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Need a good stable PSU, not too expensive.

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December 7, 2009 6:00:19 AM

I'm making a new computer and i need to know what would be a good PSU, not too expensive around 200$ if possible, cheaper is acceptable. My current setup is as follows.

XFX 790i Ultra SLI ATX Intel Motherboard - Motherboard

Samsung P2370HD - Monitor

Mushkin Enhanced Blackline 996657 - RAM


Western Digital VelociRaptor WD3000HLFS - HDD


Antec 1200 Black Steel - case


Sony Optiarc DVD Burner or LG Black BlueRay Burner - Disk Drive


Intel PWLA8391GT - Ethernet card


Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64 Bit OEM - OS


Core 2 Extreme QX9770 - CPU


EVGA 017-P3-1175-AR NVIDIA GeForce GTX 275 - Graphics



Also, I'm kind of new to this, will my current setup work for 64 bit operation?

I forgot to specify, I am trying to look ahead, i would like to SLI this Graphics card eventually, and add more RAM to it.
December 7, 2009 6:33:32 AM

requiemsallure said:
I'm making a new computer and i need to know what would be a good PSU, not too expensive around 200$ if possible, cheaper is acceptable. My current setup is as follows.

XFX 790i Ultra SLI ATX Intel Motherboard - Motherboard

Samsung P2370HD - Monitor

Mushkin Enhanced Blackline 996657 - RAM


Western Digital VelociRaptor WD3000HLFS - HDD


Antec 1200 Black Steel - case


Sony Optiarc DVD Burner or LG Black BlueRay Burner - Disk Drive


Intel PWLA8391GT - Ethernet card


Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64 Bit OEM - OS


Core 2 Extreme QX9770 - CPU


EVGA 017-P3-1175-AR NVIDIA GeForce GTX 275 - Graphics



Also, I'm kind of new to this, will my current setup work for 64 bit operation?



Have you already bought these parts?? If you have not paid for this yet then DO NOT DO IT. You can do so much better for likely ALOT less money. The Extreme edition processors are a waste of money and that one is already obsolete. Build a i7 system and not a Core based system. It will be alot more powerful.
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December 7, 2009 6:42:13 AM

batuchka said:
Hmm unless you already bought/have these hardware i would go DDR3 platforms for a new build i.e AM3/i5/i7 A PSU like the Corsair 650TX would serve u well
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


I haven't bought anything yet, however the icore family is too expensive for me, the processors that i would want cost, and i don't particularly like AMD. I could probably overclock a low end i7 to be better than my current setup but i dont understand their FSB specifications, for instance instead of having a format like the core 2 series i.e. 1600mhz FSB they use something like 6.4 GT/s I dont really understand what this means.

also i was looking more towards future applications for the PSU, i want to SLI my cards eventually
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December 7, 2009 6:46:19 AM

anort3 said:
Have you already bought these parts?? If you have not paid for this yet then DO NOT DO IT. You can do so much better for likely ALOT less money. The Extreme edition processors are a waste of money and that one is already obsolete. Build a i7 system and not a Core based system. It will be alot more powerful.



If i were to do this, i would get an x58 motherboard, but i still dont understand the I/O bus or what i would assume to be the FSB format to its speed in relation to the normal FSB format i.e normal: 1600Mhz I/O bus: 6.4 GT/s

could you clarify the difference to me?
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December 7, 2009 7:22:42 AM

Ok, so I found the answer to my question about FSB and i understand its nonexistent to a point in respect to the memory. Thanks i think I'll change my setup a bit and farther inquire about it later.
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December 7, 2009 4:26:19 PM

re: The original question about a quality psu able to run sli/GTX275:

I would look first at the Corsair or PC P&C 750w units. They are top tier quality and will cost closer to $100 than $200.

64 bit operation is no problem with anything being discussed


Every current motherboard will have a gigabit ethernet port, many have two. A separate card is not necessary.

I think you are better served by a i5-750/P55 or i7-920/X58 cpu/motherboard combo. They are faster and cooler than the QX9770.

