, are:

1. Wait for the nVidia new releases this quarter which may have some excellent new cards but at a minimum may put price pressure on most existing cards
2. Get the HD 5770. It is not as fast as the 4890 or GTX 275, but costs substantially less, has DirectX 11, latest architecture, uses a lot less energy, and runs cooler. If desired, OC to get a little more speed now. Then after new build, go to Crossfire and have a very powerful system without spending a bundle.
3. Get the GTX 275 since it is the fastest - althought it costs more than the 4890 and only you can determine the price/power option that bests meets your budget and personal preferences.

Here is a comparison from the THG charts - showing the 5770 single and in CF and the 4890 and 275 - remember that FPS over 40 make little difference and over 50 are not even noticeable:

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/gaming-graphics-card...

And a review showing all three cards:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-5770-overclo...

And finally you should be familiar with the THG Best PCIe Card monthly article:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-310-5970,24...
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January 4, 2010 1:20:03 PM

sighQ2 said:
I can see the point about only boost the grafx card. as a stopgap. And if you get a good grafx card, even better for transfer to new sys - but by that time, even better grafx might be out - it's endless when you start playing the "future card".

But I am not suggesting that you always buy the latest graphics card - in fact I have never paid that premium, although I might consider it with the new nVidia cards coming out, depending on pricing. But you seem to miss the point - which is don't buy some interim components that you expect to discard after short use when you can buy something for long term investment and benefit. And by planning for Crossfire of SLI, when you want more power later you don't throw out the old card and buy the latest, you simply add another matching card and get the same performance for an incremental cost of about half of buying the new card.
January 14, 2010 11:46:28 AM

Does anybody know how to calculate GPU bandwidth ?
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January 14, 2010 5:19:10 PM

Do you mean the GPU memory bandwidth or the bandwidth of the mobo connection?

In either case, neither is as important as the overall processing power which depends on a lot of factors, more importantly the number processors, the speed of processors, and the architecture, and many others. It is best to focus on overall performance charts instead of any one particular strutural element.
!