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Revised WCing Loop. Need your suggestions?

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April 29, 2012 11:34:30 PM

I posted about 2 months ago in this thread: http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/273533-29-first-custo...

But now a few things have changed:

1) My budget has expanded

2) I am going to be cooling my GPU

3) I want a better looking system.

So before I say anything else, yes I have read the sticky. I've been doing research for about 2 months now. Also, like I said, my budget has expanded. I can pay probably up to $600 max, but I'd like to keep it under $500 ($450 ideally).

Here's a picture of my computer right now:


Sorry for the poor quality. I should have stolen my mom's DSLR hehehe. I know this is off-topic, but do you guys have any cable management suggestions for the 5.25 bay area? It looks too messy for me. Oh and the CPU power connector will be hidden away. I just need to buy a sleeved extension cable.

Anyways, here's my parts list as of right now:

CPU Block: EK Supreme HF - Gold Plated ($79.99)
- Only gold plated CPU block left that I can find...
GPU Block: EK-FC570 GTX SE - Nickel Plated [Plexi] ($99.99)
- I know EK has had some problems with their nickel plating corroding. Should I avoid getting this? I don't have a GTX 570 yet, but I was planning on getting one. I wanted the 2.5GB version for 3D modeling :/ 
Radiator 1: XSPC EX120 ($39.95)
Radiator 2: XSPC EX280 ($62.99)
- I was planning on getting one 360 rad, but I have 2 120 fans and 2 140 fans. I don't want the 140s to go to waste, so why not use a 140 rad? Plus I don't know if the 360 would've fit. Maybe only in the bottom...
Resevoir: Phobya Balancer 250 - Gold Plated ($39.95)
- I'm not sure if this will fit with my cable mess near the 5.25 bays. If I can clean that up, maybe it will. Otherwise, I'll probably just get the 150 version and save $5...
Pump: Swiftech MCP655 ($79.95)
- There is a special edition version which has the option for compression fittings, but I can't justify spending an extra $15. Also, I might get an after market top in the future, so I'll save that money for now.
Fittings: Phobya 19/10mm Compression Fittings - Gold Plated [x9] ($49.50)
- Cheaper than Monsoons, so I chose these.
Fittings (Extra 1): Phobya 19/10mm 90° Compression Fittings - Gold Plated ($7.99)
- Just need one to make the loop look neater near the 120mm rad.
Fittings (Extra 2): Phobya Metal Reusable Hose Clamp 3/4 OD - Black [x2] ($2.18)
- These are for my pump (until I get a top and more fittings).
Tubing 1: PrimoFlex Pro 1/2 ID x 3/4 OD - Black [x4] ($9.00)
Tubing 2: PrimoFlex Pro 1/2 ID x 3/4 OD - Clear [x4] ($9.00)
- I'm only going with clear tubing if the coolant is compatible (see coolant). Otherwise, I'll get 8ft of black.
Killcoil: IandH Sillver Killcoil ($6.99)
- Won't need this if I get the coolant (see coolant).
Coolant: Distilled Water and Mayhems Aurora - Hydra Gold Concentrate ($17.95 for concentrate + $2 for water)
- Now this is where it gets tricky. This stuff looks amazing. It's the only gold coolant that doesn't look like urine (cough cough Primochill)

This is what the Aurora looks like:

Now I've done some research and I run into some problems. Apparently, this coolant is made for photo work and "show" systems (according to his Wiki page). It also seems to have some compatibility issues, but I don't see any with my loop. It performs almost identical to distilled water. And it has biocide in it, so no need for a killcoil. Does anyone have experience with this? I've read some reviews like this, and I just love the look of it. It says to not use a lot of 90° fittings, but I'm only using one. Some people have had no problems using them. Do you think I should give it a shot? If I don't get the coolant, then I'll just get 8ft of the black tubing like I said, the killcoil, and change the GPU block (if I get it) to the black acetal version.

Alright so I can't really do a total as there is a million different options. But it averages out to around about $490. Is there anything I'm missing? Anything I can save on?

Oh and lastly, this is a quick diagram of my new loop:

April 30, 2012 5:30:57 AM

Bump. I need your guys' opinions!
a c 324 K Overclocking
April 30, 2012 2:04:27 PM

I've read from many people that the Aurora coolant is only for short-term use. After a while it tends to separate and precipitate out. While I will agree it looks fantastic in a loop, when it comes to longevity, I would have some reservations.

I know it's easy to want all the bling and glowing color from a first-timer's perspective, but using distilled water and some biocide will save you the headaches down the road. You also won't need to worry about cleaning/servicing your loop as often. The only way I use color is colored tubing anymore- but I've used food color dye (liquid only) and Hydrx in the past. I'd really only recommend liquid dyes if you are set on going the colored water route. You don't need coolants unless you are running some sort of mixed metals loop or want to abide by EK's rules of play when concerning their nickel plated blocks.

Trust me on this- coolants and fancy additives are more of a pain long-term than they are worth.
Related resources
May 1, 2012 5:01:54 AM

rubix_1011 said:
I've read from many people that the Aurora coolant is only for short-term use. After a while it tends to separate and precipitate out. While I will agree it looks fantastic in a loop, when it comes to longevity, I would have some reservations.

