Radiator fans-intake vs exhaust
Tags:
- Water Cooling
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Cooler Master
- LED Monitor
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Overclocking
Last response: in Overclocking
Cs342
February 20, 2012 4:10:57 AM
I currently have a 240mm radiator mounted at the top of my CM 690 II Advanced. There are 2 Cooler Master 120mm LED fans on top of the rad (I also have 2 Yate Loons lying around - would those be better?). Since hot air rises it would make sense to use the rad fans as exhaust, but since they are on top of the rad and not under it, using them as intake is what I've been doing. Should I use the rad fans as intake or exhaust?
More about : radiator fans intake exhaust
Two issues here. First as to the radiator you want to bring cool air over the radiator so that that the heat that has been absorbed by the coolant will be transferred to the air. Then the cooled coolant is circulated back to the heat source to absorb more heat. So you have a correct fan installation for the radiator (you are bringing cooler ambient air across the radiator). The second issue is that this introduces warmed air into the case. Also there is probably heat sources in the case not being serviced by the radiator. Soooo you need to expel the heated internal case air (usually done with fans pulling air from the case and exhausting it from the rear. To balance the air flow and air pressure you want to bring outside air in from the front. You will want slightly more exhaust than supply of air. Please note that pulling air from the case across the radiator handicaps the liquid cooling by providing already heated air that is not cool enough to absorb all the heat from the liquid.
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Cs342
February 20, 2012 5:52:51 AM
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cliffro
February 20, 2012 6:10:36 AM
@Dogsnake, it sounds like a catch 22 by your desciption.
@Cs342, That's positive pressure and is usually considered bad.
I'd say try it as exhaust, with enough cool air coming into the case(Front, Bottom and possibly the side if it doesn't have the window) that should be enough to keep the CPU relatively cool, if not try it the other way.
I have my H60 set up as exhaust, mainly because of the places I can install it do not have fan filters. So I would spend too much time cleaning it.
I have the fan that came with it installed in my 5.25 bays pulling air in and blowing right at the rad and a Coolermaster Blademaster PWM between the rad/case pulling air. Come summer I might add another for push-pull.
@Cs342, That's positive pressure and is usually considered bad.
I'd say try it as exhaust, with enough cool air coming into the case(Front, Bottom and possibly the side if it doesn't have the window) that should be enough to keep the CPU relatively cool, if not try it the other way.
I have my H60 set up as exhaust, mainly because of the places I can install it do not have fan filters. So I would spend too much time cleaning it.
I have the fan that came with it installed in my 5.25 bays pulling air in and blowing right at the rad and a Coolermaster Blademaster PWM between the rad/case pulling air. Come summer I might add another for push-pull.
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Cs342
February 20, 2012 6:46:32 AM
Up for a bit of modding?
you can raise the rad on legs, make a deflection plate up, all sorts of things,
Worked on my last build,
although I actually have a roofbox separating things
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/forum2.php?config=t...
get the dremel out mate
Moto
you can raise the rad on legs, make a deflection plate up, all sorts of things,
Worked on my last build,
although I actually have a roofbox separating things
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/forum2.php?config=t...
get the dremel out mate
Moto
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Cs342
February 20, 2012 7:00:16 AM
If you have a plate on top of the roof it would block the downblast from the radfans, stop it entering the case, and then the roof fans inside would blow out of the grill, and be directed by the plate to the rear thereby exhausting the heat,
plus you can add the extra fans to the rad, also helping things
Moto
plus you can add the extra fans to the rad, also helping things
Moto
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Cs342
February 20, 2012 7:25:01 AM
lafontma
February 20, 2012 10:22:16 AM
Cs342
February 20, 2012 11:00:51 AM
With a radiator, you'd rather have the coolest air you can, if possible. That being said, if your case has good airflow it shouldn't matter which direction you orient the fans as long as you are getting enough cool air in and the warm air out.
This question seems to perplex people far more than it should.
This question seems to perplex people far more than it should.
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The radiator is nothing more than another heat sink device. The coolant absorbs the heat, the radiator provides an increased surface area for the liquid to be cooled by air flow. The heated air is removed and the cycle continues. There is no catch 22. You have to move the heated air out of the case. Cs342, I suggest you turn the side fan to exhaust, add a rear fan to exhaust. Without getting into cfm computations, this gives you 3 intakes and 3 exhausts. You want a slight negative pressure in the case (exhausting more than supplying). I just looked at pics. of the case. and you have no room to add fans except maybe at the bottom. So your choice is to add a fan exhausting down. This is not the best solution as being close to the floor blocks air flow.You can also try changing the rear and side fan (exhaust) to greater cfm types. Your choices are limited by your case. But if you are not having heat issues there is no need to get a different one.
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Cs342
February 20, 2012 10:46:36 PM
Cs342
February 21, 2012 12:22:29 AM
Cs342
February 21, 2012 12:59:29 AM
Everything that I have seen recommends pulling air into the air and through the rad for optimal cooling
Regarding air through the rad, the best arrangement is to have a push/pull configuration which makes sure that as much air as possible is moving through the rad. If the air isn't, then your cooling is suffering.
