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Radeon HD 5970 dual-GPU card 5870X2

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November 1, 2009 11:17:32 AM

I thought people were saying ATI wouldn't make this. But 13.5 inches long... wow.. too long.

Thinking to buy, but would the 850 PSU be enough with 4 HDs and an SSD?

More about : radeon 5970 dual gpu card 5870x2

a b U Graphics card
November 1, 2009 12:04:59 PM

I wouldn't recommend it, especially if the PSU isn't high end. You're pulling a lot of load from a lot of sources.

OCZ Z Series Gold 1000W - $299
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

It's not cheap but when you're running that kind of stuff, you can't skimp here.
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a b U Graphics card
November 1, 2009 2:10:43 PM

The card TDP i believe is around 300w so a good quality 850w will be plenty.
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a b U Graphics card
November 1, 2009 2:13:37 PM

Sure but he's pushing 4 HDDs and a SDD too.

You want to trust all that to minimum overhead?
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a b U Graphics card
November 1, 2009 5:06:08 PM

Lets assume this is his usage:
100% load.
cpu 150w
gpu 300w
hdd/sdd/motherboard/fans/sound card etc.. 200w (being very generous)
total 650w and thats at 100% load. Still good space to overclock.

A solid quality 850w is fine.

Im running a q6600 oc 3.2ghz + 2 gtx 260 oc on a 500w.
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a b U Graphics card
November 1, 2009 5:12:36 PM

The card that people are seeing is an engineering sample. If I have to explain what that is you shouldn't be buying it. Also, a solid 850W (the higher 80PLUS the better) should be fine.
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November 1, 2009 5:34:12 PM

No company in their right mind would release a 13.5 inch video card. As Brockh said, it's an ES. They'd cut back on the speed / number of stream processors before releasing a card that wouldn't fit in hardly any case out there. It'll be a more manageable size when it goes on sale.
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November 3, 2009 6:57:20 AM

yes, mine is an Antec 850 quattro... its a good psu, just old...

also i know its a ES... but that means this will be the closest information i have to go on for the future specs

thanks everyone
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a b U Graphics card
November 3, 2009 2:03:14 PM

A good 850 will easily be enough.
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November 9, 2009 5:17:54 PM

rodney_ws said:
No company in their right mind would release a 13.5 inch video card. As Brockh said, it's an ES. They'd cut back on the speed / number of stream processors before releasing a card that wouldn't fit in hardly any case out there. It'll be a more manageable size when it goes on sale.


that reminding me of voodoo 6600 with 8 gpu........(voodoo 6000 was quad gpu card) a voodoo 6600 was roughly 15~17 inches long

3dfx was a breast back then..
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November 20, 2009 1:24:57 AM

So the ES was not off by much and the PSU I have may not be enough.. (If i want to re clock to the original freq.) this card is crazy.
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a b U Graphics card
November 20, 2009 8:39:42 AM

Which 850 do you have?

It may well be enough.
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November 20, 2009 4:59:38 PM

cheesesubs said:
that reminding me of voodoo 6600 with 8 gpu........(voodoo 6000 was quad gpu card) a voodoo 6600 was roughly 15~17 inches long

3dfx was a breast back then..


And just how many Voodoo 6600s made it to retail? Hell, even the 6000 for that matter.
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a b U Graphics card
November 20, 2009 5:13:23 PM

TheViper said:
Sure but he's pushing 4 HDDs and a SDD too.

You want to trust all that to minimum overhead?

Hard drives barely use any energy at all. HDDs use ~10watts each...SSDs use even less...
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a b U Graphics card
November 20, 2009 7:55:31 PM

And anyone using that many drives will also have a large number of fans operating and other high end features that draw power. Minimal they may be, chancing it on a low end PSU simply isn't wise and as already seen by the original poster, 850 watts from his PSU was not enough.

I stand by my posts and his responses have vindicated them. Under normal circumstances I too would have suggested 850 to be adequate but normal circumstances these are not.
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November 23, 2009 3:52:59 AM

rodney_ws said:
And just how many Voodoo 6600s made it to retail? Hell, even the 6000 for that matter.


v6600 was still in beta test and only as few as 12 engineer model/prototype ever made before bankrupt. since it was an engineer model so we would never know their actual size when they are undergo mass production. as far as I know the v6600 was suppose to be directly counter geforce 3/radeon 8500(it was delay til august) however it's performance is only equal to geforce 2 gts in the time....as an eight gpu card this is an embarrassing moment which cause they bankrupt.

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November 30, 2009 1:58:01 AM

cheesesubs said:
v6600 was still in beta test and only as few as 12 engineer model/prototype ever made before bankrupt. since it was an engineer model so we would never know their actual size when they are undergo mass production. as far as I know the v6600 was suppose to be directly counter geforce 3/radeon 8500(it was delay til august) however it's performance is only equal to geforce 2 gts in the time....as an eight gpu card this is an embarrassing moment which cause they bankrupt.