If you are looking at 6gb, then I would favor the X58 motherboard which will have 6 slots for ram. Do not worry about FSB or ram speeds. Either of the nehalem based cpu's have a very good integrated memory controller which is able to feed the cpu with data from any speed ram. The difference in real application performance or FPS(vs. synthetic benchmarks) is minimal between the slowest and fastest ram. Think 2-3%.

For a high end system, consider a SSD for the OS and a larger separate storage drive for everything else.
A good Kingston 40gb SSD will be as little as $140. Do some research here, the markeplace is changing weekly.

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December 8, 2009 5:19:07 PM

would it be cheaper to run a 40 GB ssd and get another hdd for data? would it be able to fit some games on it as well, after the os is on it?
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December 8, 2009 5:27:36 PM

ASUS P6T7 WS Supercomputer - Motherboard


Samsung P2370HD - Monitor


OCZ Platinum OCZ3P1600LV6GK- RAM


Western Digital VelociRaptor WD3000HLFS - HDD????? (Considering a SSD trying to find the right one though)


Antec 1200 Black Steel - case


Sony Optiarc DVD Burner Or LG Black BlueRay Burner - HDDVD


Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64 Bit OEM - OS


Core i7 920 - CPU


EVGA 017-P3-1175-AR NVIDIA GeForce GTX 275 - Graphics


PSU



Ok, I have the new setup for my future rig, I don't trust the PSU calculators and I am eventually going to add more RAM and SLI my Graphics card. based on this what should I get for a PSU?

If anyone has any recommendations for a SSD that would be great also.
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December 8, 2009 5:43:56 PM

I agree with the 750W suggestion. SLI/Crossfire typically will require 600W. Definitely go with a major brand (Corsair, OCZ, Antec). I personally recommend sticking with Corsair, as they are the highest quality IMO. Also, they're not too expensive.

I would trade the GTX 275 for an HD 5850 for $50 less (or an 5870 for $50 more). These are the best cards out there. ATI is absolutely killing nVidia right now.

RAM: I'm assuming the listed ones are these. Feel free to correct me, but I couldn't find those listed. If so, go with some good DDR3 1333 CL 7 for $25 less. The performance difference won't be noticeable.

Case: Did you look at the HAF 932? It's a little cheaper, has bigger fans (i.e. quieter) and is a little larger. I don't think it's as versatile, as the Antec's external bays can be internal or external.
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December 9, 2009 5:39:27 PM

MadAdmiral said:
I agree with the 750W suggestion. SLI/Crossfire typically will require 600W. Definitely go with a major brand (Corsair, OCZ, Antec). I personally recommend sticking with Corsair, as they are the highest quality IMO. Also, they're not too expensive.

I would trade the GTX 275 for an HD 5850 for $50 less (or an 5870 for $50 more). These are the best cards out there. ATI is absolutely killing nVidia right now.

RAM: I'm assuming the listed ones are these. Feel free to correct me, but I couldn't find those listed. If so, go with some good DDR3 1333 CL 7 for $25 less. The performance difference won't be noticeable.

Case: Did you look at the HAF 932? It's a little cheaper, has bigger fans (i.e. quieter) and is a little larger. I don't think it's as versatile, as the Antec's external bays can be internal or external.



As far as the RAM goes, the ones I had listed can be found here

I'm confused I looked at the specs of the two GPU's and the 275 has a slower core clock but it has a much higher memory clock, why is the 5850 better? isn't the memory clock at 1000ish too low in view of 2200ish? I did however notice that the 5850 has an insane amount of additional stream processors
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December 9, 2009 5:55:40 PM

Those sticks are good, but deactivate on Newegg. Those are the specs you want though.

I'm not an expert on the technical differences; all I really care about is the results. I do know that all the benchmarks point to the 5850 being better. Check them out in the reviews and articles...
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December 9, 2009 6:06:34 PM

You can't compare Nvidia and ATI GPU's on specs alone. They're build so differently that the specs can't be compared. The 5850 is a much faster GPU. Just check the gaming benchmarks on any reputable site if you don't want to take our work for it.