I know it's easy to want all the bling and glowing color from a first-timer's perspective, but using distilled water and some biocide will save you the headaches down the road. You also won't need to worry about cleaning/servicing your loop as often. The only way I use color is colored tubing anymore- but I've used food color dye (liquid only) and Hydrx in the past. I'd really only recommend liquid dyes if you are set on going the colored water route. You don't need coolants unless you are running some sort of mixed metals loop or want to abide by EK's rules of play when concerning their nickel plated blocks.

Trust me on this- coolants and fancy additives are more of a pain long-term than they are worth.
Arggg I typed this out on my iPod, but it didn't save :(  Oh well, I'll try to remember what I wanted to say.

I understand what you mean about the coolant. On the wiki, it said that the Aurora wasn't suited for home builds and had some compatibility issues. Plus draining every six months would've been a hassle. I think the killcoil + distilled water will be my choice.

For the GPU block, do you think it is now safe for me to purchase? Or are EK's nickel-plated blocks still messed up? I don't have a 570 (yet), so it doesn't matter too much. But I wanted the HD version because it has more memory, which I need. Since the EK blocks are the only ones for that PCB, I don't really have another option. Except maybe look at another video card? Haha

Ok I have a bit of an off topic question (don't worry, this is my last), do you know if it is still possible to purchase Mushkin Copperhead RAM? I know its discontinued and water cooling RAM is useless, but it looks so awesome! Plus it's the only RAM I can find that matches my color scheme.

Thanks for your help,

Jake
a c 324 K Overclocking
May 1, 2012 2:20:02 PM

I'm not a fan of EK's nickel blocks, even after they have claimed to fix the plating issue. They basically require you to use corrosion inhibiting coolant (while other manufacturers do not for their nickel products) or else you void the warranty and cannot be replaced if plating is damaged. Either stick to copper EK blocks, or look for other options. I wouldn't get a block until you have a card picked out or purchased- you'll need to know if it's reference PCB or not...which is pretty important.

As for the RAM question...not sure on that one. You can always post a 'Want to buy' ad in the classifieds section to see if anyone has any they would sell, check Ebay, or maybe see if anyone has them on closeouts. If they are discontinued, you may only be able to find them used or via an outlet seller.
May 1, 2012 2:40:10 PM

rubix_1011 said:
I'm not a fan of EK's nickel blocks, even after they have claimed to fix the plating issue. They basically require you to use corrosion inhibiting coolant (while other manufacturers do not for their nickel products) or else you void the warranty and cannot be replaced if plating is damaged. Either stick to copper EK blocks, or look for other options. I wouldn't get a block until you have a card picked out or purchased- you'll need to know if it's reference PCB or not...which is pretty important.

As for the RAM question...not sure on that one. You can always post a 'Want to buy' ad in the classifieds section to see if anyone has any they would sell, check Ebay, or maybe see if anyone has them on closeouts. If they are discontinued, you may only be able to find them used or via an outlet seller.
Ok that's good to know. It sucks that the only only blocks for the card I want are EK's nickel-plated :(  Maybe I should look into another video card...

And I'll do a "want to buy" post like you suggested. I already checked Ebay, with no luck. Hopefully someone doesn't want theirs anymore!
a c 324 K Overclocking
May 1, 2012 3:07:49 PM

I know you are looking at a 570...can you post the exact model? This might help in the search to know exact PCB we are looking for.
a c 324 K Overclocking
May 1, 2012 5:25:42 PM

I don't see the nVidia logo near the PCI-e connector (which is usually an indicator of reference nVidia cards). The fact that it is also a 2560MB vs. a 1280MB version also tells me it likely isn't reference unless EVGA simply replaced the reference VRAM modules with larger ones (1280 x2 = 2560). Either way, they also might have a different VRM layout as well or added Mosfets.

If you look at the difference between the EVGA 1571-AR (1280MB version) and the 1579-AR (2560MB version) they appear to have identical PCB layouts, but the EK cooling config is saying they don't use the same block.

012-P3-1571-AR:


025-P3-1579-AR:
a b K Overclocking
May 1, 2012 9:07:22 PM

it would appear that the mofets on the lower card are much taller than the top card so some modding of the block would be necessary if you wanted to use the same block for both.
May 2, 2012 1:22:49 AM

rubix_1011 said:
I don't see the nVidia logo near the PCI-e connector (which is usually an indicator of reference nVidia cards). The fact that it is also a 2560MB vs. a 1280MB version also tells me it likely isn't reference unless EVGA simply replaced the reference VRAM modules with larger ones (1280 x2 = 2560). Either way, they also might have a different VRM layout as well or added Mosfets.

If you look at the difference between the EVGA 1571-AR (1280MB version) and the 1579-AR (2560MB version) they appear to have identical PCB layouts, but the EK cooling config is saying they don't use the same block.