Edit:
Cooler as intake: the most it will effect is your gpu if anything.
Regarding air through the rad, the best arrangement is to have a push/pull configuration which makes sure that as much air as possible is moving through the rad. If the air isn't, then your cooling is suffering.
Edit:
Cooler as intake: the most it will effect is your gpu if anything.
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Cs342
February 21, 2012 4:11:18 AM
Yes do that with the fans.
The GPU will be cooled from the front intake and the side exhaust. Trust me it works. But if you want, you can monitor temps in both set ups and see what's better for you.
Also, GPUs rarely get to 100% load so even if there was a small amount of temp increase, you would still be fine with the extra side exhaust.
The GPU will be cooled from the front intake and the side exhaust. Trust me it works. But if you want, you can monitor temps in both set ups and see what's better for you.
Also, GPUs rarely get to 100% load so even if there was a small amount of temp increase, you would still be fine with the extra side exhaust.
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Cs342
February 21, 2012 4:29:44 AM
Alright thanks, by the way I am using the water block right now, would switching to something like a Rasa or Apogee perform a lot better or do all blocks perform the same?
http://www.syscooling.com/products/Water_Blocks/2011/09...
http://www.syscooling.com/products/Water_Blocks/2011/09...
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^ you're looking at older block?
take a look at eh supreme HF, XSPC Raystorm, Swiftech Apogee HD blocks. the winner in most dept is the XSPC raystorm - no budget? get the copper edition of the raystorm block.
blocks didn't perform the same a few years ago but now, almost all R+D dept are churning out near similar performing blocks.
** to respond to previous post of OP, if you think your temps are horrible/bad - post it and get feedback on whether you need a new block or better fan orientation.
+ 1 to modding the case like moto
take a look at eh supreme HF, XSPC Raystorm, Swiftech Apogee HD blocks. the winner in most dept is the XSPC raystorm - no budget? get the copper edition of the raystorm block.
blocks didn't perform the same a few years ago but now, almost all R+D dept are churning out near similar performing blocks.
** to respond to previous post of OP, if you think your temps are horrible/bad - post it and get feedback on whether you need a new block or better fan orientation.
+ 1 to modding the case like moto
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Cs342
February 21, 2012 6:25:25 AM
Cs342
February 21, 2012 6:30:57 AM
Cs342
February 21, 2012 6:33:59 AM
I can't seem to find reviews on it anyway... I only bought it because it was the only block available locally. Here are my pump and radiator:
http://www.syscooling.com/products/Water_Pumps/2011/092...
http://www.syscooling.com/products/Radiators/2011/0919/...
I hope THOSE don't need to be upgraded
http://www.syscooling.com/products/Water_Pumps/2011/092...
http://www.syscooling.com/products/Radiators/2011/0919/...
I hope THOSE don't need to be upgraded
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I'd say that will hold until you can afford to upgrade the block, even swapping it out for a more modern unit isn't going to improve your temps by more than 1-2'c at best if at all,
the solution here is getting maximum cool air through that rad, that will be your best plan of attack
the block will be fine for now, address the issue that affects your temps the most first
**Edit, you posted pump and rad whilst I was posting hehe,
Moto
the solution here is getting maximum cool air through that rad, that will be your best plan of attack
the block will be fine for now, address the issue that affects your temps the most first
**Edit, you posted pump and rad whilst I was posting hehe,
Moto
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Cs342
February 21, 2012 6:42:58 AM
I would upgrade the pump tbh, but if the budget won't allow right now then dwai, as long as you are not kinking the tubes and are getting good flow it will be ok,
rads are rads by and large, even between the top performers theres very little difference,
if building a new loop is on the cards then plan it from the ground up, I would hold with the current loop as is rather than upgrading one part at a time every six months,
Moto
rads are rads by and large, even between the top performers theres very little difference,
if building a new loop is on the cards then plan it from the ground up, I would hold with the current loop as is rather than upgrading one part at a time every six months,
Moto
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Cs342
February 21, 2012 6:56:38 AM
build quality will vary from manf to manf, it may have been 600Lph with a 4 metre head from the factory, but how quickly a pump degrades depends on the quality of seals used, bearings etc, you can find some older pumps that just won't quit and some of the earlier Xspc pumps were, problematic shall we say hehe
same as any other game really you get what you pay for, and unfortunately some places are more subject to availability issues than others
I'm off for a while now though man,climbing time hehe I'll check back later
Moto
same as any other game really you get what you pay for, and unfortunately some places are more subject to availability issues than others
I'm off for a while now though man,climbing time hehe I'll check back later
Moto
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Cs342
February 21, 2012 7:06:57 AM
Cs342
February 21, 2012 7:55:22 AM
well as i said earlier, i am intending, some time next week, to replace tubing to UV 1/2 inch (primochill LRT), and also swap my reservoir (any recommendations on a cheap res? are res pump combos any good? XSPC X20 750 Dual Bay for example?). what i would like to know is whether or not changing the waterblock and radiator (it will still be a 240mm rad for sure since that's all my case and most others can fit) will make a huge (eg 10 degrees Celcius) difference in CPU temps.