How long ago was all this? sounds interesting... any references i can go read up on?n
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November 30, 2009 3:33:14 AM

hi all

maybe you can all help me further with this... i am debating whether to get this card... $600 i can afford it and i will be looking at an i9 when more details come out and as i wait for the socket issues to be over from foxconn... so i still have some time... But the problem i have it looking at the performance i just don't know what to get as this is not as significant as the $600 price tags justifies... I have a cross fire system and that left a bad taste in my mouth as the cost doesn't really make the performance worth it... (3970). i know it won't be linear... but i want something close to "high performance" any suggestions?
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a b U Graphics card
November 30, 2009 6:47:51 AM

TheViper said:
And anyone using that many drives will also have a large number of fans operating and other high end features that draw power. Minimal they may be, chancing it on a low end PSU simply isn't wise and as already seen by the original poster, 850 watts from his PSU was not enough.

I stand by my posts and his responses have vindicated them. Under normal circumstances I too would have suggested 850 to be adequate but normal circumstances these are not.

I'll stand by my statement: a good 850 would be enough. I've measured my system's power consumption at the wall, and an 850 would (barely) be enough to power my 4870 quadfire + OC i7 + 3 HDDs + SSD + bunch of fans + misc other crap. I'd be quite surprised if a single 5970 took more power than 4870 quadfire, and I doubt the rest of the OPs system pulls any significant amount more power than mine. Since I've measured mine and it could be powered by a good 850, I know that the OPs system plus a 5970 could also be powered by a good 850.

Now, if you were to run 5970 CF, that would require a good quality 1000-1200W PSU, but that's a different scenario.
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November 30, 2009 7:56:46 AM

hok said:
hi all

maybe you can all help me further with this... i am debating whether to get this card... $600 i can afford it and i will be looking at an i9 when more details come out and as i wait for the socket issues to be over from foxconn... so i still have some time... But the problem i have it looking at the performance i just don't know what to get as this is not as significant as the $600 price tags justifies... I have a cross fire system and that left a bad taste in my mouth as the cost doesn't really make the performance worth it... (3970). i know it won't be linear... but i want something close to "high performance" any suggestions?



Hiya.

Sounds like you last bought some really old cards they've improved Crossfire since and in fact it's called Officially CrossfireX now, I honestly forget the speed of that which I just Googled and they were never called a 3970 but the 3870X2. Did you have 2 3870X2 cards in Crossfire or 2 3870 card in Crossfire? Both had either GDDR3 or GDDR4 Video Ram which was a lot slower, they went with the first GDDR5 Ram on the series in between but only at effective speed of 3600mhz! That was the 4870X2 and an awesome card at almost double your cards, and a single 4870X2 would beat yours in Crossfire for sure!

Now the HD5970 (all should really have the HD in front of model number) is confusing people a lot, for one thing you can hardly find one still!! A few on ebay are selling over from $700+ to $800+ just because they are so darn rare! Amazon takes preorders on Sapphires and Diamonds of the HD5970 but they want $649.99 for them and all they say is After Christmas! I had 2 Sapphires and 1 Diamond on Preorder but so far have cancelled the 1 Diamond. I recently emailed back and forth a few times suggesting $649.99 on a Preorder so far out was silly, and that I'd likely Cancel both my Sapphires eventually unless they lowered them to the $599.99 price. They said they'd consider it and check back if not shipped by Jan 28th???

If they ever come in (a problem with GPUs at TSMC the HD5870 (11" with Single GPU runs at 850mhz with Ram 4800 Effective plus OC more!) is also harder than crap to find) they are called 12" cards but actually 12.4 inches and the main air intakes are on the end of the card! So if you try to squeeze them in without decent space for air intakes they do get hot!!

To get an ATX 300 Watt or under Rating ATI downclocks both the GPUs to 725mhz and Effective Ram to 4000mhz! A lot of confusion as ATI bases power draws on the downclocks yet has made charts bragging about the Massive OC Potential! They will not go quite that high but the ATI Overclock limits are a crazy 1000mhz on Cores and 6000mhz Effective Ram, that assumes even a Voltage OC that ATI provides the software for too!!