012-P3-1571-AR:
http://www.coolingconfigurator.com/upload/pictures/EVGA-GeForce-GTX-570HD-PCB.jpg

025-P3-1579-AR:
http://www.coolingconfigurator.com/upload/pictures/DSC_1197_75114.jpg
Thanks for the pictures and information. I see you used coolingconfiguration.com :) 

It says the block will have physical compatibility. Also, this video shows the block installed on the card I was looking at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cVoYscBOzc

Maybe I save some possible headaches and just shell out another $100 (which I actually recently got) and get a 580. Just a thought.

- Jake
a b K Overclocking
May 2, 2012 2:02:03 AM

It looks like from the pictures from cooling configurator that the mounting holes for the cards are different in several places, which is probably why the reference blocks won't work. Other than that the PCBs do look identical.

I'll be back on later to hit some more points - just trying to juggle several things right now
May 2, 2012 4:18:17 AM

boiler1990 said:
It looks like from the pictures from cooling configurator that the mounting holes for the cards are different in several places, which is probably why the reference blocks won't work. Other than that the PCBs do look identical.

I'll be back on later to hit some more points - just trying to juggle several things right now
It's fine take your time. Honestly, I'm in no rush. Get what you need to get done first :) 

- Jake

Best solution

a b K Overclocking
May 2, 2012 4:48:00 AM
Share

Back; had a friend over a bit earlier, and my gf and I got a Dyson vacuum and just had to test it out (we're both engineers). Quite a well thought out vacuum.

Onto more relevant things:

Quote:
1) My budget has expanded

Hooray! :D 

Quote:
So before I say anything else, yes I have read the sticky. I've been doing research for about 2 months now. Also, like I said, my budget has expanded. I can pay probably up to $600 max, but I'd like to keep it under $500 ($450 ideally).

$400-500 is about right for a high-end custom loop. You could save a little bit buy maybe snagging some used parts (maybe rads, reservoirs, and possibly some blocks). Some of the parts in my original loop were used; all that remains of that is my CPU block and 360 rad now.

Quote:
I know this is off-topic, but do you guys have any cable management suggestions for the 5.25 bay area? It looks too messy for me. Oh and the CPU power connector will be hidden away. I just need to buy a sleeved extension cable.

I think some of the cables from the 5.25" bay could go down through that cutout rather than up top with everything else. That should clean it up a bit in there.

Quote:
CPU Block: EK Supreme HF - Gold Plated ($79.99)
- Only gold plated CPU block left that I can find...

Any reason for the gold-plated block? It seems a bit gaudy and expensive for what you get, but if it's your thing then go for it. I have an EK Supreme HF Full Copper and it works quite well, but I got that used for under $60 ;) 

Quote:
GPU Block: EK-FC570 GTX SE - Nickel Plated [Plexi] ($99.99)
- I know EK has had some problems with their nickel plating corroding. Should I avoid getting this? I don't have a GTX 570 yet, but I was planning on getting one. I wanted the 2.5GB version for 3D modeling :/ 

If you'd like to know my opinions on the EK nickel situation, read the very long last post on this thread.
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/266834-29-before-nick...

Quote:
Radiator 1: XSPC EX120 ($39.95)
Radiator 2: XSPC EX280 ($62.99)
- I was planning on getting one 360 rad, but I have 2 120 fans and 2 140 fans. I don't want the 140s to go to waste, so why not use a 140 rad? Plus I don't know if the 360 would've fit. Maybe only in the bottom...

These might be ok with the right fans (any idea of the CFMs the ones inside your case push?). A 280 rad has roughly the same area as a 360 rad (~39k mm^2 vs ~42k mm^2)

Quote:
Resevoir: Phobya Balancer 250 - Gold Plated ($39.95)
- I'm not sure if this will fit with my cable mess near the 5.25 bays. If I can clean that up, maybe it will. Otherwise, I'll probably just get the 150 version and save $5...

Get whichever you think will fit better (hand measurements never fail); reservoirs don't have much of an effect on the system overall, since it's just a tank of water.

Quote:
Pump: Swiftech MCP655 ($79.95)
- There is a special edition version which has the option for compression fittings, but I can't justify spending an extra $15. Also, I might get an after market top in the future, so I'll save that money for now.

You could also get a pump top that allows for a reservoir (like the Koolance one I had) and put compression fittings on that.

Quote:
Tubing 1: PrimoFlex Pro 1/2 ID x 3/4 OD - Black [x4] ($9.00)
Tubing 2: PrimoFlex Pro 1/2 ID x 3/4 OD - Clear [x4] ($9.00)
- I'm only going with clear tubing if the coolant is compatible (see coolant). Otherwise, I'll get 8ft of black.

Primochill Primoflex Pro is quite nice tubing. Definitely going to be using it in future builds.

Quote:
Coolant: Distilled Water and Mayhems Aurora - Hydra Gold Concentrate ($17.95 for concentrate + $2 for water)
- Now this is where it gets tricky. This stuff looks amazing. It's the only gold coolant that doesn't look like urine (cough cough Primochill)

As discussed, the Mayhems coolant is probably not a great choice. As Rubix mentioned, none of us knows what give the coolant a pearlescent effect; in car paints it's bits of metal (which would be terrible in a WC loop). I'd personally stick to distilled with either dye or colored tubing. From a purist's point of view, distilled water will have a higher thermal conductivity than water with other additives (corrosion inhibitors, dyes, etc) and will therefore transfer heat better.