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3650
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December 9, 2009 7:54:16 PM

If you plan to get one card now and one later you definitely want to pick a newer model card. ATI's lineup just refreshed with the 5xxx series-so you know they will be available for a while. (Nvidia's lineup will refresh early/mid next year and GTX 275s may become scarce by that time)

I think a Corsair psu would be a good option too. 750-850w-depending on how much you intend to overclock all this stuff.

lol--when you put your specs in the corsair psu calculator it says " Wow, are you sure you aren't running a small city? Your system is going to need quite a bit of power - more than almost any other system out there."
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December 12, 2009 7:52:34 PM

ASUS P6T7 WS Supercomputer "Ultimate Gamer" - Motherboard

Samsung P2370HD - Monitor

OCZ Platinum OCZ3P1600LV6GK- RAM

Antec 1200 Black Steel - case

Sony Optiarc DVD Burner Or LG Black BlueRay Burner - HDDVD

Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64 Bit OEM - OS

Core i7 920 - CPU

Radeon HD 5850 - Graphics

Corsair HX1000W - PSU

Thanks to everyone who helped me with deciding... well multiple things. here is my computer. I was also able to find most of these parts at Micro Center (Great store btw) those i cannot I'll buy from new egg. the only thing im missing is my SSD but i know what i want for that. thanks
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December 12, 2009 8:15:44 PM

Wow you guys all fail for letting him buy that MOBO, pay full price for Win 7 instead of $30 and letting him get a 1kw PSU...


FYI Requiem a Corsair 750 can easily run Xfire 5870's, and probably even Xfire 5970's...


totally should have gone with an Asus P7P55D-E, or Gigabyte P55 UD4P w/ usb 3.0/ SATA 6.0 and an i7-860 for the money...
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December 12, 2009 8:18:16 PM

We all said 750-850... he decided to go 1000w on his own.
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December 12, 2009 8:22:36 PM

cause I'm overclocking processor about 70% 2.66 -> 3.5Ghz. I don't know if I'm going to overclock the GPU yet.

Roger i will look into that motherboard but i think its arch is for the i7 8xx? and i would have to look again but there was a a major problem with them in relation to the 9xx series.

OEM is the cheapest Windows 7 out there to my knowledge if you know of another place i could get it cheaper that would be great.

besides, I've bought nothing yet. I'm not going to buy anything until after Christmas.

your saying that a 750-850w PSU would run an i7 Core 920 OC 3.5 and HD 5850x2 Possibly OC'ed, Extra fans, an HDD, and an SSD?
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December 12, 2009 9:08:32 PM

the i7-920 is on the x58 chipset, the i7-860 is on the p55 chipset. Those MOBO's are P55 chipset, and the only ones out atm with USB 3.0 support and SATA 6.0 support. Both are modifications of very popular and reliable mobo's so there shouldn't be any issues.

i7-920= x58
i5, i7-860=P55

OC wise you can OC a i7-920 to 3.2 w/o raising voltage.
For p55 OC you'll need to increase voltage, but still not a concern. In fact lemme give you numbers.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-5850,2433...

Tom's used a i7-975 extreme OC to 4.0ghz w/ xfire 5870's and only used 561 watts total system power. This number is actually ~20% higher than actual usage since it's measure at the electric socket, IE meaning that a 80% rated PSU is using only 80% of the socket draw.

That's the most powerful CPU on the planet OC'ed, w/ most powerful GPU's on the planet in a top of the line system, artificially pushed to full CPU and GPU usage by software, and you could run it on a 550 watt PSU. Get our point?

No way on earth your setup will ever even get CLOSE to the Corsair 750's load. The only reason we recommend a 750 is cuz PSU companies like to make money so lower wattage PSU's don't have the cables needed for Xfire/SLI.
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December 12, 2009 9:12:38 PM

OS http://win741.com

Win 7 pro or home premium $30.

