PTnuke vs. kill coil!?

Well, I need to add one of these into my arriving loop, so which one will work better?

PTNuke looks like the better option:
http://www.petrastechshop.com/pepcobi1.html
42 answers Last reply
More about ptnuke kill coil
  1. They're both about the same - you either use a few drops of PT Nuke every time you fill, or just stick in a silver coil once and forget about it.
  2. I'd go silver, you need to refresh PT or similar additives and over the years it adds up, buy a couple of coils and thats it for life
    Moto
  3. Being a Nuke user, I agree that silver is the more economical way to go.
  4. They're about the same. But killcoil is generally the more preferred option due to convenience and low-maintenance. Agreed with everyone else, I'd go with a few coils, and you're pretty much set. Plus from what I've heard, it's quite entertaining to see the coil bouncing around in the water :lol: :kaola:
  5. I just use antifreeze. Temps are about the same and I don't have to worry about bacteria or corrosion
  6. Pinhedd said:
    I just use antifreeze. Temps are about the same and I don't have to worry about bacteria or corrosion

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't antifreeze cause more damage to your blocks? Also, from what I've seen around forums, antifreeze is probably the last thing people would recommend..
  7. -Jackson said:
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't antifreeze cause more damage to your blocks? Also, from what I've seen around forums, antifreeze is probably the last thing people would recommend..


    Some types of antifreeze might. However using 50/50 or 25/75 mixtures of Ethlyene-Glycol and water are perfectly fine. The ethylene-glycol acts as a natural lubricant for the pump and its toxicity prevents the growth of bacteria. As far as causing damage, that can happen with water too if you're not careful about the types of metal that you have in your loop. Antifreeze might make matters worse if you have multiple types of metals that can be oxidized in your loop. This is why it's extremely ill-advised to mix copper blocks with aluminium blocks. However, copper/nickel and aluminium/nickel are okay because nickel does not oxidise at low temperatures. Nickel is extremely resistant to corrosion as well which makes it very useful. The other concern with antifreeze is that it can actually damage tubing, which is easily avoided by using nickel coated barbs and coolant safe tubing.

    Most coolant kits actually contain Ethylene-Glycol or the non-toxic Propylene-Glycol as their primary additive. These kits cost 4-8 times as much as a bottle of automotive antifreeze and perform about the same.
  8. Anti-freeze, killcoil, or PTnuke...
  9. Killcoil hands-down imo.
  10. plus Killcoil just sounds awesome
  11. :) an antifreeze/coolant mixtures need to be consistent. Too much and they'll add stress to the pump as they have lower viscosity. I'd say kill coil - just drop one/two in your loop and maybe leave it in the res and all you need to do is worry about tubing and flushing components instead of topping up pt nuke.
  12. My vote is for biocide that isn't copper-based; which would leave you more in the chemical biocide arena (like something you would use in an aquarium). You still only need a few drops, but it works just as well as PTNuke and can be found in most mega-markets or your local pet store for only a few $$.

    I also run a killcoil, but the jury is out on how effective a silver coil in a loop is more effective at killing crawlies than the total mass of copper in the loop. (Copper/silver both are naturally good at killing micro-organisms; silver is better but you have far more copper) And, since your loop has far more copper making contact with water than you do that silver strip, the debate is which is actually doing the most good.
  13. rubix_1011 said:
    My vote is for biocide that isn't copper-based; which would leave you more in the chemical biocide arena (like something you would use in an aquarium). You still only need a few drops, but it works just as well as PTNuke and can be found in most mega-markets or your local pet store for only a few $$.

    I also run a killcoil, but the jury is out on how effective a silver coil in a loop is more effective at killing crawlies than the total mass of copper in the loop. (Copper/silver both are naturally good at killing micro-organisms; silver is better but you have far more copper) And, since your loop has far more copper making contact with water than you do that silver strip, the debate is which is actually doing the most good.


    Not all waterblocks have copper coming directly in contact with the water. In fact I'd say that the best ones don't. The best ones are plated with nickel to prevent corrosion
  14. Pinhedd said:
    Not all waterblocks have copper coming directly in contact with the water. In fact I'd say that the best ones don't. The best ones are plated with nickel to prevent corrosion


    Most of them do, however, since copper transfers heat an order of magnitude better than nickel (401 vs. 91 W/mK).

    It's interesting that nickel protects against corrosion but it is quite chemically similar to copper.
  15. boiler1990 said:
    Most of them do, however, since copper transfers heat an order of magnitude better than nickel (401 vs. 91 W/mK).

    It's interesting that nickel protects against corrosion but it is quite chemically similar to copper.