If you want to go EK nickel, you may as well go with an 'approved coolant' because pure distilled water isn't good enough for them...
May 2, 2012 5:58:41 AM

boiler1990 said:
Back; had a friend over a bit earlier, and my gf and I got a Dyson vacuum and just had to test it out (we're both engineers). Quite a well thought out vacuum.

Onto more relevant things:

Quote:
1) My budget has expanded

Hooray! :D 

Quote:
So before I say anything else, yes I have read the sticky. I've been doing research for about 2 months now. Also, like I said, my budget has expanded. I can pay probably up to $600 max, but I'd like to keep it under $500 ($450 ideally).

$400-500 is about right for a high-end custom loop. You could save a little bit buy maybe snagging some used parts (maybe rads, reservoirs, and possibly some blocks). Some of the parts in my original loop were used; all that remains of that is my CPU block and 360 rad now.

Quote:
I know this is off-topic, but do you guys have any cable management suggestions for the 5.25 bay area? It looks too messy for me. Oh and the CPU power connector will be hidden away. I just need to buy a sleeved extension cable.

I think some of the cables from the 5.25" bay could go down through that cutout rather than up top with everything else. That should clean it up a bit in there.

Quote:
CPU Block: EK Supreme HF - Gold Plated ($79.99)
- Only gold plated CPU block left that I can find...

Any reason for the gold-plated block? It seems a bit gaudy and expensive for what you get, but if it's your thing then go for it. I have an EK Supreme HF Full Copper and it works quite well, but I got that used for under $60 ;) 

Quote:
GPU Block: EK-FC570 GTX SE - Nickel Plated [Plexi] ($99.99)
- I know EK has had some problems with their nickel plating corroding. Should I avoid getting this? I don't have a GTX 570 yet, but I was planning on getting one. I wanted the 2.5GB version for 3D modeling :/ 

If you'd like to know my opinions on the EK nickel situation, read the very long last post on this thread.
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/266834-29-before-nick...

Quote:
Radiator 1: XSPC EX120 ($39.95)
Radiator 2: XSPC EX280 ($62.99)
- I was planning on getting one 360 rad, but I have 2 120 fans and 2 140 fans. I don't want the 140s to go to waste, so why not use a 140 rad? Plus I don't know if the 360 would've fit. Maybe only in the bottom...

These might be ok with the right fans (any idea of the CFMs the ones inside your case push?). A 280 rad has roughly the same area as a 360 rad (~39k mm^2 vs ~42k mm^2)

Quote:
Resevoir: Phobya Balancer 250 - Gold Plated ($39.95)
- I'm not sure if this will fit with my cable mess near the 5.25 bays. If I can clean that up, maybe it will. Otherwise, I'll probably just get the 150 version and save $5...

Get whichever you think will fit better (hand measurements never fail); reservoirs don't have much of an effect on the system overall, since it's just a tank of water.

Quote:
Pump: Swiftech MCP655 ($79.95)
- There is a special edition version which has the option for compression fittings, but I can't justify spending an extra $15. Also, I might get an after market top in the future, so I'll save that money for now.

You could also get a pump top that allows for a reservoir (like the Koolance one I had) and put compression fittings on that.

Quote:
Tubing 1: PrimoFlex Pro 1/2 ID x 3/4 OD - Black [x4] ($9.00)
Tubing 2: PrimoFlex Pro 1/2 ID x 3/4 OD - Clear [x4] ($9.00)
- I'm only going with clear tubing if the coolant is compatible (see coolant). Otherwise, I'll get 8ft of black.

Primochill Primoflex Pro is quite nice tubing. Definitely going to be using it in future builds.

Quote:
Coolant: Distilled Water and Mayhems Aurora - Hydra Gold Concentrate ($17.95 for concentrate + $2 for water)
- Now this is where it gets tricky. This stuff looks amazing. It's the only gold coolant that doesn't look like urine (cough cough Primochill)

As discussed, the Mayhems coolant is probably not a great choice. As Rubix mentioned, none of us knows what give the coolant a pearlescent effect; in car paints it's bits of metal (which would be terrible in a WC loop). I'd personally stick to distilled with either dye or colored tubing. From a purist's point of view, distilled water will have a higher thermal conductivity than water with other additives (corrosion inhibitors, dyes, etc) and will therefore transfer heat better.

If you want to go EK nickel, you may as well go with an 'approved coolant' because pure distilled water isn't good enough for them...
Sorry I had to laugh about the vacuum. I don't know why, but I thought it was funny. I guess I will contribute by saying I love my vacuum too. I just moved into a new house, and it has a vacuum built into the walls. You just hook up the hose to the wall; I think it's pretty cool :D 

Alright I'll address everything one by one:

Quote:
$400-500 is about right for a high-end custom loop. You could save a little bit buy maybe snagging some used parts (maybe rads, reservoirs, and possibly some blocks). Some of the parts in my original loop were used; all that remains of that is my CPU block and 360 rad now.
I'll look around for some used parts. I bet there are some pretty good deals out there. I'll spend some time looking around.

