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Mini ITX questions

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July 6, 2010 8:54:06 AM

Hello,

Just wondering if someone can assist me with the question(s) I have below:

1) I am after a mini itx board which has the below requirements (at a minimum) which I hope some supplier may have available now or plan in releasing the such requirements?

Requirements:

a) Mini itx factor
b) LGA 1156
c) integrated HD 5770 (minimum) or higher

Optional wishful additions:

d) wi-fi
e) Lucid Hydra

Is there such a Mini ITX board available from some manufacturer? or is there plans for one to be available?

2) Besides merging the performance of different GPU cards, I understand the Lucid Hydra can also improve the performance of the integrated GPU without the addition of cards? Is this is true, how much of a practical performance increase should be expected?

3) Another question about the Lucid Hydra which which I should post on a different topic forum, but I will try here instead since I have the question above:

Does anyone know if the Lucid Hydra merges the performance of integrated GPU's on a motherboard. Example: Motherboard having an Integrated HD 5770 and Intel core i7 which has a GMA HD GPU?

Any help on the above is appreciated.

D

More about : mini itx questions

July 6, 2010 1:06:02 PM

there is no such board available
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July 12, 2010 1:02:07 PM

If my earlier spec requirements is not available, is there then a mini itx factor board which has the following requirements?

Requirement 1:

a) LGA 1156
b) integrated HD 5770 (minimum) or higher

Requirement 2:

a) integrated HD 5770 (minimum) or higher

Look forward to any feedback?

Thank you

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Related resources
July 12, 2010 1:37:39 PM

dariusz72 said:
If my earlier spec requirements is not available, is there then a mini itx factor board which has the following requirements?

Requirement 1:

a) LGA 1156
b) integrated HD 5770 (minimum) or higher

Requirement 2:

a) integrated HD 5770 (minimum) or higher

Look forward to any feedback?

Thank you

D

no there is no such thing as onboard 5770 not even on an atx board
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a b V Motherboard
July 12, 2010 2:21:42 PM

best bet for a small build with this much power is micro ATX (also give more expansion slots)

ie mATX board with i5-750 and a 5770 (discrete card, as mrhoshos96 said, there is no integrated one) and a good 450w PSU
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July 12, 2010 6:08:49 PM

doesn't exist. i'd echo using a micro atx board with good onboard graphics...

curious why you wanted on board graphics and lucid hydra when lucid is to mix graphics cards when you appear to wanna use onboard >_<

i like lucid for what it represents but there are only a handful of boards that have it, currently i believe limited to MSI boards and all full atx... and running around 275+ per mobo alone


i'll echo the intel board with 32nm chips right now it'll give ya the best energy savings and least amount of heat for a small form factor build. if graphics are a huge concern you might also wanna look into low profile factor graphics cards usually use little power/ heat but can still fit a small form factor box . but there are a few mobos with decent onboard chips if you're heart is set on all on one board
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July 13, 2010 9:03:50 AM

Quote:
curious why you wanted on board graphics and lucid hydra when lucid is to mix graphics cards when you appear to wanna use onboard >_<

i like lucid for what it represents but there are only a handful of boards that have it, currently i believe limited to MSI boards and all full atx... and running around 275+ per mobo alone


G00fySmiley thank you for you reply.

I'm assuming the lucid hydra can:

1. Besides merging the performance of different GPU cards, I understand the Lucid Hydra can also improve the performance of the integrated GPU without the addition of cards?

2. If there is an integrated graphics chip on a motherboard (future motherboard) like the HD 5770 and a LGA 1156 socket which support the GMA HD GPU, I presume the Lucid Hydra can merges the performance of the HD 5770 and the GMA HD GPU? Hence increase the overall graphic performance of the motherboard / system.

Of course the above assumption is being made if the above spec motherboard exists.

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July 13, 2010 9:06:23 AM

mrhoshos96 said:
no there is no such thing as onboard 5770 not even on an atx board


mrhoshos96,

I have read some where that there are motherboards which have an integrated HD 5770.

I should find the link to the article I read...

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July 13, 2010 9:11:37 AM

Question:

Currently what is the best (if that the right word to use...) integrated graphic processor on a mini itx motherboard (and atx motherboard) available on the market?

I understand there is the ION, ION2, Intel core i7 which has an integrated GMA HD GPU and probable more...?

Would the GPU on the Intel core i7 which has an integrated GMA HD GPU be faster than the ION 2? And by how much (assumptions)?

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a b V Motherboard
July 13, 2010 3:10:25 PM

the best is a tie between the newest intel IGP that is on the cpu (i3 and i5-6xx series not the i5-7xx series) and AMD's 785G chipset (which is a HD4200), and as a side note, none of the i7's have an IGP which means you can't use it without a discrete card on the miniITX boards

about the Hydra:
1) not, Lucid cannot increase the speed of a single GPU like an IGP solution, it uses 2 (or more) GPU's and has them work together (much like SLI and Crossfire, but without restrictions), however the scaling currently is not that good
2) I am not sure if Lucid supports the int IGP's (since they are so slow), though even if they do/will the IGP's are so slow compared to the 5770 that you wouldn't notice any increase whatsoever

you best bet is to use a discrete card in the mini-itx solution which would be limited to a single slot card so you are looking at the 5570 maybe 5670 at best, if you move to microATX you can then theoretically use any GPU you want

also, if you have that link about the 5770 as an IGP i woud love to see it, just to see the heatsink on the Motherboard to cool it (look at the discrete 5770's, and you will understand why this isn't feasible)
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July 13, 2010 6:02:15 PM