    Nickel is similar to copper but only at very high temperatures. Nickel won't oxidise at temperatures below 400C which is why its used in all sorts of harsh environments and for tasks such as restraining lead-acid batteries. The thermal conductivity of the metal doesn't matter much at all because the conductivity of water is horrible (0.6). Fortunately, the heat capacity of water is outstanding and thus good water turbulence will completely marginalize the impact of a copper-nickel barrier.
  16. Nickel used in watercooling components is only plating, and only done so for aesthetic purposes, not for performance. Most water blocks that I have seen are copper for both contact surfaces (mount/water) and any nickel is plated and only for looks. The best blocks (whether nickel plated or just copper) are good due to the flow rate and thermal transfer design of the block...due to the copper block and top used in the specific design.
  17. ahem - might i add that EK blocks in nickel flavor have a (severe)allergy towards kill coil, PT nuke or copper sulphate solution in distilled...?
  18. I hear they aren't fond of water either :-)
    *edit, maybe its just the wrong kind of water....
    :-p
    Moto
  19. :lol: good one!
  20. Motopsychojdn said:
    I hear they aren't fond of water either :-)
    *edit, maybe its just the wrong kind of water....
    :-p
    Moto

    Or maybe because people don't use EK coolant/products in their loop ;) :whistle:
  21. I do actually, :P
    theres two EK COPPER Vga HF Supremes modded under my DCII shrouds in my rig :)
    Pics here
    and I research my gear hard before I part with cash, mostly because I need to know how I can/can't mod them
    I don't use coolant btw,
    plain distilled, couple of killcoils and some UV cathodes
    *Edit, sorry man, I misunderstood your post as a dig, I realise you meant that folks are only 'supposed' to use the approved list of coolants, and yes, thats one thing I actually am against myself, shoddy product/process is one thing, covering it up by demanding you only use their stuff compounds it into bad business practice territory for me :)
    Moto
  22. Motopsychojdn said:
    I do actually, :P
    theres two EK COPPER Vga HF Supremes modded under my DCII shrouds in my rig :)
    Pics here
    and I research my gear hard before I part with cash, mostly because I need to know how I can/can't mod them
    I don't use coolant btw,
    plain distilled, couple of killcoils and some UV cathodes
    *Edit, sorry man, I misunderstood your post as a dig, I realise you meant that folks are only 'supposed' to use the approved list of coolants, and yes, thats one thing I actually am against myself, shoddy product/process is one thing, covering it up by demanding you only use their stuff compounds it into bad business practice territory for me :)
    Moto

    Haha yeah, EK's got a bad rep/infamous for blaming the coolant for corrosion of blocks. :lol:
  23. The more added crap you put in the water the less cooling conductivity it has.

    If we ran our computers at below 0c we would need anti-freeze but we don't.

    Every water block I have is copper inside, including my GPU blocks.

    I guess you guys using automotive anti-freeze have never taken a car radiator to a clean out shop.

    Distilled water is proven time after time to be the best thermal conductor.

    My RadBox has no kill coil and just one externally dissolved AC Pan Tablet.

    @amuffin If PT Nuke can do it's job with just 1 or 2 drops then that would be a good choice, if the price was acceptable.

    A kill coil in a pump/res combo tends to accelerate the white forming inside the tubing.

    In my RadBox setup seeing as how the XSPC pump/res is notorious for the kill coil white reaction in about 2 weeks of operation, I decided to fore go the kill coil and took one AC Pan Tablet, dissolved it in 2 ounces of distilled water then filtered it and poured the liquid into my reservoir.

    The AC Pan Tablets are stocked at Home Depot and are shown in the Below Ambient thread so far no problems and a lot cheaper solution.

    The bottom line is you have to decide for yourself what you'll use, the AC Pan Tablets I'm using works just fine even though it's not marketed for water cooling loops, has not given any problems in over a year of open loop use no critters and crawlies or weird formations, and so far no closed loop problems either.

    Good Luck on your decision! Ry
  24. Wait what white reaction? :??: I'll be using an alphacool vcp655 with an xspc dual bay res. Well the kill coil is 7-11 dollars with shipping, but PTNuke is 6-7 with shipping...
  25. Silver just flaking off and sticking to the sides. I get more stuff from the inside of my tubing that it wouldn't matter...
  26. I haven't noticed it occurring in my loop yet, one of my coils is in the res inside the Pc and when i last cleaned out it was a little dull-looking but no buildup of any sort, quick wipe and its was shiny as,
    can't say about the other three in the tubing as they are off on travels and haven't sent a postcard as to where they are :)
    Rubix did some experimenting though, to determine whether proximity to the pump affected it or not
    Moto
  27. it was rubix who conducted a test here right? where the placing of a kill coil to a power source , i.e: pump, would cause the tubing to whiten faster.
    *just read modo's post - yeap twas rubix

    so the tests showed the farther away form the power source it is, the slower the whitening effect.
  28. It was an odd set of tests, though and I'd like to re-test them to see if the results are always reproduced. Even with the killcoil absent, there was still a white substance that appeared on the inside of the tubing; when try it was almost like a very fine powder/film that could be wiped off with your finger. However, the killcoil seemed to act as a catalyst, causing the white film to appear faster and thicker when tested in the same testing time period.
  29. rubix_1011 said:
    It was an odd set of tests, though and I'd like to re-test them to see if the results are always reproduced. Even with the killcoil absent, there was still a white substance that appeared on the inside of the tubing; when try it was almost like a very fine powder/film that could be wiped off with your finger. However, the killcoil seemed to act as a catalyst, causing the white film to appear faster and thicker when tested in the same testing time period.