Quote:
I think some of the cables from the 5.25" bay could go down through that cutout rather than up top with everything else. That should clean it up a bit in there.
I agree. I'll probably fiddle around this weekend with some options. I'm going to try to keep the cables as flat as possible (hopefully you understand what I mean).

Quote:
Any reason for the gold-plated block? It seems a bit gaudy and expensive for what you get, but if it's your thing then go for it. I have an EK Supreme HF Full Copper and it works quite well, but I got that used for under $60 ;) 
Well I know some people think gold is too flashy and not worth the extra money, but I like it. I'm willing to spend the extra money because I want it to match the rest of my build (well the motherboard and custom painted case, at least).

Quote:
If you'd like to know my opinions on the EK nickel situation, read the very long last post on this thread.
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/ [...] ckel-block
Thanks for the link! I'll definitively give it a read :) 

Quote:
These might be ok with the right fans (any idea of the CFMs the ones inside your case push?). A 280 rad has roughly the same area as a 360 rad (~39k mm^2 vs ~42k mm^2)
The 140s push 62.5 CFM, and the 120s push 47.27 CFM. Would those fans be ok?

Quote:
Get whichever you think will fit better (hand measurements never fail); reservoirs don't have much of an effect on the system overall, since it's just a tank of water.
Yeah I'll probably do a test fit with maybe a toilet paper roll or something similar.

Quote:
You could also get a pump top that allows for a reservoir (like the Koolance one I had) and put compression fittings on that.
Do you mean something like this?: http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_p... Hmm maybe I'll look into this option. Thanks for the suggestion.

Quote:
Primochill Primoflex Pro is quite nice tubing. Definitely going to be using it in future builds.
Awesome! Good to know its quality stuff :) 

Quote:
As discussed, the Mayhems coolant is probably not a great choice. As Rubix mentioned, none of us knows what give the coolant a pearlescent effect; in car paints it's bits of metal (which would be terrible in a WC loop). I'd personally stick to distilled with either dye or colored tubing. From a purist's point of view, distilled water will have a higher thermal conductivity than water with other additives (corrosion inhibitors, dyes, etc) and will therefore transfer heat better.

If you want to go EK nickel, you may as well go with an 'approved coolant' because pure distilled water isn't good enough for them...
Yeah I'm dropping the coolant. I'm just going with distilled water and a killcoil.

I saw that about the EK block. That kinda makes me hesitant to buy it. Honestly, why do they have this policy? Because if it is to have people buy their coolants, it probably isn't working very well. I don't see how distilled water can possibly not be an approved coolant. Oh well no rush to buy it. Maybe the price of the 580 will drop and I can afford it...

Thanks again for spending time to help me out!

- Jake

*I might not respond tomorrow as I will be gone from 7am-9pm (school, then sports, then confirmation). Just wanted to give you a heads up :) 
a b K Overclocking
May 2, 2012 6:46:03 AM

Quote:
The 140s push 62.5 CFM, and the 120s push 47.27 CFM. Would those fans be ok?

Depending on what you ultimately put in there, those will probably work ok. Faster 120s might be beneficial.

Quote:
Do you mean something like this?: http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_p... Hmm maybe I'll look into this option. Thanks for the suggestion.

Yeah. I had this one by Koolance for my 655, though it's changed a little in its construction: http://koolance.com/index.php?route=product/product&pro...

It's supposed to mount vertically like the reservoirs you're looking at, but of course it didn't come with any instructions at all and I had no idea. Ended up getting a lot of air in my pump :/ 

Quote:
I saw that about the EK block. That kinda makes me hesitant to buy it. Honestly, why do they have this policy? Because if it is to have people buy their coolants, it probably isn't working very well. I don't see how distilled water can possibly not be an approved coolant. Oh well no rush to buy it. Maybe the price of the 580 will drop and I can afford it...

I think they can't really pinpoint the initial cause of the corrosion that was happening, so they just restricted their policies. I don't think it was a great business tactic and I'll be holding off on buying their products for a while. I've also become fond of how well my Swiftech universal GPU block is performing :) 
a c 324 K Overclocking
May 2, 2012 6:24:33 PM

Quote:
It looks like from the pictures from cooling configurator that the mounting holes for the cards are different in several places, which is probably why the reference blocks won't work. Other than that the PCBs do look identical.


Boiler- nice spot on the mounting holes. The ones around the GPU and most of the PCB look the same, but the ones around the top-right side are definitely different. It actually looks like the 1571-AR has an extra one close to the power connectors that the 1579-AR doesn't, but the remaining might be the same.

Looking at PCBs to determine their differences is like looking at Escher paintings and trying to make sure your eyes aren't playing tricks on you.
May 5, 2012 4:31:30 PM

Both of you, thanks so much for taking time to help me out. I honestly really appreciate it.