At downclocked speeds they are really only at a high idle so IF you find one you're going to OC it! How much is the question? We know 850/4800 is the factory stock speed of the same cores in the HD5870, so that the bare minimum! A few have been benchmarked and OC speeds are at least in range of 890 to 930mhz cores/5000 to 5500 Ram, but it depends on the Card's GPUs as they all vary. As far as cooling they use a backside metal plate to passive cool the ram, and ATI provides each HD5970 with a 400 Watt Rated Chamber Cooler (in a "300 Watt" Card is quite a hint! *LOL*)

A big question in these forums has been what size PSU to use since most expect to only need one HD5970 once OC'd but want the logical option to be able to run two in CrossfireX! I use 1600 Watt Ultra X3 PSUs in a SilverStone TJ-10 Case for all my builds (except family gifts for Mom etc), but for others I advise at least 1000 watts and a 1200 watt if fits Case and Budget. What confuses people is ATI puts for that "rating" only 850watts for 2 in Crossfire. OC'd these cards can draw near 400 watts per card someday when DX11 games are out and pulling a lot in a tough game, so 1000 watts will work most of the time but 1200 makes more sense.

Personally I will benchmark all mine with one and two HD5970 cards someday when show up, but most people will use one card only and I may just sell those off and stay with a single HD4870X2. For myself it depends if I get into Gaming since now I only build for Gamers, so mine do not need at least one HD5970 to get DX11!

If this delay crap goes on much longer (TSMC is having a heck of a time making the 40nm size anything, while the 28nm is in testing at the partially AMD owned Fabrication plants)! A lot of gamers are going to await until a year from now (or at least await a 4GB version and then sell them off after less than a year), when the 28nm RV970 cores in HD6870 cards are due!!
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November 30, 2009 8:06:08 AM

+1, a good 850 is MORE THAN enough. a good 700-750 (ex. hx750) would be enough.

stop wasting on overkill psu's, seriously.
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November 30, 2009 11:08:00 AM

BruceOTB said:
+1, a good 850 is MORE THAN enough. a good 700-750 (ex. hx750) would be enough.

stop wasting on overkill psu's, seriously.




Thanks hell_storm2004

It says 12.16 inches but the link shows what I mean about being careful
not to try to squeeze these into near actual length areas, the case I use
has 13.5" space which is barely enough for good air flow since only 1" open

http://techreport.com/r.x/radeon-hd-5970/card-full.jpg
=======================================


I'm not sure why so many of you worry about going to bigger PSUs? Actually ideal is to hit the peak efficiency area too although that's too complex usually like on the example below it is best at 800 watts

Although note in general the PSU efficiency drops much lower as it is used near it's peak output which is why so many of us say go bigger if can afford an it fits


Here are many myths exposed about PSUs including Brands pushing many rails


http://www.pcpower.com/technology/myths/#m8

Note 1 Where power use is lowered by upgrading to a larger PSU


http://ultraorder.com/images/item_details_images/ULT400...

Example of the PSU I use I found

Take care, Dane
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a b U Graphics card
November 30, 2009 1:18:19 PM

cjl said:
I'll stand by my statement: a good 850 would be enough.

Now go back and read my post again. Relevant line pasted below.

TheViper said:
chancing it on a low end PSU simply isn't wise.

If you'll notice, we're on the same page here.



And what happened? His low end 850 watt PSU couldn't handle it.
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November 30, 2009 3:10:27 PM

hok said:
How long ago was all this? sounds interesting... any references i can go read up on?n


november 2000/january 2001
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December 2, 2009 10:13:19 AM

cheesesubs said:
that reminding me of voodoo 6600 with 8 gpu........(voodoo 6000 was quad gpu card) a voodoo 6600 was roughly 15~17 inches long

3dfx was a breast back then..


when i saw it i had the same thought. i got a bit scared that ATI will follow the same fate as 3DFX did.

already the 5500 model of 3dfx was quite huge, i think it was in year 2000, i played my favourite game NFS:p orsche on a computer with the 5500 model on an exhibition and it run very smoothly, my 3500 was not fast enough to run this game smoothly. the case of the computer was open and boy that card was huge.

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December 6, 2009 3:58:51 PM

duhovnik said:
when i saw it i had the same thought. i got a bit scared that ATI will follow the same fate as 3DFX did.

already the 5500 model of 3dfx was quite huge, i think it was in year 2000, i played my favourite game NFS:p orsche on a computer with the 5500 model on an exhibition and it run very smoothly, my 3500 was not fast enough to run this game smoothly. the case of the computer was open and boy that card was huge.


consider that voodoo 3 has only 1 rop 4 tmu it does not suit for gaming in modern standard because of low rops cause the high letency. even in their newer vsa100 core was just a rebranded of voodoo2/3 with new fabrication, the technology still stay in 1998 which occurre that voodoo 4/5/6 had no chance compete opponent's gpu line, even an old rage 128 was outclassed vsa100 by a long shot in single gpu test, and that was in 2000. for that case they can just put more core on the same pcb board(dual layer would be costly). a v5500 only perform as good as rage128, as for a qud gpu card this is truly embarassing...

yeah that card is a beast. v5500 is about 11 inches long already, not to mention v6000 and v6600
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