    That's what happens with my system. I'm confident it's the tubing releasing stuff into the loop; I'll probably soak and/or rinse next time I build a loop.

    I wonder if those deposits just acted as points of nucleation for silver particles that were dissolving in the water.
  30. Silver breaks down very slowly, even in solution but you could have a point there, something, whether its ionisation fields or simple metal reaction is a catalyst for this substance, it'd be nice to nail it down, identify it and if necessary, prevent it from occurring
    Moto
  31. It was never actually proven it was silver breaking down because if it was actually silver the thickened coating inside the tubing, should conduct electricity, because silver conducts electricity.

    If the silver coil itself was actually breaking down to create the deposits after time it should show some signs of degrading but it doesn't?

    As already mentioned it's like the silver is a catalyst, of some phenomenon, if it's doing something to the liquid accelerating the process having to do with the electromagnetic field and flowing fluid?

    IDK but it does happen, but obviously not to everyone?

    No conclusion! Just More questions?

    @amuffin Are you even more confused man?

    Just go with the PT Nuke and 100% steam distilled water, and forget the killcoil, that's my advice.
  32. I checked the inside of the tubing with my multimeter and it appears to be non-conductive, but my gear is a normal multimeter that anyone can get at a Radio Shack or the like. I don't think the cloudiness is necessarily silver, but like we've mentioned, the silver coil does seem to act like a catalyst as the clouding develops more quickly and noticeably more prevalent with each instance the silver coil was present in the testing.

    This topic makes me want to kick up this testing again...which I just might based on the amount of interest. (Sooo many things going on and so many to-do's but might also give me a chance to post up a video on filling a loop or even some boiling water tubing bends). Time to start writing down the testing variables and planning for tubing test, v2.
  33. i just like having a killcoil because i put it in the loop and forget about it, haha.
  34. @ rubix, ryan and the other people interested in this cloudy tube test - On the H50 mod, I use a PC ICE clear liquid coolant and some locally available tubing of 8mm ID 10mm OD. On my regular/irregular maintenance runs, I too noticed the tube clouding. It gradually works its way to being frosty until i change out the coolant+tubing.

    I don't use any silver kill coils in my H50 modded loop+the only thing that is common to all folks is the copper rad(with the exception of me having the stock corsair alu rad as the second rad), an electric pump module and some liquid.
  35. I wonder what would happen if you used older tubing (constantly run in a loop) compared to newer tubing (with and without a killcoil). I think some of the clouding is just chemicals from the tubes.


    One way I see this being run is have two loops with brand new tubing (ideally new/same components as well to eliminate variation - may take some fundraising ;)). Run both for a week or so, compare the tubing deposits, and then change out the tubing on one loop and drop killcoils in each one. Run that for the same time and you have some results.

    That way you should be able to see the build up due to chemicals and build up due to chemicals + killcoil (if there is a correlation).
  36. boiler1990 said:
    I wonder what would happen if you used older tubing (constantly run in a loop) compared to newer tubing (with and without a killcoil). I think some of the clouding is just chemicals from the tubes.


    One way I see this being run is have two loops with brand new tubing (ideally new/same components as well to eliminate variation - may take some fundraising ;)). Run both for a week or so, compare the tubing deposits, and then change out the tubing on one loop and drop killcoils in each one. Run that for the same time and you have some results.

    That way you should be able to see the build up due to chemicals and build up due to chemicals + killcoil (if there is a correlation).

    Now, don't you wish that I had the money for my upcoming loop right now ;) :lol:
  37. Tubing clouding is typically discussed as occurring due to chemicals leeched from tubing manufacture. However, it still isn't understood whether it's the same from one tubing manufacturing process to another or if those are triggered differently due to those events.

    Even plain distilled seems to cause this, but still might just be the control that this occurs. I've read some other threads where forum members wanted to create a cross-reference spread sheet of loop components and tubing brands to see if there were commonalities.
  38. I could afford to buy the parts and run the tests, but I know my parents wouldn't like having two loops just running in the house. It's also really hot here in DC, and my PC generates enough extra heat as it is.

    I'll give it a go in August or so once I get to my new apartment in AZ. I'll probably also have a use for some of those parts once my gf starts getting her discounts :D
  39. :lol: okay okay maybe a walk through of the factory(will ninja-shoplift the factory)
  40. Just a couple of ES's would do, oh and a mobo to put them in please
    Moto
  41. Motopsychojdn said:
    Just a couple of ES's would do, oh and a mobo to put them in please
    Moto

    ES?
  42. ES = Engineering Samples. Basically sample/prototype CPUs that they distribute (usually to employees) for real-world testing. I know some people who live near Intel's R&D HQ in Oregon (pretty much the only place you can get ES's), and they were running Ivy Bridge 2-3 years ago - thus proving how disgustingly far ahead of the market Intel is.
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