So it looks like I'd have trouble mounting the block on the 1579-AR, correct? Is it even worth the hassle?

I was also thinking about getting a GTX 480 instead. I know they are powerful, but their downside is 1) power hungry, 2) loud, 3) hot. By water cooling the card, I'd eliminate two out of three of the problems. Right now it is $210 on Newegg (and Amazon I think). Does this sound like a good move? If it is, I might even go SLI, but I'd probably have to step up my PSU...

- Jake
a b K Overclocking
May 5, 2012 5:17:26 PM

Well the 570 is basically equivalent to the 480 except in power consumption and a few other benchmarks but $210 sounds like too much to spend on a new 480, especially when you can find a used 560Ti (OCed to 570 speeds like mine) for ~$150-170. Don't really know what you're looking to spend on the GPU alone.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/309?vs=306
May 5, 2012 6:01:36 PM

boiler1990 said:
Well the 570 is basically equivalent to the 480 except in power consumption and a few other benchmarks but $210 sounds like too much to spend on a new 480, especially when you can find a used 560Ti (OCed to 570 speeds like mine) for ~$150-170. Don't really know what you're looking to spend on the GPU alone.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/309?vs=306
Thanks for the link. Regarding the GPU, I'm willing to spend up to $350ish. Don't know if I can shell out the extra $50 for a GTX 580...

What about a 560Ti 448 Core? Would that be an option compared to the other cards? I don't know if I already told you this, but the card won't be used mainly for gaming. Yes, I will do a lot of gaming on it, but it's main purpose will be for video editing and 3D modeling/animation. I use Cinema 4D and Adobe products (mostly After Effects and Photoshop). I'm not really considering a workstation card as they aren't good for gaming, which I still will be doing. Plus I can't really afford the decent ones :( 

- Jake
a b K Overclocking
May 5, 2012 7:59:31 PM

Unless you're a hardcore professional you don't need a Quadro/FirePro card.

The 448 Core is actually a pretty decent card - it easily takes down a 570 when OCed, and you get the benefit of more CUDA cores for work.
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/499?vs=306

Also, the rest of the Kepler cards should hopefully be coming out soon. Wish they had a slated release date since most of the market is waiting for the 670/660 GPUs (which should be right in your price range).
May 5, 2012 8:45:39 PM

boiler1990 said:
Unless you're a hardcore professional you don't need a Quadro/FirePro card.

The 448 Core is actually a pretty decent card - it easily takes down a 570 when OCed, and you get the benefit of more CUDA cores for work.
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/499?vs=306

Also, the rest of the Kepler cards should hopefully be coming out soon. Wish they had a slated release date since most of the market is waiting for the 670/660 GPUs (which should be right in your price range).
Yeah I don't really see the need for getting a Quadro/FirePro card as the work I do is more of a hobby rather than a job.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the GTX 570 have 480 cores? So wouldn't it have more than the GTX 560Ti - 448? Or were you just saying, in general, more cores would be better...

Yeah I've been waiting for the GTX 660/670 forever! I've seen some leaked benchmarks (who knows how accurate they are), and it looks very promising so far. I heard from somewhere, that May 10th is when they would officialy launch the card (TweakTown maybe?).

- Jake
a b K Overclocking
May 5, 2012 9:08:57 PM

Quote:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the GTX 570 have 480 cores? So wouldn't it have more than the GTX 560Ti - 448? Or were you just saying, in general, more cores would be better...

The 570 has more cores, but a 560Ti 448 and 570 perform nearly exactly the same stock as shown in that link. The 560Tis OC better though, so you're basically getting a card better than the 570 (unless your work benefits from the # of cores in the GPU). My MSI 560Ti Hawk is just a few % below the 570 speeds, and I think I could push it a little bit more.

Quote:
Yeah I've been waiting for the GTX 660/670 forever! I've seen some leaked benchmarks (who knows how accurate they are), and it looks very promising so far. I heard from somewhere, that May 10th is when they would officialy launch the card (TweakTown maybe?).

May 10th would be awesome. I'm hoping to take a little bit of a step up this summer, and I'd be looking at either a second 560Ti or one of the newer cards.
May 5, 2012 11:59:43 PM

boiler1990 said:
Quote:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the GTX 570 have 480 cores? So wouldn't it have more than the GTX 560Ti - 448? Or were you just saying, in general, more cores would be better...

The 570 has more cores, but a 560Ti 448 and 570 perform nearly exactly the same stock as shown in that link. The 560Tis OC better though, so you're basically getting a card better than the 570 (unless your work benefits from the # of cores in the GPU). My MSI 560Ti Hawk is just a few % below the 570 speeds, and I think I could push it a little bit more.

Quote:
Yeah I've been waiting for the GTX 660/670 forever! I've seen some leaked benchmarks (who knows how accurate they are), and it looks very promising so far. I heard from somewhere, that May 10th is when they would officialy launch the card (TweakTown maybe?).

