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Looking for advice on this new pc build

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December 4, 2009 1:45:56 PM

APPROXIMATE PURCHASE DATE: this month before christmas
BUDGET RANGE: 1200 dollars (but I am in the Czech Republic so the costs of components are a little different

SYSTEM USAGE FROM MOST TO LEAST IMPORTANT: gaming

PARTS NOT REQUIRED: keyboard, mouse, monitor, speakers,

PREFERRED WEBSITE(S) FOR PARTS: alza.cz
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Czech Republic

PARTS PREFERENCES: I would like to use an i7 920, mobo asus x58 rampage

OVERCLOCKING: Maybe
SLI OR CROSSFIRE: Yes in 18 months if I upgrade the monitor and need to boost the Graphics

MONITOR RESOLUTION: 1280x1024

ADDITIONAL COMMENTS: I would like a quiet PC
I have windows xp. will upgrade to win 7 sometime next year

I'd like a pc with a powerful base to play the latest games and with an upgrade path. For the resolution I play at right now, I know a less powerful processor would be as effective as the i7 920 I am picking. I want to be able to upgrade my monitor and crossfire higher spec graphic cards as an option in the future, knowing that the processor and mobo I'm buying now will be up to it.

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Processor: i7 920
Socket 1366
http://www.czechcomputer.cz/product.jsp?artno=60314

Motherboard
ASUS X 58 for 1366
rampage or p6t
http://www.alza.cz/asus-rampage-ii-gene-d112825.htm
or
http://www.alza.cz/asus-p6t-se-d113000.htm

RAM
I'd like RAM 4GB now and upgrade to 8 GB or even 12 GB in the future when the price falls.
I know it should be DDR 3 but I'm confused about the frequency..
1333Mhz or 1600Mhz?

cooler
I thought a passive because I'd like quiet:
Thermalright Ultra-120 eXtreme 1366
http://www.alza.cz/chladic-na-procesor-pasivni-chladic-...
But I don't know how effective it is?
Would an active fan be better? Which one?

Graphic card:
asus 4890 or asus hd 4870
http://www.alza.cz/asus-eah4890-htdi-1gd5-d115179.htm

case
tower: cooler master elite 330
http://www.alza.cz/asus-eah4890-htdi-1gd5-d115179.htm

hard drive
Not sure.
seagate barracuda 1TB 7200 revs
http://www.alza.cz/pevny-disk-seagate-barracuda-7200-12...

OR should I try a RAID setup?(bear in mind, I've not setup a RAID system before, but I have a friend, a techie who I hope should be able to advise me)
western digital Velociraptor 150 GB 10,000 revs
plus
seagate barracuda ES.2 500 GB 7,200
http://www.alza.cz/seagate-barracuda-es-2-d78195.htm

Power:
I definitely need advice here.
600 W or 400 W?
According to this review, with a HD 4890 and an i7 920 the max wattage I'll see is about 325 W
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/build-balanced-platform,r...
So I need a 400 W power supply?
Eurocase 400 w
http://www.alza.cz/zdroj-eurocase-400w-i-d47796.htm
or
Eurocase 450 W
http://www.alza.cz/zdroj-eurocase-450w-i-d47899.htm
or Eurocase 550W
http://www.alza.cz/zdroj-eurocase-550w-i-d57485.htm
please advise.

MAny thanks for any advice or tips you can give me. is there anything I've forgotten?

More about : advice build

December 4, 2009 2:01:09 PM

It's really hard to get an i7 on that budget. Might I suggest an i5? Also, Intel isn't the best choice for an upgrade path. There isn't a whole lot out there about how what they're going to do in the future. AMD has stated that they will be keeping their AM3 socket current for the next few years.

As far as what you've got picked out, there are major problems.

RAM: You need triple channel RAM (3 sticks). That means 6 GB at the least. Go with DDR3 1333 mhz, CAS Latency 7. This will be as fast as 1600 mhz sticks.

Cooling: Passive will be a lot quieter, but will run hotter. I would not recommend trying to overclocki with a passive cooler. In order to recommend going passive, you will need to get a very good case, such as the HAF 922.