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Changing the rad is the most effective of the two options,
waterblocks don't offer more than a couple of degrees difference, but a better rad with good air through it can make a huge difference, despite 'my rads are rads' comment earlier, I should have mentioned the importance of having good flow as the defining factor between.
My Xspc dualbay res is fine, can't hear the pump although I know some people have had issues, I believe they were resolved by Xspc
What are your current temps like? and whats your ambient temp too, you can't get below ambient as a rule, not without some serious mentality
Moto
waterblocks don't offer more than a couple of degrees difference, but a better rad with good air through it can make a huge difference, despite 'my rads are rads' comment earlier, I should have mentioned the importance of having good flow as the defining factor between.
My Xspc dualbay res is fine, can't hear the pump although I know some people have had issues, I believe they were resolved by Xspc
What are your current temps like? and whats your ambient temp too, you can't get below ambient as a rule, not without some serious mentality
Moto
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I've never seen those components you listed above...kind of like finding an otherwise extinct animal that you never knew existed.
The pump almost looks like a Thermaltake brand of some sort, but not exactly at the same time. That radiator looks like one of the very first DangerDen 240 rads I had a long time ago, but I can tell it isn't. I'm curious if there are links/retailers that you have the ability to buy from...maybe we can compare some gear for you.
First rule of watercooling- not all gear is created equal. A radiator still might be a radiator, but you can't expect the same results from every one.
The pump almost looks like a Thermaltake brand of some sort, but not exactly at the same time. That radiator looks like one of the very first DangerDen 240 rads I had a long time ago, but I can tell it isn't. I'm curious if there are links/retailers that you have the ability to buy from...maybe we can compare some gear for you.
First rule of watercooling- not all gear is created equal. A radiator still might be a radiator, but you can't expect the same results from every one.
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Quote:
kind of like finding an otherwise extinct animal that you never knew existed. in other news, saint19 wants to become Bruce Wayne and get a 21 multimotor eyefinity setup
Quote:
First rule of watercooling- not all gear is created equal. A radiator still might be a radiator, but you can't expect the same results from every one. @ OP - i didn't mention this earlier but there is no cross-sectional diagram of any sort to compare the cpu block with any of today's or yester-years blocks to give you a sound advice.
* rubix - took the Tt "idea" out of my mouth ... and they weren't any good either.
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Cs342
February 22, 2012 2:22:52 AM
changing the res won't affect temps,
Resses only make noise when water moves air so if there is very little to no air in there, it can't make much noise
my Pc is about ten inches away and I would estimate the noise (fans on low) at less than 10Db
you could actually leave a res out of the loop altogether, but your bleeding has to be spot on if you do that,
I would try moving the fans a bit before spending any money,
try the fans directly on top of the case blowing upwards, then the rad on top of them, and finally two fans on top of the rad,
I think you'll see a temp difference without buying new parts but my preference of purchase order would be:
Pump (maybe pump/res combo as you suggested)
better fans
rad
waterblock
tubing
but as stated, I'd play around with what you do have first to get the best from those parts,
Moto
Resses only make noise when water moves air so if there is very little to no air in there, it can't make much noise
my Pc is about ten inches away and I would estimate the noise (fans on low) at less than 10Db
you could actually leave a res out of the loop altogether, but your bleeding has to be spot on if you do that,
I would try moving the fans a bit before spending any money,
try the fans directly on top of the case blowing upwards, then the rad on top of them, and finally two fans on top of the rad,
I think you'll see a temp difference without buying new parts but my preference of purchase order would be:
Pump (maybe pump/res combo as you suggested)
better fans
rad
waterblock
tubing
but as stated, I'd play around with what you do have first to get the best from those parts,
Moto
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Cs342
February 22, 2012 5:59:20 AM
My top priority right not is actually tubing and res because i want UV lighting and my res right now has a spinning wheel that is driving me crazy from the noise. Obviously I want to improve CPU temps as well since it's idling at around 25-30 degrees Celcius, which tbh I have seen people achieve that with air cooling, and goes to 60 degrees under full load Prime 95 at stock speeds. That's why right now I'm getting a Logisys dual cathode UV kit, Primochill LRT UV Blue tubing with UV blue barb fittings and UV blue clamps (all 1/2 inch)
and im thinking of getting a res pump combo but am concerned about noise
and im thinking of getting a res pump combo but am concerned about noise
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Cs342
February 22, 2012 6:27:55 AM
i know your pump res combo doesnt make any noise, but im worried mine will , just take a look at this one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSswZIbY9G4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSswZIbY9G4
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@ cs - no offense but why don't you save yourself the worry, time and effort and get something that'll give you peace of mind and a worth while setup.
revert back to the stock cooler, rid yourself of this cheap no name watercooler.
and get a good kit like the "great-for-starters" XSPC raystorm RX kit
revert back to the stock cooler, rid yourself of this cheap no name watercooler.
and get a good kit like the "great-for-starters" XSPC raystorm RX kit
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