May 10th would be awesome. I'm hoping to take a little bit of a step up this summer, and I'd be looking at either a second 560Ti or one of the newer cards.
I really hope the launch is on May 10th. It'd be even better if the 670 was around $350, but I have a feeling it will be around the $400 range...Hopefully I'm wrong (and it's cheaper)!

- Jake
a b K Overclocking
May 6, 2012 1:56:27 AM

That's pretty nifty. I love EVGA GPUs - their service is great, and the GPUs perform very reliably. Their warranty terms just changed so now it's tied to the GPU, not the owner (great for upgraders like me :D )
May 6, 2012 3:48:32 AM

boiler1990 said:
That's pretty nifty. I love EVGA GPUs - their service is great, and the GPUs perform very reliably. Their warranty terms just changed so now it's tied to the GPU, not the owner (great for upgraders like me :D )
Hey I was on Ebay just browsing, and I came across some pretty good deals. I need your opinion though.

EVGA SuperClocked GTX 580 Hydro Copper 2 ($389.99) [USED]: http://www.ebay.com/itm/EVGA-SuperClocked-GTX-580-Hydro...

EVGA GTX 580 1.5GB ($329.99) [NEW]: http://www.ebay.com/itm/EVGA-GeForce-GTX-580-PCI-e-DP-1...

Do these seem like good deals to you? I really like the Hydro Copper one because it's the same price as the 560Ti 448 + water block.

- Jake
a b K Overclocking
May 6, 2012 4:52:53 AM

The Hydrocoppers are pretty good, since the blocks are made by Swiftech. I hope the seller plans to use anti-static bubble wrap:
"It will be on bubble rap and pop corns to protect graphic card nice and neat!"

It's really up to you. You should be covered by eBay's Protection for 45 days after the purchase should anything happen.
May 6, 2012 5:35:07 AM

boiler1990 said:
The Hydrocoppers are pretty good, since the blocks are made by Swiftech. I hope the seller plans to use anti-static bubble wrap:
"It will be on bubble rap and pop corns to protect graphic card nice and neat!"

It's really up to you. You should be covered by eBay's Protection for 45 days after the purchase should anything happen.
I think I might go for it. The seller has gotten nothing but positive feedback. And I'll probably send him an email about the packaging. Thanks for the heads up about that. Lastly, my PSU should be able to handle the 2600k OCed and the GTX 580, right?

- Jake
a c 205 K Overclocking
May 6, 2012 2:36:03 PM

yougotjaked said:
Hey I was on Ebay just browsing, and I came across some pretty good deals. I need your opinion though.

EVGA SuperClocked GTX 580 Hydro Copper 2 ($389.99) [USED]: http://www.ebay.com/itm/EVGA-SuperClocked-GTX-580-Hydro...

EVGA GTX 580 1.5GB ($329.99) [NEW]: http://www.ebay.com/itm/EVGA-GeForce-GTX-580-PCI-e-DP-1...

Do these seem like good deals to you? I really like the Hydro Copper one because it's the same price as the 560Ti 448 + water block.

- Jake


I wouldn't buy used graphics cards off ebay, you have no idea whether they've been overclocked to the point they're crippled.

I would seriously re-think jumping in that pond they may seem fine at stock clocks but time you overclock any at all, fail.

It would be much better to say "yougotjaked" than "youjakedyourself".
May 6, 2012 4:29:26 PM

4Ryan6 said:
I wouldn't buy used graphics cards off ebay, you have no idea whether they've been overclocked to the point they're crippled.

I would seriously re-think jumping in that pond they may seem fine at stock clocks but time you overclock any at all, fail.

It would be much better to say "yougotjaked" than "youjakedyourself".
What if I bought a new one, like this? http://www.ebay.com/itm/EVGA-Corporation-NVIDIA-GeForce...

- Jake
May 6, 2012 4:31:55 PM

boiler1990 said:
I plugged your stuff into this calculator and it say you'll need about 550W (with a decent OC), so you should be fine with the TX650.
http://extreme.outervision.com/PSUEngine
Thanks! I got around 550w (553w) too, so I'm a bit relieved :) 

- Jake
a c 205 K Overclocking
May 6, 2012 5:50:23 PM

yougotjaked said:
What if I bought a new one, like this? http://www.ebay.com/itm/EVGA-Corporation-NVIDIA-GeForce...


Well if it's guaranteed brand new boxed never opened package that's different, yes you can trust that, I'm referencing used possibly overclock damaged, that I wouldn't touch.
May 6, 2012 7:11:24 PM

4Ryan6 said:
Well if it's guaranteed brand new boxed never opened package that's different, yes you can trust that, I'm referencing used possibly overclock damaged, that I wouldn't touch.
Ok thanks for the heads up. I'll be sure to be aware of that.

- Jake
a b K Overclocking
May 6, 2012 10:17:29 PM

Also, GPUs that warranty by serial # (Asus, MSI, and newer EVGA cards) are easier to buy used. I do most of my PC hardware trading on Anandtech and [H]ardForum, where there are many more people who respect their stuff ;) 
May 6, 2012 10:25:43 PM

boiler1990 said:
Also, GPUs that warranty by serial # (Asus, MSI, and newer EVGA cards) are easier to buy used. I do most of my PC hardware trading on Anandtech and [H]ardForum, where there are many more people who respect their stuff ;) 
Yeah I've been looking around on overclock.net too; I just can't find any good deals (or at least one that hasn't already expired).