GPU: If you're trying to stay current, you should look at the newer ATI DirectX11 cards (the 5xxx series). These offer about the same performance as the older cards, but have more features and run cooler/quieter. They are only slightly more expensive.

HDD: I recommend the Samsung Spinpoint F3. It will be faster, and probably the same price or cheaper. Do not get a Velociraptor. The F3's are almost as fast and substantially cheaper.

PSU: You'll need a lot more than 400W, especially if future-proofing. If you ever add a second GPU, you will need to buy a new PSU. I'd recommend buying a 650W Corsair if your not going to Crossfire (or even a 550W). If you are going to Crossfire, get a 750W. Definitely stick to the major brands (Corsair and OCZ are the most popular).
December 4, 2009 2:08:01 PM

You'll want DDR3 Triple channel memory for a core i7 920 build, so thats 3gb, 6gb or 12gb (not 4gb, 8gb or 12gb).
Passive cooling for a core i7 is a no go, those CPU's run really hot and a passive cooler will not do. That cooler you've choosen is good with a decent 120mm fan.

That PSU is crap for your needs. If you plan on going crossfire and overclocking then I'd say a Corsair 750x HX PSU is needed (depending on the cards you intend to use in crossfire).

I would advice you spend alittle more on a case with good air flow, maybe a Antec 900.

If your gaming at 1280x1024 then a HD5770 will do, and you could add a second for when you upgrade your monitor. I wouldn't bother with a ATi 4xxx series card anymore, DX11 games are just around the corner.
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December 4, 2009 2:41:23 PM

Thanks for the quick replies.

MAdAdmiral suggested an i5 and I considered that...but I was reading that the 1366 socket is better for crossfiring....and I was thinking about crossfiring the future...still it is a cheaper option...and the loss of performance at crossfire isn't too massive

regards the PSU I was thinking I'd get the lowest possible now and upgrade it when and if I crossfire...would that be 550W or 650 W for the system I outlined?

Will look into different cases

will also look into a better fan

As for the graphics card, I've been thinking this over for sometime. I was looking at this review:
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/build-balanced-platform,r...
where the 4890 pulls out a decent performance on Crisis at low res high detail, and the 260 GTX was below a decent fps...and I imagine the 5750 would be well below those marks.
I know 5870 is just around the corner...but I won't need that until and if I upgrade the monitor. I'm looking for a card that'll hold itself afloat singlehandedly for the next 18months at 1240 res and I'm not sure the 5750 would do that....not according to the reviews I've been reading
December 4, 2009 2:51:01 PM

The HD5770 is on par with a HD4870 and a GTX260, its certainly enough for 1280x1024.
BTW the 5870 has been out for some time now.

Another option would be to just go with one HD5850, its overkill for a 1280x1024 monitor, but you wouldn't have to upgrade your graphics card when you get a better monitor.

You'd save money in the long run if you just brought a 750W quality powersupply now, instead of buying a 500W PSU now and then needing to upgrade to a better one once you decide to go crossfire.

To answer your question a 550W quality (well known brand like OCZ, Corsair, Antec ETC...) will be enough for a single card upto a 5850
December 4, 2009 5:03:13 PM

thanks again omg.

will think it all over. About the 5870....I'm in the Czech Republic...and it doesn't look like any of the range of cards will be arriving here in any quantity before sometime early next year. :fou:  I'm kind of itching to get my upgrade underway before then, hence looking at the cheaper cards.
December 4, 2009 6:13:48 PM

Yeah the 58xx series cards are hard to come by, maybe just get a temporary card for now and then wait until march next year and you should have a good range of cards to choose from E.g. ATi 58xx and 59xx series, and also nVidia's G300 series.

I know the feeling its so fustrating, I want to do a complete rebuild, but i know i want a 5850 in my next build and there just isn't enough to go around at the moment.