If you're not a college student, just find a random one.
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December 12, 2009 11:39:44 PM

banthracis said:
Tom's used a i7-975 extreme OC to 4.0ghz w/ xfire 5870's and only used 561 watts total system power. This number is actually ~20% higher than actual usage since it's measure at the electric socket, IE meaning that a 80% rated PSU is using only 80% of the socket draw.

That's the most powerful CPU on the planet OC'ed, w/ most powerful GPU's on the planet in a top of the line system, artificially pushed to full CPU and GPU usage by software, and you could run it on a 550 watt PSU. Get our point?

No way on earth your setup will ever even get CLOSE to the Corsair 750's load. The only reason we recommend a 750 is cuz PSU companies like to make money so lower wattage PSU's don't have the cables needed for Xfire/SLI.


Ok i just looked at the link you sent me, correct me if im wrong but its just showing the draw for the GPU's i didn't see anything in there about a OC'ed i7 975 let alone any processor, from my understanding the power draw for a i7 9xx on load is about 350w + GPU's at 469, that is 819w is it not? or am i calculating it wrong, are there other variables?

SATA 6.0 would be nice but USB 3.0 is worthless at this point in time, there isnt any need for data rates that fast over USB. USB 2.0 supports rates up to 480Mb/s which is plenty fast, correct me if I'm wrong but 5GB/s is unnecessary at this time because it's full potential is cannot be reached? also QPI and DMI are used on both chipsets, however on the x58 chipset there is an extra PCIe channel and an additional DDR3 channel, allowing triple channel DDR3 as opposed to dual channel on the P55 boards.

once again feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, I'm still learning.
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Best solution

December 13, 2009 5:22:14 AM

Read the whole article...specifically the test setup page
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-5850,2433...

Quote:
Intel Core i7-975 Extreme (Bloomfield) 3.33 GHz, 6.4 GT/s, 8 MB L3 Cache, power-saving settings disabled
Overclocked to 4 GHz (25 * 160 MHz)


I dunno why you think PC components use so much power. They don't especially now with 34 and 42 nm processed on everything. Read articles carefully... you're taking total system power numbers and assuming they're power usage for a single component.

1. Modern CPU is never gonna go above 300 watts no matter how much you OC it. In fact, x58 is designed for 130W, P55 95W. Anything over those numbers voids warranty and exceeds the recommended numbers. Also the root of the Foxconn MOBO issues. Ppl taking P55 way above 95W thinking it's built for 130W like i7-920. It's not, and since Foxconn wasn't expecting ppl to push watts so far above specs, you get dead MOBO's after 4.0 ghz (admittedly they screwed up their pins as well, but it only fails when you exceed specs by a lot).

Take an i5 extreme OC to 4.2 ghz only 280 watts. An i7-920 will be less power as you don't need anywhere near the voltage increase to get an OC.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i5-750-overclo...

i7 4.o ghz only uses 217.6 watts
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/overclock-core-i7,2...

btw, those numbers are TOTAL system power draw at the plug numbers, not CPU by itself.

2. GPU's have a 300watt ATX limit. Impossible to go above that w/o an industry standard change. That's the reason why the 5970 doesn't have the clock speeds of a 5870, it can't get enough pwer to do so.
Read this article for more info
http://anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3679

3. Add those up your 2 main pwr drawing components can not possibly go over 600 watts.
4. HD, fans, DVD etc are like 5-10 watts each max. SSD is like 2 watts.

You're never gonna get to 750 watts never mind 1000...

As for y you need USB 3.0 and SATA 6.0
read
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/usb-3.0-performance...

1. It's called future proofing. In a year or so time everything is gonna be on those 2 standards. Saying 3.0 isn't needed is like the idiots 4 yrs ago who said USB 2.0 is stupid cuz we're never gonna utilize it's full bandwidth.
2. Tech moves fast, give it 2 years and everything today will be outdated.
3. SSD's already have hit the SATA ceiling. There's a reason why companies are making PCI slot SSD's, they've maxed SATA bandwidth.