Lucid hydra is really interesting technonoly. and i do hopeto use it in my nex tbuild. but its really expensive and nowhere near as efficient as crossfire or sli.. that said i wanna mix a 5770 and a 460 .. just to mess with peoples minds when they see it :D  and i fully plan to benchmark it an d post on forums for fun

do note though tha tmost onboard gpus are so weak and lucid being so inefficient any gains would be barely noticable at best

as for inegrated 5770 only in laptops and thats not a true 5770, usually gpyu makers make a crippled chip to use less power and heat for a laptop gpu and then call it a higher series so it'll sell well.

i'm curious what you are building this small box fo rthat you want so much power in it? is it for a media center or like a portable lan rig?
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July 14, 2010 9:56:19 AM

Hello mindless728

Thanks for your post

Just looking at the below link you are right that the i3 & i5-6XX have the IGPU on the chip. The i5-661 looks like to be the fastest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_GMA#HD_Graphics_.28G...

Just curious:

Between the ION, ION2, IGPU on the i5-661 and HD 4250, which would be the fastest, and by how much (comparison to the four)?

Unfortunately, my mini-itx solution which I am after I cannot have a discrete graphics card - It needs to be integrated, as my requirements are to place the mini-itx board into a small case which I can mount in to the rear of the monitor using the vesa mount system (please refer to my other post re my case/project requirements - http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/285298-28-mini-case-r...)

I am not after a integrated GPU which can run the latest generation of games as the purpose is to run emulated or PC games such as racing, flight and Mech on a rock'n'ride machine.

I found the link below which demonstrates my gaming requirements. The project in the link uses a mini itx solution with an integrated ION GPU. The ION in this case seem to run the games very well. However, I would like to find the fasted integrated GPU on a mini itx board on the market to cover my future gaming requirements.

http://www.ubergizmo.com/15/archives/2010/07/daytona_us...

I am also willing to hold-off purchasing a mini itx which has a integrated GPU for 6 months or so if I know there is a manufacture which will be releasing a board which is faster than what is available on the market today. (Does any one know what the near future holds for mini itx boards with integrated GPU?)

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a b V Motherboard
July 14, 2010 1:55:56 PM

well, i would imagine most of those IGP's being so close in performance that even if one is better, it won't matter much

though it's an interesting idea with the vesa mounts, why not just find a case you like and mount it to the back (even a mini ITX one), it's a little bit of modding, but not a lot
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July 14, 2010 4:13:54 PM

honestly for your purposes i'd definatly go with ian intel board for the 32mn chips, less heat and more efficiency. but if you're gonna really want good graphics even the best on your list, the i5-661 is not gonna give you great framerates, but best out now for itx. if you really want playability and no graphics card though your best bet is likely to wait and see what comes... but...

i like the idea you have though mounting behind the tv, however after looking at what would be available casewise i have a question... how mechanically inclined are you? if you wanted somethign really origional you could do a custom case from wood, or just get a small case that allows a graphics card and mount it directly to the tv stand, or even go industrial and use washers/ chain to make it mount via the pattern, btu i wouldn't try that unless you have confidence in your ability to craft a case. its not hard, i build the one i use right now the mounting might be a little tricky but not to terribly complicated. wood with plexiglass and stain and a little hardware, i put about 65 bucks in materials and dremel bits to get it right but worth it imo
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July 16, 2010 11:01:29 PM

I have quickly investigated what lies ahead in the near future for improved board performance.

Intel Sandy Bridge CPU looks to be a much improved performance over the current intel i series CPU (ie. i5-661), and may even be released this year!

I may have to hold off buying a mini itx boaed until gigabyte or another manufacturer brings out their updated mini itx boards with Sandy Bridge CPU, as the next generation will definatly improve the GPU performance....

Here are some links:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/14/intels-sandy-bridge-...

http://www.electronista.com/articles/08/08/14/intel.200...

I wonder what AMD have in plans for their next generation of CPU/boards?

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July 16, 2010 11:15:03 PM

g00fysmiley said:
honestly for your purposes i'd definatly go with ian intel board for the 32mn chips, less heat and more efficiency. but if you're gonna really want good graphics even the best on your list, the i5-661 is not gonna give you great framerates, but best out now for itx. if you really want playability and no graphics card though your best bet is likely to wait and see what comes... but...

i like the idea you have though mounting behind the tv, however after looking at what would be available casewise i have a question... how mechanically inclined are you? if you wanted somethign really origional you could do a custom case from wood, or just get a small case that allows a graphics card and mount it directly to the tv stand, or even go industrial and use washers/ chain to make it mount via the pattern, btu i wouldn't try that unless you have confidence in your ability to craft a case. its not hard, i build the one i use right now the mounting might be a little tricky but not to terribly complicated. wood with plexiglass and stain and a little hardware, i put about 65 bucks in materials and dremel bits to get it right but worth it imo


G00fySmiley,

I had thought amount doing a mod case, the idea being to cut open a small area in the M350 universal mini itx case (http://www.mini-box.com/M350-unive [...] 8Ta38Lc3b0 ) to insert a dedicated low profile video card, however I feel the over looks will not be pleasing (even though I could make a great looking cover for the exposed video card). Unless I find a better case.

But thank you for your advice.

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September 28, 2010 10:47:31 PM

Is integrated graphics a nessesity? If you could incorporate a discrete vido card into your mini-ITX build, you'd have many more options.

Take any mini-ITX H55-based motherboard from Gigabyte or Zotac or whoever and stick a 5770 in the PCIe slot.

You can find a few different cases that will allow you use almost any ATX PSU that you want and a discrete video card. Maybe one of those can be modified to suit your needs.
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