Good luck with your build dave, hope it works out for you
December 4, 2009 6:28:38 PM

So how about this:

i7 920
asus p6t se
corsair tx750
antec 900
OCZ 1600 mhz 6GB DDR3 PC12800 gold
SAmsung Spinpoint F3 500GB
ASUS EAH 5770 (probably)
my only problem is the cooler, I've no idea what's strong enough?:
ASUS triton 88
http://www.alza.cz/chaldic-asus-triton-88-d107959.htm

It's under 1500 dollars close to 1300 dollars and will do what i need it to do for now.
When I've got more money I'll get a better graphic card
December 4, 2009 6:53:12 PM

Yeah looks sound.

Not sure about the triton, have you looked at any reviews?

I know the Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme is good for an i7 (i have one) and also the Prolimatech Megahalems is meant to be the best for an i7.

Have a look at some reviews, it'll make the choice easier.
December 5, 2009 7:03:56 AM

OK. Now you confused me. The Thermalright ultra Extreme was the cooler I'd chosen in the original build but I understood your reply to that post to say I'd need some fan cooler. Or did you mean I'd need a case with fans to be able to use that cooler?

The Prolimatech isn't available in this part of the world.

I have a final question about noise. That Antec 900 case, it's got a bunch of big fans built in. Do they make a lot of noise?

Was my original wish of a quiet pc a bit of a waste of time with an i 7?
December 5, 2009 7:14:26 AM

No you can have active cooling (fans) and it can still be silent, you just have to choose the right fans.

The Thermalright ultra 120 extreme can support up to 2 fans, Its a good cooler, but you have to buy a 120mm fan for it, Don't use it as a passive cooler!

If believe the fans on the antec 900 are pretty loud (well what I would consider loud)

On low fan speed setting they produce 25DB
On medium fan speed they produce 28DB
And on High fan speed they produce 30DB

http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/120mm-Enermax-UCMA12-Mag...(MBT)-Batwing-Blades-15k-RPM-inc-Rubber-A-V-Plugs

^ that fan is very quiet, and pushes alot of air, so you could buy the Antec 900 find out if the stock fans that came with the case are too loud, if they are then replace them. If not then happy days.
December 5, 2009 7:38:27 AM

OK. Thanks, I'll look into it....changing over all those fans almost seems more trouble than it's worth....

To be honest the price of this monster is creeping up and up and out of the ball park I'd marked.

I've been taking a look at the performance reviews of the phenom x4 955 and I'm thinking I might have to take a step down to it. Or possibly to the i5.

The phenom is half the price of the i7 920, and though the performance is behind, it isn't so far behind that it makes me worried.

The i5 is 100 dollars cheaper than the i7 920, over here. So I'm chewing on that as a possibility too (though I know about the weakness of it's crossfiring)
December 5, 2009 8:13:35 AM

Well it would make sense i guess, considering its a gaming machine.

A phenom x4 955 would be a wise choice if you intend to go crossfire. Be sure to get an AM3 motherboard, It'll make future upgrades easier on your wallet

Your graphics card will make alot of noise, so unless your going to get an aftermarket cooler for that then i wouldnt worry about your case being noisy.

I tryed to have my PC quiet by buying fans that are <20DB, but then i brought a HD4890 and it all went to shhhit
December 5, 2009 8:48:06 AM

Quote:
Your graphics card will make alot of noise, so unless your going to get an aftermarket cooler for that then i wouldnt worry about your case being noisy.


I'm not worried...it's my wife who'll kill me :whistle: 

hmmm

I just did a rough pricing.... and a phenom x4 955 rig will come in at 1000 dollars. About 400 dollars cheaper than the i7 920.

That would even allow me to by another 5770 just for laughs to crossfire and it'd still be 200 dollars cheaper. (I won't be doing that).

I'm going to chew it over but I think the phenom is the way I'll go. I'm not going to be playing at a higher resolution than 1240 x10xx for the foreseeable future. The AM3 socket is allegedly going to remain valid for a while longer. The whole rig is 400 dollars cheaper! I can crossfire it when the graphics card starts falling off in performance with another 5770. Or just splash out on whatever top card is about at the time....
December 5, 2009 9:12:24 AM

you could spend that 400 dolars on watercooling that 5770, that would be quiet.

sounds like the phenom is the way to go. let me know how it all turns out =]
December 5, 2009 1:58:55 PM

I think you are getting a bit confused here.