Quote:
See the wall at around 260MB/s? We're hitting the limit of what's possible over 3Gbps SATA. Expect read speeds to go up once we start seeing SATA 6Gbps drives and controllers to support them.


http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdoc.aspx?i=3631&p=...

4. Triple channel vs dual channel offers no performance advantage. Tom's or anandtech did a full test on that issue a while ago, go look it up if you want the details.
5. The limited PCI Express slots on P55 aren't an issue either.


i5 and i7 have very close average FPS, but min FPS is much higher for an i5, and slowdowns really hurt the gaming experience.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=363...


Also Tom's posted a nice article a few months ago addressing the whole issues. They noted that while there was a difference, in P55 vs X58, it wasn't anything noticeable.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i5-lynnfield,2...


Quote:
Are eight lanes per card enough? Almost certainly, yes


Quote:
With two cards installed, Core i5 simply didn’t gain as much performance as Core i7 at high resolutions. It wasn’t, however, noticeably handicapped


high resolution in this case being 30" 2560x 1600" which your monitor doesn't support anyway.



Honestly, if you're gonna come here asking for advice and ignore everyone when they tell you you don't need a 1k watt PSU, then just go ahead and waste your money, we're not gonna care.

I"ll give you everything this time, but don't expect people on the forums to walk you through every benchmark and give rationale and research for every suggestion. If you want every detail, go do your own research. Read the links we give (the whole article) and read the other benchmarks on Tom's and on Anandtech. All the advice we give is based on those tests, our own builds and other hardware reviews.

Edit: Since I'm posting everything, might as well add y everyone should get a SSD, and y it's totally worth the price premium. Though if you're really worried, Kingston is offering a 30GB one for $84.99 after MIR. It uses the Intel controller, which is the best one atm.
http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdoc.aspx?i=3667&p=...

I bring you Anand Lai Shimpi, probably the best known and most respected hardware reviewer in the world. In comparing SSD's to normal HD's:

Quote:
n every major article I’ve written about SSDs I’ve provided at least one benchmark that sums up exactly why you’d want an SSD over even a RAID array of HDDs...it’s an order of magnitude faster than a hard drive. It’s the difference between a hang glider and the space shuttle; both will fly, it’s just that one takes you to space. And I don’t care that you can buy a super fast or high flying hang glider either.


http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdoc.aspx?i=3631&p=...

Lastly, as to y Intel's controller is the best, here's anand again. Read the full article for all the details.

Quote:
Is Intel still my overall recommendation? Of course. The random write performance is simply too good to give up and it's only in very specific cases that the 80MB/s sequential write speed hurts you. Is Indilinx a close runner up? Absolutely. It's truly a lower cost alternative.


http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdoc.aspx?i=3631&p=...
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December 13, 2009 6:07:42 PM

To be honest I did do my own research, there are a lot of bad articles out there and a lot of bad advice. which i would assume is what I came upon, on a second note I've yet to build a computer yet, yes I'm a bit stubborn I do not like to just take word I enjoy knowledge of why and how. You gave me some great information, and indeed maybe I didn't get quite enough research, or I was looking in the wrong places... which still equates. I suppose I've inconvenienced you and I apologize for that.

If it doesn't bother you further, I wonder are there any other sites than the ones you've pointed out good for research?
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December 13, 2009 6:32:02 PM

I wasn't angry, sorry if I came off that way. I was just annoyed that I linked you article on power usage and you didn't bother reading the test setup page :( 

But yea, for ppl like me who regularly read Tom's and anandtech, asking about test setup details for an article is like asking a driver where the gas petal is, we think it's obvious, even when there are ppl our there who aren't drivers :D 


For Hardware reviews, Tom's and anandtech are the best.

HardOCP is also a very nice source, but gaming oriented.

Frostytech is the best for HSF reviews.

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