- Jake
a c 324 K Overclocking
May 7, 2012 5:07:09 PM

Agree with boiler- if you can buy used from a manufacturer that allows warranty to follow the hardware and not the user, you essentially have a good guarantee to get a replacement card if the current one is bad. I have sold a few of my old EVGA cards on Ebay and helped one guy get a refurb replacement for one that died. He shipped back to me, I called EVGA, swapped it and shipped back to him. He paid all shipping costs, but it was what he wanted to do. I'm personally glad EVGA went to the current warranty model, though.

Used gear is used gear though...you never really know what kind of life it lived prior to your purchase. I would try to develop a rapport with someone to help gauge how honest you feel they are being with you. Regardless, it ultimately comes down to you, as the buyer to take the leap of faith based on what someone is telling you is a great deal.

Ford still sold a lot of Pintos after everyone confirmed they exploded. Just FYI.
May 8, 2012 5:08:34 AM

Darn all of the cards are already sold :( 

So you think I should still look for a 580 or go back to the 560 Ti 448?

- Jake
a c 205 K Overclocking
May 8, 2012 10:15:28 AM

yougotjaked said:
Darn all of the cards are already sold :( 

So you think I should still look for a 580 or go back to the 560 Ti 448?

- Jake


Jake, Unless you have to do it right now wait for the 680GTXs to be readily available and the 580GTX prices will drop significantly, the only reason they haven't dropped more is because the 680s are stumbling out of the gate.

A good 580GTX water block will run you around 100 bucks and I recommend the Heatkiller, but if you buy a reference EVGA 580GTX you have to wait to be sure if it's with the IHS or without the IHS, That's very important!

Scroll down in this thread until you get to the 580GTX water block installation, to see what I'm talking about.
May 9, 2012 4:12:53 AM

4Ryan6 said:
Jake, Unless you have to do it right now wait for the 680GTXs to be readily available and the 580GTX prices will drop significantly, the only reason they haven't dropped more is because the 680s are stumbling out of the gate.

A good 580GTX water block will run you around 100 bucks and I recommend the Heatkiller, but if you buy a reference EVGA 580GTX you have to wait to be sure if it's with the IHS or without the IHS, That's very important!

Scroll down in this thread until you get to the 580GTX water block installation, to see what I'm talking about.
That makes since regarding the lack of price drops of the 580. I don't have to buy right now, as I have (some) patience. I'm also keeping an eye on the 670. Someone received one early, and it was beating the 680 when overclocked. My only concern is that the 600 series cards aren't the best at computing.

Thanks for the recommendation for the water block. Is this the block you used in your thread?: http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_p... Also, thanks for the heads up about the IHS. That could've possibly caused me a lot of headaches!

I scrolled through parts of your post. I liked how you used an old case as a radbox. Very clever! I also took a look at the water block installation.

- Jake
a c 205 K Overclocking
May 9, 2012 9:15:51 AM

^ Yes that heatkiller is the water block, but if I remember correctly only frozencpu had the NoIHS, but PPCs may have it by now.
a c 205 K Overclocking
May 10, 2012 9:23:57 AM

^ Affirmative! Thanks rubix_1011
May 11, 2012 1:25:16 AM

Noooooo!!!! The EK Supreme HF Gold edition is no longer being sold anywhere! Same with the gold Apogee HD (but that was a while ago). I really wanted a gold CPU block :( 

- Jake
May 13, 2012 5:38:32 AM

Would it be possible to take any block and get it gold plated somewhere? There's a shop nearby where I live that does all sorts of plating work. Should I just send them an email? I think Linus from NCIX did something similar: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mLj-xgvqdE

If it does work, should I still get a Supreme HF or should I get another block?

- Jake
May 14, 2012 2:41:15 AM

Hey I think I'm going to get better fans.

For the 120s (x2), I think I'll get the *gasp* Gentle Typhoons: http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_p.... I did some research and the NZXT fans have horrible static air pressure. If those are too spendy, then I might get the Swiftech Helix or the Akasa Viper

I'm not sure about the 140 rad. I couldn't really find any good radiator fans. This was the best I could find: http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_p.... Should I go this route, or should I do a 240 rad instead with more GTs?

Oh and I'm thinking about getting a MCP35x instead of the 655. Should I switch or keep the 655? They are priced the same, by the way.

- Jake
a b K Overclocking
May 14, 2012 4:33:54 AM

unless space is the issue, i would stay with the 655.
May 14, 2012 4:36:14 AM

toolmaker_03 said:
unless space is the issue, i would stay with the 655.
Do you think the 655 would be ok for in the future (restriction wise)? I might have up to 3 radiators, 2 GPU blocks, a CPU block, and maybe a RAM block. But for now I'll just have 1 CPU, 1 GPU, and 2 radiators.

- Jake
!