If your objective is gaming then the graphics configuration is the first issue.

At 1280 x 1024, then your graphics power requirement is modest. As little as a 4650 ddr3 will give you great performance in most games. Read this article:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-graphics-card,...

Let me assume that you might want to upgrade to a 24" monitor and game at 1920 x 1024. Then you are looking at a card like the 5770 for good performance. For exceptional performance no more than a 5850 would be required.

Only if you are thinking of a 30" monitor at 2560 x 1600 whould you be thinking of crossfire or a stronger card.

I would look for one of the cards based on 40nm manufacturing. They will run cooler and reduce your noise and cooling requirements.

Avoid crossfire/sli if you can. Your PSU costs will be lower, and your cooling requirements will be lower. Realize that crossfire scaling depends on the game and drivers. It will not double. If, in the future, you want to get better graphics, just sell your old card, and replace it with the next best single card of your choice.

With a single graphics card, all you need is a quality 500W PSU with two 6-pin pci-e power connectors. Quality units come from Corsair, Seasonic, PC P&C, and Antec to name a few. Pick a tier 2 or better unit from this list:
http://www.eggxpert.com/forums/thread/323050.aspx
Do NOT skimp on the psu quality.

The i7-920 is a fine cpu, and will drive any of those cards well. But, the i5-750 will perform the same, and costs $100 less. The P55 motherboards cost a bit less also. For gaming, 4gb of ram is sufficient. Crossfire on a p55 motherboard is not an issue for any sane configuration. You get two pci-e slots at 8x/8x. Since only the most extreme parts(GTX295/5970) can use more than 8x, it will not be an issue.

For quiet computing, do some research at www.silentpcreview .

In my experience, the prime cause of noise is how fast all of your fans are spinning. If your fans are turning at 1000 rpm or less, then your system will be relatively quiet. That means that you want large fans, 120 mm at least. If a case has at least two such fans for input, and two for output, then your system will be relatively quiet. I would suggest the Antec 300 as an inexpensive good case:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Do not try to run a good cpu without an active cooler. With a slow turning(<1000 rpm) fan, you will get good cooling, and you will not hear the fan buried within the case. Pick any of the top ten coolers from any review.

---good luck---

December 5, 2009 4:19:52 PM

why would you advice a 4650, even at 1280 x1024 it will strungle, and wont stand a chance with new games + theirs no DX11 support.

He's on a tight budget so a 5770 makes sense, A 5850 would be nice, but he cant afford it in his budget + he doesnt have a monitor that will tax it yet.

Did you not read his posts, hes going for a phenom x4 955 setup, no need for i7 or i5
December 5, 2009 5:57:34 PM

Rustyy117 said:
why would you advice a 4650, even at 1280 x1024 it will strungle, and wont stand a chance with new games + theirs no DX11 support.

He's on a tight budget so a 5770 makes sense, A 5850 would be nice, but he cant afford it in his budget + he doesnt have a monitor that will tax it yet.

Did you not read his posts, hes going for a phenom x4 955 setup, no need for i7 or i5


Tom's hardware says a 4650 will give great performance at 1280 x 1024 in most games:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-graphics-card,...

For a gaming PC 4650 is the minimum, and the stronger, the better, particularly if there is ever a larger monitor as a possibility.

By the time DX11 becomes a requirement for games, today's cards will be obsolete. Game producers will not sell many games that require DX11 today. I see that as a non-issue today.

X4-955 is OK, and just a bit less capable than i5-750. Either would be appropriate. Since the prices are about the same, the OP can pick, his favored cpu vendor. The choice will come down to which motherboard is favored.
December 5, 2009 9:15:19 PM

No they wont lol, DX11 games are already coming out.

I think we should agree to disagree, i just think the HD5770 would be the best option.
!